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View Full Version : Volountary fail a check?



SolkaTruesilver
2007-07-24, 01:48 PM
I wondered if it is possible for a caster to volountary fail a caster check? Because I had tough of a cheap way to assassinate someone. Explosive Rune somewhere VERY close to someone + Dispel Magic (volountary failed) to make it explode.

the problem is, if the caster check succeed, the explosive rune is simply removed...

tainsouvra
2007-07-24, 01:58 PM
I wondered if it is possible for a caster to volountary fail a caster check? Because I had tough of a cheap way to assassinate someone. Explosive Rune somewhere VERY close to someone + Dispel Magic (volountary failed) to make it explode.

the problem is, if the caster check succeed, the explosive rune is simply removed... Assuming you're decently high level, you could probably just make a wand with the Dispel Magic at the minimum level, might be close enough.

I'm thinking that's a poor assassination technique, though. You're nearby, you cast a spell, suddenly there's an explosion and he dies. That's pretty obvious, and if you could do that without getting caught, you might as well just Fireball him yourself and save a spell slot.

Actana
2007-07-24, 02:03 PM
I don't think its so poor, hey:

1. Still/silent spell
2. Lurk somewhere out of sight
3. Cast it and fail check
4. BOOM!

EDIT: and to answer the question: Yes, I don't see any reason why you couldn't fail the check, after it is you who cast the original spell. (Isn't it?)

Arbitrarity
2007-07-24, 02:07 PM
The trick is really a bag of holding full of slips of paper, followed by a CL 5 dispel magic against CL 15 explosive runes. All the paper has explosive runes. Dump, use wand, run AWAY!

Jasdoif
2007-07-24, 02:09 PM
Assuming you're decently high level, you could probably just make a wand with the Dispel Magic at the minimum level, might be close enough.Why bother with a wand? You can always cast at a lower caster level, as long that caster level is sufficient to cast the spell at all.

lord_khaine
2007-07-24, 02:09 PM
if they are in a bag of holding, then you can dispel the explosive runes, and really, in this case you might as well throw a fireball after them.

Arbitrarity
2007-07-24, 02:10 PM
Fireball != 6d6*100000.

Keld Denar
2007-07-24, 02:12 PM
This has been brought up before. Fill a book up with explosive runes. Shrink object it. Fill another book with explosive runes, shrink object it. Lather, Rinse, Repeat. Then get a bag, have the fighter person throw it, and then dispel it mid air. You're very own tac nuke bomb. Teleport back to your sanctum, scribe a couple hundred more books, and then blow something else up. Boring.

I believe last time I saw it, there were still a chosen few who believe you can't volountarily fail a check like that. You CAN set your dispel caster level to 5 (min allowable for a 3rd level spell) and make sure your explosive runes caster level was high enough that the DC is over 25 (highest result on d20+5) so there is no possible way to make the check.

Then again, I believe you automatically make checks to dispel your own magic, but I can't cite that off the top of my head. That is circumventable by just having another high level wiz rune your books, and you rune his books, then blow stuff up together.

Jasdoif
2007-07-24, 02:14 PM
Then again, I believe you automatically make checks to dispel your own magic, but I can't cite that off the top of my head.You can choose to automatically succeed on dispel checks against your own spells, but it's not required.

tainsouvra
2007-07-24, 02:15 PM
Why bother with a wand? You can always cast at a lower caster level, as long that caster level is sufficient to cast the spell at all. Mostly in case he has anything that boosts his effective level or stats for the check/DC/etc--the item won't have it.

In the simplest case, though, you're right.

Dervag
2007-07-24, 02:21 PM
The catch with the explosive rune tactical nuke is that it still only damages things within ten feet; no mushroom cloud.

Diggorian
2007-07-24, 02:29 PM
The catch with the explosive rune tactical nuke is that it still only damages things within ten feet; no mushroom cloud.

I was just thinkin that. Localized damage but I'd maybe call for Fort saves to avoid blindness and deafness for the blast.

Seems to me also that if the DM allows an extra 10ft to radius per spell, then the 100 + 10ft level range of the dispel isnt far enough for you to not die. 150ft range would mean 15 runes at most, or you could be a Rogue with evasion multiclass :smallbiggrin:

Superglucose
2007-07-24, 02:43 PM
I would suppose you could fail a check. It would be like, say, trying to pick a lock but doing it in such a way that it won't really work (using a small twig instead of a lockpick, just shoving the lockpick in and out, etc.)

On a related note, I always prepare explosive runes...

Always. :vaarsuvius:

ChrisMcDee
2007-07-24, 06:12 PM
I see no reason why you couldn't choose to automatically fail almost any test. Perhaps on that natural 20 you still pass to represent unintentionally fluking it?

Weezer
2007-07-24, 08:58 PM
or maybe if you roll a one you fail at automatically failing the check.

ClericofPhwarrr
2007-07-24, 11:00 PM
Personally, I prefer the Explosive Ruins + Purify Spell metamagic (BoED, +1 spell level). Good creatures take no damage, neutral creatures take half. If you're in an all-good party, you can make oodles and oodles of these, and they have all sorts of fun, self-harmless uses.

1) Fighter charges.
2) Multiple ruins on the front of his shield and armor explode when close enough, severely hurting evil monster and leaving fighter unscathed.
3) Fighter smacks monster (if needed).
4) ???
5) Profit.

Not for every situation, but for a whole lot of them.

Eldritch_Ent
2007-07-25, 02:41 AM
You don't even need a magic trigger- just surround a vial of Alchemist's fire with a "wrapper" of explosive rune parchments (But not so much it'd keep the vial from breaking), and just throw it- no spell check required, and you can have the rogue do it.

Inyssius Tor
2007-07-25, 02:46 AM
You do, actually, need a magic trigger (unless that vial of alchemist's fire is capable of reading the explosive runes, which I very much doubt). There are only three things that can trigger an explosive runes spell:

1. Reading them.

2. Botching an erase spell.

3. Botching a dispel magic spell.

4. Botching a Disable Device check, if you happen to be a rogue.

EDIT: Wait, there are four!