Urban Dungeon Delver

[Max Caysey]

Just as the neon says... I am looking for an urban dungeon delver, or should I say a city delver. Am looking for good ideas to present to my DM. I like the class and would be a great benefit for my rogue in our urban themed campaign. Therefore I'm hoping to create a urban variant of the class, like urban druid.

Any suggestions would be cool.

[Zaq]

You're talking about the PrC from Complete Adventurer, right?

I've never been terribly impressed with Dungeon Delver myself (the skill prereqs make it obnoxious to enter except as a Rogue, but what it gives doesn't seem to be sufficiently better than what a Rogue gets to justify setting two feats on fire and losing Sneak Attack), but hey, if it looks good to you, then that's what you want, right? But we'd need to discuss what parts of it you actually like to decide what changes are appropriate.

If you want inspiration, there are a few explicitly city-themed PrCs in Races of Destiny and Cityscape, the most obvious one being Urban Soul. It's not a terrible class, even though it's not a great class either. But you might see if it gives you some ideas (or if you might just want to use it instead of Dungeon Delver).

Basically, what parts of Dungeon Delver interest you enough to draw you to the class? We want to make sure that you don't trade away the parts that you find interesting, after all.

[Grod_The_Giant]

I mean, what does the class give?

We can probably change the prereqs a bit-- Craft (Architecture) instead of (Stonemasonry), Knowledge (Local) instead of (Dungeoneering), and Urban Tracking instead of Blind-Fight.

Darkvision-- meh, who cares. We can drop that.
Deep Survival-- How 'bout switching the bonus to Gather Information checks made in urban environments, instead?
Trap Sense-- fine
Reduce-- Still useful in a city; we can keep that.
Stonecunning-- Most cities have a lot of stone and brick... but maybe we can switch it up to be "unusual building features" instead of stone.
Augury-- fine
Skill Mastery-- fine
Evasion-- fine
Blindsense-- This one we might change out. For, uh... a wider-range tremorsense, maybe?
Passwall-- Still useful.
Find the Path-- Less useful. We could replace it with another mid-high level divination, perhaps... Stone Tell? Prying Eyes? Telepathic Bond? Heck, Locate Creature or Locate Object are still useful.
Phase Door-- Still useful.

[Max Caysey]

OK... So we're playing an urban, low magic, low ressources game, at low optimization at low level.

Our party consists of a level 3 half-orc thug, who is our B.A. Baracus, a level 3 human cloistered cleric, who is knowledge broker, a la Charles Magnussen from Sherloch (at least he want to end up that way) a level 3 human melee rogue, who is kind of jack of all trades, master of none and then we have my level 3 human rogue, who is a sneaky thief. My "job" in the crew is getting into a building scouting ahead and either steal something or opening the door or ambush. Except for the half-ork, nobody is combat optimized... which challenges us a lot but its fun...

So what I like about the class is not only the fluff, but it would make my job of getting into and out of building easier. Indeed all the abilities can be had with spells and magic items, but so far we have one master work silver dagger. Rest is purely mundane. So the abilities granted would be nice. Especially darkvision, reduce, passwall and phase door. Indeed its not really optimized, but that's not really the name of the game... or at least not combat optimization. I am trying to optimize my ability to get into and out of buildings, sneak passed guards and that sort of things.

We play in a huge metropolis, where we are henchmen of a large trading guild, currently at war with another trading guild. The part we mosty adventure is the harbor and slums... Since there are stricked punishment for stealing, killing and the use og magic, most of our adventures take place during the night!