Good options for my paladin?

[JobsforFun]

My paladin's current spells and stats:

Oath: Treachery from unearthed Arcana

Race: Aasimar

Lvl: 4

Strength: 18
Dexterity: 15
Constitution: 17
Intelligence: 14
Wisdom: 15
Charisma: 20

Party consists of a: Paladin (ME), Cleric (Forge Domain), Bard (College of Whispers), Fighter/Gunslinger, Warlock, and a Barbarian (not sure he might be a fighter).

Spells:

Cantrip: Light (from race)

Lvl 1: Shield of faith, Bless, Thunderous smite, charm person (Domain), and Expeditious retreat (Domain)

I am generally just looking for any opinions on spells I should take at Lvl 5 or multi classing abilities.

[AttilatheYeon]

U can change ur spells around after a long rest. Unless u have a magic weapon, i'd reccomend divine favor.

[Tauguy628]

If you plan on multiclassing, it is a good idea to make it to level 6 first (for that amazing aura). Both lore bard and sorcerer are popular to multiclass with paladin, but straight paladin is also very strong. For spells, make sure to coordinate with your cleric and I would pick up find steed at some point for a cool mount.:smallbiggrin:

[JobsforFun]

If you plan on multiclassing, it is a good idea to make it to level 6 first (for that amazing aura). Both lore bard and sorcerer are popular to multiclass with paladin, but straight paladin is also very strong. For spells, make sure to coordinate with your cleric and I would pick up find steed at some point for a cool mount.:smallbiggrin:

I have never multi classed before, so I am open to any options.

[JobsforFun]

U can change ur spells around after a long rest. Unless u have a magic weapon, i'd reccomend divine favor.

I thought that thunderous smite might be better since it is a extra 2d6 instead of the d4.

[KnotaGuru]

I thought that thunderous smite might be better since it is a extra 2d6 instead of the d4.

Thunderous smite is done after the first hit. Divine favor lasts 1 min (as long as you maintain concentration) and applies to every attack you make during that minute. It's also radiant damage, works well vs undead ;)

[JobsforFun]

Thunderous smite is done after the first hit. Divine favor lasts 1 min (as long as you maintain concentration) and applies to every attack you make during that minute. It's also radiant damage, works well vs undead ;)

Don't they both last for 1 mintue? Both say their duration is "up to 1 min"?

[BiPolar]

Don't they both last for 1 mintue? Both say their duration is "up to 1 min"?

Thunderous smite's duration is how long you can hold it before releasing it, not how long the damage effects continue.

But in general, I've found the smites to really not be worth the concentration. You're much better off with a concentration buff (SoF, Bless, Divine Favor, etc.) Personally, I generally run SoF, Bless, or Protection from Good/Evil and save the other spell slots for Divine Smites and Command.

Command is awesome.

[tomato]

Paladin level 5 and 6 are arguably their most powerful levels. You gain an extra attack, effectively doubling your damage output, and you also gain your charisma mod as a bonus to saving throws for yourself and all allies within 10 feet of you. That is a massively powerful effect that is worth delaying multiclassing for.

Once you get to paladin 6, there are numerous multiclass options: Warlock or Sorcerer for better spells, fighter or rogue for more attack damage.

Regarding Thunderous Smite, it works differently from Divine Favor. Thunderous Smite acts as a buff you apply to only your next attack; you get the damage from the spell only once, and not to every attack you make for the duration. Divine Favor acts as a buff you apply to all attacks for the duration. One gives you temporary burst, the other gives you more damage over time. Both will eventually fall out of favor for other spells, but use what you like more.

[BiPolar]

Paladin level 5 and 6 are arguably their most powerful levels. You gain an extra attack, effectively doubling your damage output, and you also gain your charisma mod as a bonus to saving throws for yourself and all allies within 10 feet of you. That is a massively powerful effect that is worth delaying multiclassing for.

Once you get to paladin 6, there are numerous multiclass options: Warlock or Sorcerer for better spells, fighter or rogue for more attack damage.

Regarding Thunderous Smite, it works differently from Divine Favor. Thunderous Smite acts as a buff you apply to only your next attack; you get the damage from the spell only once, and not to every attack you make for the duration. Divine Favor acts as a buff you apply to all attacks for the duration. One gives you temporary burst, the other gives you more damage over time. Both will eventually fall out of favor for other spells, but use what you like more.

Agreed with the above. You don't want to consider multiclassing Paladin until after level 6.

The important thing to remember about Smite spells is that you are basically using them for their Riders and not their damage. Want/need an effect (prone, fear, anti-invisibility, etc.) then a Smite spell is a good idea. However, more often than not, the spell slot is better used as a Divine Smite. With my paladin, i've generally only kept Wraithful smite on my daily list and only rarely used it.

[JobsforFun]

Agreed with the above. You don't want to consider multiclassing Paladin until after level 6.

The important thing to remember about Smite spells is that you are basically using them for their Riders and not their damage. Want/need an effect (prone, fear, anti-invisibility, etc.) then a Smite spell is a good idea. However, more often than not, the spell slot is better used as a Divine Smite. With my paladin, i've generally only kept Wraithful smite on my daily list and only rarely used it.

Thanks, I might consider multi classing into another charisma focused class such as warlock or bard but that depends on the stuff paladins get past level 6 because I haven't looked to far into that.

What would be some good spells that I should get once I reach level 5 and 6? I don't have the PHB in-front of me so I am not sure what level of spells you get.

[BiPolar]

Thanks, I might consider multi classing into another charisma focused class such as warlock or bard but that depends on the stuff paladins get past level 6 because I haven't looked to far into that.

What would be some good spells that I should get once I reach level 5 and 6? I don't have the PHB in-front of me so I am not sure what level of spells you get.

Honestly, I don't think it matters much because you're more of a smite machine then a caster :)

I play a Vengeance paladin, and usually keep the following active:

1 - Bless, Command, Cure wounds, Protection from Evil and Good, SoF, Wraithful Smite
2 - Find Steed (dropping it if my mount remains alive or I don't see a need for the mount...which I usually don't), Magic Weapon (only if you don't have one)
3 - Blinding Smite

As I said above, I'm generally saving those slots for smites or running Bless, Protection, SoF. And although Command is a round less of attacks, it can completely remove a creature's actions from a battle and potentially give you advantage on the next attack round.

[JobsforFun]

Honestly, I don't think it matters much because you're more of a smite machine then a caster :)

I play a Vengeance paladin, and usually keep the following active:

1 - Bless, Command, Cure wounds, Protection from Evil and Good, SoF, Wraithful Smite
2 - Find Steed (dropping it if my mount remains alive or I don't see a need for the mount...which I usually don't), Magic Weapon (only if you don't have one)
3 - Blinding Smite

As I said above, I'm generally saving those slots for smites or running Bless, Protection, SoF. And although Command is a round less of attacks, it can completely remove a creature's actions from a battle and potentially give you advantage on the next attack round.

Would bless work with spells like cure wounds or healing word? I don't have it in-front of me I think it is saving throws and attack rolls only but I am not sure.

[BiPolar]

Would bless work with spells like cure wounds or healing word? I don't have it in-front of me I think it is saving throws and attack rolls only but I am not sure.

Bless gives you and 2 others (unless you use a higher level slot) an extra d4 on attacks and saving throws. It's independent of cure wounds and healing word.

Do you have a cleric in your party? They often run Bless, but in mine, it's up to me as the cleric is more of a damage dealer and uses his concentration for spirit guardians.

[JobsforFun]

Bless gives you and 2 others (unless you use a higher level slot) an extra d4 on attacks and saving throws. It's independent of cure wounds and healing word.

Do you have a cleric in your party? They often run Bless, but in mine, it's up to me as the cleric is more of a damage dealer and uses his concentration for spirit guardians.

We have a forge domain cleric (said above), he has healing spells but not sure about bless.

With the great weapon fighting type that lets you re-roll 1's and 2's on damage dice would that include the divine favor spell's d4?

[Fishyninja]

We have a forge domain cleric (said above), he has healing spells but not sure about bless.

With the great weapon fighting type that lets you re-roll 1's and 2's on damage dice would that include the divine favor spell's d4?

I've been told yes and no on this I think RAW it's yes, RAI is very DM dependant.
Another 2nd level spell to look at is Aid. 5hp and an increase of max HP (by 5) for 8 hours.
Now it doesn't seem like much but the fact you can stick it on three people is handy. Helps the squishier of the party survive.

[BiPolar]

I've been told yes and no on this I think RAW it's yes, RAI is very DM dependant.
Another 2nd level spell to look at is Aid. 5hp and an increase of max HP (by 5) for 8 hours.
Now it doesn't seem like much but the fact you can stick it on three people is handy. Helps the squishier of the party survive.

The reroll 1s and 2s is a tough one. RAW does seem to mean it is for ALL damage die, Jeremy Crawford said it's just for the Melee Weapon itself, but also said the reason behind that is because "rolling dice takes up time."

Personally, I don't buy that reasoning, and I like rolling dice :) And a Divine Smite is an expenditure of a very limited resource, so we reroll ALL damage die once if it is a 1 or 2.

But definitely discuss with your DM.

As for Aid, it's a great spell, but dropping one of your limited spell slots to give 5HP is a lot to ask. Yes, it's 3 creatures, but it's not a lot of HP. Maybe at lower levels it's worth it, ut you don't get that 2nd level slot until 5th level where those extra 5HP aren't a huge boon as they were earlier. But that doesn't mean it has no place :) I just never saw as much of a reason to drop that slot when I could use it to smite :)

I'm also a believer that the best defense is a good offense :)

[Fishyninja]

The reroll 1s and 2s is a tough one. RAW does seem to mean it is for ALL damage die, Jeremy Crawford said it's just for the Melee Weapon itself, but also said the reason behind that is because "rolling dice takes up time."

Personally, I don't buy that reasoning, and I like rolling dice :) And a Divine Smite is an expenditure of a very limited resource, so we reroll ALL damage die once if it is a 1 or 2.

But definitely discuss with your DM.

As for Aid, it's a great spell, but dropping one of your limited spell slots to give 5HP is a lot to ask. Yes, it's 3 creatures, but it's not a lot of HP. Maybe at lower levels it's worth it, ut you don't get that 2nd level slot until 5th level where those extra 5HP aren't a huge boon as they were earlier. But that doesn't mean it has no place :) I just never saw as much of a reason to drop that slot when I could use it to smite :)

I'm also a believer that the best defense is a good offense :)
Oh indeed I prefer a bit of bishy bashy too however you have got to look after the squishys.
And the nice thing about pally's....don't like a spell, don't prepare it :P

[JobsforFun]

Oh indeed I prefer a bit of bishy bashy too however you have got to look after the squishys.
And the nice thing about pally's....don't like a spell, don't prepare it :P

I know our cleric has AID, should I look into getting it as well then?

[BiPolar]

I know our cleric has AID, should I look into getting it as well then?

If the cleric has it prepared, I wouldn't. They have more spell slots to handle the casting of that and still be relevant. You drop that 2nd level slot and you've reduced your bishy bashy resources significantly :)

[Fishyninja]

If the cleric has it prepared, I wouldn't. They have more spell slots to handle the casting of that and still be relevant. You drop that 2nd level slot and you've reduced your bishy bashy resources significantly :)

As BiPolar states, no point both of you having it, and again the idea of Clerics and Pallys are Bishy Bashy Buff Monsters.
So make sure your buffs complement each other and muller the heck out of anything infront of you.