Artificer Problem

[Anderlith]

So i really like the Artificer class, the UA seems like its on the right track. What i dont like is the random magic items you gain as you level. One of my players is going to play an Alchemist & i'd rather give them some other ability instead. I was thinking of giving them something like Lore Bard Spell Secrets, but they dont get spells before they get the item so idk what to do. Give them the extra spell one level late or give her something else? What's a good replacement?

[StorytellerHero]

You can try this one. It's been through a few rounds of feedback and updates.

The design is based around dynamic tool crafting on the fly.

There's an alchemy-based archetype, a power suit based archetype, a gunslinging based archetype, and a robot companion archetype.

There is also a lot of supplemental material, including new feats, cheap magic items, and new magic spells.

http://www.dmsguild.com/product/204687/THE-ARTIFICER-5e-Revised

[Anderlith]

You can try this one. It's been through a few rounds of feedback and updates.

The design is based around dynamic tool crafting on the fly.

There's an alchemy-based archetype, a power suit based archetype, a gunslinging based archetype, and a robot companion archetype.

There is also a lot of supplemental material, including new feats, cheap magic items, and new magic spells.

http://www.dmsguild.com/product/204687/THE-ARTIFICER-5e-Revised

I dont want another version of the Artificer, just looking for some advice for swapping out a part

[Talionis]

My suggestion is to grant some other magic item not on the list you has Dm feel comfortable being an appropriate power level for your table. Have player give three suggestions you pick one. If player makes outlandish picks just pick something you find appropriate.

I'm hoping Arrificer changes to half caster whenprinted. I also agree Artificer needs a much larger list of spells to choose from.

[Maxilian]

What don't you like about the Magic Item part? (depending on what you don't like of it, its easier to tell you of a good substitude)

[Anderlith]

What don't you like about the Magic Item part? (depending on what you don't like of it, its easier to tell you of a good substitude)

It's lack luster & kind of contrived. Like they didnt want to give them crazy crafting rules so they let them just have preapproved magic items that the "crafted" in thier spare time. The list is kind of annoying because it's mostly just a bunch of boring utility items most people already want/have in games, like Handy Haversack.

[Fishyninja]

It's lack luster & kind of contrived. Like they didnt want to give them crazy crafting rules so they let them just have preapproved magic items that the "crafted" in thier spare time. The list is kind of annoying because it's mostly just a bunch of boring utility items most people already want/have in games, like Handy Haversack.
I'd argue that if you gave them weapons then it would break the game. I mean when you look at the Gunsmith they are getting a weapon that has the base damage of a greatsword (if I recall) They also get a magical ammo bag that refills and they can add extra damages to the firearm. It seems to me that the items they have utility wise are fine.

Also again depending on the DM some magic items are very common others not so much. I have only come across one magic item in all of my current games so far.

[tieren]

We noticed in our playtest that it doesn't specifically say the thunder cannon does magic damage (for purposes of overcoming resistance to non-magic items).

We decided to treat it like a pact weapon and do the magic damage, did anyone decide the other way?

[DivisibleByZero]

I would just make him an half-caster instead of the one-third progression that the have. That's how it should have been designed in the first place.
That also solves your problem in that they *will* have spells when they get that feature.


We noticed in our playtest that it doesn't specifically say the thunder cannon does magic damage (for purposes of overcoming resistance to non-magic items).

We decided to treat it like a pact weapon and do the magic damage, did anyone decide the other way?

That only matters at levels 1 & 2, when they aren't using a special shot. Once they get to level 3 and start using special shots, those all deal elemental damage. The first 2d6+Dex is piercing. After that they're using special shots, which are magic. So no, I don't see it as a problem.

[ad_hoc]

It's lack luster & kind of contrived. Like they didnt want to give them crazy crafting rules so they let them just have preapproved magic items that the "crafted" in thier spare time. The list is kind of annoying because it's mostly just a bunch of boring utility items most people already want/have in games, like Handy Haversack.

It sounds like the issue is that you play a high magic game with a ton of magic items, so the ability feels lacklustre in comparison.

I think this is a result of having those magic items. They're going to make any character of any class feel less powerful by comparison.

[Steampunkette]

What do you want the Artificer to be?

If you want them to be more casty, make them half-casters.

Do you want them to be more tinkerish? Give them some rogue-like tool usage. Bonus action interact with objects, faster lockpicking and trap disarming.

Do you want them to be flexible? Make a list of pseudo-invocations and let your PCs whip out different abilities.

Do you want them to change how they use their core mechanics? Provide some more options for their alchemy bag and thundercannon (not more damaging or harder to resist, but different areas or abilities).

[Anderlith]

It sounds like the issue is that you play a high magic game with a ton of magic items, so the ability feels lacklustre in comparison.

I think this is a result of having those magic items. They're going to make any character of any class feel less powerful by comparison.

Not really big on magic items but it's just that the ones the artificer gets are the more common ones that dont really give any one artificer much in the way of individuality. I'd prefer if they could choose stranger things, or have a handful of magical gadgets that were not quite full fledged magic items, or something.

[RaynorReynolds]

The items aren't random. They are on the list because they aren't crazy powerful but are still useful. I don't think the lore bard ability fits with the artificer.

[Talionis]

I'll respectfully disagree. Artificers see magic as a tool. They spend similar amounts of time studying science and magic as Wizards yet they are currently 1/3 casters. I could see the devotion to study as the artificer being able to learn any type of magic because he might need it to craft his items.

The artificer is far behind full casters. Bards don't break the game and they are full casters.

It makes perfect sense by fluff to me as much or more than for a Bard, Bard can add Wish this way. Is it balanced? That's a different question. But honestly I would like a bigger list of spells to choose from.

[ad_hoc]

Not really big on magic items but it's just that the ones the artificer gets are the more common ones that dont really give any one artificer much in the way of individuality. I'd prefer if they could choose stranger things, or have a handful of magical gadgets that were not quite full fledged magic items, or something.

The idea that any permanent magic items can be common and not differentiate a character from others in the party shows that you have a lot of magic items in your game.

Default 5e has very few magic items per character, especially early on.

[Anderlith]

So how do i go about making them half casters? Is there a comparable chart?

[toapat]

So how do i go about making them half casters? Is there a comparable chart?

the spell progression would be identical to a ranger's with a few more spells known. the problem is by 5th level alot of the thematically appropriate spells for artificer are already taken, and that filling out the 5th lvl options becomes much more difficult because of that.

[Anderlith]

the spell progression would be identical to a ranger's with a few more spells known. the problem is by 5th level alot of the thematically appropriate spells for artificer are already taken, and that filling out the 5th lvl options becomes much more difficult because of that.

How many spells known should they have? What should i add to the spells known list to buff it off?

[Talionis]

Small list something like

Animate Object
Creation
Legend Lore
Passwall
Teleportation Circle

The better progression and general feel of being more magical make sense to me.

[DivisibleByZero]

Don't even worry about it.
Most campaigns don't last that long, so you'll probably never even need to add any spells. If yours does happen to get to 17th+ level, you can worry about it then, and by that point you'll have a better understanding of which spells belong there.