View Full Version : Fighter vs. Warlock?

2007-07-25, 10:58 PM
Okay, my friend and I are having a discussion about who can outdamage who, Fighters or Warlocks at level 20.

He's sticking to Eldritch blast being channeled through melee attacks an end with more damage.

I'm saying that a fighter would wipe the floor, as far as damage output goes.

Anything is allowed, help me prove my point (or his)!

Jack Mann
2007-07-25, 11:04 PM
Fighter. Go with power attack, leap attack, and shock trooper with a greatsword. Start with 16 strength. Ups to 21 at level 20 through stat bumps, 26 from a tome, and +6 from an item makes it 32 for a +11 bonus.

He charges and attacks the target, power attacking for full. He hits for 2d6+76, before any other bonuses to damage. He'll also hit a lot more often. And won't be as squishy in combat.

I mean, both classes are pretty weak, but at least the fighter can contribute something, if he can reach it. And doesn't get dominated. Or hit by something bigger and stronger. But damage? Yeah, he does that a lot better than the warlock. That is not the fighter's problem.

2007-07-25, 11:07 PM
Depends exactly what you mean. The fighter would do more raw damage (power attack, leap attack, etc) than the warlock, but the warlock would do damage more reliably (eldritch blast is almost always effective, whereas charging can be difficult to set up at level 20). That being said, by 20 a warlock is probably more of a battlefield controller than a blaster.

2007-07-25, 11:49 PM
Jackman, couldnt the warlock go for the same combo and then do more with the channeled blast?

2007-07-25, 11:55 PM
The warlock could Maximize Quicken Eldritch Blast, then Maximize one. With Hellfire Warlock, that's 15d6 maximized twice, so 30x6 so 180. Empower em and you're doing even more, get a greater chausible of fel power and in one round you're doing:

Maximize Empower: 17d6/2+17d6(maximized), which is 59.5+102 = 161.5
Maximize Quicken Empower: Same as above, for another average of 161.5.

That's an average of 323 damage in one round, doable a few times per day.

Even a non maximized Eldtrich Blast is 59.5 average damage, on top of doing 2d6 extra damage a round, having a minimized chance to miss, ignoring spell resistance, and also having a save or something plopped on. Oh, and on top of that you can make it do AoE damage.

2007-07-26, 01:02 AM
What I always find interesting in talking about Warlocks is that people ignore the Chain Blast invocation... it's essentially iterative attacks as if you were a warrior, though you can't target the same individual twice. And it would be fairly cheap to make a staff-equivalent of it (Yeah, Warlock 12/Chameleon 2!) that will work indefinitely.

2007-07-26, 03:05 AM
Dark. Discorporation.

Immunity to weapon damage, among other things. And 4d6 points of damage per round that requires neither an attack roll from you or a saving throw from the opponent.

It lasts for 24 hours. Not to mention that a warlock with the right invocations can also be invisible while it's all going on.

Warlocks don't have to outdamage the fighter in a PVP fight.

Mistook the point of the excercise.

Now, in terms of sheer points, the fighter has an edge, but it's only possible damage, he still has to be in a position to deal it. Eldritch blast can drain levels, and it's a touch attack, which is much easier to make against enemies at that level (against most dragons you just have to avoid rolling a 1). For the most part I'd forgo the multiple attacks to be in a nice position while firing, at the max range of Eldritch Spear a warlock can be sitting pretty with improved invisibility, since blindsense is a very limited range ability.

Inyssius Tor
2007-07-26, 03:09 AM
Oh, of course, but this argument is about pure damage output, not overall superiority.

2007-07-26, 04:05 AM
Warlock. They can maximise blah blah blah, and do it in a Cone effect.

2007-07-26, 05:15 AM
If the warlock stands opposite the fighter and they take turns smaking the hell out of each other the warlock will get his ass handed to him in a sling, and he'll deserve it. By high level the fighter shouldn't even get a look at the warlock, invocations and sneakiness should cripple the fighter without them being able to swing at anything. The strengh of the fighter is slug it out combat, the warlock has options beyound that and just playing the fighters game by the fighters rules will end baddlty for them.