Next D&D Book: October 17th?

[jaappleton]

So my friend NewbieDM (That's @newbiedm on Twitter, give him a follow, great guy) found this just a moment ago.

https://twitter.com/newbiedm/status/842742603917524993

Could very well be a placeholder date, thats true. But its pretty consistent with the model WOTC has shown thus far in 5Es lifespan.

But... what is it?

LET THE SPECULATION BEGIN!

[Millstone85]

Manual of the Planes, Manual of the Planes, Manual of the Planes,
Manual of the Planes, Manual of the Planes, Manual of the Planes,
Manual of the Planes, Manual of the Planes, Manual of the Planes...


With infos on, well, the planes, but also various settings including Eberron, Dark Sun and Spelljammer.

Please.

[jaappleton]

Manual of the Planes, Manual of the Planes, Manual of the Planes,
Manual of the Planes, Manual of the Planes, Manual of the Planes,
Manual of the Planes, Manual of the Planes, Manual of the Planes...


With infos on, well, the planes, but also various settings including Eberron, Dark Sun and Spelljammer.

Please.

I'm right there with ya'.

[Sir cryosin]

Is it going to be the equivalent of a player handbook 2.
But it's going to be filled with more crunch like half of it's probably going to be four players and the other half is going to be for DM. I can't remember where I read it or heard it from but I heard that the that they were talking about doing a crunch book. Which would make sense due to all the Unearthed arcana that we got like one right after the other. I do believe the next few on Earth are cannas that we get are going to be things about like crafting and other and other stuff for DM's that will show up in this new book. But hey take this with a grain of salt because this is nothing but speculation and rumors.

[Sir cryosin]

Another reason for my speculations on my post above is if we do get something like planescape, spelljammer, dark Sun, Eberron. All needs a little bit rules tweaking to get the feel that they had in previous Editions brought in to 5e. So that's what I think this book is going to do you going to give us some more rules that we can use so when they come out with the books for these other campaign settings that it'll be a lot easier to run them.

[Steampunkette]

I'd be happy with a PHB2 with the psionic classes in it and all the new paths and revised ranger. Possibly as an expansion on FR's area for "Kingdoms of the East" with Halruaa and Thay fully fleshed out in the world-book portion. That way they could bring the "Mystic" (Or whatever classes spring from it) into the Sword Coast as a Foreigner.

Though a nice Manual of the Planes with Spelljammer, Eberron, Athas, and Sigil would also be pretty great.

[RSP]

I doubt a release 7 months from now has the Mystic/Psion. Crawford has stated multiple times a new class, like the Mystic, gets a ton of play test done, in house and by select NDA groups, AFTER they get the feedback from their surveys about what players of D&D want to see.

Take in account the survey gets posted a week after the UA is released, and that they're up for a month, then WotC needs to read through and analyze all that data, which for a popular class like the Mystic, should be a lot.

Then they need to tweak everything and push out round 1 of playtest, tweak everything again for round 2 of playtest, so on and so forth.

I doubt "extensive playtest" equals a couple months of work, seeing as publishing a book takes a lot of time, going through multiple drafts for typos, art work, rewrites and the actual printing.

I would imagine the book needs to be done, rules content-wise, probably at least 3 months prior to a release date, but it could be they make the placeholder when said rules content is sent for layout.

Not trying to ruin your day, but I doubt a new class makes an October release.

[jaappleton]

I doubt a release 7 months from now has the Mystic/Psion. Crawford has stated multiple times a new class, like the Mystic, gets a ton of play test done, in house and by select NDA groups, AFTER they get the feedback from their surveys about what players of D&D want to see.

Take in account the survey gets posted a week after the UA is released, and that they're up for a month, then WotC needs to read through and analyze all that data, which for a popular class like the Mystic, should be a lot.

Then they need to tweak everything and push out round 1 of playtest, tweak everything again for round 2 of playtest, so on and so forth.

I doubt "extensive playtest" equals a couple months of work, seeing as publishing a book takes a lot of time, going through multiple drafts for typos, art work, rewrites and the actual printing.

I would imagine the book needs to be done, rules content-wise, probably at least 3 months prior to a release date, but it could be they make the placeholder when said rules content is sent for layout.

Not trying to ruin your day, but I doubt a new class makes an October release.

I see your logic, and its pretty sound.

That said... No offense, but I really hope you're incorrect. :smallbiggrin:

[Typhon]

Manual of the planes, Eberron setting, Dark Sun setting, Planescape setting, anything not Forgotten Realms. Maybe a PHB2 or just a book of extended options for players and DMs.

[Sir cryosin]

I doubt a release 7 months from now has the Mystic/Psion. Crawford has stated multiple times a new class, like the Mystic, gets a ton of play test done, in house and by select NDA groups, AFTER they get the feedback from their surveys about what players of D&D want to see.

Take in account the survey gets posted a week after the UA is released, and that they're up for a month, then WotC needs to read through and analyze all that data, which for a popular class like the Mystic, should be a lot.

Then they need to tweak everything and push out round 1 of playtest, tweak everything again for round 2 of playtest, so on and so forth.

I doubt "extensive playtest" equals a couple months of work, seeing as publishing a book takes a lot of time, going through multiple drafts for typos, art work, rewrites and the actual printing.

I would imagine the book needs to be done, rules content-wise, probably at least 3 months prior to a release date, but it could be they make the placeholder when said rules content is sent for layout.

Not trying to ruin your day, but I doubt a new class makes an October release.

I see were your point and normaly that would be correct. But it would be a book of "CRUNCH" and won't need all the art work in other books. It may seems rushed but it not impossible. I also have a feeling that it will be a phb2 like book with most UA in it. It been around 3 years sent 5e came out and a vary large fan based wants a bit more options to classes, new classes, rules. Just like players wanted monster races and some more monsters we got volo's guide and it was well received. So I feel we could be getting a book with most if not all UA in it.

[rooneg]

I see were your point and normaly that would be correct. But it would be a book of "CRUNCH" and won't need all the art work in other books. It may seems rushed but it not impossible. I also have a feeling that it will be a phb2 like book with most UA in it. It been around 3 years sent 5e came out and a vary large fan based wants a bit more options to classes, new classes, rules. Just like players wanted monster races and some more monsters we got volo's guide and it was well received. So I feel we could be getting a book with most if not all UA in it.

You do realize the PHB is a book of "CRUNCH" and it's absolutely filled to the brim with art, right? I see literally no reason to believe that would change for the theoretical new book of player options.

[jaappleton]

Oh they have the artwork well in advance. That's all done, I think. I think all the fluff is done. So the only 'empty' part of the book is the crunch stuff, which... A lot should be finalized now. Most of the archetypes so far in UA should likely be all done. Cleric? Bard? Barbarian? Etc.

[xroads]

I'd love to see Dark Sun, Eberron, or Planescape make a come back. Or even Birthright.

I also wouldn't mind more fluff on Forgotten Realms. Particularly a book that updated and focused on the other lands of the Realm (ex. Kara-Tur).

[xroads]

Oh they have the artwork well in advance. That's all done, I think. I think all the fluff is done. So the only 'empty' part of the book is the crunch stuff, which... A lot should be finalized now. Most of the archetypes so far in UA should likely be all done. Cleric? Bard? Barbarian? Etc.

Ooohh... speaking of artwork. The artist in me wouldn't mind another "Art of D&D book" for my collection. :smallbiggrin:

[jaappleton]

HOLD ON A SECOND

So there's actually two items listed there. One for a smaller price, for $6 or $9, depending on if you have Prime.

WHAT IS THAT?!

My guess? A DM screen.

I think this is an adventure book!

[Typhon]

I wonder if it could be a full revision of the main books; cleaning up the wording, clarifying the main rules and mechanics, adding depth to features that people have been wanting, and adding more crunch to some of the overall game.

[Steampunkette]

HOLD ON A SECOND

So there's actually two items listed there. One for a smaller price, for $6 or $9, depending on if you have Prime.

WHAT IS THAT?!

My guess? A DM screen.

I think this is an adventure book!

So close after Yawning Portal?

I suppose it's possible. Yawning Portal isn't really an "Adventurer's League Jumping Off" point.

With it being in October, it's possible they might expand Ravenloft further. But that leaves Cryptic's Neverwinter in the cold.

[erok0809]

Based on previous releases, the player books (sword coast, Volo's) tend to come out in the winter, while the spring and fall releases tend to be modules, or at least module-like like Yawning Portal will be. So an October release will probably be the next module after Yawning Portal, I think, with the next player additions coming sometime in the winter.

[Steampunkette]

I imagine the next module could play SKT and go Sourcebook as well.

SKT introduces tons of information about various towns in the north, and gives lots of chances to expand outward from any of them, without quite getting into their history as deeply as, say, the SCAG did.

A campaign set in, say, Eberron could have a ton of information on the portion of the world it's set in, to give a loose idea of some of the changes since 3e/4e.

[DanyBallon]

If it's a PHB2 type book, Mystic will definately not be in it, unless they want to add the class as is. In order to have a street day release by mid october, and a FLGS release 2 weeks before, they muse receive the books not later than 3rd week of september. There's almost a month of shipping by boats from the printing press in China to different WotC warehouses over the world. Then the printing process will take at least a couple of weeks. This means that the final formating and editing must be sent by the end of July. This leave us only with a few month to playtest all the Mystic material and WotC analysing the surveys. And I believe that due to the extent of the class, there might be at least one revision of the Mystic before it's final release.

[jaappleton]

I think its an adventure book at this point.

I don't think Yawning Portal is going to be AL approved, really. I mean, the Tomb of Horrors isn't somewhere you send a beloved character when you have to face the consequences of what happens in there :smallbiggrin: I'm sure they'll allow them for one shots and such, but nothing there is really any sort of campaign, right?

So with STK have been released a bit back, going so long without an AL adventure seems VERY unlikely to me.

[Steampunkette]

Well... I dunno.

I could see them, maybe, making a discorporated AL season where characters are doing various dungeon delves around the world in between world-shaking crises. Releasing smaller dungeons and popcorn runs for AL play, maybe bringing back some of the older not-quite-classics that don't warrant and explosive re-release with a full color adventure path tied to them.

That said, I still think it's probably an adventure. I'm really hoping it's Dark Sun and they add in Psionics and a bunch of fluff on the City-State of Tyr... And yeah, I know it needs playtesting that would need to be finished by July at the latest. But they don't need to release the Mystic to release Psionics.

It would be pretty amazing if they recapped the major events from Freedom through the Dragon's Crown as a cohesive adventure path...

[Deleted]

You do realize the PHB is a book of "CRUNCH" and it's absolutely filled to the brim with art, right? I see literally no reason to believe that would change for the theoretical new book of player options.

There is quite a bit of art in the PHB that comes from 4e.

The female dwarven barbarian, the bard, and the ancient Paladin symbol thingie comes to mind. The male human barbarian might also be 4e but I'm not for sure.

I'm sure there is other art in the PHB that comes from previously made stuff and just edited to work in the PHB. I think this has been a running thing for a while now. 4e had Tome of Battle art and othet things scattered around.

But that being said, crunch doesnt mean the lack of fluff or art. 4e, what people tend to call the most crunch heavy, has more fluff that any other PHB since every martial, divine, and arcane ability has fluff (and not just the spells).

===edit===

I really want a PHB II that has a "build your own" martial, spellcaster, and psionic class that you can then multiclass by picking subclasses from a general list.

Subclass at 2, 7, 12, 17.

[rooneg]

I think its an adventure book at this point.

I don't think Yawning Portal is going to be AL approved, really. I mean, the Tomb of Horrors isn't somewhere you send a beloved character when you have to face the consequences of what happens in there :smallbiggrin: I'm sure they'll allow them for one shots and such, but nothing there is really any sort of campaign, right?

So with STK have been released a bit back, going so long without an AL adventure seems VERY unlikely to me.

You're incorrect. Yawning Portal is 100% AL legal. I agree, it's kind of insane and if I had a high enough level character I wouldn't bring them anywhere near Tomb of Horrors, but apparently That's The Plan (tm).

That said, the Yawning Portal season is going to be super short, like 3 months, half the length of a usual AL season, so take that into account when speculating.

[Oramac]

Well..........the Critical Role Sourcebook is scheduled to release August 19th-ish for Gen Con. It's not officially a WOTC product, but it is written in 5th Edition rules.

Other than that, I'd love to see a PHB2 in October! But I'm not holding my breath.

[jaappleton]

Know what....? I just realized something.

The rule for AL is "PHB +1", right? So you can use stuff from the PHB and Elemental Evil, or PHB and Volo's, or, PHB and SCAG, etc. But you can never use more than one thing in addition to the PHB.

Why is that? I think its to prevent stacking. "Well if I take A from this book, and B from this book, and C from this book, and D from that supplement, I have something that should never be allowed!" They're being VERY careful about maintaining balance. Sure, mathematically, some things are superior to others. But overall? The PHB is pretty darn solid. And they don't want to mess with that. The PHB is the base line, and they're only willing to let things get so far above that base line.

So, considering that...

I don't think we'll get another PHB.

I think the PHB is the PHB and that is that. That's all there is. Everything else we get will be the +1.

Its purely speculative, maybe eventually when they have enough supplemental material out they'll 'revise' the PHB with additional content. But I don't think we're going to get a full "PHB 2". And if we do get it, I think its quite a few years out, like 3+ years away.

[DanyBallon]

Know what....? I just realized something.

The rule for AL is "PHB +1", right? So you can use stuff from the PHB and Elemental Evil, or PHB and Volo's, or, PHB and SCAG, etc. But you can never use more than one thing in addition to the PHB.

Why is that? I think its to prevent stacking. "Well if I take A from this book, and B from this book, and C from this book, and D from that supplement, I have something that should never be allowed!" They're being VERY careful about maintaining balance. Sure, mathematically, some things are superior to others. But overall? The PHB is pretty darn solid. And they don't want to mess with that. The PHB is the base line, and they're only willing to let things get so far above that base line.

So, considering that...

I don't think we'll get another PHB.

I think the PHB is the PHB and that is that. That's all there is. Everything else we get will be the +1.

Its purely speculative, maybe eventually when they have enough supplemental material out they'll 'revise' the PHB with additional content. But I don't think we're going to get a full "PHB 2". And if we do get it, I think its quite a few years out, like 3+ years away.

It would make sense

As far as I'm concerned, I prefer new cruch to be tied to setting specific fluff, kind of what SCAG provide. So in this regard, I would be more than happy with a Manual of the Planes with new archetypes, like someone already sugested in another thread.

[jaappleton]

It would make sense

As far as I'm concerned, I prefer new cruch to be tied to setting specific fluff, kind of what SCAG provide. So in this regard, I would be more than happy with a Manual of the Planes with new archetypes, like someone already sugested in another thread.

I think that was me. :smalltongue:

[Steampunkette]

I dunno...

A PHB2 would be just as balanced as any other sourcebook provided. I could see it being PHB+1 and the PHB2 being simply considered another +1. Alternatively, I could see The PHB2 being it's own base. So PHB2+1 other could be a thing.

That said, it's probably never going to be "PHB2" by name. I have a feeling they'll add the content in like they did with SCAG. A new sourcebook with some crunch and plenty of setting-specific fluff.

After all, they don't need the chapters on races, character creation, skill use, feats, combat, exploration, healing and dying, the status effects appendix, and so on. So that much space in a "PHB2" style book could be setting-specific information.

Heck, maybe we'll get something like Volo's for the PC races and classes from the PHB with the introduction of new classes, before the rest of the book is Dark Sun or Eberron info.

[rooneg]

Know what....? I just realized something.

The rule for AL is "PHB +1", right? So you can use stuff from the PHB and Elemental Evil, or PHB and Volo's, or, PHB and SCAG, etc. But you can never use more than one thing in addition to the PHB.

Why is that? I think its to prevent stacking. "Well if I take A from this book, and B from this book, and C from this book, and D from that supplement, I have something that should never be allowed!" They're being VERY careful about maintaining balance. Sure, mathematically, some things are superior to others. But overall? The PHB is pretty darn solid. And they don't want to mess with that. The PHB is the base line, and they're only willing to let things get so far above that base line.

So, considering that...

I don't think we'll get another PHB.

I think the PHB is the PHB and that is that. That's all there is. Everything else we get will be the +1.

Its purely speculative, maybe eventually when they have enough supplemental material out they'll 'revise' the PHB with additional content. But I don't think we're going to get a full "PHB 2". And if we do get it, I think its quite a few years out, like 3+ years away.

It's certainly possible, but they're also creating an awful lot of potential new subclasses in the UA stuff right now. I'd be surprised if those all dribbled out over the course of years. I mean sure, some of them probably get cut, never see the light of day, etc, but it's still a LOT of content. I'd be surprised if we didn't see at least one book with considerably more player focused content than SCAG had, for example. It may still be a setting book of some sort (i.e. Eberron, or Dark Sun, or Manual of the Planes with stuff from a bunch of different worlds), but it seems likely there will be something with a bunch of player options in it.

[Sir cryosin]

I don't like calling it phb2 because they have said if they make a book like that it will not be called phb2. Also I think the so called phb2 will be more akin to dmg. With player options aka UA archetypes. And what I mean by CRUNCH is updated rules, new ones and just more technical stuff about running the game. Not so much about lore and fluff. So I think we might get a dmg2 with player options.

[DivisibleByZero]

I don't expect a PHB2.
Look at the placeholder price. The PHB/DMG/MM released at much higher costs. The larger Adventure modules released at much higher costs. The only things that actually released at those lower costs were SCAG and Volo's, if I'm not mistaken. So I expect another setting specific book similar to SCAG that has some player options, but isn't filled with them. I also don't expect it to be a different setting at that price.
Then again, that placeholder price might be wrong and none of my theorizing on it will matter.

[jaappleton]

It's certainly possible, but they're also creating an awful lot of potential new subclasses in the UA stuff right now. I'd be surprised if those all dribbled out over the course of years. I mean sure, some of them probably get cut, never see the light of day, etc, but it's still a LOT of content. I'd be surprised if we didn't see at least one book with considerably more player focused content than SCAG had, for example. It may still be a setting book of some sort (i.e. Eberron, or Dark Sun, or Manual of the Planes with stuff from a bunch of different worlds), but it seems likely there will be something with a bunch of player options in it.

Right, but we've all been convinced they're for ONE book, haven't we? We never considered the possibility of the content being spread out across multiple books. Even so, if it IS in a singular book, it could be (As I stated in various topics) that its a Manual of the Planes. "Here's Eberron, where you can expect to encounter the Artificer! And here's Dragonlance, where you might find a Forge Domain Cleric!", etc. That STILL means PHB +1, which prevents "Volo's + PHB + Manual of the Planes".

We're saying the same thing. If its one book for all this content, I just don't think its a PHB.... And it really can't be a PHB, can it? They'd have to reprint the actual classes. They're not going to do that. They're not printing PHB 2 and still including Cleric in it. They might have more Domains, but they won't include the whole base Cleric class.

[rooneg]

Right, but we've all been convinced they're for ONE book, haven't we? We never considered the possibility of the content being spread out across multiple books. Even so, if it IS in a singular book, it could be (As I stated in various topics) that its a Manual of the Planes. "Here's Eberron, where you can expect to encounter the Artificer! And here's Dragonlance, where you might find a Forge Domain Cleric!", etc. That STILL means PHB +1, which prevents "Volo's + PHB + Manual of the Planes".

We're saying the same thing. If its one book for all this content, I just don't think its a PHB.... And it really can't be a PHB, can it? They'd have to reprint the actual classes. They're not going to do that. They're not printing PHB 2 and still including Cleric in it. They might have more Domains, but they won't include the whole base Cleric class.

That's what I mean by "dribbled out over the course of years". If they keep to the current scheme they do 1 non-adventure book a year. If that book has a SCAG level amount of player options, or even a Volo's Guide level of them (is Volo's Guide more player stuff? Probably a little bit by page count, the SCAG stuff has a bunch of fluff mixed in with the crunch) it would take years to burn through their current crop of UA stuff.

[DanyBallon]

Right, but we've all been convinced they're for ONE book, haven't we? We never considered the possibility of the content being spread out across multiple books. Even so, if it IS in a singular book, it could be (As I stated in various topics) that its a Manual of the Planes. "Here's Eberron, where you can expect to encounter the Artificer! And here's Dragonlance, where you might find a Forge Domain Cleric!", etc. That STILL means PHB +1, which prevents "Volo's + PHB + Manual of the Planes".

We're saying the same thing. If its one book for all this content, I just don't think its a PHB.... And it really can't be a PHB, can it? They'd have to reprint the actual classes. They're not going to do that. They're not printing PHB 2 and still including Cleric in it. They might have more Domains, but they won't include the whole base Cleric class.

As for the name PHB2, it is possible to do so without reprinting everything from PHB, they've done this before. PHB2 for 3.5 was exactly this, some new classes, and new options for existing classes.

[jaappleton]

As for the name PHB2, it is possible to do so without reprinting everything from PHB, they've done this before. PHB2 for 3.5 was exactly this, some new classes, and new options for existing classes.

....Similar to how Goliath was included with Volo's, despite being in Elemental Evil previously.

Hmm....

I just don't see them padding the book like that. Totally possible, though. But I really think they're sticking with that "This is the PHB, this is our base line, nothing goes too far beyond that" mentality. I think that's pretty much gospel over there.

[rooneg]

As for the name PHB2, it is possible to do so without reprinting everything from PHB, they've done this before. PHB2 for 3.5 was exactly this, some new classes, and new options for existing classes.

Yes, but they've already said that they don't want a "book of new player options" to be called PHB2 because new players find it confusing. They pick up PHB2 because they think it's version 2 of the PHB, and of course you want the most recent version.

[Typhon]

I could definitely see a settings compendium such as the manual of the planes.

[jaappleton]

Yes, but they've already said that they don't want a "book of new player options" to be called PHB2 because new players find it confusing. They pick up PHB2 because they think it's version 2 of the PHB, and of course you want the most recent version.

I think there's also an accessibility aspect to it.

When I first decided to jump into D&D, 4th Edition was out. I went with 4E because of A) The Acq Inc games and B) Because I could get ALL the content with D&D Insider.

It was that, or buy a crapton of books and spend a LOT more money.

I looked at 3.X before making the decision, and there were so many books there, too. Honestly, I felt a bit overwhelmed, even intimidated when it came to getting my feet wet.

I think they're trying to eliminate that with 5E. To play, you need the PHB. If you want to get another book to tack on to it, cool. If not, no biggie. Its a way to draw new players into the hobby, I think. Honestly, its a smart play by WOTC.

[Stan]

The rule for AL is "PHB +1", right? So you can use stuff from the PHB and Elemental Evil, or PHB and Volo's, or, PHB and SCAG, etc. But you can never use more than one thing in addition to the PHB.

Why is that? I think its to prevent stacking....

Yea, the most broken things in 3e were often made from combining bits from different sourcebooks that were never meant to be combined. Also, the work to balance everything in a new book with everything in the PHB is enough work without trying to playtest everything vs everything. They snuffed that out from the beginning of 5e.

However, they could change the rule to PHB, (whatever new crunch book is called), +1.

Really though, I don't know how much AL is in their thoughts when they think about the publishing line. It's a big group but it's still a small proportion of the buyers. They probably expect AL to adapt to published material than vice versa.

[rooneg]

Yea, the most broken things in 3e were often made from combining bits from different sourcebooks that were never meant to be combined. Also, the work to balance everything in a new book with everything in the PHB is enough work without trying to playtest everything vs everything. They snuffed that out from the beginning of 5e.

However, they could change the rule to PHB, (whatever new crunch book is called), +1.

Really though, I don't know how much AL is in their thoughts when they think about the publishing line. It's a big group but it's still a small proportion of the buyers. They probably expect AL to adapt to published material than vice versa.

The core 5e designers (not the AL admins, the people at WotC working on the game itself) have basically said that they're on board with PHB+1 as an answer to this sort of problem. They don't want to set themselves up for a world where they have to test every single new class/feat/race/whatever with every single other one. The idea being that in a home game the DM can just say "no, that's busted you can't use it", but in an organized play setting you don't want to do case by case bannings or nerfings, so instead you just fall back to PHB+1.

So I wouldn't expect a PHB+PHB2+1 to be in the works. WotC has basically already said they don't want to, and they're the ones who call the shots on such things in AL.

[Stan]

The core 5e designers (not the AL admins, the people at WotC working on the game itself) have basically said that they're on board with PHB+1 as an answer to this sort of problem. They don't want to set themselves up for a world where they have to test every single new class/feat/race/whatever with every single other one. The idea being that in a home game the DM can just say "no, that's busted you can't use it", but in an organized play setting you don't want to do case by case bannings or nerfings, so instead you just fall back to PHB+1.

So I wouldn't expect a PHB+PHB2+1 to be in the works. WotC has basically already said they don't want to, and they're the ones who call the shots on such things in AL.

You're basically implying a slippery slope argument. Adding a phb2, so you can use two specified books plus any third, does not open the floodgates to allowing everything. I just posted that they don't want to test everything vs everything.

I really don't think they are doing a pure crunch book, that would be a phb2 with a different name. But I don't think AL is the reason; it likely has to do with how they are now treating D&D as a brand and how they want the game relatively simple in the hopes of many new buyers if the movie does well.

[rooneg]

You're basically implying a slippery slope argument. Adding a phb2, so you can use two specified books plus any third, does not open the floodgates to allowing everything. I just posted that they don't want to test everything vs everything.

I really don't think they are doing a pure crunch book, that would be a phb2 with a different name. But I don't think AL is the reason; it likely has to do with how they are now treating D&D as a brand and how they want the game relatively simple in the hopes of many new buyers if the movie does well.

It's not only the testing combinatorics though, it's also "how many books does a new player need to not feel like a chump when they sit down at a game with experienced players who own everything". If you double the amount of core content that can be combined with any arbitrary +1 book you've doubled the buy in and also increased the amount of combinatoric testing needed. It's a mostly linear increase, but it's still an increase.

[Deleted]

Yes, but they've already said that they don't want a "book of new player options" to be called PHB2 because new players find it confusing. They pick up PHB2 because they think it's version 2 of the PHB, and of course you want the most recent version.

Because no company has ever said something to play lip service and then later changed their mind because people are almost begging them to (or becauae they know they will make money).

[Ninjadeadbeard]

You know what I want most during this edition?

A new setting.

Planescape, Eberron, Darksun, Spelljammer, Ravenloft and others* are all great settings with loads of cool stuff. But I would like to see a new one too, to expand the canon as it were. A New Setting Handbook would be just a treat!

*Faerun isn't on the list, obviously

[rooneg]

Because no company has ever said something to play lip service and then later changed their mind because people are almost begging them to (or becauae they know they will make money).

Considering that WotC has been remarkably consistent regarding what they've said and done over the course of this edition, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt, especially considering the complete lack of contrary evidence.

[jaappleton]

Considering that WotC has been remarkably consistent regarding what they've said and done over the course of this edition, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt, especially considering the complete lack of contrary evidence.

Plus WOTC has an entirely new person running it. Chris *****, formerly of Microsoft. He joins and since then, there's been big pushes on the digital front; Fantasy Grounds, Roll20, the new D&D Beyond...

So don't expect the same ol', same ol' from WOTC anymore.

EDIT: Really, thats his last name! Starts with a 'c', ends in 's'.

[rooneg]

Plus WOTC has an entirely new person running it. Chris *****, formerly of Microsoft. He joins and since then, there's been big pushes on the digital front; Fantasy Grounds, Roll20, the new D&D Beyond...

So don't expect the same ol', same ol' from WOTC anymore.

EDIT: Really, thats his last name! Starts with a 'c', ends in 's'.

I will believe this when I see it. So far, the only hint of anything new is the D&D Beyond thing, which itself fits into the 5e plan of "small in-house team doing development and coordination, mostly of biannual seasonal storylines, outsource lots of stuff to 3rd parties". I expect a lot more change in the parts of WotC's business that are MTG related, specifically the digital stuff related to MTG, which seems to be getting it's clock cleaned by a variety of competitors.

[Asha Leu]

I'm hoping for, in descending order:

1) A big setting-neutral (or multi-setting) sourcebook filled with a variety of different crunch - races, classes and subclasses, feats, spells and maybe some more monsters (As awesome as Volo's was, it still seemed deficient in a few areas - such as the total lack of new goblin variants).

2) A Dark Sun sourcebook. It's always been my favourite non-homebrew setting and would be a perfect place for an official release of the Mystic. Plus it would surely have to have a few new monsters too, and you can never have too many monsters.

3) An Eberron sourcebook. I haven't really had any experience either playing or DMing in Eberron (I was too young and living in to isolated an area to have much of a chance to splurge on non-core books back in the 3.5 days, and I had basically given up on 4E by the time that Eberron book was been released), but I've always thought the setting looked really interesting. Plus it seems a natural fit what with UA's releases of the Artificer and Mystic.

4) A more specific themed splatbook. Something focussed on Demons or Undead or Seafaring Adventures or Wintery Locales or whatever. Given how sporadically we get new 5E content, I'd far prefer something more generic, but I'll take what I can get when it comes to 5E sourcebooks.

5) Another Yawning Portal type collection of shorter, unconnected adventures. I'm not too fussed on whether they are originals or remakes.

6) If it *must* be a single adventure path, then something much shorter than the norm would be a blessed release. Say, more the length of the Sword Coast Adventurers Guide than Storm King's Thunder.


What I definitely do not want:

- Yet another enormous, 15-level long adventure. Those mammoth hardcovers would have worked if they are only an occasional thing, a special release between more regular shorter adventures, but I don't think the 300-page, levels 1-12 module is a natural fit for your standard published adventure.

Each one is such a big investment, both in money and time spent playing them, and the sheer length means that they are either really railroady or shambling, labyrinth "sandboxes" that require so much extra work from the DM that you might as well just write their own campaign. Either way, they are pretty useless if you DM for groups that prefer more player-driven games and are likely to go off the rails in bizarre ways.

- Basically anything exclusively focussed on the Forgotten Realms. Enough already!

[DanyBallon]

What I definitely do not want:

- Yet another enormous, 15-level long adventure. Those mammoth hardcovers would have worked if they are only an occasional thing, a special release between more regular shorter adventures, but I don't think the 300-page, levels 1-12 module is a natural fit for your standard published adventure.

Each one is such a big investment, both in money and time spent playing them, and the sheer length means that they are either really railroady or shambling, labyrinth "sandboxes" that require so much extra work from the DM that you might as well just write their own campaign. Either way, they are pretty useless if you DM for groups that prefer more player-driven games and are likely to go off the rails in bizarre ways.

- Basically anything exclusively focussed on the Forgotten Realms. Enough already!

Considering the popularity of Pathfinder adventure path, I understand why WotC went with campaign type adventure released every 6 month. Compared to Paizo adventure path, they cost less overall. But I feel they haven't yet reached the quality of Paizo's as far as story goes. SKT, CoS, OoA and PotA where close though.

As far as all adventure being set in the Sword Coast, I thought that it was to facilitate the relationship with NWN Online, but Tales of the Yawning Portal is a departure from this model, so we may now be up for something completely different next fall :smallsmile:

[Anderlith]

I feel like it will be like the Swordcoast book, where it covers the Planes for the DM & then gives Player options, where each one showcases a class/class option from that plane. So they'll give a blurb of Eberron, then show the Artificer. Then they'll show Dark Sun & give us the Mystic. Maybe the Elemental Planes & then the elemental Sorcerer options etc. Other class options will be sprinkled into whatever they can best fit.

So a book half for DMs, with new trap rules etc. An overview of all the Planes, & a bit of player options places in each blurb. I feel like WOTC is moving away from having just DM books & just Player books

[Mortis_Elrod]

You know what I want most during this edition?

A new setting.

Planescape, Eberron, Darksun, Spelljammer, Ravenloft and others* are all great settings with loads of cool stuff. But I would like to see a new one too, to expand the canon as it were. A New Setting Handbook would be just a treat!

*Faerun isn't on the list, obviously

I'd like a new setting too, anyone know how long its been since we had one?

[Millstone85]

I'd like a new setting too, anyone know how long its been since we had one?I think the last one was 4e's default setting, sometimes known as Points of Light, Nentir Vale or The Dawn War. That was 9 years ago.

[jaappleton]

I think the last one was 4e's default setting, sometimes known as Points of Light, Nentir Vale or The Dawn War. That was 9 years ago.

And didn't they also kinda... un-do all of it? Something about the Sundering?

[jaappleton]

I feel like it will be like the Swordcoast book, where it covers the Planes for the DM & then gives Player options, where each one showcases a class/class option from that plane. So they'll give a blurb of Eberron, then show the Artificer. Then they'll show Dark Sun & give us the Mystic. Maybe the Elemental Planes & then the elemental Sorcerer options etc. Other class options will be sprinkled into whatever they can best fit.

So a book half for DMs, with new trap rules etc. An overview of all the Planes, & a bit of player options places in each blurb. I feel like WOTC is moving away from having just DM books & just Player books

I'm inclined to agree. I think that is what we'll get.

Though two pages on Eberron and then the Artificer doesn't do Eberron justice. It doesn't do ANY setting justice. I'm hoping they're able to really flesh things out.

[Millstone85]

And didn't they also kinda... un-do all of it? Something about the Sundering?Why yes, but then it was further undone by the Mourning of Cyre and the Devastation of Athas.

More seriously, WotC did try to make Forgotten Realms as similar to Points of Light as they dared.

The Spellplague jumbled the Astral Plane and the Outer Planes so they would now be the Astral Sea, and the Inner Planes so they would now be the Elemental Chaos. Then Asmodeus ended the Blood War by somehow throwing the Abyss into the Elemental Chaos. It was also revealed that a Dawn War had occurred at some point.

But in Points of Light, the Astral Sea was always the Astral Sea, the Elemental Chaos was always the Elemental Chaos, and the Abyss was created during the Dawn War when a god threw a shard of pure evil at the primordials. It is a different setting with its own take on the cosmology and it has not been updated with any Sundering.

Now me, I am more of a "settings as planets, same planes" kind of a guy, so I can dream of Planescape and Spelljammer adventures. But sometimes, that's just not meant to be.

Edit: Points of Light also borrows from other settings. Here is my favourite quote from 4e.
Bane vs Bane
The Bane of the core D&D® setting is not the same god as the Bane of the Forgotten Realms® setting! Oh, there's substantial conceptual overlap. (The matching names probably clued you in on that.) They serve roughly the same purpose in the pantheons, their religious precepts have a great deal in common, and they make use of similar tactics and servitors.
Yet their differences are many as well, especially in terms of personal history, behavior, and even appearance. All that follows describes the core Bane, and it shouldn't necessarily apply to the Bane of Faerûn.I was like "Oh, I get it now!" but at the same time "**** you! Why did I have to find that clarification in a magazine? And why not use a different name to begin with?".

[Deleted]

You know what I want most during this edition?

A new setting.

Planescape, Eberron, Darksun, Spelljammer, Ravenloft and others* are all great settings with loads of cool stuff. But I would like to see a new one too, to expand the canon as it were. A New Setting Handbook would be just a treat!

*Faerun isn't on the list, obviously

That would require them to be able to either have the talent or evaluate talent of others. WotC hasn't exactly filled me with confidence into their skill evaluation abilities.

Maybe I just expect better for the stuff I spend money on, but there is no way I'm dropping 40-60 smackers on a setting book that is backed by WotC.

Spelljammer already has a lot of good fan support that I doubt WotC can top.

One of the reasons I'm diving into Numenera so much is because the setting is absolutely awesome. The whole dying earth vibe (dirt isn't dirt, love it) and techno/magic blend is just a breath of fresh air.

So while I agree... I would be very sceptical of anything wotc puts out.

[Mortis_Elrod]

That would require them to be able to either have the talent or evaluate talent of others. WotC hasn't exactly filled me with confidence into their skill evaluation abilities.

Maybe I just expect better for the stuff I spend money on, but there is no way I'm dropping 40-60 smackers on a setting book that is backed by WotC.

Spelljammer already has a lot of good fan support that I doubt WotC can top.

One of the reasons I'm diving into Numenera so much is because the setting is absolutely awesome. The whole dying earth vibe (dirt isn't dirt, love it) and techno/magic blend is just a breath of fresh air.

So while I agree... I would be very sceptical of anything wotc puts out.

That reminds me that i need to get back into that. I loved Numenera, mechanics and setting and all

[Deleted]

That reminds me that i need to get back into that. I loved Numenera, mechanics and setting and all

I was worried at first the mechanics would be convoluted and choppy... But hot dang is it pretty simple.

I don't think there is a better setting. People may like different aettings but the love, care, and devotion that went into the setting isn't matched.

[Anderlith]

If they did release a new setting i figure we would see surveys first.

[BillyBobShorton]

I think its an adventure book at this point.

I don't think Yawning Portal is going to be AL approved, really. I mean, the Tomb of Horrors isn't somewhere you send a beloved character when you have to face the consequences of what happens in there :smallbiggrin: I'm sure they'll allow them for one shots and such, but nothing there is really any sort of campaign, right?

So with STK have been released a bit back, going so long without an AL adventure seems VERY unlikely to me.

Face, meet egg.

Do they really need to write in the "how to" when it comes to tying the YP dungeons together? This is a game of imagination, not a cookbook. Where I play, and DM, for AL, there are 8 tables all with their own spin on YP. Most of them are tying things together between dungeons to varying degrees. And AL has even started releasing connection 1-shots.

But generally, coming up with the continuity is for the players and DM's to do. WotC has provided the blueprint. And as with most of their 5e stuff, right down to the DMG, MM, and PHB, it's all foundations a guidelines. Creativity, man...

Anyway... more to the OP: so I watched the Stream of Annihilation preview on Dungeon Life's youtube page and unless I misunderstood something, they seem to indicate that much of the art they've drawn up over the years was part of a long-term (loose) release schedule concept... and they stated that the artwork they show during the actual video is indicative of what's in their next release...


The artwork was a street-level busy street in a golden majestic city with commoners of varying races doing the usual hustle&bustle of big city fantasy life, however... many of them were using dinosaurs as mounts, pets, cart-pullers, etc...

I'm not uber-versed in much of the Canon D&D lore and worlds. Can anyone shed some light on what this may indicate? Or let me know if I just heard the whole thing wrong?

[Khrysaes]

Face, meet egg.

Do they really need to write in the "how to" when it comes to tying the YP dungeons together? This is a game of imagination, not a cookbook. Where I play, and DM, for AL, there are 8 tables all with their own spin on YP. Most of them are tying things together between dungeons to varying degrees. And AL has even started releasing connection 1-shots.

But generally, coming up with the continuity is for the players and DM's to do. WotC has provided the blueprint. And as with most of their 5e stuff, right down to the DMG, MM, and PHB, it's all foundations a guidelines. Creativity, man...

Anyway... more to the OP: so I watched the Stream of Annihilation preview on Dungeon Life's youtube page and unless I misunderstood something, they seem to indicate that much of the art they've drawn up over the years was part of a long-term (loose) release schedule concept... and they stated that the artwork they show during the actual video is indicative of what's in their next release...


The artwork was a street-level busy street in a golden majestic city with commoners of varying races doing the usual hustle&bustle of big city fantasy life, however... many of them were using dinosaurs as mounts, pets, cart-pullers, etc...

I'm not uber-versed in much of the Canon D&D lore and worlds. Can anyone shed some light on what this may indicate? Or let me know if I just heard the whole thing wrong?

Chult is an jungle covered Island/Peninsula(Depending on edition of D&D) in Faerun that has a bunch of dinosaurs present. Note that there are also ships in the image, which helps make this part believable. Lots of Yuanti live on Chult.

In Eberron, Talenta Plains and Q'Barra have dinosaurs around too. In Talenta, Halflings ride them around as mounts. This is more unlikely. There would probably be a full on Eberron release rather than one specific to Talenta, and Chult is already there in the Forgotten Realms to make it tie in with the rest of the releases so far.

[Beechgnome]

Yeah, I've seen Chult mentioned in other forums as well. Evidently the last Drizzt book dropped some hints too. So we may be getting more Forgotten Realms, only with more dinosaurs, yuan ti and possibly Dendar the Night Serpent at the end of things.

[BillyBobShorton]

Chult is an jungle covered Island/Peninsula(Depending on edition of D&D) in Faerun that has a bunch of dinosaurs present. Note that there are also ships in the image, which helps make this part believable. Lots of Yuanti live on Chult.

In Eberron, Talenta Plains and Q'Barra have dinosaurs around too. In Talenta, Halflings ride them around as mounts. This is more unlikely. There would probably be a full on Eberron release rather than one specific to Talenta, and Chult is already there in the Forgotten Realms to make it tie in with the rest of the releases so far.

Thanks! Hopefully it's part of being on the right track. I'd love to (as well as many moon druids) see something like that!

[Tetrasodium]

There would probably be a full on Eberron release rather than one specific to Talenta, and Chult is already there in the Forgotten Realms to make it tie in with the rest of the releases so far.

You are probably correct, but ebberon could have individual books for a lot of things. I'd love to see an eberron themed version of the MM done volo's style, a book for droaam & shadowmarches. & maybe a book on the 5 nations, a book on different time periods during the war, maybe a book on the purge & similar interesting events in eberron's massive timeline, plus a book onthe eberron planes (ie not FR's ffs) since Keith Baker seems interested in writing one.

[jaappleton]

How appropriate to claim I have egg on my face for purely speculating on something several weeks ago, after having been the one to brought it to the forums attention to begin with, when nobody else was aware something was being released.

How dare I. What an moron I am.

/sarcasm

Or, y'know, look about three or four posts past my original one and see that rooneg already informed me that Yawning Portal was AL Legal months ago.

[Fishybugs]

Chult is an jungle covered Island/Peninsula(Depending on edition of D&D) in Faerun that has a bunch of dinosaurs present. Note that there are also ships in the image, which helps make this part believable. Lots of Yuanti live on Chult.


On the D&D podcast, they've been talking about a new adventure coming out later this year. Strangely, they have also done a Lore You Should Know segment on Chult.

If you guys aren't listening to this podcast, it's definitely worth a listen.

[BillyBobShorton]

Why is nobody talking about the Tomb of Annihilation!!!?????

http://geekandsundry.com/wizards-of-the-coast-announce-new-storyline-tomb-of-annihilation/

[MrPlunderloot]

I'd love if they added Dragonlance, tho they didn't add it for the 4e rulebooks.... hopefully Dragonlance does not go the way of the dinosaur as well. That being said i believe that a PHB II will be years away tho a revised PHB or DMG is not entirely out of the question. I like the idea of a Manual of the Planes, tho the Book of Vile Darkness and Book of Exalted Deeds would also be way up there. just some wishful thinking on my part.

Another great option would be a revised version of Oriental Adventures that I'm sure would be very much appreciated! I am currently using lore from the 3.0/3.5e Oriental Adventures mixed withsome 4e/5e lore changes and using Kara Tur for my first campaign. I like the idea of doing something away from te norm, so my adventureres are a group of "witch hunters" (think Geralt of Rivia or the Grey Wardens). We didn't start in a tavern either as i noticed the 78% start in a tavern.... that is kinda lame, tho it does work.

Anyway looking forward to the new books they provide in the future. Good luck fellow adventurers and DM's.

[Gnomes2169]

With how many subclasses they just made for review that have (or could be spun into) an Asian theme, methinks an Oriental Adventures book could happen sometime in the future. Why else would you put the Kensai, Ancestral Guardian (aka, Ancestor Spirits ala Mulan), College of Swords (aka, College of Wu Jing, the most over the top fighting ever (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=McaLlW7xDxU)) and the Arcane Archer (aka, the mystical bowman seen commonly in Indian and Japanese mythos), all in the same supplement?

Just need a few more (Like the Void Watcher for the wizard, 4 Seasons bloodline for Sorcerer, and Ninja for Rogue) and most every role is covered for an Oriental Adventures book!

[Ruebin Rybnik]

I don't think this book will hold any of the new character options from UA. With the number of things in UA the book they'll be in is probably gonna be $50. Also Wizards already anounced a book release that's going to have alot of the UA stuff. Xanathar's Guide to Everything. being release 21 November 2017.

http://dnd.wizards.com/products/tabletop-games/rpg-products/xanathars-guide-everything

I agree that this book is probably another module.

[jaappleton]

The subclasses are in Xan's.

[ZB2017]

If it relates to Chult, that'd be cool

I just ordered The Ring of Winter, hearing that it is one of the best Forgotten Realms books and is set there