Monk Weapons

[ErebusVonMori]

If I read my RAW right, unlike unarmed attacks, the damage of monk weapons e.g quarterstaff doesn't scale up with level? And in that case why would any monk use a weapon?

[ExLibrisMortis]

You are right, and you wouldn't. Monks are - sadly - not proficient with many good weapons, though two-handing a quarterstaff lets you use 1.5x your strength bonus. With feats, it is possible to get a reach weapon as special monk weapon, which is a good reason to forego unarmed attacks.

The scorpion kama (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ps/20070223a) is a magic weapon that does deal your full unarmed strike damage.

[Inevitability]

If I read my RAW right, unlike unarmed attacks, the damage of monk weapons e.g quarterstaff doesn't scale up with level? And in that case why would any make use a weapon?

It does indeed not.

And as for why one would use weapons anyway, there's various reasons. Enhancements, weapon-specific feats, use against creatures resistant to bludgeoning, random loot giving you something nice...

[ErebusVonMori]

It's fully possible to add more enchantments to an item right?

[Psyren]

Happy Monkday!

The main reason is that weapons are generally easier to enchant than unarmed strikes (cheaper and doesn't take up a body slot.) Weapons can also get useful properties like Reach (which can also be more difficult to get onto unarmed strikes.)

There are ways to get that kind of scaling damage onto a weapon though; Pathfinder for instance has Ascetic Strike. (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/ascetic-strike-combat/)

[CharonsHelper]

Most importantly - monk weapons cost half as much to enchant as an Amulet of Mighty Fists, and the weapon doesn't use up your neck slot.

If you play Pathfinder's Unchained Monk (I would generally recommend it if possible - Core Monk in Pathfinder sucks, and all 3.5 monks suck.) then you gain proficiency with some pretty good weapons. Unarmed will eventually do higher dice damage, but the weapon is cheaper to enchant, 1.5x STR damage, and with a better crit range.

[ErebusVonMori]

Are there ways to get an enchantment onto your unarmed attacks?

[Ruethgar]

Arguably the Sculpt Self feat can let you enchant your unarmed strikes with the custom creation method. I think Warforged have an option as well. Then there is the aforementioned amulet. Also the Ward Cestus counts as an unarmed attack for hit and damage and can be enchanted like any other weapon. A single dip into the Kensai base class gives you proficiency, but many may say you are already proficiency if you are proficient with unarmed and EWP only lets you use the cestus defense option.

[CharonsHelper]

Are there ways to get an enchantment onto your unarmed attacks?

The Amulet of Mighty Fists. (I think late 3.5 they kept changing FAQ on whether you could use a gauntlet. I remember that the FAQ was one way - and then the other - but I don't know what they ended on. In Pathfinder it's definitely not allowed though.)

[Necroticplague]

Are there ways to get an enchantment onto your unarmed attacks?

Yes, there are.

You can also enchant Guantlets, which get the boost from a monk's damage (since a guantlet is considered an unarmed attack).

[Big Fau]

The only Monk weapon that gains the unarmed scaling is the Scorpion Kama in the MIC. In most cases, its better to just boost your effective Size Category to get extra damage than it is to go for an enchanted unarmed strike.

[ErebusVonMori]

Is it possible to add enchantments to an already enchanted weapon?

[Big Fau]

Is it possible to add enchantments to an already enchanted weapon?

Absolutely. It's a basic rule of upgrading weapons.

[Psyren]

Yes, there are.

You can also enchant Guantlets, which get the boost from a monk's damage (since a guantlet is considered an unarmed attack).

They are, but that's not quite the same as them being equivalent to the Monk's Unarmed Strike, which I read as being a separate thing (in both editions.) There's also the problem that gauntlets aren't actually monk weapons and that monks aren't proficient with them.


Is it possible to add enchantments to an already enchanted weapon?

Yes, see "Adding New Abilities".

[ErebusVonMori]

Which book do I find that in?

[Big Fau]

Which book do I find that in?

DMG, or check the SRD's Magic Item section.

[Psyren]

Here's the link: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/creatingMagicItems.htm#addingNewAbilities

[Karl Aegis]

The accuracy boost from a +5 weapon is a significant upgrade compared to an unarmed strike on a 3/4 BAB class. By the time your unarmed damage dice becomes decent damage dice isn't very significant.

[Mato]

Are there ways to get an enchantment onto your unarmed attacks?Yes.

The two cheap ways are a are masterwork gauntlet (302gp) or masterwork ward cetus (310gp) but you cannot furry with either of them. You can instead enchant a necklace of natural weapons (900gp), bracers of striking (1,310gp), of if you are warforged you can use a battlefist (2,600gp) which also increases your unarmed damage. And unlike wielding a specific weapon you can enchant these independently and your unarmed strike deals the combined total. For example, instead of buying a +5 holy gauntlet for 98,000gp, you can buy a +5 necklace & +1 holy bracer for 68,000gp for a 30,000gp savings.

As a monk through, you can use a number of spells such as a minor schema of greater mighty wallop (6,000gp) for a size increase that lasts five hours, for 9,600gp it provides a +2 size increase, 14,400gp for +3, 19,200gp for +4, and if you started out small you can pick up a +5 for 24,000gp. But, keep in mind the +4 for less than twenty thousand in the later levels of the game is enough to deal 12d8 (54 on average) per punch so you won't need much more.

It also means enhancing your unarmed strike with +5 holy and +4 size increases to damage still costs the monk less than it does for any other class to buy a +5 holy weapon. You could take that 10,800gp saved and buy three martial items out of the tome of battle and learn three martial maneuvers to improve your flexibility, and then you can still take the remaining gold and buy a small house.

[Rijan_Sai]

The accuracy boost from a +5 weapon is a significant upgrade compared to an unarmed strike on a 3/4 BAB class. By the time your unarmed damage dice becomes decent damage dice isn't very significant.

True, though it should be noted that Magic Fang (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/magicFang.htm) (and Greater (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/magicFangGreater.htm)) can be used on a Monk's fists. (As could Magic Weapon (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/magicWeapon.htm), though obviously not at the same time...)

[Gruftzwerg]

Well, monk weapons are not really meant for pure monks. Cause those rely more on their own body than anything else.
Monk weapons are more for monk dips. It's nice for some builds to dip monk for the base flurry you can get with monk weapons (if your chance to hit is high enough, otherwise you end in a flurry of misses).

[Venger]

Are there ways to get an enchantment onto your unarmed attacks?
use savage species's necklace of natural attacks instead. same thing as amulet of mighty fists but not as overpriced.

[Ruethgar]

AFB ATM, but IIRC the Chaos Monk flurry equivalent had less restrictions in addition to being flat out better and being able to be combined with a Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian without alighnment conflict.

Also, being treated as unarmed attacks for the purposes of attacks should let a gauntlet/cestus count for a flurry. There are also alternate base weapon sets for Monk weapons if you wanted more options, one including a short sword another has some spears as well as things like the meteor hammer which is a Monk weapon with just the EWP to normally use it.

[Telonius]

Are there ways to get an enchantment onto your unarmed attacks?

Just for completeness, the Kensai prestige class from Complete Warrior (not to be confused with Kensei from Oriental Adventures) allows you to enchant a signature weapon. That "weapon" can be your fists.

[Venger]

Just for completeness, the Kensai prestige class from Complete Warrior (not to be confused with Kensei from Oriental Adventures) allows you to enchant a signature weapon. That "weapon" can be your fists.

the somewhat well-known fistbeard beardfist (http://www.minmaxboards.com/index.php?topic=6062.0) centers around this ability.

[Dagroth]

To help make a Monk more competitive, we created an item called "Handwraps (or Sap Gloves)". They take up the "Hands" item slot, but can be make Masterwork and be enchanted with both Glove & Weapon enchantments. They can be enchanted individually (so one could be +1 Undead Bane and the other +3 Impacting), but you have to choose which one you're using on each strike. One could also add a Silver/Cold Iron/Adamantine plate to them (for the appropriate cost for a light weapon) to allow a Monk to overcome the appropriate DR.

Combine with Versatile Unarmed Strike to do Slashing or Piercing damage.

[Petrukio]

And in that case why would any monk use a weapon?

At early levels (and before the Monk can afford the 13,000gp for Monk's Robes), some of the weapons actually deal quite a bit more damage than the monk can generally achieve on his own. The sansetsukon (three section staff) (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment/weapons/eastern-weapons/weapon-descriptions/sansetsukon-three-section-staff), for example does 1d10;19-20/x2, which an unchained monk cannot achieve on his own without spending one feat (Improved Critical) and reaching 8th level.

After that, yes, you're right - there's really no reason a monk would use a weapon. Well, except for what everyone else has said.

[Gruftzwerg]

well another option comes to my mind:

weapons that offer combat maneuver bonuses.

Kama: can be used for tripping and dropped if you lose your roll instead of being tripped yourself.

Nunchaku: +2 disarm and against being disarmed

Sai: +4 disarm and against it.

Note that you don't need to use em for regular attacks, while still having them in your hands. You can still use your normal unarmed attacks and just use em for the maneuvers when needed.

Further you can enchant em with additional weapon enchantments than you don't need (or that don't apply) to your unarmed strikes or what doesn't fit anymore into your Necklace of Natural Attacks. (e.g. Blindsighted, Dancing, Defending, Disarming, (greater) Dispelling, Eager, Spellstrike, Warning just to name a few)

And last, some "Collusion"-Shuriken are always handy. You can draw as many as you like in your full attack action and use em instead of your regular attacks (even in a flurry). If you should run out of enemies in melee range and still have attacks left (from your full-attack flurry) you can use em for your Shuriken. And thx due to Collusion (+5 dmg) they have at least some noticeable dmg.

[ayvango]

If I read my RAW right, unlike unarmed attacks, the damage of monk weapons e.g quarterstaff doesn't scale up with level? And in that case why would any monk use a weapon?

I prefer scorpian kama enchanted with morphing bonus. Now you could use Greater Mighty Wallop on your unarmed strike and get its bonus on morphed rapier or even on elvencraft bows.