wizard-revisited unearthed arcana - 20th March.

[8wGremlin]

http://dnd.wizards.com/articles/unearthed-arcana/wizard-revisited

http://media.wizards.com/2017/dnd/downloads/MJ320UAWizardVF2017.pdf


two wizards - Theurge (again) and War magic

thoughts!

[Specter]

Garbage.

This Theurge had already been released somewhere (and everybody complained about them obtaining the 17th-level cleric ability BEFORE A CLERIC), and they didn't care to change any of the bad in it. War Magic is now the best dip for martials, but still has nothing on the Abjurer in terms of magical defense.

[Sans.]

Tf is this?! Yet another mixy class, and an archetype that is terrible for pure wizards until level 10!

[Blue Lantern]

Every time a Wizard centered UA comes out, I facepalm so hard I hurt myself.

We got it, you love Wizards, Wizards.

[Arkhios]

Garbage.

This Theurge had already been released somewhere (and everybody complained about them obtaining the 17th-level cleric ability BEFORE A CLERIC), and they didn't care to change any of the bad in it. War Magic is now the best dip for martials, but still has nothing on the Abjurer in terms of magical defense.

I don't remember seeing a survey earlier, which might be why they might not actually be aware of all those issues people on the forums claim to have with Theurge. Come next survey, go voice your concerns and maybe they'll know better this time around.

[Matrix_Walker]

They mentioned in the notes that it was in fact the same as previously published, and re-released for feedback this time.

[DragonSorcererX]

Why the War Mage doesn't get Light Armor, Simple Weapons and Shields? Isn't he supposed to be a WAR Mage?

[King539]

Why the War Mage doesn't get Light Armor, Simple Weapons and Shields? Isn't he supposed to be a WAR Mage?

It's not meant to be a gish, but a wizard that splits study between evocation or abjuration.

[Foxhound438]

Every time a Wizard centered UA comes out, I facepalm so hard I hurt myself.

We got it, you love Wizards, Wizards.

"Crap! all the forum trolls are only talking about how good clerics are! what now?"

"Ah, uh, um... we makE THE WIZARD GET THE CLERIC STUFF!"

"Genious! But they still don't have the armor, how do we make wizards just better than clerics?"

"Uh, um... we give the wiZARD THE BEST CLERIC STUFF SOONER!"

"PERFECT"

[Captain Panda]

"Crap! all the forum trolls are only talking about how good clerics are! what now?"


Who does this? Clerics are okay, but not exactly stealing the spotlight outside of their niche.

[McNinja]

Garbage.

This Theurge had already been released somewhere (and everybody complained about them obtaining the 17th-level cleric ability BEFORE A CLERIC), and they didn't care to change any of the bad in it. War Magic is now the best dip for martials, but still has nothing on the Abjurer in terms of magical defense.

I agree. Why play a cleric when you can just play a theurge? Tempest cleric abilities are incredibly OP combined with lightning wizard spells. Witch Bolt suddenly becomes a competent spell with the tempest channel divinity ability. With the Life domain, you get the healing spells and bonuses of Life with the flexibility of a Wizard.

I mean ****, at worst you could feasibly simulacrum another healer. If they restricted the theurge to the knowledge and light domains it would be much better, but right now it's way too OP.

The War Mage isn't quite as bad, but it's nice to get a +2 AC bonus while flying and the deflecting shroud is a pretty cool ability.

[skaddix]

Nah Wizard Bias Typical.

Favored Soul got rebalanced Theurge keeps all the goodies because Its a Wizard's World.

You get to be a better cleric then the cleric. Its like FS but all they got is metamagic. You have the advantage in spell list.

Plus when you get to level 18. You have infinite healing potential for free.

[Spellbreaker26]

Yeah, I'm going to agree with the consensus on Theurge. It's one of the most badly designed of the UA classes, because it is A] Overpowered and B] irritating to cleric players* by getting the abilities earlier.

The problem is that they have a decent-ish fix right in front of them, reduce the options to light and knowledge. But for some reason they have refused to do so outside of the fluff. The Tempest Theurge may be one of the strongest subclasses in the game as a result, possibly only exceeded by the Loremaster UA (which is similarly awful).

As for the warmage, I was actually kinda impressed that they made a UA wizard subclass that didn't suck. I'm not totally happy with it, and I feel it should have gotten some bonus proficiencies. In addition, they are still hanging on to that damn "add intelligence to initiative" thing that they did for loremaster and, while it's more appropriate here, I still don't like it. My fix would be to replace that Tactical Wit 2nd Level ability with "You gain proficiency in two martial weapons of your choice. In addition, when casting the spell Mage Armour you may choose to add your constitution modifier rather than your dexterity modifier to your AC."

I feel like this would go a long way to making the more durable mage they seem to be going for here.


*I am a cleric player, so I can confirm this

[Strill]

In addition, they are still hanging on to that damn "add intelligence to initiative" thing that they did for loremaster and, while it's more appropriate here, I still don't like it.

I agree. The bulk of the Alert feat is the initiative bonus, and getting it here for free is basically giving this archetype an extra feat, where other Wizard archetypes only get a minor discount on scribing spells.

[ShikomeKidoMi]

Why the War Mage doesn't get Light Armor, Simple Weapons and Shields? Isn't he supposed to be a WAR Mage?

Yes. In that he specializes in using his magic for war. Having him swinging a sword around would take time away from battle magic.

[Citan]

Hi all, thanks OP for link...
Sooo... In one word: WOW.

1) I join others about Theurge, this is a big, hard slap in the face of any and all Clerics. Plain stupid.

2) The best School for any Wizard dip as an Eldricht Knight is now officially War Magic.
2nd level ability is a way to boost an already (usually) high AC without using precious slots on Shield, and makes character also MUCH more resilient against saves including the mental ones. And you won't care about not being able to cast anything else than a cantrip in next turn since you usually use weapon attacks (or cantrip + bonus action attack) in the first place.
Bonus to initiative is cherry on cake for any EK that kept at least decent INT which is often the case.

But the true greatness comes at level 6: the "2 more dice extra damage per short rest" makes even Burning Hand a great option for clearing small mobs, and once you get Eldricht Strike you become the best Fireball striker (Action Surge > Attack > Fireball).

Beyond that, I'm happy to see that some of the ideas I had in my homebrew are now also used by Wizard, which means they are probably not overpowered at that level... Or so I hope at least... XD

[JellyPooga]

because Its a Wizard's World.

*cue walking bass*

This is a Wizards world.
Yes it's a Wizards world.
But it ain't nuthin'. Nuthin!
...without a Cleric or a Rogue.

[SharkForce]

biggest thing i don't like with war wizard is that 5e was supposed to have this design goal of not having tons of fiddly numbers. now it seems like all WotC can do is put fiddly little bonuses in every new thing they show to us. keep it up for a while, and anything from the first wave will be obsolete because sure, a little +1 isn't going to make a huge difference (well, with the exception of save DC, which is one of the small bonuses they seem fixated on giving for some unfathomable reason), but when you can get 5 or 6 of those together, all of a sudden anyone *not* using that build is going to be obsolete.

the idea isn't terrible. but the execution is a problem. they need to stop giving all these numeric bonuses all over the place.

[Binary]

In addition, they are still hanging on to that damn "add intelligence to initiative" thing that they did for loremaster and, while it's more appropriate here, I still don't like it

Actually it's worse. The Loremaster chose Int OR Dex to use for Initiative. War Magic gets gets Dex AND Int bonuses.

[skaddix]

*cue walking bass*

This is a Wizards world.
Yes it's a Wizards world.
But it ain't nuthin'. Nuthin!
...without a Cleric or a Rogue.
Not if your a Theurge you can heal, buff, blast, control.

All you need is a Paladin or Fighter with the Sword and Board or Halberd for Control to stand and tank for you.
And a Rogue because you need a skill monkey to disarm traps, sneak, etc.

[Spellbreaker26]

Actually it's worse. The Loremaster chose Int OR Dex to use for Initiative. War Magic gets gets Dex AND Int bonuses.

Yes, but unlike the Loremaster the class as a whole is more reasonable. Plus a Warmage being more comfortable on the battlefield makes more sense than a stuffy old professor.