Best / Strongest Ranger Conclave?

[jaappleton]

So the Ranger is sorta up in the air as far as heavy optimization goes, because there's so much UA on it that optimization handbooks kinda... Well, what do you include, and what do you not include, right?

So, I put this forth to my fellow playgrounders... Optimize the crap out of it.

Level 4.

All races, books and UA available.


I was thinking of the new Slayer, but with Slayer's Eye taking up a bonus action, and Hunter's Mark also requiring one, and the extra attack from Crossbow Expert also competing for it... I'm not sure how viable it is.

[sir_argo]

I don't consider myself an optimizer, but I am joining a new campaign (1st level) and making a UA Ranger: Dark Stalker, human variant. Sharpshooter feat. Favored enemy humanoids. I like the Dark Stalker for a variant human because it gets 90' darkvision at 3rd level and also foes gain no benefit from their darkvision when determining if you can hide. At 4th level, my plan is to take the Alert feat instead of an ASI.

[joaber]

Using new rules there is lots of good options.

I like new beastmaster, looks like the beast power increase with your level, not ranger level, so is a great 3lvl deep multiclass. Would be perfect if you get extra attack at level 5, and pass without a trace (ok, this would be a little OP). I think best ones that fit in expanded list are:
-Pteranodon, be a small race and now you have a flying mount that don't provoke AoO when attack. Small races are always good archers, or you can use a lance + shield (or two lances with dual wielder).
-Constructor snake, nice hit dice, hit, blindsight (low, but ok) and free restrainned.

Underdark Scout is really nice for human, great combo if multiclass with any darkness+devil's sight build, and obviously assassin.

I really liked Monster Slayer with Slayer’s Eye, with 1d6 + spells make any hunter ranger with colossus slayer looks obsolete. Ok, need bonus action, but sometimes you can set this before combat while in stealth, and don't make difference if you want to use your concentration to other thing that isn't hunter's mark.

Primeval Guardian, looks good too, I prefer ranged weapon rangers, but this could work with multiclass darkness+devil's sight + bonus action hide. THP is always nice, you have your 1d6, but he has the best spell selection. Entangle is one of bests lvl 1 spells you can get (will not work with darkness, unless you're a mystic too with mastery of shadows). The high ones are great too, but probably will not stay as ranger at lvl 9. I see now that Ancient Fortitude with Consumtive Power (mystic lvl 10) is a great combo.

[Mortis_Elrod]

Well my three favorite would be Monster Slayer, Deep Stalker, and Horizon Walker, in ascending order.
I just really like the idea of a character who can mimic night crawler, though i wish horizon walker was better for twfing. on the other hand monster slayer is ripe for it. You delay by two turns (slayer eye then hunter mark) but early levels that attack might be enough to finish a fight a round earlier. Deep Stalker is my favorite stealthy archetype, and its good for the ambush type of ranger.

vHuman 8/15(+1)/15(+1)/10/14/8
Level 1 Rogue/ 3 Monster Slayer
Bounty hunter background.

Take sharpshooter or dual wielder or medium armor master or tavern brawler.

twf style or archery you choice.

Favored enemy humanoids

You're hunt anything for money, and you can take them dead or alive. Doesn't matter who they are you can reead them like a book. Their weaknesses, their strengths, what they had for dinner last night. Nothing gets past your slayers eye. and if you need to alive them well you can always just punch them around, tackle them to the ground, and hold them down. If only Use rope was a skill.

[Edgerunner]

When it comes to Multi-Classing... what advantages are there to going past Ranger 3?

Yea Extra Attack @5 and Favored Enemy +4 @6 is a solid move but is it worth it?

[Foxydono]

When it comes to Multi-Classing... what advantages are there to going past Ranger 3?

Yea Extra Attack @5 and Favored Enemy +4 @6 is a solid move but is it worth it?
Currently playing a ranger 5/rogue 4 because I came to the same conclusion. All the rogue abilities are way better then any of the ranger stuff after lvl 5/6, except for the last UA maybe.

Play hunter conclave with horde breaker myself because an extra attack beats 1d6 dmg from colussus slayer most of the time. As for optimizing it depends really, if your human deep stalker is a solid choice. If I could reroll I would try the monster slayer. Knowing all the weaknessess of an enemy can be gamebreaking. If it's not a tight dungeon crawl I would definitly pick the Aarakocra, cause this has everything you want really. Although a feat is tempting I would max out Dex at lvl 4. Otherwise I might be interested in trying a bugbear or goblin. This is assuming you won't be multiclassing.

[Sir cryosin]

If we are just looking at amount of attacks with a stock ranger the the stalker and beast win 5 attacks that's adding in swift quiver. Oh I think the new monster hunter gets a special attack slayer's counter.

[Sir cryosin]

With the new stocked ranger any concave is good. I don't feel one is better then the others it just a matter of style you want I also feel it is worth taking ranger higher then 3 or 5 levels now. To optimize the Ranger you got to figure out what you want to do with it first just like any other class

If my mystic by some strange reasons die my back up character is a Arcane cleric 1 ranger beast concave X. I took the one level of Arcane cleric just for a wisdom green flame blade and another cantrip. He is a s&b Ranger with shield master feat. Sents he get only one attack gfb gives him more damage. While his pet will eventually get 2 attacks. You might be able to get higher damage with a bow and sharp shooter build but you don't have a cool pet. Oh also my DM has said we can if we put in the effort get a guard Drake as a pet. So yaa.

[jaappleton]

I'm thinking Ranger 6 at most.

The campaign features going against a Goblin (and Goblinoid) army, so the Revised Ranger's Primeval Awareness and Favored Enemy are things I think will be very good for the group.

[DracoKnight]

Okay, so honestly, I think the best Ranger of the bunch is the Revised Beast Master. At 5th level, you've got four attacks that you as a player control (potentially). This does require some investment to pull off, but it's worth it. I'm gonna assume Standard Array/Point Buy, but I think your group tends to roll for stats, right? Well this build should get easier to pull off if you do.

VHuman

Stats:

STR 8
DEX 16 (15 + 1)
CON 14
INT 10
WIS 16 (15 + 1)
CHA 8

So for your VHuman feat, you're gonna take a feat I would normally never recommend: Dual Wielder. Pick up a pair of rapiers and you have +2 damage over shortswords, and +1 to your AC while you wield them.

ASIs: +2 DEX, +2 CON, +2 DEX, +2 WIS, +2 WIS

Grab Studded Leather armor when you can, and when you max out your DEX, you'll be in full plate equivalent. For a while, though, medium armor might be better - except when you're trying to stealth.

Now this build is for Beast Master, and you're going to want to choose the panther (http://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/Sktz9Ot3g). I know a lot of people will say: "OMG! You're dual wielding AND you have a panther? Drizzt fanboy much?" But seriously, the panther is one of the better pet options (they get Expertise in Stealth), and TWF is actually fairly decent with this build.

For your panther, you're gonna wanna spend its ASIs in the following way:

+1 DEX/+1 CON, +2 CON, +1 DEX/+1 CON, +2 DEX, +1 DEX/+1 CON

Your panther ends up with a 20 DEX, a 15 CON, and if you can get the Druid to cast awaken on them, their INT will go up as well.

Your panther will look like this at 4th level (http://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/By-8CtFthe), and like this at 5th level (http://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/r13PVYF3g), 11th level (http://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/SkmP_Kthg), 17th level (http://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/rJZatOKFhg), and 19th level (http://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/HJxyuYYng).

Your standard attack routine will be to cast hunter's mark, attack, have your beast attack, your beast will attack on their turn, and then at the start of your next turn you'll attack and offhand attack. Repeat until monster is dead.

Your DPR (at 4th) will be 4.5 (rapier) + 4 (DEX mod) + 3.5 (hunter's mark) + 2.5 (panther claw) + 5 (panther DEX + your proficiency bonus) = 19.5, and next turn that will jump to 28 as you add in your offhand attack. It'll jump to 26/35 if a monster fails their save against your panther's pounce.

At 5th level, your DPR becomes 4.5 + 4 + 3.5 + 2.5 + 6 + 2.5 + 6 (Coordinated Attack) = 29, and next turn that will jump to 37.5 as you add in your offhand attack. It'll jump to 37/45.5 if a monster fails their save against your panther's pounce.

At 19th level, your total DPR will be 52 on a round where you have both hunter's mark and your offhand attack. It'll jump to 63 if a monster fails their save against your panther's pounce.

TLDR; the revised Beast Master is one of the few builds where TWF works really well. It's a solid, more intuitive option now and it's fun to watch your pet grow from CR 1/4 to CR 7.

Aside: If you roll for stats and get an 17/18, that frees up one of your ASIs for a feat, and in this case I would recommend Defensive Duelist to help shore up your AC a little bit. Or I would bump CON again.

[GandalfTheWhite]

So...holy sh!t, Beast Master gut gud.

[Specter]

At level 4 it's not even fyn. Beastmaster (revised) all the way. At later levels you can get every archetype on a decent playing field.

[Legendairy]

Hey DracoKnight, out of curiosity wouldn't it be more DPR to take crossbow expert as a vhuman then sharpshooter and pull pretty much the same routine but with the nifty -5 +10 rider?



Edit: Grammatical conjecture.

[jaappleton]

Hey DracoKnight, out of curiosity wouldn't it be more DPR to take crossbow expert as a vhuman then sharpshooter and pull pretty much the same routine but with the nifty -5 +10 rider?



Edit: Grammatical conjecture.

Crossbow Expert and Sharpshooter comes with the cost of two feats on a class that doesn't get too many. Rangers need Dex, Wis, Con, and some need Str (If you're a masochist and hate life), so most don't have the ASI to spare.

Though...

What's the combo for infinite advantage? Kobold riding a Wolf? Always have Advantage for Sharpshooter, Crossbow Expert means you can be up close with no penalty...

On a Kobold, though, it doesn't activate until level 8. Needing two ASIs with zero improvement to Dexterity, Con, or Wisdom. Likely probable with rolled stats, not with a point buy.

[Legendairy]

True, but you can postpone the max dex a bit seeing as how the feats make up for any dpr loss. You could also let con slide since hopefully as a ranged character you won't be in the melee mix. I mean you could always multiclassing into Mystic if your dm is cool with it and do amazing things.

I do agree tho that beast conclave seems to be the best but I favor dark stalker. A bit more "nova-ish" but I like the abilities and spells.

Don't remember but even at melee range if your wolf trips won't you get disadvantage with a ranged weapon?

[jaappleton]

Does the Animal Companion benefit from Hunter's Mark at all, or no? I think it did (eventually) in the old PHB version, but I don't see it anywhere in the Revised version.

EDIT: Let's get crazy. I did say "optimize the crap out of it", right?

What's a potential animal companion that falls under the guidelines but isn't listed? Anything in Volo's? I'm checking now, but maybe someone knows off hand.

[DracoKnight]

Does the Animal Companion benefit from Hunter's Mark at all, or no? I think it did (eventually) in the old PHB version, but I don't see it anywhere in the Revised version.

EDIT: Let's get crazy. I did say "optimize the crap out of it", right?

What's a potential animal companion that falls under the guidelines but isn't listed? Anything in Volo's? I'm checking now, but maybe someone knows off hand.

From Volo's: Dimetrodon, hadrosaurus, velociraptor, cow*, and dolphin all fit the guidelines, IIRC.

*I'm an idiot , cows are Large.

[Hrugner]

From Volo's: Dimetrodon, hadrosaurus, velociraptor, cow*, and dolphin all fit the guidelines, IIRC.

*I'm an idiot , cows are Large.

hadrosaur is large as well. dimetrodon has more than the 15 hp limit so he's out. Velocirpator checks out though, they meet the cap of 8 total hp from one attack but don't exceed it. Packtactics on the velociraptor is also good. I think giant poisonous snake is still the best choice unless you need something that flies.

[jaappleton]

hadrosaur is large as well. dimetrodon has more than the 15 hp limit so he's out. Velocirpator checks out though, they meet the cap of 8 total hp from one attack but don't exceed it. Packtactics on the velociraptor is also good. I think giant poisonous snake is still the best choice unless you need something that flies.

The Snake is darn sweet. Panther does have Pounce which knocks prone and gives me advantage for both of my attacks, though... hmm.

[FinnS]

The Snake is darn sweet. Panther does have Pounce which knocks prone and gives me advantage for both of my attacks, though... hmm.

You only have Advantage for attacks within 5'.
You suffer Disadvantage when attacking with any weapon from more than 5' away vs a prone enemy.
(Yes, that includes reach melee weapons)


PRONE
*A prone creature's only movement option is to crawl,
unless it stands up and thereby ends the condition.
*The creature has disadvantage on attack rolls.
*An attack roll against the creature has advantage
if the attacker is within 5 feet of the creature.
Otherwise, the attack roll has disadvantage.

[Arkhios]

I know my optimization savviness is a bit rusted these days as I don't have 24/7 to spend for that level of adjustment.
Thus, this isn't much of an optimization, but rather an opinion. Besides the Revised Beast Master (I'm with DracoKnight's build, purely awesome), I'm quite fond of Horizon Walker (Revised or not).

Ignoring damage resistances for a full turn with a bonus action can come quite handy, especially if you have Hunter's Mark active before you use Planar Warrior.

[joaber]

The Snake is darn sweet. Panther does have Pounce which knocks prone and gives me advantage for both of my attacks, though... hmm.

Constrictor snake gives you advantage to all attacks while enemy is restrainned, and he attack with desadvantage.
As I said in my first post, Pteranodon is a great option for small races, a flying mount at lvl 3! you can dual wielde lance, and his dive attack doesn't provoke AoO. You can stay 10ft above target if he doesn't have reach. But probably is better for a ranged attacker, pteranodon can dive, stay distant and you spam your bows safely from melee oponents.

Both options don't add much with reaction attack at level 5. Constrictor snake can't restrain another target, but can restrain again if target break free or his main attack fail. Pteranodon don't get nothing with his reaction, since he'll not stay in enemy range.

Better options for the 3 level deep ranger, go to another class to get extra attack.

but constrictor snake is probably my first option, free restrainned is too great to pass out, no size restriction, no save. hit dice is d10, and have blindsight (just 10ft).

[Hrugner]

I know my optimization savviness is a bit rusted these days as I don't have 24/7 to spend for that level of adjustment.
Thus, this isn't much of an optimization, but rather an opinion. Besides the Revised Beast Master (I'm with DracoKnight's build, purely awesome), I'm quite fond of Horizon Walker (Revised or not).

Ignoring damage resistances for a full turn with a bonus action can come quite handy, especially if you have Hunter's Mark active before you use Planar Warrior.

Horizon Walker is my personal favorite as well, ignoring DR, some teleportation, finding portals is pretty cool for a ribbon as well. But since he knows he's fighting goblins ignoring DR isn't as important here. He's also expecting to go only to level 6, so we only need to look at the third level ability.

[FinnS]

Some good builds but the power of a Deep Stalker in a dark environment like the UD should not be underestimated.

A Drow Elf fighting a Deep Stalker in the dark is exactly the same as a Human fighting a Drow Elf in the dark.
The Drow suffers from the Blinded condition vs a Deep Stalker in the dark exactly the same as a Human suffers the Blinded condition vs a Drow in the dark.

[sir_argo]

A Drow Elf fighting a Deep Stalker in the dark is exactly the same as a Human fighting a Drow Elf in the dark.
The Drow suffers from the Blinded condition vs a Deep Stalker in the dark exactly the same as a Human suffers the Blinded condition vs a Drow in the dark.

This is something of which I would love to get clarification. Sadly, the language used in the description (sigh) vague.

"You are also adept at evading creatures that rely on darkvision. Such creatures gain no benefit when attempting to detect you in dark and dim conditions. Additionally, when the DM determines if you can hide from a creature, that creature gains no benefit from its darkvision."

What exactly does it mean "detect you in dark and dim conditions"?

Does that mean when you attempt a perception roll? I mean, a DM can just say, Well, he doesn't need to make a perception roll because he has darkvision. So since he doesn't need to make a perception roll, this ability has no effect.

What exactly does it mean "when the DM determines if you can hide from a creature, that creature gains no benefit from its darkvision"?

Since the rule on hiding is, "You can't hide from a creature that can see you", the DM would determine that because the creature has darkvision, he can see you, and thus you can't hide, and so this ability has no effect.


Very badly worded. I think what they meant is that the Ranger can Hide as if the creature has no darkvision, and the creature's darkvision does not reveal the hidden ranger. But honestly, I'm less than half sure of that.

[jaappleton]

This is something of which I would love to get clarification. Sadly, the language used in the description (sigh) vague.

"You are also adept at evading creatures that rely on darkvision. Such creatures gain no benefit when attempting to detect you in dark and dim conditions. Additionally, when the DM determines if you can hide from a creature, that creature gains no benefit from its darkvision."

What exactly does it mean "detect you in dark and dim conditions"?

Does that mean when you attempt a perception roll? I mean, a DM can just say, Well, he doesn't need to make a perception roll because he has darkvision. So since he doesn't need to make a perception roll, this ability has no effect.

What exactly does it mean "when the DM determines if you can hide from a creature, that creature gains no benefit from its darkvision"?

Since the rule on hiding is, "You can't hide from a creature that can see you", the DM would determine that because the creature has darkvision, he can see you, and thus you can't hide, and so this ability has no effect.


Very badly worded. I think what they meant is that the Ranger can Hide as if the creature has no darkvision, and the creature's darkvision does not reveal the hidden ranger. But honestly, I'm less than half sure of that.

As much as I thoroughly enjoy the UA content, because it allows for so much theory crafting and all that (I really do love that stuff), I have to admit some of it really poorly worded. It needed another pass before being presented to the public.

[FinnS]

This is something of which I would love to get clarification. Sadly, the language used in the description (sigh) vague.

"You are also adept at evading creatures that rely on darkvision. Such creatures gain no benefit when attempting to detect you in dark and dim conditions. Additionally, when the DM determines if you can hide from a creature, that creature gains no benefit from its darkvision."

What exactly does it mean "detect you in dark and dim conditions"?

Does that mean when you attempt a perception roll? I mean, a DM can just say, Well, he doesn't need to make a perception roll because he has darkvision. So since he doesn't need to make a perception roll, this ability has no effect.

What exactly does it mean "when the DM determines if you can hide from a creature, that creature gains no benefit from its darkvision"?

Since the rule on hiding is, "You can't hide from a creature that can see you", the DM would determine that because the creature has darkvision, he can see you, and thus you can't hide, and so this ability has no effect.


Very badly worded. I think what they meant is that the Ranger can Hide as if the creature has no darkvision, and the creature's darkvision does not reveal the hidden ranger. But honestly, I'm less than half sure of that.

Using stealth isn't just about sight.
Being invisible doesn't make you undetectable, you still have to use your stealth to move silently for that.

The statement "Gains no benefit from Darkvision" is clear as day.

What benefits does one get from Darkvision?
The ability to see in darkness as if it were dim and in dim as it were normal light.

You simply do not get those benefits vs a Deep Stalker.

Taking away those benefits means you are effectively blind to a Deep Stalker in total darkness.
I can't see another interpretation for it other than Darkvision can not be used to see a Deep Stalker.

[Foxhound438]

I'm not going to go in depth on optimized builds, but here's my two cp:

new beastmaster has a high potential with the changes to HP and stat scaling, and someone else already posted one, but I'll just add that a good "cheesy trick build" is to have a giant crab as your companion for the auto-grab and have magic initiate: druid with the create bonfire cantrip. After your crab grabs an enemy, light it on fire on your turn, then until it dies you have an extra 1-4d8 every turn. It's at the cost of hunter's mark though, so if you're going for a 2wf or hand crossbow build, you may lose a bit of damage until you get to 3d8. If you don't like the bonfire idea, you can just talk to your friendly bard and have him/her take cloud of daggers for a similar, yet more potent effect. Set up team synergy, basically. The damage ends up a bit behind panther, but the free grab every hit could be nice for a pseudo-crowd control effect.

Note also that you don't necessarily have to re-cast your continuous damage spell, as your crab can still "drag" a new target into that space. If your DM rules that the crab has to pass through the space to do so, that's probably fine anyways. the strategy uses spells that do continuous damage rather than instant burst damage, so if the crab (which has relatively high natural AC) has to take a proc or two per combat it's probably fine.

[Foxhound438]

Using stealth isn't just about sight.
Being invisible doesn't make you undetectable, you still have to use your stealth to move silently for that.

The statement "Gains no benefit from Darkvision" is clear as day.

What benefits does one get from Darkvision?
The ability to see in darkness as if it were dim and in dim as it were normal light.

You simply do not get those benefits vs a Deep Stalker.

Taking away those benefits means you are effectively blind to a Deep Stalker in total darkness.
I can't see another interpretation for it other than Darkvision can not be used to see a Deep Stalker.

since the actual text of the feature is that you don't get the benefit of that feature when trying to detect the stalker, it's a perfectly viable interpretation to say that that's only when making perception checks after they've already used the hide action. Basically, they don't get to auto-see you as long as you're in dim light.

[FinnS]

since the actual text of the feature is that you don't get the benefit of that feature when trying to detect the stalker, it's a perfectly viable interpretation to say that that's only when making perception checks after they've already used the hide action. Basically, they don't get to auto-see you as long as you're in dim light.

If that were the case, there would be no reason for the paragraph that follows about hiding.
There is clearly a distinction being made between seeing them in general and hiding.


You are also adept at evading creatures that rely on darkvision. Such creatures gain no benefit when attempting to detect you in dark and dim conditions.
Additionally, when the DM determines if you can hide from a creature, that creature gains no benefit from its darkvision.

That whole second paragraph is just about actually hiding, it specifically says "additionally". Meaning the first paragraph clearly has nothing to do with hiding and is prior to the act of hiding.

[Foxhound438]

If that were the case, there would be no reason for the paragraph that follows about hiding.
There is clearly a distinction being made between seeing them in general and hiding.



That whole second paragraph is just about actually hiding meaning the first paragraph has nothing to do with actually hiding.

by my interpretation, the first is about being seen while already hidden, the second is about being able to go from location known to hidden. It's certainly not the only interpretation, if you don't like it that's fine.

[joaber]

by my interpretation, the first is about being seen while already hidden, the second is about being able to go from location known to hidden. It's certainly not the only interpretation, if you don't like it that's fine.

rechecking the hiding part of PHB, looks like is about giving lightly obscured (when you're in dim light) or heavily obscured (in darkness) conditions for the target with darkvision if you fill the other requirements: silence (treading on dry leaves) and no signs of passage (walking in the snow).

[FinnS]

by my interpretation, the first is about being seen while already hidden, the second is about being able to go from location known to hidden. It's certainly not the only interpretation, if you don't like it that's fine.

It doesn't read that way at all.
There is absolutely no reason what so ever to even write the second paragraph if the first paragraph was already about hiding.
And it's clearly not about Hiding or the sentence "Additionally, if the DM determines that the DS can hide" would not have been used to start that second paragraph.

There are plenty of things in RAW that can be interpreted in multiple ways, this is not one of them.
There is a clear distinction being made between detecting/seeing and actually hiding.

Unless actually hiding, a DS can still be detected in the dark by sound and/or smell but not with sight relying on Darkvision.

[sir_argo]

Terrible wording. I think (and this is only a guess) that it is similar to a wood elf who can hide while only lightly obscured, I think that a Dark Stalker can hide if the only way a creature can see the Ranger is with Darkvision. So if the Ranger and the Drow are in a lightless cave, the Ranger can hide even while in "direct sight" of the Drow. I also think it means that Darkvision doesn't work on a hidden Dark Stalker.

That's just how I interpret it. Please, please, don't anybody tell me they know the RAW on this.

[FinnS]

It's just like you are not hidden just because you're invisible and you're not invisible just because you're hidden.

A DS is invisible to darkvision in the dark but is not hidden.
You can still be detected through sound and/or smell.
A DS still has to hide/stealth to not be detected by means other than darkvision.

This is the only way those two paragraphs make sense.

[MeeposFire]

Crossbow Expert and Sharpshooter comes with the cost of two feats on a class that doesn't get too many. Rangers need Dex, Wis, Con, and some need Str (If you're a masochist and hate life), so most don't have the ASI to spare.

Though...

What's the combo for infinite advantage? Kobold riding a Wolf? Always have Advantage for Sharpshooter, Crossbow Expert means you can be up close with no penalty...

On a Kobold, though, it doesn't activate until level 8. Needing two ASIs with zero improvement to Dexterity, Con, or Wisdom. Likely probable with rolled stats, not with a point buy.

I am going to have to disagree with you there especially if you are planning to multiclass.

First if you did go for this feat based route around crossbows str would not be needed so that stat is not required.

Second rangers gain major benefits from high wisdom from two class abilities which are spell casting and their level 20 feature. If you are multiclassing then the level 20 feature is moot. As for spell casting while you can certainly build supporting using high wisdom and your spell casting the truth is you can also build a ranger that takes good spells that do not require a high wisdom thus you could just stick with a 13-14 wisdom for multiclassing. Remember unlike a prepared caster rangers do not get more spells known for high wisdom (wow they do get something for not being prepared even though I still am not a fan of that) and there are spells out there that you can use that have no ability score requirements most famously hunters mark. Also if you multiclass with a class with no spell casting this further diminshes the value of high wisdom even more. Long story short wisdom is an option but not a requirement.

As for con everybody wants it but playing a ranged character slightly reduces its need (though I would still raise it).

So really dex is what you really need and it is all you have to have If you liked the idea of a crossbow build. Con is always great but does not need to happen right away and while wisdom has its uses and thus having a decent score in it is a good idea you do not need to continually invest in it unless you are thinking of using spells that require saving throws or spell attack rolls a lot (which in my experience is not the case).

The biggest problem with a crossbow build (or any ranged build) is that if you beatmaster it leaves your beast with less targets around him so he is more likely to be attacked by enemies (whereas if you are there with him then the attacks might be spread out a bit more). Not a build killer at all just a little annoyance.


Of course you do not have to go with a crossbow build but it can be very effective.

[joaber]

I am going to have to disagree with you there especially if you are planning to multiclass.

First if you did go for this feat based route around crossbows str would not be needed so that stat is not required.

Second rangers gain major benefits from high wisdom from two class abilities which are spell casting and their level 20 feature. If you are multiclassing then the level 20 feature is moot. As for spell casting while you can certainly build supporting using high wisdom and your spell casting the truth is you can also build a ranger that takes good spells that do not require a high wisdom thus you could just stick with a 13-14 wisdom for multiclassing. Remember unlike a prepared caster rangers do not get more spells known for high wisdom (wow they do get something for not being prepared even though I still am not a fan of that) and there are spells out there that you can use that have no ability score requirements most famously hunters mark. Also if you multiclass with a class with no spell casting this further diminshes the value of high wisdom even more. Long story short wisdom is an option but not a requirement.

As for con everybody wants it but playing a ranged character slightly reduces its need (though I would still raise it).

So really dex is what you really need and it is all you have to have If you liked the idea of a crossbow build. Con is always great but does not need to happen right away and while wisdom has its uses and thus having a decent score in it is a good idea you do not need to continually invest in it unless you are thinking of using spells that require saving throws or spell attack rolls a lot (which in my experience is not the case).

The biggest problem with a crossbow build (or any ranged build) is that if you beatmaster it leaves your beast with less targets around him so he is more likely to be attacked by enemies (whereas if you are there with him then the attacks might be spread out a bit more). Not a build killer at all just a little annoyance.


Of course you do not have to go with a crossbow build but it can be very effective.

Agree. In fact, many multiclass rangers can dump Wis depending of what spells you'll choose (you just need 13 in Wis).
I'm making a goblin ranger that will leave the class after level 5, picked goodberry, hunter's mark, pass without trace and spike growth. The only missing part about the low Wis in that case is for wisdom checks and saves.