Akashic Magic- Do I have this right?

[thecrimsondawn]

Ran into this alt rule set eyeing over Lords of the Night, and shocked that I have never seen or heard of it before. Just wanna make sure I have the basics down before I dive into a build, so any advice and tips are most welcome.

Essence - the pool of power that you use to fuel all your Veilweaving with. I see this quote "Every creature has a finite amount of essence in their being, referred to as an essence pool" however I see nothing about a total pool amount for non veilweaving classes. Do non veilweaving classes have an essence pool of 1, null, or something else?

Essence Capacity - The max number of essence you can pump into a single thing. From the little chart at the bottom, it looks like most of your playtime you will have an essence cap of 2 or 3, with a tad bit more from Vizier class feature "Improved Essence Capacity", and I saw a single feat that boosts one source by 1 as well. I understand this thus far, however looking at the veils, even fully augmenting the things with as much essence as I can dump into it, the damage or effect of the abilities is far, far below the damage output of any other class I can think of. Because of just how low the results I am getting, I am thinking I am either overlooking something or doing something wrong. Some advice here would be most helpful :)

Veilweaving - Lets see if I have this right. When I wake up, I spend my essence into the veils that I want to use for the day. Since the veils have different bonuses, I can choose one of the effects, or how strong the effect is. As a swift action I can take the points I have spent and re spend them across the veils I have equipped. Considering how big their essence pool will be, and how small the essence cap is, I will have a TON of points left over, raising another flag that I am doing something wrong here or missing some key information. Clarification please?

Chakra Binds - By the sounds of it, its just a slot with added bonuses when I add a veil to it. It seems to simply be motivation to bind to that specific slot for added bonuses. Do I have this right?

Veil question - I see nothing saying that it is required that I bind every veil in the morning. Would I be able to leave a slot open hypothetically, for a situation that may come up (such as needing true seeing) or is there no real point to doing that?

Classes - Ive found only 2 so far - the Vizier, and a PrC from the Lords of the Night book. Are there any others, and could you share name and/or sources for them so I can take a gander at them please? :)

Recommendations - Despite my feeling that this will be best used for multi classing, I will start with a pure build to learn and master this alt rule set that has gained my attention. As such, are there any feat or veil recommendations or avoid at all cost advice you are willing to share as well?


Sorry for the stream of questions. I figured I would get them all out of the way at once. Even if yall only know the answer to one or two, that would help out a lot. Thanks in advance :)

[Coretron03]

First, have a read of this guide if you haven't, here http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?377818-PsyBomb-s-Guides-to-the-Akashic-Mysteries!&goto=newpost
Contains alot of useful stuff.

1: The fluff is that all creatures have a personal storage of essence but cannot use it without training, either taking a veilweaving class like the Vizier, taking certain archtypes for normal classes that are not on the srd and taking the extra essence feat ([url]http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/variant-magic-rules/akashic-magic/feats/extra-essence/[/url, any of which giving you the ability to use your esscence pool.

2: They can reach pretty decent damage totals with enough effort (like using the hand cannons veil with improved capacity and the shock gauntlets (Probably got the name wrong) veil and taking the typical archer feats plus the chakra targeting feat let you make quite a few attacks at good damage, although it requires a bit of investment. Even just using the riven darts veil bound and boosted using improved capacity let you do ok damage (at level 11 you can send 7 darts that deal 6d4 damage, max of 2 darts per person. Uses some stuff that isn't on the srd but in the book. They're capable of doing much more then damage though.

3: Viziers can invest essence into wands for more charges and everyone can take feats that they can power with essence. Improved capacity let you invest more into veils.

4:Yes, they give bonus if you bind them there. Can only have 1 bound per chakra though, and if you use the Viziers veilweaving ability you can't have them bound unless you spend a hour doing that.

5: I'm not sure.

6: There are 2 more veilweaving classes, the Daevic and the Guru. There not on the srd, only available in the book itself. In the same book there are a couple more prcs, my favourite the amplifier which is like a theruge for the vizier and normal casters. There's also alot of archtypes for normal classes that give esscence.

7: The guide I linked can help you with this.

[Psyren]

Have you ever played with 3.5's "Magic of Incarnum?" Akashic is basically a conversion/remaster of that.

[Milo v3]

Here is a link to the product which has the actual full mechanics and rules for Akashic Magic. (http://paizo.com/products/btpy9o6i?Akashic-Mysteries)

[thecrimsondawn]

Thanks for all the replies everyone :)

The feeling I got from this alt rules was a lot like the Binder from Tome of Magic in 3.5, allbit, a lot better in quite a few ways. I enjoyed Binder just as I enjoy Warlock, and I feel d&d needs to step away from the daily use limits of all but the most powerful of abilities, and these classes really fit my desire to find things like that.

Im not sure if I have played using content from MoI or not. 3.5 has SO MUCH STUFF, that there is no way I could be certain.

Ill give this class a play with the current information posted on the srd to see if I really do enjoy the rules or not. If I do, I would most certainly support yet another DSP product and grab the pdf.

The amplifier eh? As a fan of duel progression classes, am I right to assume that its a PrC, or is it a base class that has access to a spell list and veils?

[Milo v3]

The amplifier eh? As a fan of duel progression classes, am I right to assume that its a PrC, or is it a base class that has access to a spell list and veils?
Yeah it's a prestige class.

[Coretron03]

Yep, the Amplifier grants full veilweaving and full casting and can be entered from a arcane, divine or even psionic class and required your typical 2nd level spells/powers but only requires 2 levels in vizier. For giving up 2 caster levels you get the ability to improve/change a spells effect if you have a veil with the same descreptior or subtype, either boosting the caster level of the spell/power, using it to give you more "effective" essence into the veil or convert them into self healing. The capstone give benfits if you sacrifice your highest level spell/power for some nice benefits. A couple feats let you do stuff to combine veils and magic/psionics like effectively +1 caster level for your chosen school, reducing augmentation costs and even free metamagic (Which is awesome as it lets you extend key buffs or other cool stuff for a hour per metamgic feat. If you had enough time you could extend every spell you could cast if you have a hour/spell to prepare).

I recommend getting the full product, it's chock full of cool options for alot of characters.

[thecrimsondawn]

After reading the guide and doing my research, oh, and of course thanks to yall as well, I can honestly say, I REALLY like this system. I do have a couple remaining questions tho.

So the guide talks about a race with +4INT bonus, and that would be ideal. However, it seems that its some sort of alt race feature or something of a parent race. What is the core race that it changes, or am I misunderstanding it?

I have a confusion about veils still too. I see a listed number of veils you can shape per day, and then there is binding them to a chakra, and infusing them with essence. There seem to be the three main things you do as a veilweaver. When shaping the veils, can you only shape one for a given slot, even if its not bound, or can you shape more then one that governs the same slot and only gain the effects of one at a time? Looking at the total number of veils the Vizier gets, it is exactly enough to fit every veil slot, so I am assuming its 1 for 1 only, with the exception of a feat I saw earlier.

Lastly, the gears are turning now, and I am working on my build. Currently, I am thinking about a 1 level dip in Warder to get an INT based combat reflexes, and to swap out one martial discipline with Elemental Flux, for the first level stance that adds your initiator level in fire damage to all your attacks. Perhaps even taking the archetype Dervish Defender for INT to AC as well, but this raises three more questions

1) does armor effect the Viziers ability at all if you have the ability to wear it? I dont recall seeing anything about an ASF equivalent so far.
2) the guide says the hand cannons count as a wielded weapon when shaped. Does this effect both hands so I can gain the benefits of Dervish Defender, or would I need have some other weapon in my hand with hand cannon at the same time?
3) would hand cannon get the bonus damage from the Storm Gauntlets veil if I have them both on at the same time?

If these things work together, I have a very dangerous build I feel :D

[Ninjaxenomorph]

Let's say you are level 5 vizier; you can have 4 veils shaped, 5 essence, and can bind to your hands and feet (let's assume that you aren't playing an akashic race and you don't have any extra essence or veils from feats). You can choose any 4 veils off your list and shape them in separate slots; many veils can be shaped in multiple slots for this reason. Your essence can be invested into these veils as a swift action, and moved around with a swift action. If you BIND veils, you put the essence into it and lock it there; it cannot be reassigned until you reshape your veils.

[Milo v3]

So the guide talks about a race with +4INT bonus, and that would be ideal. However, it seems that its some sort of alt race feature or something of a parent race. What is the core race that it changes, or am I misunderstanding it?
It doesn't change a core race, it changes one of the races introduced in the book.

[Ssalarn]

After reading the guide and doing my research, oh, and of course thanks to yall as well, I can honestly say, I REALLY like this system.


Thanks, I enjoyed writing it :smallbiggrin:



I do have a couple remaining questions tho.


Let me see if I can help!



So the guide talks about a race with +4INT bonus, and that would be ideal. However, it seems that its some sort of alt race feature or something of a parent race. What is the core race that it changes, or am I misunderstanding it?

This is the Hibkha, or ibisfolk, a variant of the suqur (hawkfolk) race presented in Akashic Mysteries. AM contains three new races and two racial subvariants of each.



I have a confusion about veils still too. I see a listed number of veils you can shape per day, and then there is binding them to a chakra, and infusing them with essence.

So far, so good.



There seem to be the three main things you do as a veilweaver. When shaping the veils, can you only shape one for a given slot, even if its not bound, or can you shape more then one that governs the same slot and only gain the effects of one at a time? Looking at the total number of veils the Vizier gets, it is exactly enough to fit every veil slot, so I am assuming its 1 for 1 only, with the exception of a feat I saw earlier.

Generally it's only one veil per slot; there is a vizier a class ability and a feat that both expand this though.



Lastly, the gears are turning now, and I am working on my build. Currently, I am thinking about a 1 level dip in Warder to get an INT based combat reflexes, and to swap out one martial discipline with Elemental Flux, for the first level stance that adds your initiator level in fire damage to all your attacks.

One suggestion I'd give here, consider the Feelkha race (elephantfolk, gamla subvariant) for Warder builds. It's +CON/INT and large sized, which is awesome for Warders.



Perhaps even taking the archetype Dervish Defender for INT to AC as well, but this raises three more questions

1) does armor effect the Viziers ability at all if you have the ability to wear it? I dont recall seeing anything about an ASF equivalent so far.


Akashic magic does not suffer from ACP or ASF. While your vizier doesn't start with armor proficiencies, nothing's stopping you from picking up armor elsewhere.



2) the guide says the hand cannons count as a wielded weapon when shaped. Does this effect both hands so I can gain the benefits of Dervish Defender, or would I need have some other weapon in my hand with hand cannon at the same time?

Hand Cannons require you to have a free hand to use them and can't be used in the same round as another weapon; this may be an issue as regards the Dervish Defender archetype, though I'd have to double-check the exact text there.



3) would hand cannon get the bonus damage from the Storm Gauntlets veil if I have them both on at the same time?

Yes. Hand Cannons can benefit from pretty much any effect that would modify any other weapon.



If these things work together, I have a very dangerous build I feel :D

Viziers can be very nasty, especially multiclassed. If you pick up Akashic Mysteries, there are two other classes, the Daevic and the Guru; both are more martially oriented than the Vizier and may provide you with some additional options, though Vizier and Warder is a pretty potent combo. The Daevic is a full BAB veilweaver with a more combat focused set of class features and abilities. A Dominion Daevic can TWF with a shield enhanced with essentially a portable black hole that can suck in enemies (El's Utterdark Shield), and might be something worth looking at for TWF builds. Also, it seems like you're a pretty savvy player so this may not matter, but the daevic's particular method of veilweaving is designed to be more "set and forget" than the vizier's, so it can be an easier entry point to the system.

[thecrimsondawn]

Awesome! Thanks for that detailed reply! :D

I think this answers all the questions I currently have. My DM and I just talked about it, and I got the OK to give this guy a playtest (still going to need to run the handcannon thing by him tho but its looking like it would work via RAW, but if its RAI or not, well, that I would not know :p)
Depending on if our party lives or dies in our current save the world from the undead setting, I may be making a vampire veilweaver instead, because who needs CON when you have CHA ;-)


Hmm.... a tier 5 mythic multi classed Warder/Vizier Vampire. Nothing op about this idea at all :p

[Ssalarn]

Awesome! Thanks for that detailed reply! :D

I think this answers all the questions I currently have. My DM and I just talked about it, and I got the OK to give this guy a playtest (still going to need to run the handcannon thing by him tho but its looking like it would work via RAW, but if its RAI or not, well, that I would not know :p)
Depending on if our party lives or dies in our current save the world from the undead setting, I may be making a vampire veilweaver instead, because who needs CON when you have CHA ;-)


Hmm.... a tier 5 mythic multi classed Warder/Vizier Vampire. Nothing op about this idea at all :p

Since you already mentioned having Lords of the Night, I'm sure you've seen the Black Templar, the akashic necromancer PrC. Sounds like you already have a solid character progression in mind, but it never hurts to mention that there's other thematically appropriate options available :smallsmile:
Black Templar can also be pretty nice since it's only a 5 level PrC, so there's frequently room to fit it into builds that might not otherwise accommodate a PrC (or additional PrC).

[thecrimsondawn]

Since you already mentioned having Lords of the Night, I'm sure you've seen the Black Templar, the akashic necromancer PrC. Sounds like you already have a solid character progression in mind, but it never hurts to mention that there's other thematically appropriate options available :smallsmile:
Black Templar can also be pretty nice since it's only a 5 level PrC, so there's frequently room to fit it into builds that might not otherwise accommodate a PrC (or additional PrC).

Ya, it did indeed catch my eye. In fact, the whole reason I even found the Akashic Magic was thanks to Lords of the Night. Vampire says they use Cha instead of Con for all Akashic feats, and I was like....what in the 9 hells is an akashic feat?, and then...here I am :D

[NomGarret]

While it's certainly possible to wind up with more Essence than places to put it, that disappears after the first couple levels and you'll be running with closer to 2/3 capacity most of the time.

One gear point that was called out in the guide but is worth mentioning again: Akashic Catalysts. They function as a sort of "virtual essence" which gives you one more way to boost your numbers above the base level cap.