Is it just me or have the characters just got so much more useful?

[TheAlmightyOne]

Belkar has learned evasion and has proved himself usefull against MITD
Roy, thanks to his new sword, managed to get Xykon on the ropes for a while, not to mention essentially defeating a zombie dragon and a death knight in one attack
Hayley, now faced with the responsibility of leadership, has become much more resourceful and competant
Elan. His level in dashing swordsman has made him competant in battle and his new instructions have aloud him to create useful images
Durkon seems to be better at numbers as he instantly hit the heuaceva and ninja
V. Held the breach practicly on his own until he ran out of spells and still lives

I thought they were supposed to be incompetant

[Soepvork]

Elan. His level in dashing swordsman has made him competant in battle and his new instructions have aloud him to create useful images


Nah, Elan should have been "bardic" this battle... Inspire courage with a army of allies anyone?

[Azukar]

Well they are growing levels...

[Orzel]

When you battle thousands of people, your other abilities are more likely to get a chance to shine.

[Tirian]

Nah, Elan should have been "bardic" this battle... Inspire courage with a army of allies anyone?

What? Elan got two strips entirely dedicated to his bardic powers during the battle. But when the enemy is paying more attention to you than your allies, so much better to be a Dashing Swordsman.

As far as the OP's point goes, I'm really glad to see competence from the OOTS. We'll never be completely certain what level they are, but it is undoubtedly a point that one does not bumble into. They are the best of the best among people in their continent, and now that we know and love them it's possible to fill strips with "whoa, that's cool" moments as easily as jokes at their expense. Which is great.

Although, now that you mention it, we had a strip of Roy kicking Xykon around, Elan being a DS, V disintegrating the elementals, and Haley and Belkar each taking out a small army of goblinoids. I certainly hope that we don't start enjoying Hinjo's junk before Durkon gets a chance to be surrounded by undead and showing what he's made of. (And, no, a sneak attack against the heuceva doesn't count. I want to see squaring off against the hated undead with all that's holy, that was just saving Hinjo's life.)

[Chronos]

What? Elan got two strips entirely dedicated to his bardic powers during the battle. But when the enemy is paying more attention to you than your allies, so much better to be a Dashing Swordsman.In a battle that was, what, 50 strips long? That's 48 strips during which he was vastly less effective than he should have been. He would literally have been hundreds or thousands of times more effective (yes, I did the math) if he had done nothing but sing for the entire battle.

[Gundato]

I don't hold the lack of Barding against Elan. Without Roy, that is a considerably weaker force on the wall. So Elan had to focus more upon saving his own butt (as well as the other people on the wall) than buffing the army. A buffed army is great, but I don't think it is worth a couple dead PCs.

[Ithekro]

Besides, that gives the PCs a "reliable" backup spellcaster for their escape. The question remains, what does Elan know in terms of spells? He's get 18 Charisma and room for like 21 known spells and like 12 spells left for today. He could hurt somebody with that.

[Gundato]

Assuming he has a single offensive spell. Judging from what we have seen, and his personality/archetype, almost every single one of his spells is probably of the "Illusion that is useful for telling a story" variety.

[Tirian]

In a battle that was, what, 50 strips long? That's 48 strips during which he was vastly less effective than he should have been. He would literally have been hundreds or thousands of times more effective (yes, I did the math) if he had done nothing but sing for the entire battle.

I didn't realize there was anyone left who needed more of the whole "Repel, repel, repel, repel the evil goblin invasion" joke. :smallconfused: Besides, to borrow the words of a famous flying squirrel, "That trick never works!"

If Rich homeruled that a rousing bard speech before a battle would give a morale boost to the entire army until defeat was obvious (i.e the castle exploding) and that a tearful memorial to a fallen hero would last longer yet, then I would respect a wise decision. There's absolutely no real-world rationale to justify a troubador on the battlefield. On the other hand, the jovial sass-talking of a Dashing Swordsman seems like precisely the sort of thing that would give an additional inspiration to the nearby troops in the heat of battle.

[Oxymoron]

I don`t think we shall expect too much from Durkon this battle. He truly had his moment in the Cliffport-battle. In this battle, V was the great hero. However it seems like Durkon is going up against Redcloak, so maybe we can expect som Durkon-action in the next strip.

[Chronos]

There's absolutely no real-world rationale to justify a troubador on the battlefield.Really? It's funny, then, that every real-world army has included them. What do you think the fifes and drums and bagpipes and other military musicians are for?

As for saving his own butt, Elan gets two attacks per round. Dashing quips gave him +4 to damage for each of those two hits. Inspire Courage, on the other hand, would give a +2 to damage and attack to him and everyone else. Even just looking at the soldier or two on each side of Elan, that's already doing more to help Elan survive.

Nor would Elan have had to use up any spells. That's a use of Bardic Music (which Elan can do a dozen times a day), not a spell, and a single use would last the entire battle. So he'd still be fresh to illuse the hobgoblins at the boat.

[Spiky]

Really? It's funny, then, that every real-world army has included them. What do you think the fifes and drums and bagpipes and other military musicians are for?

Um, target practice after the armed soldiers were dead? Don't recall a history book with a rousing story of the singers winning the battle. There are close situations in the Bible, but as the humans never did the actual fighting, close don't cut it.

[Ithekro]

It is not about the fighting, it is about encouraging troops, moving along orders at great distances, and striking fear into your enemies. Take the bagpines for example. They are an instrument of war...that is what they were designed to do. They are designed to shreak like the banshee and scare any enemy force from the field of battle before the soldiers even come into weapons range. Drums are to keep formations and pass along orders, as are bugles. The remainder are to keep friendly troops inspired and patriotic inbetween battles and prehaps to rally the men back into action should things go wrong. They are (or where) important on the battlefield. They might not have every taken a life by themselves (though I can imagine someone being scared to death by the bagpines) the results from their being played have had influence in the battles of history. Not the glorious kind, but enough to keep the armies going.

Elan's speech at the beginning of the battle was suppose to help inspire the troops...he just kind of screwed it up.

[Belkar's Left Foot]

;>_< people this is a comic, what happened happened, no use arguing on "what ifs" But I do wish we would see more offensive magic from Elan, illusions are useful and all....but I want some offense people! I can't be the only one.....can I? :smallconfused:

[the_tick_rules]

they're always powerful, they just applying themselves.

[Krellen]

but I want some offense people! I can't be the only one.....can I? :smallconfused:
Bards have approximately one offensive spell: shout. It's not very impressive.

[maitreyi]

They've never been tested as much as they have been recently. Or had more at stake, that must make a difference.

[Holy_Knight]

In a battle that was, what, 50 strips long? That's 48 strips during which he was vastly less effective than he should have been. He would literally have been hundreds or thousands of times more effective (yes, I did the math) if he had done nothing but sing for the entire battle.

Remember though, he has only limited uses of bardic music. It's possible that he did use it more than we actually saw on panel, and/or that sometimes he was saving it for when it could potentially turn a bigger tide.

[Roderick_BR]

Yeah, after so many battles, they learn new things.
And this battle was particularly hard, forcing them to work better than before.

[Tirian]

Really? It's funny, then, that every real-world army has included them. What do you think the fifes and drums and bagpipes and other military musicians are for?

Big drums and bagpipes and bugles are for communication during battle. Drums and fifes are for establishing a cadence during a march. Lutes and kazoos are only for singing about the battle's heroes in a tavern ten years later.