Charisma to perception and other head shaking

[Rowan Wolf]

So I attend a non-AL game at a local shop and there and as one of three new players (the shop hosts additional AL legal games, but all of them were full). The DM is easygoing, and UA material is allow, but I think one of the other players is either not clear on the basic mechanics or outright ignoring (or at worst cheating).

On a perception check he announced he was able to add Cha to the check I am not sure if there is a feature that adds that but I could be mistake, that seemed odd, but later events have me confused.

So as a multiclass character (the character leveled to 5 during the session) a warlock/sorcerer and at the last encounter of the day he used both 3rd level spells and exceed the sorcery point maximums.

I don't want to be "that guy" that points out the less than by the book activities (as I got stuck with that in a very poorly ran AL game last year), so I am going to see what happens.

More wanting to know if anyone has the reference for Charisma to perception?

[Dr.Samurai]

The Sentinel Raven feature of the Raven Queen warlock patron grants you a bonus to Perception checks equal to your Charisma modifier.

Not sure on the sorcery points. Since warlock spells refresh on a short rest, he may have burned them for more sorcery points before a short rest and then regained the slots back after the hour. He'd have his regular spell slots and more sorcery points to use.

[Steampunkette]

Could be the Raven Queen, definitely.

Alternatively, describing a skill in different ways requires a different stat for the check.

Let's say I'm proficient in Athletics, a Strength Based Skill.

I want to make a Judgement on whether or not I could clear a long jump from a balcony to a nearby rooftop.

Since I'm not making the jump I shouldn't use Strength, and Intelligence fits best at judging a distance and estimating strength/velocity/angle.

But since there's no skill in the game that represents understanding how to jump other than Athletics, I'd apply my Athletics proficiency to the skill check.

Intelligent Athletics check.

[Tanarii]

First of all, the order of operations, so to speak, is you make an ability check, and add proficiency bonus for a skill or tool if you have it. So it's not a perception check. It's a Wisdom (perception) check normally, and the player is asking to make a Charisma (perception) check instead. That's a small but important philopshical distinction.

Second, there's a variant rule in the PHB (and online Players Basic rules) that allows variant skills. By default it's always a Wisdom (perception) check. But under the variant rule, is whatever ability check is appropriate, with skill proficiency applied. The example given is Stength (Intimidation) instead of Charisma (Intimidation). One I commonly use is Constitution (Athletics). I can't recall without checking but that may also be given as an example.

But in theory the DM should be determining what ability check is appropriate, if any is needed. And what proficiency applies (none, standard skill, variant skill, or tool) as appropriate. That's not to say a player can't ask for a check, specific ability, or if they can apply a proficiency bonus to it from whatever source. And some DMs may prefer to let players determine what to use. (Caveats because different DMs will run the game different ways.)

So if you want to bring it up at all, judge how the DM adjudicates, then ask the DM why Charisma (perception) works in that situation. Personally I'd do it quietly after the game with just the DM there, and make it a question about understanding how you can apply your own characters ability scores, skills, and tools. Make it clear it's not about undercutting another player.

[Rowan Wolf]

Thanks. Raven Queen patron OK, though that still doesn't explain the class features not adding up to potential character level (the total level 5 multiclassed character with level 3 spell), but at least first mystery is solved.

[Steampunkette]

Thanks. Raven Queen patron OK, though that still doesn't explain the class features not adding up to potential character level (the total level 5 multiclassed character with level 3 spell), but at least first mystery is solved.

A level 5 Sorcerer/Cleric would have 3rd level spell slots.

A Warlock/Sorcerer should not, because Pact Magic is a separate thing.

However, the DM may be House-Ruling the features to stack for the purpose of Sorcerer Spell Slots.

[RSP]

You may want to explain that Sorcerer slots don't mix with Pact Magic

[Rowan Wolf]

Most likely as he seem to think he could cast slow on aforementioned character.



However, the DM may be House-Ruling the features to stack for the purpose of Sorcerer Spell Slots.
No house rule in place of that nature it is almost like the guy thinks he get the features of both classes equal to the total character level as he started with no fewer than 2 warlock level (as repelling blast was used before the level up), but slow was cast after gaining a level for a total level 5 overall.

[Dr.Samurai]

He may just be confused about how spell slots work with multiclassing, or confusing the 5th level prerequisite for Mire the Mind to mean 5th character level and not class level. He may just be making a mistake.

[Rowan Wolf]

He may just be confused about how spell slots work with multiclassing, or confusing the 5th level prerequisite for Mire the Mind to mean 5th character level and not class level. He may just be making a mistake.

Hopefully it is just that though I don't know how to politely approach the subject.

The game is only every other week so, I will see where things go. Maybe one of the 3 AL table will have room if this table and that will solve that.

[Rowan Wolf]

Update, a whole lot of misinterpretationon that player's part. He argued that "Additionally, when you gain a levei in this c1ass, you can choose one of the sorcerer spells you know and replace it with another spell from the sorcerer spelllist, which also must be of a levei for which you have spell slots." While stacking the warlock levels with sorcerer on the mulitclass chart. Apparently that has been how the groups he normally played with had ran it.

Still shaking my head.

[Jerrykhor]

This is where you pull out the rules on multi-classing and tell him to cut that **** out.

[Rowan Wolf]

This is where you pull out the rules on multi-classing and tell him to cut that **** out.
I referenced the multiclassing section, before he brought up the section on "Spells Known" in the Sorcerer section. I am mostly blaming poor reading comprehension, willful ignorance and/or munchkinism. Needless to say he argued for it most of the time a few new players joined the table and were making characters. I am still finding it difficult to believe any table plays as he considered normal.