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UnwiseAlistair
2017-04-06, 06:42 PM
So I know blackguard exists for paladins who become evil, but is there something that works for a paladin who falls on the law/chaos scale rather than good/evil? I'm pretty new to pathfinder so I'm wondering if there's something in one of the bazillion books for something like this.

Sayt
2017-04-06, 07:16 PM
There is the gray paladin from Ultimate Intrigue, but that only gets you to NG, not CG.

Jarmen4u
2017-04-06, 07:31 PM
Google Paladin of Freedom. It's a class variant where the paladin can be CG instead of LG.

souridealist
2017-04-06, 07:38 PM
I don't know of any, sadly - it would be really cool. I wish we got more discussion of paladins falling on the law/chaos axis, but it doesn't come up a lot, probably because it's harder to do.

3.5 had a chaotic good paladin variant in some sourcebook or other, and it's very easy to cook up in Pathfinder; you can basically just swap 'law' with 'chaos' and vice versa on the paladin page and switch the levels when you get Aura of Courage vs Aura of Resolve and you're good to go. I don't know if that's quite what you wanted, though.

Is this a thought experiment, or do you have a paladin character who you're thinking might fall? If you're in the second situation, I might look at retraining some of the levels as cleric levels, depending on what deity your paladin served. (It would make a lot more sense for Sarenrae than Abadar, for example.)

But yeah, I don't think there's a prestige class for that exact scenario. I'd love to be wrong, though.

Bohandas
2017-04-06, 07:56 PM
There's the Holy Liberator (I think from either Complete Divine or Vomplete Warrior, I forget which), but I don't think it lets you trade in levels like blackguard does. I imagine it could be adapted easily enough.

Jarmen4u
2017-04-06, 09:12 PM
I don't know of any, sadly - it would be really cool. I wish we got more discussion of paladins falling on the law/chaos axis, but it doesn't come up a lot, probably because it's harder to do.

3.5 had a chaotic good paladin variant in some sourcebook or other, and it's very easy to cook up in Pathfinder; you can basically just swap 'law' with 'chaos' and vice versa on the paladin page and switch the levels when you get Aura of Courage vs Aura of Resolve and you're good to go. I don't know if that's quite what you wanted, though.

Is this a thought experiment, or do you have a paladin character who you're thinking might fall? If you're in the second situation, I might look at retraining some of the levels as cleric levels, depending on what deity your paladin served. (It would make a lot more sense for Sarenrae than Abadar, for example.)

But yeah, I don't think there's a prestige class for that exact scenario. I'd love to be wrong, though.

I'm more of a 3.5 guy, but are Freedom Paladins not in Pathfinder? That sucks.

Arutema
2017-04-07, 12:45 AM
So I know blackguard exists for paladins who become evil, but is there something that works for a paladin who falls on the law/chaos scale rather than good/evil? I'm pretty new to pathfinder so I'm wondering if there's something in one of the bazillion books for something like this.

Blackguard was cut from Pathfinder in favor of the Antipaladin. It has similar language about fallen paladins retraining into antipaladin, but there's still nothing for paladins who fall to chaos rather than evil. By RAW, this leaves them stuck as fighters with no bonus feats unless they use Ultimate Campaign's retraining rules to change classes.

Dagroth
2017-04-07, 01:23 AM
Yeah, the Holy Liberator class from Complete Divine is basically a CG Prestige Paladin class. It's not really meant for "fallen" Paladins.

It is not altogether uncommon for paladins to slip away from the unswerving path of law in their overriding quest for good and become holy liberators. For the most part, the ex-paladin who adopts the holy liberator class does not regain any of his lost paladin abilities. However, the character’s paladin levels stack with holy liberator levels for the purpose of determining caster level for holy liberator spells and for determining the power of his smite evil ability.

Particle_Man
2017-04-07, 02:06 AM
I think Pathfinder (not using 3.5) has LG paladins, CE antipaladins, (any)E Insinuators (a variant of anti-paladins), and Lawful(any) hell knights (not sure about the last). NG, CG and N seem to be absent their equivalents (although I think Insinuators that are NE can at least appeal to N outsiders as temporary patrons).

Particle_Man
2017-04-07, 02:09 AM
Oh, if 3.5 is allowed in, you could go with (raises shields against rotten fruit) the Soulborn, which can be LG, CG, CE or LE and which can "fall" into any of the other three extreme "diagonal" alignments and still be "powered up" qua Soulborn. Thus one could start as a LG Soulborn and "fall" to CG and become a CG Soulborn.

Psyren
2017-04-07, 10:04 AM
If my Paladin fell for being too Chaotic, I would just retrain as an Inquisitor, Warpriest, Vigilante or Cavalier instead. No point in staying where I'm not wanted or doing something I'm not suited for.