Abrams Tank (D20 M) Vs. Battle Titan (3.5)

[Tainted_Scholar]

A Battle Titan (MMIII pg38) Vs. an Abrams Tank.

Fight takes place in the world's largest, and emptiest, parking lot. 800 ft by 800 ft. At high noon.
They start 100 ft apart.
The Battle Titan has the equipment from the stat block, but it can be re-feated.

Looking solely at their stat-blocks I'm fairly certain that the Battle Titan would win, however I'm not terribly familiar with D20 Modern as a system. As such, I decided that to ask the Playground's opinion on the matter.

[Remuko]

Are we using D20 Massive Damage Rules or 3.5? There's a massive difference.

[Tainted_Scholar]

Are we using D20 Massive Damage Rules or 3.5? There's a massive difference.

3.5 for the Battle Titan. D20 for the tank, assuming the Abrams is even subject to it.

[ColorBlindNinja]

Are we using D20 Massive Damage Rules or 3.5? There's a massive difference.

Is the Fort save still DC 15? Battletitans have a Fort save of +29 and if it takes Steadfast Determination it won't ever fail that save.

Edit: According to a quick Google search, it is DC 15 and the tank has to deal over 29 damage (Battletitans have 29 Con) in order to force the save. The tank should be dealing about 65 damage every round if it deal 10d12 on a hit.

[Inevitability]

Is the Fort save still DC 15? Battletitans have a Fort save of +29 and if it takes Steadfast Determination it won't ever fail that save.

Edit: According to a quick Google search, it is DC 15 and the tank has to deal over 29 damage (Battletitans have 29 Con) in order to force the save. The tank should be dealing about 65 damage every round if it deal 10d12 on a hit.

I'm fairly sure we're assuming their default statblocks. Adding Steadfast Determination on the battletitan seems like a violation of that.

[Tainted_Scholar]

I'm fairly sure we're assuming their default statblocks. Adding Steadfast Determination on the battletitan seems like a violation of that.

I allowed re-feating for the Battle Titan.

[Inevitability]

I allowed re-feating for the Battle Titan.

Oops, nevermind my post then.

[Mato]

Looking solely at their stat-blocks I'm fairly certain that the Battle Titan would win, however I'm not terribly familiar with D20 Modern as a system. As such, I decided that to ask the Playground's opinion on the matter.And just in case he's wrong.

I allowed re-feating for the Battle Titan.Feel free to respec the battle titan as needed until it can win. :smallwink:

And it will, the tank requires an operator otherwise it's a helpless object. Otherwise the tank can drive in circles at it's lowest speed category (5~100ft) for hours while the melee-only battle titan harmlessly runs after it. And assume they charge head first at each other and stand toe-to-toe, the tank rams for 12d8 and guns for 10d12/2d12, needing six rounds after the ram to win with an every increasing chance of a natural 1 against the massive damage killing the battle titan. The battle titan's claws & tail deal an average of 0 damage after hardness and needs six attacks with it's bite to bring the tank into negative numbers (note the tank needs brought down to -32hp to be destroyed and the crew can still attack). What I'm saying is, there is no logical reason the tank would ever lose and the OP already doubted this to begin with for a good reason. But he wants to be right, so someone hit it with awaken and a bunch of wizard levels.

[ColorBlindNinja]

And just in case he's wrong.
Feel free to respec the battle titan as needed until it can win. :smallwink:

And it will, the tank requires an operator otherwise it's a helpless object. Otherwise the tank can drive in circles at it's lowest speed category (5~100ft) for hours while the melee-only battle titan harmlessly runs after it. And assume they charge head first at each other and stand toe-to-toe, the tank rams for 12d8 and guns for 10d12/2d12, needing six rounds after the ram to win with an every increasing chance of a natural 1 against the massive damage killing the battle titan. The battle titan's claws & tail deal an average of 0 damage after hardness and needs six attacks with it's bite to bring the tank into negative numbers (note the tank needs brought down to -32hp to be destroyed and the crew can still attack). What I'm saying is, there is no logical reason the tank would ever lose and the OP already doubted this to begin with for a good reason. But he wants to be right, so someone hit it with awaken and a bunch of wizard levels.

Assuming the Battletitan has Steadfast Determination, Leap Attack and Shock Trooper (and ditches the armor) it can charge and power attack for around 60 damage (after applying hardness). The tank can't kill it in one hit and Battle Titan's next attack kills it.

Edit: Just noticed it has enough hit dice to take epic feats. Give it Dire Charge and it can make a full attack. At that point I'm pretty sure it destroys the tank in one round. Superior Initiative would be a good pick too.

[Starbuck_II]

An Abrams Tank can't even kill a tree on average.
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/wilderness.htm#forestTerrain
I mean dang: The trunk of a typical tree has AC 4, hardness 5, and 150 hp.

[Tainted_Scholar]

An Abrams Tank can't even kill a tree on average.
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/wilderness.htm#forestTerrain
I mean dang: The trunk of a typical tree has AC 4, hardness 5, and 150 hp.

Let's not get into the insanity of D&D inanimate objects. Especially since you can drop that tree from orbit and it will be just fine. Average rolls on 20 D6 is 70.