Help for building a Valor Bard

[Dankus Memakus]

I'm playing a 7th level Half-Elf Valor Bard and I really want him built similar to a paladin, I'd like spell suggestions, Feat suggestions, weapons, anything to help really. I'd like him built like a sturdy, support-y spellcaster. (Also, our DM doesn't want us to multiclass so I cannot take 2 paladin levels and get smite sadly) Just some extra info about my character.

- Fights with a longsword and shield
- Uses medium armor
- grabbed some heal spells
- Chaotic Good
- No magic items yet (they are quite rare in our world)
- Fairly high strength and dex

[nickl_2000]

I'm playing a 7th level Half-Elf Valor Bard and I really want him built similar to a paladin, I'd like spell suggestions, Feat suggestions, weapons, anything to help really. I'd like him built like a sturdy, support-y spellcaster. (Also, our DM doesn't want us to multiclass so I cannot take 2 paladin levels and get smite sadly) Just some extra info about my character.

- Fights with a longsword and shield
- Uses medium armor
- grabbed some heal spells
- Chaotic Good
- No magic items yet (they are quite rare in our world)
- Fairly high strength and dex


Probably the most basic feat suggestion would be War Caster. If you are in the thick of things this is a flat out requirement. After that, possibly Medium Armor Mastery if you have he Dex to make it work or Shield Mastery would help you stay alive against this AoE spells.

[Dankus Memakus]

Probably the most basic feat suggestion would be War Caster. If you are in the thick of things this is a flat out requirement. After that, possibly Medium Armor Mastery if you have he Dex to make it work or Shield Mastery would help you stay alive against this AoE spells.

Medium armor mastery requires a 16 in dex correct?

[nickl_2000]

Medium armor mastery requires a 16 in dex correct?

The requirement is Prof in Medium armor,

It gives:
- No Disadvantage on stealth checks
- You can add +3 to AC instead of +2 in medium armor

Not the most amazing, but if you are a sneaky group it could really help. Also, if you can get away with it, check out the spiked armor from the Sword Coast Adventure Guide

[Specter]

Valor Bards definitely need extra attack and a fighting style ASAP. After level 6, that's what you should aim for, from Paladin or Fighter.

[Arkhios]

Valor Bards definitely need extra attack and a fighting style ASAP. After level 6, that's what you should aim for, from Paladin or Fighter.
Unfortunately, as OP said, their DM doesn't want them to multiclass.

I'm playing a 7th level Half-Elf Valor Bard and I really want him built similar to a paladin, I'd like spell suggestions, Feat suggestions, weapons, anything to help really. I'd like him built like a sturdy, support-y spellcaster. (Also, our DM doesn't want us to multiclass so I cannot take 2 paladin levels and get smite sadly) Just some extra info about my character.
This might be the case, where, once again, it's worth to note that Multiclassing is an optional rule. At least they get to have feats, which is nice.

[MrFahrenheit]

Stop pumping dex. Take shillelagh with magical secrets and grab yourself a quarterstaff.

[Vorok]

Your charisma will dictate what spells you'll want to take, if you're not planning on going towards 20, then i'd say take more spells with no saves (healing, support buffs, or spells like Heat Metal, Plant Growth, Dimension Door and Animate Objects (if it suits your character) ).

For feat, definitely Warcaster, so you can cast spells in battle. If you're using a shield, you could consider Shield Master, though I'm not sure you're quite out of options for your bonus actions (inspiration, healing word are both bonus actions.

For stats, don't stretch your self too much. You'll want some charisma, you said you're going for 'fairly high' strength and dexterity, how's your constitution, intelligence and wisdom?

Also check out the guides of EvilAnagram on here (Player's gonna play), and on the EnWorld forum, [GUIDE] A party without music is lame: A Bard Guide, by mellored

[Gort]

Probably the most basic feat suggestion would be War Caster. If you are in the thick of things this is a flat out requirement. After that, possibly Medium Armor Mastery if you have he Dex to make it work or Shield Mastery would help you stay alive against this AoE spells.

War caster is good, but not compulsory.

Have a look at the Bard spell descriptions, many of the best Bard spells are verbal only and don't require you to have a free hand. For example my first few spell picks would be Vicious Mockery, Dissonant Whispers, Healing Word, Suggestion. None of these are helped by War Caster.

[Mandragola]

I'm playing a 7th level Half-Elf Valor Bard and I really want him built similar to a paladin, I'd like spell suggestions, Feat suggestions, weapons, anything to help really. I'd like him built like a sturdy, support-y spellcaster. (Also, our DM doesn't want us to multiclass so I cannot take 2 paladin levels and get smite sadly) Just some extra info about my character.

- Fights with a longsword and shield
- Uses medium armor
- grabbed some heal spells
- Chaotic Good
- No magic items yet (they are quite rare in our world)
- Fairly high strength and dex

Valour bards are a bit odd. It's crucial to understand from the start that they are not paladins and cannot do a paladin's job. A valour bard, especially without multiclassing, is just not a front-ranker. Their melee attacks just don't do nearly enough damage to risk putting them there.

Instead, a valour bard is a full-caster who is a bit tougher due to having armour on. You'll still have a lot of good spells. You're put in the unfortunate position of having to decide between a high strength or dex and a high charisma - and wanting both.

One potential answer to this problem is to dump dex and take heavy armour proficiency as your lvl 4 feat. It comes with a built in +1 strength, so by 7th you ought to have 16 str and cha. One less stat to boost would make a substantial difference to you - though it would rule out sneaking around the place.

[nickl_2000]

War caster is good, but not compulsory.

Have a look at the Bard spell descriptions, many of the best Bard spells are verbal only and don't require you to have a free hand. For example my first few spell picks would be Vicious Mockery, Dissonant Whispers, Healing Word, Suggestion. None of these are helped by War Caster.

even without the free hand part of War Caster, it is still a useful feat. Having advantage on all concentration checks would be extremely useful for a front line Bard.

[Dankus Memakus]

Just a clarifying comment i rolled for my stats by rolling 3 d-6's, thats the house rule and i have fairly good stats

10 Wis
11 Int
19 Cha
17 Str
16 Dex
15 Con

Those are after racial bonuses as well.

I haven't done a feat yet, so those are scores with no bonuses, i jumped from level 3 to 7 in one session and haven't leveled up my character fully yet, hence the asking for suggestions before I do

[Arkhios]

even without the free hand part of War Caster, it is still a useful feat. Having advantage on all concentration checks would be extremely useful for a front line Bard.

Agreed, besides, Vicious Mockery is particularly nasty as an Opportunity-Cast-Spell.

Valor Bard's strength might not be in their own big damage bursts, but rather in their abilities to help allies both defensively and offensively, making a VB surprisingly good defender for the group. For the "threat-management" they have their spells in addition to having the option to attack twice instead of just once.

[Saiga]

Just a clarifying comment i rolled for my stats by rolling 3 d-6's, thats the house rule and i have fairly good stats

10 Wis
11 Int
19 Cha
17 Str
16 Dex
15 Con

Those are after racial bonuses as well.

I haven't done a feat yet, so those are scores with no bonuses, i jumped from level 3 to 7 in one session and haven't leveled up my character fully yet, hence the asking for suggestions before I do

With those particular stats, I would take War Caster at level 4 (casting with two full hands is just way too annoying otherwise) and +1 Cha/+1 Str next time you level up to bring both scores up to the next modifier.

[JAL_1138]

Valour bards are a bit odd. It's crucial to understand from the start that they are not paladins and cannot do a paladin's job. A valour bard, especially without multiclassing, is just not a front-ranker. Their melee attacks just don't do nearly enough damage to risk putting them there.

Instead, a valour bard is a full-caster who is a bit tougher due to having armour on. You'll still have a lot of good spells. You're put in the unfortunate position of having to decide between a high strength or dex and a high charisma - and wanting both.

One potential answer to this problem is to dump dex and take heavy armour proficiency as your lvl 4 feat. It comes with a built in +1 strength, so by 7th you ought to have 16 str and cha. One less stat to boost would make a substantial difference to you - though it would rule out sneaking around the place.

Pretty much. Even ditching the shield and going for Great Weapon Master with maxed Strength doesn't give them enough melee damage to be particularly competitive with martial classes *assuming hits*, and when factoring in accuracy, it's just not there. And that would leave the VB with an insufficient AC for the front line as well, unless taking a feat for heavy armor.

Even heavy armor via feat and a shield doesn't really make them acceptable frontliners due to the piddling damage from a longsword with no Smites, no Fighting Style, and no other abilities to boost it.

They could make great use of Shield Master to knock opponents (up to Large size) prone with Expertise in Athletics, if there's another melee powerhouse around to give Advantage to, but without tag-teaming with another character it doesn't help much (and may hinder, if much of the party is ranged).

VBs can't do a Paladin's job without Paladin levels, pretty much.

A single-classed, DEX-based VB can be a really solid archer with Sharpshooter and/or Crossbow Expert, but frontliners they are not. Archer VBs suffer from the lack of Maneuvers or Archery fighting style, but can make use of Greater Invisibility to get Advantage and put enemies at Disadvantage to hit them, or at level 10 can take Swift Quiver for two extra attacks as a bonus action, or at level 10 can take Elemental Weapon* for an accuracy and damage boost with customizable damage type and to bypass resistance to nonmagical weapons.

*Elemental Weapon can help a little bit with melee damage as well with Great Weapon Master and/or Polearm Master; however, with sword-and-board and thus no -5/+10 option, it's still not enough extra damage to be worth it.