PSA: Short rest identification

[Squiddish]

Dear Giant in the Playground forums,
When you identify a magic item during a short rest, you are not gaining some kind of magical insight into the workings of the item. You are not spontaneously gaining knowledge by just being near it. You are testing it. The "identify a part of a short rest" is a way of showing trial and error testing without wasting time.
If you remove short rest identification because "they should have to test the item to figure it out", you aren't so much making identification harder as you are making it incredibly inconvenient. If you want to make it harder to identify magic items, include an arcana check or something, don't make it strenuous activity or whatever.

Thank you for your time.

[GPS]

Amen brother, it needed to be said

[Cybren]

That's not actually how the rule is written, though you can certainly play it that way. By default the rule is "... a character can focus on one magic item during a short rest, while being in physical contact with the item. At the end of the rest, the character learns the items properties, as well as how to use them"

There's no requirement for testing, testing equipment, for any kind of trial and error, for anything other than meditating while grabbing the thing.

EDIT: what would 'testing' the item even be? Trying every possible phonetic variation of every possible language for command words? Is it like this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk9_340xqeU

[GPS]

That's not actually how the rule is written, though you can certainly play it that way. By default the rule is "... a character can focus on one magic item during a short rest, while being in physical contact with the item. At the end of the rest, the character learns the items properties, as well as how to use them"

There's no requirement for testing, testing equipment, for any kind of trial and error, for anything other than meditating while grabbing the thing.

EDIT: what would 'testing' the item even be? Trying every possible phonetic variation of every possible language for command words? Is it like this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk9_340xqeU
Yeah, focusing on, as in focusing on testing. Being is physical contact with, as in touching while testing.

[Cybren]

That's an extrapolation clearly not intended by the text, even if it isn't outright contradictory

[GPS]

That's an extrapolation clearly not intended by the text, even if it isn't outright contradictory
Clearly not intended by text? What other logical explanation is there for non-maqical identification without a check?

[Cybren]

Clearly not intended by text? What other logical explanation is there for non-maqical identification?

It's very obviously magical. Why would you assume focusing on a dog collar while drinking iced tea would let you know it makes badgers fly via farts. If they wanted the mechanic to model testing and experimentation they would have said so.

[LtPowers]

Clearly not intended by text? What other logical explanation is there for non-maqical identification without a check?

Although I agree with you, I believe the alternative interpretation is that the identification is magical; it's the item revealing its secrets to someone who focuses intently on it.


Powers &8^]

[furby076]

Guys, you're clearly not understanding the text. During a short rest, you must remain in physical contact and focus on the item. This is clearly you needing to cuddle with the item, and devote quality time. Ask your item how its day was, what its favorite food is, what are its dreams and desires.

[LeonBH]

Guys, you're clearly not understanding the text. During a short rest, you must remain in physical contact and focus on the item. This is clearly you needing to cuddle with the item, and devote quality time. Ask your item how its day was, what its favorite food is, what are its dreams and desires.

Truth. And if you cuddle it wrong, you'll have to roll a Persuasion check and if you fail, you don't learn the item's secrets (like that one time it put poop in Mr. Roger's shoe and was never caught).

[Theodoxus]

This definitely falls in the rulings not rules category.

As a DM, I see short rest identification as the Toby McGuire spiderman. You're swinging your new axe around; pointing your wand at things; scrutinizing the item for identifying marks that spark your memory for some lost bit of lore... whatever.

Others probably think it akin to the magical essence whispering to the curious one, telling dark secrets and ancient plots to take over the world.

Neither interpretation is wrong. To make a definitive statement like the OPs is more 'wrongbadfun' than anything else.

[GPS]

This definitely falls in the rulings not rules category.

As a DM, I see short rest identification as the Toby McGuire spiderman. You're swinging your new axe around; pointing your wand at things; scrutinizing the item for identifying marks that spark your memory for some lost bit of lore... whatever.

Others probably think it akin to the magical essence whispering to the curious one, telling dark secrets and ancient plots to take over the world.

Neither interpretation is wrong. To make a definitive statement like the OPs is more 'wrongbadfun' than anything else.
Knowing the OP personally and the discord conversation we had before he put this up, I can say that he wasn't trying to say other interpretations were wrong, he was saying that saying short rest identification is bad was wrong.

[Contrast]

As others have said this is mostly a fluff thing so rule is explain it how you want.

That said, it also makes no sense in some circumstances. Imagine you had a magic cloak with allowed you to polymorph into a squirrel once a day for 2 hours by saying a specific code word, gave transport via plants once a week and granted a bonus to constitution saves.

What exactly are you doing to learn that if the knowledge isn't magically imparted into your head by handling the item? Particularly without having resulted in the abilities being expended?

Seems the only explanation would be to have the characters say 'oh yes I suddenly remember a very specific legend about this particular item' every time any sort of non-generic/obvious item came up which seems more silly that just having magic items have the magic property of imparting knowledge of how they work.

[Theodoxus]

As others have said this is mostly a fluff thing so rule is explain it how you want.

That said, it also makes no sense in some circumstances. Imagine you had a magic cloak with allowed you to polymorph into a squirrel once a day for 2 hours by saying a specific code word, gave transport via plants once a week and granted a bonus to constitution saves.

What exactly are you doing to learn that if the knowledge isn't magically imparted into your head by handling the item? Particularly without having resulted in the abilities being expended?

Seems the only explanation would be to have the characters say 'oh yes I suddenly remember a very specific legend about this particular item' every time any sort of non-generic/obvious item came up which seems more silly that just having magic items have the magic property of imparting knowledge of how they work.

Or you know, there's a scrap of linen sewn in the inside of the collar that explains the command words and effects... not everything has to be so cloak and dagger (forgive the pun).

[Zalabim]

Or you know, there's a scrap of linen sewn in the inside of the collar that explains the command words and effects... not everything has to be so cloak and dagger (forgive the pun).
Does it also list the materials its made of and the washing instructions?

For a book, maybe it has all its instructions on the first page or inside cover. "The human whose name is written in this note..."

If it's a suit of armor, it might come with a separate instruction manual. Just make sure you don't forget it, or you'll have some trouble figuring out how to take off (the armor/to fly).

[Contrast]

Or you know, there's a scrap of linen sewn in the inside of the collar that explains the command words and effects... not everything has to be so cloak and dagger (forgive the pun).

The hour long short rest is to give you enough time to find a magnifiying glass so you can read the tiny font on the label :smallwink:

[Elminster298]

Guys, you're clearly not understanding the text. During a short rest, you must remain in physical contact and focus on the item. This is clearly you needing to cuddle with the item, and devote quality time. Ask your item how its day was, what its favorite food is, what are its dreams and desires.

Is there a way to roofie a magical item to make this process easier? What if the item way made in an abusive low-income family? Would it basically tell you all it's secrets while swinging around a pole?

[Cybren]

Is there a way to roofie a magical item to make this process easier? What if the item way made in an abusive low-income family? Would it basically tell you all it's secrets while swinging around a pole?

This post is like a layer cake of terrible

[mephnick]

he was saying that saying short rest identification is bad was wrong.

Fair enough but I disagree. I dont l think swinging it around is nearly enough. I require the identify spell, either the party's or an NPC's. It just fits the world and the pace of the game better Imo. To be fair in my game magic items are actually rare and I require the identify spell to consume its components.

[furby076]

The hour long short rest is to give you enough time to find a magnifiying glass so you can read the tiny font on the label :smallwink:
I only wear items made in Toril. None of those poorly made Krynn items. Toril First

Is there a way to roofie a magical item to make this process easier? What if the item way made in an abusive low-income family? Would it basically tell you all it's secrets while swinging around a pole?

Roofie is the identify spell, but at the potential cost of a pearl. Remember the no touch policy


This post is like a layer cake of terrible
Oh, i say it's more like a double cream oreo cookie