Hiding grafts and such.

[CIDE]

Alright! So, after playing a Renegade Mastermaker for a while I've been putting some thought into how things like grafts and warforged components are treated during a polymorph/shapechange/whatever. They're part ofthe body AND they're equipment. Magical equipment specifically. Would they remain a part of the new transformed body or would they vanish in the new form? If they do stay with the new form is there a way to hide them without losing their benefit?

I'm interested in RAW, RAI, and how you guys would rule if you were a DM. Say the character were using the Solar trick and using the Solar's ability to look like themselves. Just to add layers to this onion.

To take it one step further would you say it's possible to hide grafts and components even in a character's base form? Something like a battlefist seems unlikely but say someone is using an embedded belt as a warforged component. Or a mask or choker. Can these be implanted in a way to hide them or would you consider them visually represented in other ways?

[Venger]

RAW, grafts aren't items/equipment. they're part of your guy's body, so follow the rules for shape changing magic accordingly.

[Necroticplague]

Alright! So, after playing a Renegade Mastermaker for a while I've been putting some thought into how things like grafts and warforged components are treated during a polymorph/shapechange/whatever. They're part of the body AND they're equipment. Magical equipment specifically. Would they remain a part of the new transformed body or would they vanish in the new form? If they do stay with the new form is there a way to hide them without losing their benefit?

The bolded is incorrect, no matter how you cut it for grafts. Grafts are very, very specifically called out as not being magic items. They're just modifications to the body. If you have wings, it doesn't matter whether you born with them, or whether you had them slapped on later. They're just a body part. Thus, if you were to shapechange, whether you'll keep the benefits depends on the graft. Some grafts provide supernatural abilities that you'll get to keep (like the ones that provide Gaze Attacks), others only provide natural abilities that you'll lose (Feathered Wings).

Meanwhile, Warforged Grafts are simply magic items. So they'll just merge into your form and be rendered nonfunctional (unless you turn into another warforged that can use them).


To take it one step further would you say it's possible to hide grafts and components even in a character's base form? Something like a battlefist seems unlikely but say someone is using an embedded belt as a warforged component. Or a mask or choker. Can these be implanted in a way to hide them or would you consider them visually represented in other ways?This is what Disguise (make parts of your body look different), Sleight of Hand (hide items on your person), and Forgery (make item look like something else) are for. Which one would depend on what you're trying to hide, and how.

[CIDE]

RAW, grafts aren't items/equipment. they're part of your guy's body, so follow the rules for shape changing magic accordingly.


I never read the graft rules thoroughly. never had a reason to. This is the first time I was even interested aside from a short glance at silthilar grafts and only because those MAY be free. But never with any DM I've ever played with. That does simplify things with grafts at least.


The bolded is incorrect, no matter how you cut it for grafts. Grafts are very, very specifically called out as not being magic items. They're just modifications to the body. If you have wings, it doesn't matter whether you born with them, or whether you had them slapped on later. They're just a body part. Thus, if you were to shapechange, whether you'll keep the benefits depends on the graft. Some grafts provide supernatural abilities that you'll get to keep (like the ones that provide Gaze Attacks), others only provide natural abilities that you'll lose (Feathered Wings).

Meanwhile, Warforged Grafts are simply magic items. So they'll just merge into your form and be rendered nonfunctional (unless you turn into another warforged that can use them).

This is what Disguise (make parts of your body look different), Sleight of Hand (hide items on your person), and Forgery (make item look like something else) are for. Which one would depend on what you're trying to hide, and how.


I know mechanically there really isn't a limit if the check were high enough but I think there's a limit at some point logically on what skillful hands can hide. But I guess that works for play.

Thanks for the response from both of you.