Spot check penalty per 20 feet

[Gelcur]

So far I have found 2 ways to get -1 penalty on Spot checks per 20 feet of distance. Cragtop Archer's Farsight ability at level 1 from RoS and Hawk's Vision feat from CAdv. The range increment penalty adjustment is not necessary. Have I missed any other options?

[ZamielVanWeber]

Be a true dragon. They get the spot penalty reduced to -1 per 20 feet.

[Jowgen]

Spyglass. Some dragon mag article clarified that this is how it actually works.

On a related note, Dragon 318 p, 54 has the Spyglass eye graft, which lets you ignore te -1/10spot penalties out to 150'. 25k.

[GilesTheCleric]

I pray for your soul if your GM uses Spot, Diplomacy, or other things RAW.

[Fouredged Sword]

I pray for your soul if your GM uses Spot, Diplomacy, or other things RAW.

You cannot tell if it is day or night, as the sun is too far away to spot without a -10000000 penalty.

[SangoProduction]

You cannot tell if it is day or night, as the sun is too far away to spot without a -10000000 penalty.

And, of course, you're ignoring any positive modifiers (such as being a giant ball of fire larger than multiple worlds), or the fact that you can see light without seeing the object itself. You'd have to be intentionally looking to be obtuse if you think of justifying that statement with a distance penalty.

[zergling.exe]

And, of course, you're ignoring any positive modifiers (such as being a giant ball of fire larger than multiple worlds), or the fact that you can see light without seeing the object itself. You'd have to be intentionally looking to be obtuse if you think of justifying that statement with a distance penalty.

There are even rules somewhere for seeing lightsources 10x farther than their illumination. Imagine that!

[ZamielVanWeber]

There are even rules somewhere for seeing lightsources 10x farther than their illumination. Imagine that!

IIRC there is a rule in Underdark I wanna say that says you automatically see light sources within the radius of the bright illumination, so the sun is covered with that at least.

[Gelcur]

Be a true dragon. They get the spot penalty reduced to -1 per 20 feet.

Spyglass. Some dragon mag article clarified that this is how it actually works.

On a related note, Dragon 318 p, 54 has the Spyglass eye graft, which lets you ignore te -1/10spot penalties out to 150'. 25k.
Both great suggestions. The true dragon one reminded me there is a spell 5th level spell in SpC that is called Dragonsight, which I think is just what I'm looking for. Sanctified Spell it and I can get it on a wand. Wish I could get it down to 3rd to put it on a Eternal Wand, if anyone has an idea that would be perfect.


A bit off topic:

I pray for your soul if your GM uses Spot, Diplomacy, or other things RAW.
We play mostly RAW with minor changes and DM has final say with Rule 0. We modified Spot to be -1 per 10' till 100' then -1 per 50' from then on. We also use the DM rules for terrain max visibility distance but have also added the modification that for every 10' up you go the range increases, assuming you got the Spot check to use it. Makes climbing trees or getting to higher ground that much more advantageous.


You cannot tell if it is day or night, as the sun is too far away to spot without a -10000000 penalty.

IIRC there is a rule in Underdark I wanna say that says you automatically see light sources within the radius of the bright illumination, so the sun is covered with that at least.
We use this rule to hand wave away the sun and moon, or any other major light producing or reflecting object.

[SirNibbles]

I don't know of any additional ways, but I do have some things based on what other people have mentioned:

Stormwrack, page 89 has rules for spotting things while sailing. The same rules could conceivably be applied for non-nautical situations.

Underdark, page 106 discusses the visibility of light sources.

In Complete Darkness, a DC 20 Spot check lets you see a light source within 20 times its illumination range. Dim Light allows you to spot a light source within 10 times its illumination range. Similar to the rules for spotting objects in Stormwrack, you automatically spot the object at half that distance.

[Fizban]

We play mostly RAW with minor changes and DM has final say with Rule 0. We modified Spot to be -1 per 10' till 100' then -1 per 50' from then on. We also use the DM rules for terrain max visibility distance but have also added the modification that for every 10' up you go the range increases, assuming you got the Spot check to use it. Makes climbing trees or getting to higher ground that much more advantageous.
Then it sure is good that the vast majority of creatures and objects lack the Hide in Plain Sight ability and are incapable of or not trying to hide. Because spot only matters if something is hiding. So claims that you can't see anything because of spot penalties are 100% not-RAW.

I'd also challenge people to say, stand at X distance (where X is however far away you think you can see things), then close your eyes, have someone obscure a new object in the area (put it half behind something or in a bush), and then see how fast you can find it, if you can. Then try it again with a different area you didn't get to examine first. The point being not to measure spot checks or penalties, but that noticing details at a distance is hard.

[Gelcur]

Sir Nibbles I will take a look at Stormwrack when I get a moment I have never gone through that book cover to cover. Thanks.



Then it sure is good that the vast majority of creatures and objects lack the Hide in Plain Sight ability and are incapable of or not trying to hide. Because spot only matters if something is hiding. So claims that you can't see anything because of spot penalties are 100% not-RAW.

I would prefer if this thread does not turn into a battleground for this fight. For clarification in our group, we consider Spot not only can you see the said thing but also does it register as something important and we consider the DC 0 for large object in plain sight RAW. Feel free to have your own opinion.

[Pleh]

You should just about auto succeed at the spot check to notice the sun. It's not very sneaky. Even with the theoretical penalty, there are some checks that are impossible to fail.