Curse Bringer Smite Clarification

[Legimus]

Even though I think it needs some tweaking, I really enjoy the Hexblade patron from UA, both thematically and mechanically. When I first saw Curse Bringer, though, I was really underwhelmed. As I've gotten more used to how pact magic gets optimized, though, it suddenly seems incredibly powerful. I'm posting here just to ask if my understanding is correct.

On a hit, Curse Bringer lets you expend a spell slot to deal 2d8 damage per spell level. By the time you can get Curse Bringer, your spell slots are already at the 2nd level, so unless you're multiclassing it's 4d8 damage. At the 9th level using level 5 spells that becomes 10d8 (avg 45) damage, which seems well worth the spell slot in the right circumstance.

Here's my question. If I get a critical hit and decide to invoke Curse Bringer, do I double the smite damage as well? Because if that's the case, at level 9 I can deal an extra 20d8 (avg 90) damage on a critical, and Hexblade's Curse gives me a 10% chance to crit. And then if I'm using Darkness + Devil's Sight, I'll grab advantage on a lot of attack rolls to up that chance even further. Hexblade suddenly seems a lot more powerful than I first thought, but I want to make sure I'm understanding the mechanics.

Thanks!

[Matrix_Walker]

Here's my question. If I get a critical hit and decide to invoke Curse Bringer, do I double the smite damage as well? Because if that's the case, at level 9 I can deal an extra 20d8 (avg 90) damage on a critical, and Hexblade's Curse gives me a 10% chance to crit. And then if I'm using Darkness + Devil's Sight, I'll grab advantage on a lot of attack rolls to up that chance even further. Hexblade suddenly seems a lot more powerful than I first thought, but I want to make sure I'm understanding the mechanics.

Thanks!

Oh yeah. You wait for the crit, then pop the smite. Just like the Pally does... Yes he will hit HARD, but he only gets two shots a rest.

[RipTide]

Yea that is exactly how that works. It is super powerful, but remember that in your set up darkness uses 1 of your spell slots and the smite uses the other. So if you do this you get a huge Nova round then become a sub par fighter until you get a short rest. Also note that regardless of the increased chance you have of getting a crit you are entirely reliant on the dice to get your nova. Compare this to say the Raven patron that can do 16D8 damage to a 60ft cone (cone of cold) without having to hope for the dice gods to smile on them.

So

Pro - super strong

Con - All of your short rest resources, single target, Luck based, requires 2 invocations (smite and devils sight), only 4D8 stronger than other options.

So its really strong if you look at it but not as OP as some might think.

[skaddix]

Its limited by the Warlock having 2 Spell Slots for most of their career....which means it benefits a lot from MC into a Sorcerer.

[joaber]

Darkness + devil sight is a problem for melee, because the rest of your party. And consume spell slots. Multiclass with mystic or shadow sorcerer could decrease a lot of the cost of darkness and free one invocation, but still a problem for your party.
I was thinking in multiclass 3 lvl as recised beast master. Get constrictor snake as beast, free restrained at will. Plus 3 spell slot and hex for make grapple more efficient. Advantage in first turn, plus some nice effects. Elvish accuracy feat to improve your crit chance in 50% and be half elf. MAD problem and no Con save.

[SirSmitington]

Hexblade is pretty dang powerful at high levels for one really good Nova if multiclassed with paladin and using the new Eldritch Smite invocation.

At 11 Paladin/9 Warlock
5th level slot Curse Bringer: 10d8
5th level slot Eldritch Smite: 6d8
3rd level slot Divine Smite: 4d8
Improved Divine Smite: 2d8

So, you're looking at 22d8 just in non-critical smite damage against a target that isn't undead or fiend.

Add in the 2d6+10+STR mod if you're using a greatsword with Great Weapon Master, plus another 1d6 if you have Hex on the target, and that's one heck of a melee weapon hit. Min of 40, max of 209 on a non-crit assuming 20 STR.

[Malifice]

Even though I think it needs some tweaking, I really enjoy the Hexblade patron from UA, both thematically and mechanically. When I first saw Curse Bringer, though, I was really underwhelmed. As I've gotten more used to how pact magic gets optimized, though, it suddenly seems incredibly powerful. I'm posting here just to ask if my understanding is correct.

On a hit, Curse Bringer lets you expend a spell slot to deal 2d8 damage per spell level. By the time you can get Curse Bringer, your spell slots are already at the 2nd level, so unless you're multiclassing it's 4d8 damage. At the 9th level using level 5 spells that becomes 10d8 (avg 45) damage, which seems well worth the spell slot in the right circumstance.

Sadly Curse Bringer doesnt exist anymore. I play a Hexblade so Im as upset as you are.

Its been replaced with a generic 'Eldritch smite' which is (1d8)+(1d8 per spell level) force damage, and it knocks the target prone.

In good news, Hexblade looks a certainty to become core in Xanathars GTE. JC confirmed that they have rolled a lot of Curse Bringer (maintaining the Hexblade curse post the death of the target) into the class itself.

Also, Warlocks dont get 9th level spells. They cap at 5th.


Here's my question. If I get a critical hit and decide to invoke Curse Bringer, do I double the smite damage as well?

Yes. Although the question now should be:

If I get a critical hit and decide to invoke Eldritch smite, do I double the smite damage as well?


Hexblade is pretty dang powerful at high levels for one really good Nova if multiclassed with paladin and using the new Eldritch Smite invocation.

Highly unlikely the intent is for you to 'double down' on (Divine Smite) and (Eldritch Smite) as a M/C Paladin/ Lock.

Rules are quiet on this at the moment as they dont take into account M/Cing in UA.

[Arcangel4774]

It's worth noting that the newest UA serves as a change to the invocation shown in the Warlock ua. However this doesn't account for the transfer of your hex curse. However it specifically calls out hexblade curse in a few of the invocations suggesting that they have a finalized version somewhere, or at the very least a revised UA version

[Malifice]

It's worth noting that the newest UA serves as a change to the invocation shown in the Warlock ua. However this doesn't account for the transfer of your hex curse. However it specifically calls out hexblade curse in a few of the invocations suggesting that they have a finalized version somewhere, or at the very least a revised UA version

JC mentions on his twitter account that they've rolled some of the prior Hexblade invocations into the Hexblade class.

"Some of Curse Bringer is now in the Hexblade itself."

https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/871901638696554497

You'll probably see a change to Hexblades Curse where it lasts a minute (and you can transfer it when a critter dies). Probably also +Cha to hit and damage with all weapons (including heavy weapons) or they remove +Cha to hit and damage totally.

Hexblades Curse sucks at the moment with how its written. 'Dont kill that creature, its under my curse and I cant shift the curse to another target unless Im the one that kills it!'

It should be: 'If the creature is reduced to 0 hit points, you can shift your curse to another target' instead of 'If you reduce a target cursed by your Hexblade’s Curse to 0 hit points you can shift...'

[D-naras]

I could see them making the Hexblade's curse becoming the following:

You add Hex to your list of spells known and you may use it once per short rest without expending a slot. If you use it in this way, it doesn't take up your concentration but lasts for a maximum of 1 minute. You can't use Hex with a slot while the special Hex lasts. In addition, whenever the target of your Hex spell is reduced to 0 hit points, you recover hit points equal to your warlock level + Charisma modifier.

Basically, remove the expanded crit range and proficiency to damage and the ability to double up on hex + curse.

I bet that using Charisma for attacks and damage will remain in the class but it could possibly pushed to a higher level or have it somehow scale with warlock levels if dipping for it is an issue (which I don't think it is).

[Corran]

I bet that using Charisma for attacks and damage will remain in the class but it could possibly pushed to a higher level or have it somehow scale with warlock levels if dipping for it is an issue (which I don't think it is).
Yeah, probably it will become a level 6 ability. Will make diping for it a lot harder. Warlock 1/2/3 are already the most infamous dips, so I dont think they will have the hexblade add up more (aside from medium armor and shield porf) to the reasons that temp players to dip in warlock.

[D-naras]

Yeah, probably it will become a level 6 ability. Will make diping for it a lot harder. Warlock 1/2/3 are already the most infamous dips, so I dont think they will have the hexblade add up more (aside from medium armor and shield porf) to the reasons that temp players to dip in warlock.

On the other hand, if they do that, then you will be pretty hosed in the ability score department for 6 levels, needing to rely on STR or DEX for that time. It will lead to pretty mediocre melee warriors that rely on Eldritch Blast until level 6, much like every other Warlock which is not ideal.

[Malifice]

I could see them making the Hexblade's curse becoming the following:

You add Hex to your list of spells known and you may use it once per short rest without expending a slot. If you use it in this way, it doesn't take up your concentration but lasts for a maximum of 1 minute. You can't use Hex with a slot while the special Hex lasts. In addition, whenever the target of your Hex spell is reduced to 0 hit points, you recover hit points equal to your warlock level + Charisma modifier.

Basically, remove the expanded crit range and proficiency to damage and the ability to double up on hex + curse.

Yeah, its super annoying [bonus action hex] then [bonus action cursebringer]. It would be nice if they just made Curse Bringer soup up a Hex somehow.


I bet that using Charisma for attacks and damage will remain in the class but it could possibly pushed to a higher level or have it somehow scale with warlock levels if dipping for it is an issue (which I don't think it is).

Agree. Although if it doesnt come online at 1st the next possible level is 6th which is too late for mine.