How badly could this be abused?

[WarKitty]

I was thinking of giving all players access to a weapon that they can add a certain amount of enchantments (suitable for level 12 or so) for free. For balance reasons I'd say the base weapon had to be a weapon of exactly +1 enchantment, and can be any weapon the character is proficient with. It can have +4 worth of enchantments added to it (this does not count the initial +1). I'd have to figure out some sort of scaling mechanism by level.

Any particular ways this can go wrong? 3.PF game.

[Geddy2112]

The game assumes you have a +2 weapon at this point anyways, so it is not all that much stronger. The biggest abuse would be savings for other magical items they could buy not having to enchant their weapon further. A +1 weapon with up to +4 worth of enchantment is not gamebreaking at level 12. A powerful weapon for the level but it is still a weapon. Full casters have 6th level spells so a +4 weapon in the hands of a martial is not all that exciting.

[WarKitty]

The game assumes you have a +2 weapon at this point anyways, so it is not all that much stronger. The biggest abuse would be savings for other magical items they could buy not having to enchant their weapon further. A +1 weapon with up to +4 worth of enchantment is not gamebreaking at level 12. A powerful weapon for the level but it is still a weapon. Full casters have 6th level spells so a +4 weapon in the hands of a martial is not all that exciting.

Yeah, they're mythic as well so I feel like "powerful weapon" just kind of fits with the theme. My real question is if there's a way my casters could find to abuse it.

[eggynack]

Not sure for 3.PF, but the main question you always have to ask is how this benefits casters, even when the answer might seem like not at all. Answer could easily be, "Significantly less than it benefits mundanes, because mundanes make more use of weapons," but if there's an abuse, it likely comes from that side of things. For that purpose, you generally want to be looking at the less damage oriented abilities. You want stuff like spell storing, those initiative boosting enhancements, smoking, maybe mouth pick and/or that one that grants proficiency (maybe this wouldn't work with your limit), and maybe a few others of note. The thing that makes this line of inquiry interesting to me is that mundanes are pretty necessarily already going to be doing whatever they're now doing more cheaply, while caster types weren't as likely to be doing this stuff before and definitely are now. Again, this could easily wind up significantly mundane favored, which would be good, but it's worth looking into.

Edit: Looks like you have the same general conclusion. The list I pointed out is a decent start, I think. Not super familiar with the broader array of weapon enhancements.

[denthor]

for perspective

+1 weapon add ghost touch is about what you are going to give your players.

I think ghost touch is a +3 enchantment

[WarKitty]

for perspective

+1 weapon add ghost touch is about what you are going to give your players.

I think ghost touch is a +3 enchantment

Right, the question is more "with all the possible enchantments in 3.5, what's the biggest options for abuse?" Because it's 3.5.

[Rebel7284]

Some combinations I would keep in mind:
- Wrathful Healing: makes someone very tanky.
- Splitting: Depending on what get copied in the split, can be potentially problematic. Spell storing arrows and such. But also archers rarely get nice things.
- Spell Storing, Power Storing, Bloodstone Weapon: breaks the action economy some, but probably fine.
- Eager Warning Defending: the caster goes first and has better AC.
- Brilliant Energy: depending on the nature of enemies in the campaign, this can be good, especially at this discount.

[Telok]

Tenth to twelfth level is where I start having minor artifact weapons and shields as end-of-dungeon loot. So it's not bad, and most of the printed enhancements are pretty bad anyway. I mean the Implacable enchantment from MIC is pretty trash for a +3 compared to Speed, and Disarming is complete trash compared to Collision or Force.

[atemu1234]

Tenth to twelfth level is where I start having minor artifact weapons and shields as end-of-dungeon loot. So it's not bad, and most of the printed enhancements are pretty bad anyway. I mean the Implacable enchantment from MIC is pretty trash for a +3 compared to Speed, and Disarming is complete trash compared to Collision or Force.

I've never wound up giving minor artifacts to the players as loot (at least, not after that one time with the Deck of Many Things).

+4 is probably pushing it for their level, though I'm fairly certain it's not quite game breaking.

[Telok]

I've never wound up giving minor artifacts to the players as loot (at least, not after that one time with the Deck of Many Things).

+4 is probably pushing it for their level, though I'm fairly certain it's not quite game breaking.

Well the Deck isn't minor and it's pretty much a Russian roulette + lottery survival randomizer.

One of the things I gave was a +5 heavy wooden shield that negated death effects, gave +4 saves versus necromantic type effects, and auto-cast Revenance if the user died. But every time it cast Revenance it lost a point of enhancement bonus. That's the sort of minor artifact I'm talking about.

[Deeds]

- Eager Warning Defending: the caster goes first and has better AC.

Oooh that's pretty nasty. Free +7 initiative on a gauntlet or quarterstaff. I suppose a caster could also use a spell storing weapon, smack themselves for non lethal damage, and get a free level 3 spell slot that's a buff spell.

EDIT: The Bane property could theoretically be chosen if your enemies are typically one species or if they know the big bad is a dragon or something. This isn't gonna break the game for casters though. :smallsigh:

[WarKitty]

So far the biggest threats seem to be initiative stuff and spell storing. Neither of those look too broken? Spell storing only goes up to third level and still takes an action to use - I feel like by level 12 if they want to cast a third level spell they'll just cast a third level spell. Initiative is a little more annoying but probably not too bad.

[Telok]

I've always just built encounters with the assumption that the players go first. Of course I have an initative-whore in my group so that bit's just logic.

[atemu1234]

I've always just built encounters with the assumption that the players go first. Of course I have an initative-whore in my group so that bit's just logic.

I have four, not one.

[ATHATH]

You might want to ban Sandblasters: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?444154-MM3-Sand-Blaster-Exotic-Weapon-Optimization

[Mordaedil]

- Brilliant Energy: depending on the nature of enemies in the campaign, this can be good, especially at this discount.
With Bane (Undead) and Disruption for the ultimate weapon of disappointment.