So, a worg cohort takes fighter levels...

[Braininthejar2]

1) when he bites, will he bite once (1 natural attack) or several times (as many as his BAB allows)

2) If he gets improved trip feat, does it combo with his trip ability from being a wolf? (a free trip attempt with each hit, and an extra hit on a grounded opponent if he succeeds?)

[Segev]

I believe that your natural weapons don't get iterative attacks; that's only manufactured weapons.

If I'm wrong, then you can choose to get iteratives with a single primary natural attack, or you can choose to use your standard natural attack routine.

[SCOTTEPIPPEN]

1) when he bites, will he bite once (1 natural attack) or several times (as many as his BAB allows)

2) If he gets improved trip feat, does it combo with his trip ability from being a wolf? (a free trip attempt with each hit, and an extra hit on a grounded opponent if he succeeds?)
I think so, also you get a nasty +4 on trip attempts

[Braininthejar2]

I think so, also you get a nasty +4 on trip attempts

So, this is "yes" to the second one?

EDIT: a worg will have trouble being smart enough for improved trip... perhaps awakened direwolf will work better...

[DEMON]

1) when he bites, will he bite once (1 natural attack) or several times (as many as his BAB allows)

2) If he gets improved trip feat, does it combo with his trip ability from being a wolf? (a free trip attempt with each hit, and an extra hit on a grounded opponent if he succeeds?)

1.
Creatures do not receive additional attacks from a high base attack bonus when using natural weapons.

2. Yes. +4 bonus on the trip attempt and a melee attack after a successful trip.

[Thurbane]

1.) No. The only (pseudo-) exceptions to getting iteratives on a natural weapon are the Rapidstrike/Improved Rapidstrike feats, and being an animal companion that only has one natural attack.

2.) Yes, that should work fine.

As you've pointed out, meeting the Int req for Combat Expertise/Improved Trip may be an issue. 2 levels in Wolf-Totem Barbarian (UA) will let you ignore the reqs and get Improved Trip as a bonus feat.

[Braininthejar2]

1.) No. The only (pseudo-) exceptions to getting iteratives on a natural weapon are the Rapidstrike/Improved Rapidstrike feats, and being an animal companion that only has one natural attack.

Pity. and weird. So, an unarmed strike guy turned into a bear could attack with the same paws as iterative unarmed strikes, and natural claw attacks on the same turn, but a wolf with class levels can't make iterative bites?
What if he took improved unarmed strike? would he then bite once and headbutt twice?

(on a related note, I hate pounce-charging with dual wielded lances)


As you've pointed out, meeting the Int req for Combat Expertise/Improved Trip may be an issue. 2 levels in Wolf-Totem Barbarian (UA) will let you ignore the reqs and get Improved Trip as a bonus feat.

As expected from a build contests guy - a simple and neat solution :smallbiggrin:

[Crake]

I think I remember reading somewhere that improved trip only got the free attack if the initial trip attempt was qualified to be a normal attack, so free trip attempts from things the trip monster ability didn't actually allow you to get a free attack, since the trip action was a free action that could only be used to trip.

Admittedly, I'm fairly sure it was a developer comment, or possibly an FAQ, and may well have been pathfinder, I'll see if I can dig it up.

Edit: Oh, it was based on this line: "If you trip an opponent in melee combat, you immediately get a melee attack against that opponent as if you hadn’t used your attack for the trip attempt. " The argument goes that since you couldn't use the free action trip attempt to attack your foe, you can't use improved trip to get an extra attack from it.

[DrMotives]

So as you mention, improved unarmed strike will let you do iterative headbutts / hipchecks whatever plus your one bite attack, but there is another option. In "Lords of Madness" there is the "mouthpick" enchantment for melee weapons. The weapon has a ring for a hilt, you give up your bite attack to be able to swing a manufactured weapon with your mouth.

[Thurbane]

So as you mention, improved unarmed strike will let you do iterative headbutts / hipchecks whatever plus your one bite attack, but there is another option. In "Lords of Madness" there is the "mouthpick" enchantment for melee weapons. The weapon has a ring for a hilt, you give up your bite attack to be able to swing a manufactured weapon with your mouth.

While that is an excellent suggestion (and one that I hadn't thought of), a Worg's trip ability specifically only triggers on a bite. I think OP mainly wants to pump up his cohort's ability to trip.

But a mouthpick weapon is great for times when you are very unlikely to trip an opponent or don't care about tripping it. And you can always make the mouthpick weapon one that can trip, so he can still utilize his Improved Trip feat.

[MHCD]

Fine, I guess I'll be the one to say it.

The worg should take levels in...

Worgblade

Maneuvers tend to play nicely with single attacks, and you still get the free trip attempt after using your bite on a strike. This also goes well with fighter, barbarian, any other character development path, since ToB goes well with everything.

Sworgsage also works, and brings something a little different to the table.

In fact, so does Crusadworg.

[Fouredged Sword]

While that is an excellent suggestion (and one that I hadn't thought of), a Worg's trip ability specifically only triggers on a bite. I think OP mainly wants to pump up his cohort's ability to trip.

But a mouthpick weapon is great for times when you are very unlikely to trip an opponent or don't care about tripping it. And you can always make the mouthpick weapon one that can trip, so he can still utilize his Improved Trip feat.

And as a mouthpick weapon, if I am remembering right, auto grants profficency there is no reason not to use a katori resin spiked chain for reach and tripping. It is a ton of fun to trip people charging you. They still get to make their attack, but are prone next to you when they do.

There are a lot of good reasons to use a weapon to trip. It is easier to stack bonuses on a weapon and you can drop the weapon to avoid being tripped if your check fails. You can also get iterative attacks and benefit from extra attacks like haste or whirling frenzy.

[Crake]

And as a mouthpick weapon, if I am remembering right, auto grants profficency there is no reason not to use a katori resin spiked chain for reach and tripping. It is a ton of fun to trip people charging you. They still get to make their attack, but are prone next to you when they do.

There are a lot of good reasons to use a weapon to trip. It is easier to stack bonuses on a weapon and you can drop the weapon to avoid being tripped if your check fails. You can also get iterative attacks and benefit from extra attacks like haste or whirling frenzy.

Just wanna let you know that the worg, if it fails the trip attempt with it's natural bite, can't be tripped back, so in that regard, the bite is actually strictly better. Plus, bonuses can be stacked on a bite just as easily via a necklace of natural attacks.

It is also worth noting that unlike the worg's bite attack, tripping with something like a spiked chain does not get a free trip attempt after a hit, you have to trip first, and then you get a free attack, so if you value damage over a trip, the bite is better.

[Fouredged Sword]

Just wanna let you know that the worg, if it fails the trip attempt with it's natural bite, can't be tripped back, so in that regard, the bite is actually strictly better. Plus, bonuses can be stacked on a bite just as easily via a necklace of natural attacks.

It is also worth noting that unlike the worg's bite attack, tripping with something like a spiked chain does not get a free trip attempt after a hit, you have to trip first, and then you get a free attack, so if you value damage over a trip, the bite is better.

Yes, but the chain has reach and a X4 crit multi. I could see ether used.