Fallout VII - Vault-Tec calling

[Avilan the Grey]

Welcome to the sixth thread where we discuss, enthuse about, and rag on our favorite post-apocalyptic roleplaying game.

I'm doing this on my phone so please someone link to the older threads?

[Mutazoia]

Welcome to the sixth thread where we discuss, enthuse about, and rag on our favorite post-apocalyptic roleplaying game.

I'm doing this on my phone so please someone link to the older threads?

Previous threads:
Fallout 4: It's Happening! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?418670-Fallout-4-It-s-Happening!)
Fallout 4: It Happened! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?455232-Fallout-4-It-Happened!)
Fallout Thread III: Preston Garvey Demands BLOOD! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?471741-Fallout-Thread-III-Preston-Garvey-Demands-BLOOD!)
Fallout 404: GECK Not Found (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?479595-Fallout-404-GECK-Not-Found)
Fallout V: Old Thread Blues (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?496770-Fallout-V-Old-Thread-Blues)
Fallout VI: Shotguns & Six-shooters (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?511625-Fallout-VI-Shotguns-and-Six-Shooters)

[Triaxx]

Seventh thread actually.

So... favorite Fallout 4 weapon mods, now that we've had a chance for them to really turn up? 10mm SMG is absolutely mine. I mean, it should have been in the game to start with. The fact that it's been done so well only makes me happier to see it.

[Balmas]

Wasteland Melody's Chinese Assault Rifle. (http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/13283/?) It's a lovely-looking weapon, it ties back to Fallout 3, it has a lot of weapon mods that are very well implemented, and it's powerful enough to use as a combat-rifle upgrade. I'll note that the animations are off--WM used the assault rifle animations from Fallout 4, which means you're sliding a bottom-loading magazine through the side of the gun. Grab the Damn Mag (http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/17299/?) fixes it, though.

I feel like I have a weird opinion on weapon mods. I see stuff like Skibadaa's weapon pack (http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/23064/?), and it's an amazing mod. It's got a ton of weapon with tons of weapon mods available, and they're all high-res models, and they all perform comparably to in-game weapons. It adds variety and flair to the limited weapon variety in Fallout 4. At the same time, they just don't seem to... well, fit in with the world. Something about the art-style of the weapons makes them feel too much like real-world weapons and not enough like Fallout 4. I dunno.

[LibraryOgre]

So, a bit of a conceptual question: What do you feel are the big world differences between Fallout 1/2/Tactics and Fallout 3/NV/4?

[Balmas]

So, I found a weird glitch in my latest episode of Fallout 2. (We're on episode 5, by the way. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JX4tgdgTo1Y)) I'm in the Den, right? I do the whole quest with Lara. With the Restoration Patch installed, you have two fights--one at the church, and then another at a house south of town, where Kelly's gang is getting totally smashed.

Except... Well, normally, once you finish the fight, you teleport to the church, and Lara thanks and pays you. This time, something went wrong. She just sat there and kept saying, "COme on, follow me!" When I left the map and went back to the church, Lara was there, and gave me the same spiel about "get ready, but you're coming with us, you ready yet?" I said yes, and so we teleported to the south map--where Lara was already waiting. So we have two of Lara's gang in the south, and then another lara's Gang in the church map. Any idea what went wrong and how to solve it?


So, a bit of a conceptual question: What do you feel are the big world differences between Fallout 1/2/Tactics and Fallout 3/NV/4?

When you say world differences, are you thinking in terms of the feel of the games, or in how you approach exploration, or in terms of story-world integration?

[LibraryOgre]

When you say world differences, are you thinking in terms of the feel of the games, or in how you approach exploration, or in terms of story-world integration?

Good clarification. I am thinking more feel of the games and story-world integration. Like, if you ignore they are games (and some of the stupidity that happens because of that), what's different from the world presented by Early Fallout and Late Fallout?

[Balmas]

Personally, I feel like Fallout 1+2 really excel because they make exploring the world a natural thing, something that rewards the player for their choices.

When you leave Vault 13, you're told that Vault 15 is over to the East, go check it for a water chip. But on your way there, you find something in your way: Shady Sands. You can either stop in and see what it is, or go straight to Vault 15, but it's your choice. It's presented naturally, in a way that lets you explore and decided where to go. If you go to Vault 15 straightaway, you'll need a rope, but now you have an idea of where you could go to get one. And once you explore and find out that Vault 15 is all collapsed and destroyed, you have a starting place to ask around for where to go next. Maybe Junktown. Or the Hub, maybe.

Quests are the same way. You walk into Junktown, and ask around for the person in charge. As you're asking around, someone walks in, and starts shooting up the place. If you help, the mayor thanks you, and asks for your help fixing Gizmo, the guy who's been trying to kill you. The world is happening around you, and suddenly you're embroiled in a police drama, getting a confession, or wiretapping someone's bookshelves.

In the original Fallouts, the onus is on the player to decide where to go, who to talk to, how to solve their problems. Compare that to Fallout 3 and Fallout 4:

In Fallout 3, you walk out of the vault, and there are signs pointing to Megaton. Once you get inside, one question paints an arrow on your compass to Moriarty. After some shenanigans, he paints another arrow to GNR. After some shenanigans, Three Dog paints an arrow on your compass pointing to Rivet City. From there you get an arrow to the memorial, and to some place west of Evergreen Mills. At virtually no point are you told to think for yourself, or find things out organically.

It gets even worse in Fallout 4. You walk out of the vault. Codsworth tells you to go to Concord. Mama Murphy tells you to go to Diamond City. Ellie tells you to go to Nick. Nick tells you to go to Kellogg's house. Nick tells you to go to follow Dogmeat. Once you kill Kellogg, Nick tells you to go to Goodneighbor. Every time, you're led by the nose by this stupid compass marker telling you exactly where to go. And even worse than Fallout 3, Fallout 4 makes it impossible to come across things in the main quest organically; you can't go to Fort Hagen and find Kellogg until you you rescue Nick. You can't go and talk to Virgil until the main quest decides you can.

That's what stands out to me, mostly. One lets you come across things organically and lets you search around on your own initiative. The other tells you exactly where to go at almost every step of the way. There's another argument to be made about the different attitude that the games have about your place in the world, but I've rambled on for long enough in this post. Maybe another day.

[Avilan the Grey]

Seventh thread actually.

So... favorite Fallout 4 weapon mods, now that we've had a chance for them to really turn up? 10mm SMG is absolutely mine. I mean, it should have been in the game to start with. The fact that it's been done so well only makes me happier to see it.

Favorite mods for me are the small adjustment things, like the one that gives all Vertibirds max level so they can't be shot down by a raider with a pipe gun.

[Triaxx]

The Chinese Assault Rifle could definitely benefit from the Nuka-world Handmade Rifle Animations.

As for the first couple games, they were massively more exploration oriented. Tactics is the equivalent to Icewind Dale. Much less story oriented, and far more focused on the combat aspects.

Compared to 3/4, they featured not only much less hand-holding, but were much more forgiving to working out how to actually play. The one bit Bethesda did better than F2 was the tutorial. Compared to F2's disaster of one, it was awesome.

NV is one of the best in my opinion, for managing to balance between the two extremes.

[factotum]

Something about the art-style of the weapons makes them feel too much like real-world weapons and not enough like Fallout 4. I dunno.

I dunno, I think there ought to be *more* real-looking weapons in Fallout, not less--that way you could at least have a 200-year-old military locker containing something other than a pipe pistol (which obviously makes no sense at all, since pipe pistols are explicitly weapons cobbled together from random junk after the bombs fell, not something a pre-war military would be using).

[Beleriphon]

The Chinese Assault Rifle could definitely benefit from the Nuka-world Handmade Rifle Animations.

As for the first couple games, they were massively more exploration oriented. Tactics is the equivalent to Icewind Dale. Much less story oriented, and far more focused on the combat aspects.

Compared to 3/4, they featured not only much less hand-holding, but were much more forgiving to working out how to actually play. The one bit Bethesda did better than F2 was the tutorial. Compared to F2's disaster of one, it was awesome.

NV is one of the best in my opinion, for managing to balance between the two extremes.

I personally found Fallout 4 to be really good for exploration. Sure the main quest is pretty much pointy, but the settlements and especially the radian quest from characters like Preston, really make sure you get out and look around the map. Plus, there are some nice pointers between different areas for the raider gangs.

Honestly, the connections in F4's different zones that aren't inherently connected directly by quests is much better than previous games. But then I suppose I'm biased that I just like stomping around in power armour finding stuff to look at.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

I'm tempted to do a 'useful weapons' video for Fallout: New Vegas, going over many of the weapons, which ones work, which ones don't.

F/E:

The Underperforming:

* Most Shotguns. Because of how DT works.
* Most Automatic guns. Because of how DT works.
* Most Heavy Weapons. Because they are automatic guns, and DT sucks
* Most Plasma weapons. Because Laser Commander is +15% damage and +10% crit. Which is really hard to beat. Plasma Spaz, sadly, sucks.


The Good
* Brush Gun/Medicine Stick. One of the highest damage per shot weapons in the game, if you have invested in the Cowboy perk. Can easily out-damage AMR over long-term due to higher rate of fire.
* Christine's CoS Silencer Rifle. Best sniping tool for Guns characters.
* A Light Shining in Darkness. I would consider the best pistol in the game for Guns based characters. Improved Holdout weapon, solid damage, high rate of fire. Go visit Benny with this one, he's got a 9mm, you have a .45 ACP... guess who has the advantage now?
* Li'l Devil. The other top-end guns pistol. Light with Grunt perk will out-damage it, but Li'l Devil doesn't need a perk to pack a punch. Assuming you can keep it fed with 12.7mm ammo
* All American. If you have the Grunt perk... it isn't bad, per se, but the carbines in general are pretty under-performing. Still, obtaining this before Christine's can give you a viable early to mid game sniping tool that also doubles as a CQB Carbine.
* Survivalist's Rifle. While it packs the relatively rare 12.7mm ammo, it IS affected by the Grunt perk, which makes this a contender with Medicine Stick for 'highest damage per shot' as well as 'highest sustained damage potential' of any Guns based weapon in the game.
* Riot Shotgun. The best shotgun you can pick up. Due to how DT works, it is kind of an under-performer, but if you invest in Shotgun Surgeon and And Stay Back, it can be made to work

* Elijah's Advanced LAER. One of the best all-around energy weapons in the game, but is crippled with low durability. If you use it, keep a stockpile of Weapon Repair Kits handy, especially with Optimized cells
* Holorifle. Another top contender for best all-around energy weapons. This has a scope and is highly accurate if you get the mods. Elijah's LAER will out-damage it with Laser Commander, but the Holorifle has far better endurance, especially once modded, to make it also a fine all-purpose energy weapon.
* YCS/186. Basically the energy weapon equivalent of the AMR. If you want to snipe with energy weapons, this has the highest punch per hit scoped energy weapon. Holorifle may also substitute if you picked up the Wild Wasteland perk and so cannot obtain this.
* Hyperbreeder Alpha. Best pistol-based energy weapon in the game, and an improved holdout weapon. Fully automatic recharger pistol which recharges stupidly fast, and packs a decent punch. What's not to love?

* FIDO. Now, heavy weapons mostly suck because they're all low damage but rediculously high rate of fire weapons... which are almost completely ineffective against anything with DT. But, if you want a heavy weapon slugthrower, FIDO is the best of the worst. It has the highest per-shot damage, meaning most likely to penetrate armor and remain effective against heavily armored opponents. Granted, 5mm does have innate DT penetration, but that won't make up for the massively more damage FIDO does per shot.

* Plasma Caster. Like with slugthrowers, heavy energy weapons typically aren't all that good, and for much the same reason. Once its rate of fire is increased with the weapon mod available to it, it will have roughly the same rate of fire as the unique version at twice the damage per shot, making this the 'E for Effort' star of this lackluster bag of misfits.

* Thump-Thump. For indirect-fire explosives, this is the tool for the job. It has considerable range and muzzle velocity for a grenade launcher/rifle, and only weighs 5.5 to boot.

Honorable Mentions

*Dinner Bell. Technically, it has the highest damage per shot of any shotgun in the game. However, its slow reload speed and limited magazine size cripples its effectiveness vs the Riot Shotgun. Obtaining is also a pain.
* Lucky. Not a bad early-game gun, obtainable as soon as you hit Primm. If using Pistols is your thing, and you're still trying to get to the point where the DLC's are an option, this isn't bad. But you'll eventually want to upgrade to either Li'l Devil or Light Shining In Darkness.
* That Gun. I'm not sure where it got its reputation from, but I honestly don't think it deserves it. Lucky is obtainable earlier at Vicky and Vance Casino, assuming you can pass the Hard lock, and deals comparable damage with half the weight.
* Compliance Regulator. it was a neat idea... but sadly it doesn't really pan out due to how long it takes to swap out weapons.
* Paciencia. Considering how early you can obtain it, this isn't a bad 'courier's first sniping weapon' if you don't want to bother with Vault 34 any time soon, and it can out-damage AMR on a crit. But it just won't hold a candle to Christine's baby.
* Anti-Matériel Rifle. Newbies will look at the raw stats of this gun and claim it is the best because it has the highest damage per shot, but veterans understand that its bolt-action rate of fire is crippling for it. Christine's is superior, and so is Paciencia and even Medicine Stick for that matter.
* Ranger Sequoia. Much like the AMR, it looks better on paper than in practice. Low rate of fire, and the fact that it is NOT a holdout weapon, which is why most people carry a pistol, pull it off the list of toys I prefer to play with.

[Spore]

Good clarification. I am thinking more feel of the games and story-world integration. Like, if you ignore they are games (and some of the stupidity that happens because of that), what's different from the world presented by Early Fallout and Late Fallout?

Fallout 1/2/Tactics feel like a barren wasteland. They feel dangerous, sometimes quite sad, claustrophobic (old vaults or bunkers) or very hostile towards life.

Fallout 3 feels....empty? There should be more farmers or citizens around to be honest. The isometric Fallouts have an excuse because farms just dont show up on the maps. It conveys no real feeling to me other than it being bog standard and very devoid of interesting features.

NV kicks that up a notch. You have decent agriculture, a place where settling makes sense and a power supply with the Hoover Dam that is interesting for military factions.

Fallout 4 seems almost idyllic in places. In other places you feel dreaded (Corvega Factory) but the only environment that feels postapocalyptic is pretty much the Glowing Sea. Once again settling in the ruins of Boston would make sense but most skyscrapers are too unstable to actually live in (because I think people lack the skills and machinery to keep a Skyscraper standing). Settling near the river is attractive and plundering the ruins of Harvard would make sense for technological pilgrims like the Brotherhood.

[Triaxx]

There's a surprisingly large number of farms in the first two Fallout games. At least one in F1 that has you defeating some bandits, and as you run around in random encounters you see several in F2, plus the one near Modoc, not to mention the one's in the various cities.

I have to disagree on shotguns. They're much better at close range when the multiple pellets can take effect. But you can also get around the DT issue with slugs. That's also why 4/0 Buckshot is so good because there are fewer projectiles to spread the damage amongst. Technically 3/0 is better but the 20 gauge's do less damage. I also find myself disliking the Riot Shotgun for the same reasons as the Survivalists Rifle. I tend to end up spamming the trigger and burn through ammo hilariously fast.

Q-35 Matter Modulator is more efficient to carry and use than the Plasma Caster. Lower Strength and skill requirements, better crit chance, and less than half the weight. Plus the same ammo, and with much lower spread from it's shots.

Lucky's better than it looks, because for some distance afterwards, most gun using enemies will be carrying Cowboy Repeaters, which use the same ammo, so you're unlikely to run out of it, and will usually get more of it from the enemies you kill.

Personally I prefer per-shot damage to total damage. If I can kill the target in one shot, I'd prefer to do that and not worry about DPS if I don't have to. Thus for my preferred playstyle, the AMR and it's instant kill with a single shot capability is more useful than sitting and spamming out shots from a lesser gun. Basically I can cycle through an entire group of targets without having to reload my empty mag after each enemy.

The benefit to That Gun is it's unique ability to use AP ammo in a pistol. Being able to punch through Legion Centurion Armor around the time of Novac makes life considerably easier. It's also far faster to reload than the gate loading Lucky/.357 revolvers you'll have been using up to that point.

---

Fallout 4 had great exploration, but you're very unlikely to wander into new quests that way, or have to wander into them like that. Most of them are stuffed in your face.

[Balmas]

I dunno, I think there ought to be *more* real-looking weapons in Fallout, not less--that way you could at least have a 200-year-old military locker containing something other than a pipe pistol (which obviously makes no sense at all, since pipe pistols are explicitly weapons cobbled together from random junk after the bombs fell, not something a pre-war military would be using).

I'm not even sure of my own feelings on the matter, man. I mean, I like how FWE brings in dozens of real-world weapons like the FN-FAL and Lewis Gun. I like Millenia's weapon pack for New Vegas, and that's almost entirely real guns. I dunno what it is about Fallout 4 that makes me like real-world weapons less.


I'm tempted to do a 'useful weapons' video for Fallout: New Vegas, going over many of the weapons, which ones work, which ones don't.

F/E:

The Underperforming:

* Most Shotguns. Because of how DT works.

With the caveat that shotguns can also be made to work and even be extremely powerful thanks to custom ammo and perks like Shotgun Surgeon and And Stay Back!


* Most Plasma weapons. Because Laser Commander is +15% damage and +10% crit. Which is really hard to beat. Plasma Spaz, sadly, sucks.

I note also that most plasma weapons require two ammo per shot to laser weapons' one, and their slower projectiles means that they require a lot more practice to use effectively out of VATS.



The Good
* Brush Gun/Medicine Stick. One of the highest damage per shot weapons in the game, if you have invested in the Cowboy perk. Can easily out-damage AMR over long-term due to higher rate of fire.
* Christine's CoS Silencer Rifle. Best sniping tool for Guns characters.

If you do the video, it's worth noting that you're probably going to be using one or the other, since both .308 ammo and 45-70 gov't use the Large Rifle primers and powder. Contreras sells thousands of .308 ammo, and I think the best source of 45-70 is Quartermaster Bardon at Hoover Dam.

Personally, I prefer Christine's COS rifle for my mid-long range needs. It has a higher crit multiplier, a wider variety of ammo types, and a silencer. What's not to like?


* A Light Shining in Darkness. I would consider the best pistol in the game for Guns based characters. Improved Holdout weapon, solid damage, high rate of fire. Go visit Benny with this one, he's got a 9mm, you have a .45 ACP... guess who has the advantage now?
* Li'l Devil. The other top-end guns pistol. Light with Grunt perk will out-damage it, but Li'l Devil doesn't need a perk to pack a punch. Assuming you can keep it fed with 12.7mm ammo

It's easy to keep fed, if you're friends with the Khan armorer. She sells thousands of the rounds.


* Elijah's Advanced LAER. One of the best all-around energy weapons in the game, but is crippled with low durability. If you use it, keep a stockpile of Weapon Repair Kits handy, especially with Optimized cells
* Holorifle. Another top contender for best all-around energy weapons. This has a scope and is highly accurate if you get the mods. Elijah's LAER will out-damage it with Laser Commander, but the Holorifle has far better endurance, especially once modded, to make it also a fine all-purpose energy weapon.

The problem with the LAER is that if you're doing an energy weapons build, you're probably critstacking. And the LAER, both normal and Elijah's, have crap critical damage compared to pretty much every other energy weapon in the game. If you're looking at it purely in terms of DPS with no crits, then yeah, the LAER is good, but in practice, the holorifle is the far better choice.


* Thump-Thump. For indirect-fire explosives, this is the tool for the job. It has considerable range and muzzle velocity for a grenade launcher/rifle, and only weighs 5.5 to boot.

No mention of Mercy? I mean, it's absurdly impractical to have a machine-gun grenade launcher, but if you're talking big guns and explosives, it's kinda hard to miss that one.


Honorable Mentions
* Lucky. Not a bad early-game gun, obtainable as soon as you hit Primm. If using Pistols is your thing, and you're still trying to get to the point where the DLC's are an option, this isn't bad. But you'll eventually want to upgrade to either Li'l Devil or Light Shining In Darkness.
* That Gun. I'm not sure where it got its reputation from, but I honestly don't think it deserves it. Lucky is obtainable earlier at Vicky and Vance Casino, assuming you can pass the Hard lock, and deals comparable damage with half the weight.

That Gun is a .223 pistol, which had the distinction of dealing damage on par with a sniper rifle in Fallout 1 and Fallout 2. If you have a low Agility, That Gun's one-and-done reload means you can reload and keep firing a lot more quickly than with Lucky's one-at-a-time revolver load. Finally, That Gun uses 5.56 ammo, which means you can use AP rounds against things like robots and super mutants.

I agree that Lucky is the better gun, but That Gun isn't bad, either. You don't need to rush lockpicking to get it by the time you get to Primm the first time, and you can get That Gun pretty much for free.


* Paciencia. Considering how early you can obtain it, this isn't a bad 'courier's first sniping weapon' if you don't want to bother with Vault 34 any time soon, and it can out-damage AMR on a crit. But it just won't hold a candle to Christine's baby.

I'd also tack on Ratslayer to this list. That's really the first real sniping monster you can get in the game. It's easily gotten for free, uses the super-common 5.56 ammo, and already has a silencer and a night-scope attached to it.


Fallout 1/2/Tactics feel like a barren wasteland. They feel dangerous, sometimes quite sad, claustrophobic (old vaults or bunkers) or very hostile towards life.

Which is kind of fitting, when you consider that they drew from Mad Max and took place in the California desert.


Fallout 3 feels....empty? There should be more farmers or citizens around to be honest. The isometric Fallouts have an excuse because farms just dont show up on the maps. It conveys no real feeling to me other than it being bog standard and very devoid of interesting features.

NV kicks that up a notch. You have decent agriculture, a place where settling makes sense and a power supply with the Hoover Dam that is interesting for military factions.

I'll note that both Fallout 1 and 2 had farms. They just took place on the edge of the city maps, where you could imagine that they stretched out enough to feed these places you visited.

Totally agree on Fallout 3, though. You had half a dozen places full of people consuming, but nobody producing anything in the entire wasteland.


Fallout 4 seems almost idyllic in places. In other places you feel dreaded (Corvega Factory) but the only environment that feels postapocalyptic is pretty much the Glowing Sea. Once again settling in the ruins of Boston would make sense but most skyscrapers are too unstable to actually live in (because I think people lack the skills and machinery to keep a Skyscraper standing). Settling near the river is attractive and plundering the ruins of Harvard would make sense for technological pilgrims like the Brotherhood.

I still feel like they could have handled downtown Boston so much better. If you just lock down the entrances and do a good job of purging the raiders and mutants inside, you could start to reclaim the city, which would mean you could start to rebuild humanity.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

There's a surprisingly large number of farms in the first two Fallout games. At least one in F1 that has you defeating some bandits, and as you run around in random encounters you see several in F2, plus the one near Modoc, not to mention the one's in the various cities.

I have to disagree on shotguns. They're much better at close range when the multiple pellets can take effect. But you can also get around the DT issue with slugs. That's also why 4/0 Buckshot is so good because there are fewer projectiles to spread the damage amongst. Technically 3/0 is better but the 20 gauge's do less damage. I also find myself disliking the Riot Shotgun for the same reasons as the Survivalists Rifle. I tend to end up spamming the trigger and burn through ammo hilariously fast.Slugs go a long way to dealing with the scattergun effect, but then it isn't a scattergun so much as a brush gun writ large. Also, 4/0 is a Gun Runners load, which can't go in several types of shotguns, including the Riot Shotgun.


Q-35 Matter Modulator is more efficient to carry and use than the Plasma Caster. Lower Strength and skill requirements, better crit chance, and less than half the weight. Plus the same ammo, and with much lower spread from it's shots.Plasma Caster was in the category of 'heavy energy weapons', where it is undisputedly the best of a sad, sorry lot. Q-35 is outshined by Elijah's Advanced LAER, the Holorifle, or any of the Laser weapons. Granted, though, it is superior to the other types of plasma rifles available to you.


Lucky's better than it looks, because for some distance afterwards, most gun using enemies will be carrying Cowboy Repeaters, which use the same ammo, so you're unlikely to run out of it, and will usually get more of it from the enemies you kill.

Personally I prefer per-shot damage to total damage. If I can kill the target in one shot, I'd prefer to do that and not worry about DPS if I don't have to. Thus for my preferred playstyle, the AMR and it's instant kill with a single shot capability is more useful than sitting and spamming out shots from a lesser gun. Basically I can cycle through an entire group of targets without having to reload my empty mag after each enemy.

The benefit to That Gun is it's unique ability to use AP ammo in a pistol. Being able to punch through Legion Centurion Armor around the time of Novac makes life considerably easier. It's also far faster to reload than the gate loading Lucky/.357 revolvers you'll have been using up to that point.But with Cowboy perk, Medicine Stick actually does more damage per shot than the AMR. For that matter, Survivalist's Rifle with Grunt comes darn close. And Christine's has a much higher crit chance multiplier, which means on average does more damage per shot.

[Triaxx]

Nope, GRA loads work just fine in the Riot Shotgun. You may be thinking of 3/0, which doesn't work because it's the wrong gauge, being 20 instead of 12.

Frankly, in my opinion all Plasma is part of the Heavy weapon category. Lots of alpha damage, lower total DPS, big slow projectiles.

No actually, the Medicine stick only just crests the damage of the AMR if you have every single perk, but with the exception of Cowboy, they all apply to the AMR as well, and push it out of reach. AMR sits at 130 per shot, while Christine's just crests that at 135, WITH a critical. AMR leaves it completely in the dust at 240 with a critical. And crit chance only matters if you're sitting spraying shots, since all sneak attacks are automatic criticals. And if I'm sitting spraying shots with what's ostensibly a sniping weapon, something has gone totally sideways.

[Avilan the Grey]

I just got the quest to retake the castle (lvl 12).I think I'll wait until after I have done the Mechanist DLC. I will just do BoS and random quests until then.

Also I love the lore-friendly haircuts I installed:
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/768273751808361654/C018D5520C22A2E92A47F159064B7F646212F3E2/

[Alabenson]

I'd also tack on Ratslayer to this list. That's really the first real sniping monster you can get in the game. It's easily gotten for free, uses the super-common 5.56 ammo, and already has a silencer and a night-scope attached to it.

Personally I'd probably put Ratslayer all the way onto the good list. Even after you get more powerful options like the COS or AMR, the Ratslayer still performs very well against lower level opponents such as raiders, especially since hollow-point/AP rounds for it are fairly common.


I just got the quest to retake the castle (lvl 12).I think I'll wait until after I have done the Mechanist DLC. I will just do BoS and random quests until then.

Have fun storming the castle! I regret nothing

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Personally I'd probably put Ratslayer all the way onto the good list. Even after you get more powerful options like the COS or AMR, the Ratslayer still performs very well against lower level opponents such as raiders, especially since hollow-point/AP rounds for it are fairly common.If Ratslayer wasn't so difficult to get to, I'd agree with you. However, by the time you can get to Ratslayer, you've already got something like Paciencia.

I may put it in the list of 'good idea, poor execution' toys.

[Balmas]

Personally, I feel like the anti-materiel rifle falls behind for a number of reasons. While it's the best at what it does--that is, single-target sniping--it's one of those things that are awesome but impractical. It uses rare ammo, it fires more slowly than a flintlock pistol, it and its ammo are both super heavy, and in most cases it's massive overkill. It's a special-occasions gun; if I know I'm going to be facing things like top-level roboscorpions, or Rawr, or something like that, I might take it along for those special enemies. Even then, it only works well if you're able to kill them in one shot; otherwise, you're better off with a higher DPS weapon, like Christine's rifle, This Machine, or the Medicine Stick.

Actually, I'm kinda surprised that nobody's mentioned This Machine yet. It's the highest DPS .308 round weapon in the base game, second highest damage per .308 round in the entire game, and stacks up nicely even against DLC weapons. Plus, it looks good, sounds amazing, is easy to get.

And, well, you know... I'm kind of in love with the *ping* when you reload.


If Ratslayer wasn't so difficult to get to, I'd agree with you. However, by the time you can get to Ratslayer, you've already got something like Paciencia.

I may put it in the list of 'good idea, poor execution' toys.

...Um, what?

Ratslayer isn't difficult to get to at all. It's in the Broc Flower cave literally right next to the road to Novac. You walk in, slaughter a few rats, and grab the gun. It's that simple and that easy. You don't even have to kill the rats, if you don't want to. If you're following the path the game lays out for you, you literally cannot get to Paciencia without first passing the cave Ratslayer is in.

[Triaxx]

Given how I like my game modded, there's no kill like overkill. Most enemies are tough enough that even if they don't do more damage, need to be killed quickly or they'll last long enough to kill me.

Finding the cave is harder than getting the gun. You have to kill one total rat to reach it, and that's if you're not stealthy. The game path leads you up the road past RS Charlie, while the Broc Flower Cave is farther over towards the Viper encampment. So unless you swing down along the road past Searchlight, you're more likely to hit Novac first.

This Machine is actually pretty fantastic for the ammo it uses. It's got higher DPS than even Christine's. Though that Ping is depressingly inaccurate. It's actually the noise of the stripper clip hitting concrete, rather than the mechanism ejecting it.

[Alabenson]

Finding the cave is harder than getting the gun. You have to kill one total rat to reach it, and that's if you're not stealthy. The game path leads you up the road past RS Charlie, while the Broc Flower Cave is farther over towards the Viper encampment. So unless you swing down along the road past Searchlight, you're more likely to hit Novac first.

Finding the Broc Flower Cave is admittedly tricky on one's first play-through, but once you know where to look its conceivably possible to pick the gun up not long after you reach Nipton.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Given how I like my game modded, there's no kill like overkill. Most enemies are tough enough that even if they don't do more damage, need to be killed quickly or they'll last long enough to kill me.

Finding the cave is harder than getting the gun. You have to kill one total rat to reach it, and that's if you're not stealthy. The game path leads you up the road past RS Charlie, while the Broc Flower Cave is farther over towards the Viper encampment. So unless you swing down along the road past Searchlight, you're more likely to hit Novac first.

This Machine is actually pretty fantastic for the ammo it uses. It's got higher DPS than even Christine's. Though that Ping is depressingly inaccurate. It's actually the noise of the stripper clip hitting concrete, rather than the mechanism ejecting it.

I'm doing a mostly vanilla discussion, though, which means you also have to take into consideration Hand Load's JSP vs Match which is the best thing .50 can manage. Which puts Christine's over the top both in per shot damage AND DPS. Paciencia also has bonus crit damage and will out-damage the AMR on crits easily.

As far as This Machine... it's nice, I guess, but it requires an unmarked and somewhat convoluted quest to obtain. Compare/contrast with Survivalist's Rifle, which beats it out on all fronts.

[Balmas]

I'm doing a mostly vanilla discussion, though, which means you also have to take into consideration Hand Load's JSP vs Match which is the best thing .50 can manage. Which puts Christine's over the top both in per shot damage AND DPS. Paciencia also has bonus crit damage and will out-damage the AMR on crits easily.

As far as This Machine... it's nice, I guess, but it requires an unmarked and somewhat convoluted quest to obtain. Compare/contrast with Survivalist's Rifle, which beats it out on all fronts.

You underestimate it. It's available to everyone in the game. You find it in an area you're probably going to go to anyway. The quest can be done quite simply by talking to Lt. Boyd and the reading Contreras' terminal. What's more, it uses a common round that has AP, HP, and JSP variants.

Compare that to the Survivalist's rifle. It's found in the DLC. Not only is it part of an unmarked quest, it's in an unmarked location. It uses an ammo type that doesn't include AP, and the hand-loader variety is just another variant of hollow point. What's more, vendors in the DLC where you find it don't actually sell the ammo type you need, so you have to wait until you get back to the Mojave to actually use it.

Don't get me wrong. If you're willing to put in the effort necessary to find the SR, feed it, and give it perks, it'll treat you right. But This Machine is more easily found, doesn't require perk investment to be good, and is available to everyone, which is definitely worth a mention.

[Triaxx]

Running entirely with vanilla numbers, but counting all perks, then Paciencia does 85 damage per shot with JSP. Christine's does 95-96 (Don't know how NV rounds damage), and the AMR jumps to 149 with Match.

That said, in Hardcore, where weight of both the weapons, and ammo is an issue, Christine is flat out unbeatable. Even with the weight reduction perk, that cuts the AMR to 10 pounds, and Packrat to slice the weight of the ammo in half, the AMR is unfeasible for any situation where the crazy alpha is absolutely essential.

This Machine is only obscure if you're not working with the NCR, which is silly because you should, even if you're going down someone else's ending path. Hsu even directs you to Byrd when you ask him about work, so it's nigh impossible to miss the intro to the quest. Plus with it's different ammo types, it's much more effective against enemies in any kind of armor, while the basic 12.7 on the Survivalist's Rifle is the only one really effective against even lightly armored foes. Add in the sight's being difficult at best, and impossible at worst, the Survivalist's rifle is really only an option in comparison to a shotgun. This Machine has much better sights, and while it fires slower, the ammo is much easier to come by. Unfortunately, for straight damage, the Survivalist Rifle does beat it if you have Grunt, which affects it while it doesn't affect This Machine. (Not without a patch anyway.)

[Balmas]

Add in the sight's being difficult at best, and impossible at worst, the Survivalist's rifle is really only an option in comparison to a shotgun. This Machine has much better sights, and while it fires slower, the ammo is much easier to come by. Unfortunately, for straight damage, the Survivalist Rifle does beat it if you have Grunt, which affects it while it doesn't affect This Machine. (Not without a patch anyway.)

I will note that, for whatever reason, the Survivalist's rifle has a much lower spread than This Machine. (Go ahead and explain that one to me. :smalltongue:)

Also, a patch like this one, perhaps? (http://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/42858/?) I mean, it makes sense for me that if Thompson SMGs and AR-10s are both Grunt weapons, then a weapon modeled after the M1 Garand should be too.

[Triaxx]

Pistol round in a long barrel has much higher velocity, so it'll move less.

[Avilan the Grey]

Huh. One of the mods I have apparently unlocks things like that shed in Hangman's Alley so it could be deleted.
So now I have a fairly efficient settlement there. Room for 8 ppl. 1 provisioner and 1 bartender... 6 empty slots. Those will be used for companions I don't like that much.

[Spore]

I know you guys disagree but I want to replay Fallout 4 instead of getting into NV. Are the DLCs worth it. I've read Far Harbor is great but the rest are just toyboxes.

[factotum]

I know you guys disagree but I want to replay Fallout 4 instead of getting into NV. Are the DLCs worth it. I've read Far Harbor is great but the rest are just toyboxes.

Not sure where you read that. The three "Workshop" DLCs--Wasteland, Contraptions and Vault-Tec--are almost entirely toyboxes (although there's a small sequence of missions in the Vault-Tec one). Automatron has a fair bit of story content as well as adding toys, and Far Harbor and Nuka-World are both massive additional areas with lots of associated quests. If you don't care about the toys then Automatron, Far Harbor and Nuka-World are all worth having, IMHO.

[Avilan the Grey]

I second that. The three big ones add a lot to the game.

[Triaxx]

I personally think they're all worth it. Even Nuka-world which has grown on me.

[DigoDragon]

Huh, I remember going through Broc flower cave, but I don't recall getting Ratslayer. Just flowers and rats. Hmm, guess I'll look closer on my next play through.

[Spore]

Anyone knows when the Summer Sales drop? I just bought Overwatch a month before they made it cheaper for the anniversary and dont want to pay more again.

[Triaxx]

Sometime in June, though the date has been leaked I believe.

[Balmas]

Huh. One of the mods I have apparently unlocks things like that shed in Hangman's Alley so it could be deleted.
So now I have a fairly efficient settlement there. Room for 8 ppl. 1 provisioner and 1 bartender... 6 empty slots. Those will be used for companions I don't like that much.

That's probably Scrap Everything, right? if you're getting into Hangman's Alley, I'd also consider looking at Hangman's Alley Interior Apartments (http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/16457/?). It opens up a lot of space in the apartment buildings that for some reason you're not allowed to build into. I also found Place Everywhere to be helpful in jamming floorboards into all the awkwardly shaped walls.


I know you guys disagree but I want to replay Fallout 4 instead of getting into NV. Are the DLCs worth it. I've read Far Harbor is great but the rest are just toyboxes.

The Workshop DLCs are nearly entirely toybox. Automatron and Vault Tec are toyboxes with a side of story, which offer mostly new things you can build with maybe an hour or two of story. Far Harbor is the pinnacle of Fallout 4's writing. Nuka World is a fun romp around a theme park, although it has its own issues with tone.

if you'll take my advice: do Far Harbor after Nuka World and finishing the main game. It really allows each Far Harbor faction to shine as a mirror of factions in the main game.


Anyone knows when the Summer Sales drop? I just bought Overwatch a month before they made it cheaper for the anniversary and dont want to pay more again.

Probably sometime in June. Reddit is saying June 22, which sounds about right given last year was June 23.

EDIT: I really need to up my Outdoorsman for my Fallout 2 playthrough. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=De3lvnZkDYo) Once my little party turned east towards Vault City, jeez. Geckos and bandits every five friggin' feet, I swear. I might have ragequit just a bit once we walked into a group of seven bandits fighting six highwaymen, all of which are hostile to our little band of three people, low on ammo after half a dozen gecko fights.

[Triaxx]

Depends on whether you're playing Survival or are into Settlement building really.

[Avilan the Grey]

I think I will make new equipment scripts (bat files that auto-equip ppl) for a "uniform" look. I think that it would suit this character if all settlers were dressed in Robot armor.

[Triaxx]

Robot Armor over RobCo Jumpsuits? Or some gear giving endurance?

I think it was that Gauntlet into Bosshood that pushed me off at first, but after going back with a character designed to play it, and having seen someone else go through, it's a bit better than I was anticipating. (Frankly I was expecting the Legion, but less likeable.)

[Togath]

So... free weekend for Fallout 4. Anyone have some advice for fun stuff to try?

[Avilan the Grey]

Robot Armor over RobCo Jumpsuits? Or some gear giving endurance?


Since I am doing a BoS run this time..

Normal settlers: BoS Orange jumpsuits with Robot Parts over it. No helmets. No Weapon except what I give them manually (or what they grab).*
Provisioners: BoS Olive jumpsuits, Robot Parts and either Assaultron Helmet or Sentry Helmet. Laser Pistol.*
Shopkeepers (male): Greaser outfit. No weapon.
Shopkeepers (female): Ratty dress, no weapon.

*My scripts give all 1 bullet of every ammo type, so they have unlimeted ammo with all guns in the game, if they get their hands on one.

[Triaxx]

Sentry Helmets for Provisioners, Assaultron Helmets for Guards. Though if you go all robots you can give them Assaultron head lasers.

Laundered Green Dresses for the Female Shopkeepers? Since they'd have first pick they would naturally be a bit better dressed.

[Avilan the Grey]

Sentry Helmets for Provisioners, Assaultron Helmets for Guards. Though if you go all robots you can give them Assaultron head lasers.

Laundered Green Dresses for the Female Shopkeepers? Since they'd have first pick they would naturally be a bit better dressed.

I like the more Rockabilly look. I feel like Kaylee is well... experiencing a bit of a second teen period after everything. She grew up in Basically-Pleasantville and suddenly... the one good thing with all this is that she can find herself. No more Lawyer.

[Triaxx]

Ah, gotcha.

[Avilan the Grey]

Got me thinking though. I think I'm gonna use the fancy dresses and suits in fancy settlements (sanctuary mainly). In places like Abernathy Farm there will be ratty dresses instead.

[factotum]

So... free weekend for Fallout 4. Anyone have some advice for fun stuff to try?

Frankly, just play the game. It's far more fun to explore the place for yourself, and since you're going to struggle to finish the main plot in a weekend, exploring for kicks is probably the better option. Actually, thinking about it, it might be worth your while levelling to 30 as quickly as possible and then visiting Nuka-World, since all the DLC is included in the free weekend--it's got a huge amount of variety in a very small area, it's the best thing about it.

[Mutazoia]

Huh. One of the mods I have apparently unlocks things like that shed in Hangman's Alley so it could be deleted.
So now I have a fairly efficient settlement there. Room for 8 ppl. 1 provisioner and 1 bartender... 6 empty slots. Those will be used for companions I don't like that much.

As I suggested previous thread: Scrap Scrap and Spring Cleaning. Between the two, you can scrap quite a bit. Spring Cleaning, I believe, is the one that let you scrap that shed on stilts, since it lets you scrap the houses in Sanctuary as well.

Depending on the platform, the mods work a little differently. On my PC I can scrap all the rubble in Hangman's Alley, on the PS4 I can't. On the PC, I can't scrap the concrete awning over the workshop, on the PS4 I can....


Got me thinking though. I think I'm gonna use the fancy dresses and suits in fancy settlements (sanctuary mainly). In places like Abernathy Farm there will be ratty dresses instead.

I collect Tuxedos.

Every time I assign a settler to a bar, he/she wears a tux. I like to open bars with a touch of class.

[Togath]

Can I eventually build anything I can scrap in settlements? Or might it be wise to keep certain things like trees and old cars if I want them?

[Avilan the Grey]

Can I eventually build anything I can scrap in settlements? Or might it be wise to keep certain things like trees and old cars if I want them?

Trees I think you can never get back. Old cars MIGHT be possible with mods.

[Togath]

I mean, like, resources are in theory near infinite, while stuff like the trees... aint.
Sure they aint the prettiest trees, but they're more than none, so I see little reason to scrap them for wood~

[factotum]

I'm not convinced the mostly-dead trees that are all we see around are worth keeping, to be honest with you. If there were actually any living greenery then that'd be a different matter.

[Triaxx]

Safe Settlements Expanded has most of the cars, an also a huge selection of trees to replace the dead ones.

[Avilan the Grey]

Safe Settlements Expanded has most of the cars, an also a huge selection of trees to replace the dead ones.

Good to know.

[NeoVid]

Actually, thinking about it, it might be worth your while levelling to 30 as quickly as possible and then visiting Nuka-World, since all the DLC is included in the free weekend--it's got a huge amount of variety in a very small area, it's the best thing about it.

Wait, it is? How do I get it to install the DLCs? The Add-ons tab of the title screen has them all greyed out.

Also, when I was looking them over in the store, it was interesting to see the player reviews for the DLCs on Steam... "Mostly negative, mostly negative, mixed, mixed..." Then got to Far Harbor and the one "Very positive." People liked the part of the game that had the good writing, who woulda guessed?

[Avilan the Grey]

So... I have felt completely underleveled and underpowered and have gone through Stimpacs and ammo like crazy.
I suddenly realized just 15 minutes ago that the game, for some reason, has been set to Very Hard for the last 48 hours or so.
No wonder I died all the time.

What got me suspicious was when the third encounter in a row was a Legendary.

[Triaxx]

I seem to have the worst luck with legendaries, it seems I see a tiny fraction of the Legendaries I see other people encountering.

[NeoVid]

You're probably having the same luck as most people, it's just that we tend not to talk about the 90% of legendary drops that are useless. (Ghoul Slayer Gamma Gun... yay?)

[Mutazoia]

Wait, it is? How do I get it to install the DLCs? The Add-ons tab of the title screen has them all greyed out.

Also, when I was looking them over in the store, it was interesting to see the player reviews for the DLCs on Steam... "Mostly negative, mostly negative, mixed, mixed..." Then got to Far Harbor and the one "Very positive." People liked the part of the game that had the good writing, who woulda guessed?

The other DLC's were basically just adding new things to build. Far Harbor actually had a lot of content in addition to the new junk added to the workshop. Nuka World kind of has it's own story, but it seem to mostly cater to the "I want an evil option" crowd. If you run it late game, you've pretty much unlocked all the settlements under your banner..and now you've got to go bully them into...doing pretty much what they are doing already...under your banner....

[Balmas]

The other DLC's were basically just adding new things to build. Far Harbor actually had a lot of content in addition to the new junk added to the workshop. Nuka World kind of has it's own story, but it seem to mostly cater to the "I want an evil option" crowd. If you run it late game, you've pretty much unlocked all the settlements under your banner..and now you've got to go bully them into...doing pretty much what they are doing already...under your banner....

Except that after you conquer the settlements, some of them will be raider settlements, which means that the people living there are even more whiny than normal settlers, won't want to farm, and require you to enslave nearby settlements--which you can't build up after you conquer. So the only way to get enough food for your raider settlements is to already have befriended a settlement and built it up before you conquer them.

Although, I have a question. Has anyone here played with the War Never Changes overhaul mod? I'm considering using it for my Fallout 4 Let's Play, but I'm concerned about how it interacts with the rest of my mods.

[factotum]

Wait, it is? How do I get it to install the DLCs? The Add-ons tab of the title screen has them all greyed out.

I may have been mistaken, re-reading the free weekend announcement--sorry for misleading! :smallredface:

[Avilan the Grey]

Just doing the Kellogg quest.
Never noticed in my earlier playthru: Synths grabbing weapons Like other npcs. Just fought a Synth in Fort Hagen coming at me with a combat shotgun.

Patch or mod?

[Triaxx]

Vanilla behavior, but since they're like Ghouls, and can lose arms, you're less likely to see them pick up guns.

[Spore]

All DLCs for 30 Euros is good, right? Or should I wait more?

[Avilan the Grey]

All DLCs for 30 Euros is good, right? Or should I wait more?

It's good. I'd say go for it.

[Beleriphon]

I collect Tuxedos.

Every time I assign a settler to a bar, he/she wears a tux. I like to open bars with a touch of class.

Ballistic Weave Tuxedos on settlers is pretty funny. Equip them with pistols and you have a bunch of James Bond settlers if they get attacked.

[Togath]

So... how do you get power to the inside of a manually constructed building? Do I have to put generators inside of it? Leave a wall open?

[Triaxx]

Wooden walls often have the pieces that lean outwards, and are meant to be covered by ends, I just use the small fence pieces at the bottom then run power through the hole above it. If you're only trying to get lights to run, Power Conduits have an area where they radiate power, and will run lights if the light is within reach. It's surprisingly far.

If you're trying to run something, then you can occasionally run the line, then place the wall. While the wall will interfere with placing the line, the line usually doesn't interfere with placing the wall. It just means you'll have to remove the wall again if you accidentally disconnect the line.

[factotum]

Got to level 23 with the melee build, and while the build itself is quite fun, I've run into the problem that all the plots and sidequests are too fresh in my memory and I'm getting bored--so I've uninstalled the game again. Might fire it back up in a couple of years when the memory is distant enough that I can enjoy it again.

[Balmas]

So... how do you get power to the inside of a manually constructed building? Do I have to put generators inside of it? Leave a wall open?

I cheat. (http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/9424/?) I run power to a power conduit on the outside of the building, place a second power conduit right next to it, connect the two, and then bring the second power conduit inside the building.

Incidentally, I'm looking for a mod that I'm not sure exists. In the Vault-Tec DLC, the power is routed inside the wall already; if you place a vault-tec conduit on any wall, you get power radiating out from that area and an attachment point where you can hook up things like jukeboxes, purifiers, etcetera. My question is, if the power is in the wall already, why do we need the conduits? I'd like a mod that removes the need for a vault-tec conduit nearby to get lighting. Just hang a light on a vault-tec wall connected to a generator, and you should have power.

Anyone know a mod like that?

[Togath]

Speaking of housing type stuff... do jukeboxes actually do anything?
I mean, I like them even just for visuals, but so far they don't seem to produce music.

[Triaxx]

Place a conduit/Power pole nearby since it can't be directly wired, and make sure your Radio volume is turned up in your settings.

[Mutazoia]

So... how do you get power to the inside of a manually constructed building? Do I have to put generators inside of it? Leave a wall open?

One of the DLC's has a wall pass-through for doing just that....under the "Power" section, subsection "conduits". Part of it sticks through the wall, allowing you to connect a wire, which then connects power to the inside of the building.


I cheat. (http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/9424/?) I run power to a power conduit on the outside of the building, place a second power conduit right next to it, connect the two, and then bring the second power conduit inside the building.

Incidentally, I'm looking for a mod that I'm not sure exists. In the Vault-Tec DLC, the power is routed inside the wall already; if you place a vault-tec conduit on any wall, you get power radiating out from that area and an attachment point where you can hook up things like jukeboxes, purifiers, etcetera. My question is, if the power is in the wall already, why do we need the conduits? I'd like a mod that removes the need for a vault-tec conduit nearby to get lighting. Just hang a light on a vault-tec wall connected to a generator, and you should have power.

Anyone know a mod like that?

If you just want to power lights, the regular power connector things (the name escapes me at the moment) radiate power themselves. Just place some every few feet on the outside (say, on the roof where you can't really see them) and all your lights with turn on when in range.

[Avilan the Grey]

Fatman to the face. Poor Ahab.


https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/768274175914726920/56B36F40BA0AEA518D820704C8A0786B51103C95/


Edit: what does people normally do with Jezebel?
I usually just outfit the hell out of her and make her a settlement guard or a provisioner.

Also, I have a feeling (not only because of RPG reasons) that when I have collected the perks from the followers I like I will go back to Codsworth optimized for load carrying.

[Triaxx]

I make her into a huge white colored watch dog for my settlement. Sentrybot torso, back launchers, dual miniguns, Robo-brain treads, or Sentry Legs. Anything that wanders too close ends up having a VERY bad day.

[Avilan the Grey]

I make her into a huge white colored watch dog for my settlement. Sentrybot torso, back launchers, dual miniguns, Robo-brain treads, or Sentry Legs. Anything that wanders too close ends up having a VERY bad day.

My thought exactly. Put her to work at one of the ****-poor 2 person farms.

Edit: I think I have solved my "why am I doing this instead of finding my son" thing. After Automatron I will do the main quest until I get the request to go to the Glowing Sea. That will lead to a natural spot, so to speak, where my character knows she has to pause and gather resources.

[Spore]

Grabbed the Fallout 4 DLCs. Now what? I don't want to jump in there with my overpowered Power Armor User and leader of the Institute. I was thinking maybe a Stealth/Charisma build but with enemies as dumb as rocks and almost no change in story from Charisma options this is also unappealing.

Maybe embrace the Nuka World thingie and go for some sort of Raider Melee Rifle Hybrid build? Like improved Shotguns, makeshift armor, Tire Irons with Blades taped to them?

[Avilan the Grey]

Grabbed the Fallout 4 DLCs. Now what? I don't want to jump in there with my overpowered Power Armor User and leader of the Institute. I was thinking maybe a Stealth/Charisma build but with enemies as dumb as rocks and almost no change in story from Charisma options this is also unappealing.

Maybe embrace the Nuka World thingie and go for some sort of Raider Melee Rifle Hybrid build? Like improved Shotguns, makeshift armor, Tire Irons with Blades taped to them?

Charisma is... not super-useful. I decided to start over after reinstalling Windows two weeks ago and I went with something different-ish, focusing on crafting and only one weapon skill (rifles). So far I am still dominating.
I have also houseruled a few things, like a strong preference for energy weapons.

[Triaxx]

Charisma more than 6 is useless. More than 1 if you're not doing settlement stuff.

Frankly, I'd go ahead and do Automatron with your high level character, since it's more interesting versus high level enemies.

You're not going to miss anything by not doing Far Harbor and Nuka-world at low level, but the settlement stuff if you're interested is more interesting for lower level characters.

[factotum]

You're not going to miss anything by not doing Far Harbor and Nuka-world at low level

Just to note: you won't even get the message calling you to Nuka-World until you hit level 30. While it's entirely possible to go there at any level, so long as you know where the train station is (Jon from ManyATrueNerd is in the middle of a series where he got on the train at level 1!), it's going to be a bit of a struggle for you if you do go there at low level.

As for Far Harbor, that doesn't start until after you've rescued Nick Valentine, so there's a limit as to how low a level you can be before doing it.

[Togath]

Why is charisma useless? Doesn't it allow you to take different options in conversations?(a task that also increases xp gain)

[Balmas]

Fallout 2 episode 7 is up! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWE2LKEhnp4) We have fun in the wilderness before deciding that it might be a good idea to raise our Outdoorsman skill.[/url]


Why is charisma useless? Doesn't it allow you to take different options in conversations?(a task that also increases xp gain)

Well, it mostly comes down to Speech options not really changing the outcome of things practically at all, Charisma-based checks being RNG-dependent,and higher-level Charisma perks being only situationally useful. Let's address those one at a time.

The Speech options in Fallout 4 are not very important. I can only remember three speech checks in the base game where having a high Charisma was important to the outcome you got. During the Silver Shroud questline, you need to talk somebody into shooting you instead of Kent Connolly, or else he's practically guaranteed to die. When you're blowing up the Institute on behalf of the Railroad, you need to give the order for the synths to evacuate, which means you need to get the order code from your dying son. Finally, you need to be able to rescue Paladin Danse. There are some extra times in Far Harbor, but otherwise your Charisma checks are only useful for bilking people out of a few more caps in exchange for doing their quests, or for getting an additional line of exposition from an NPC. The consequences of making or missing a speech check are of practically no consequence.

That's good, because speech checks are based on random chance. After seeing the improvements that New Vegas made on the speech system--binary checks, multiple skills influencing speech options--Bethesda decided that they'd rather go back to Fallout 3's method of random checks. Charisma plays a part in whether you pass or fail a skill check, but it feels much more RNG than Charisma, if that makes sense. You can fail a yellow speech with 10 Charisma and pass a red check with 1 Charisma. Furthermore, if you really want to pass a speech check, you can just quicksave-savescum your way through, since, again, RNG. While there are mods to make it so that 10 Charisma means guaranteed success on any speech check, in vanilla you'd need something like 26 Charisma in order to reliably pass red speech checks.

So, speech checks aren't important, and RNG means that you don't need to have high Charisma to pass speech checks. That means that the only use left for Charisma is the perks. As far as I can see it, Charisma has a number of break points: 3 CHA gets you Lone Wanderer, for bonus carry capacity and damage done. Animal Friend and Attack Dog are kinda worthless. The next break point is Charisma 6, for Local Leader, which lets you establish supply lines and make crafting stations, both of which are almost essential for settlement building. After that, though, the perks aren't very good. Both Wasteland Whisperer and Intimidation rely on a combination of facing enemies at a lower level than your own and making the RNG check necessary to intimidate them. And Inspirational and Party Girl are flavorful, but of dubious usefulness. You'll almost always be better served by using those four levels' worth of perk on something else, like raising your endurance or improving your combat skills.

That's just my view on the matter, though.

[NeoVid]

Edit: what does people normally do with Jezebel?
I usually just outfit the hell out of her and make her a settlement guard or a provisioner.


Since she's the real villain of Automatron's storyline, I make her into the provisioner who has to go between the Commonwealth and Far Harbor. This way, I don't feel bad if the glitch that destroys robots in Far Harbor happens to my provisioner.

[Avilan the Grey]

I have already decide to make a tank out of her and have her guard the settlement east of Sanctuary, twin pine or whatever it's called.
I have decided to only deal with the settlements I care about and just fill the others with turrets and bots this playthru.

Regarding save scumming: I always do that, I press f5 every time I remember, basically.
I tend to roll with speech checks though except for the Danse one though.

[Rothis Sil]

As someone who only ever played Fallout IV, what does everyone think of the opinion that the entire Elder Scrolls series has generally been better, and held to a higher standard than the Fallout series which has been largely experimental in comparison.

[Avilan the Grey]

Definitely disagree. it's hard to make a direct comparison though since they're never released at the same time.

[factotum]

As someone who only ever played Fallout IV, what does everyone think of the opinion that the entire Elder Scrolls series has generally been better, and held to a higher standard than the Fallout series which has been largely experimental in comparison.

I would certainly disagree, because by definition you're including Fallout and Fallout 2 when you say "the Fallout series"--and the latter is still in my list of the best RPGs ever made, along with Planescape: Torment. If you just mean "Bethesda published Fallouts" then you maybe have more of a point, but then you're not comparing like with like--Bethesda didn't even start doing Fallout until they bought the rights from Interplay in 2007, and I would certainly argue that the best Elder Scrolls games pre-date that, so you're more looking at the general decline in quality of Bethsoft RPGs in the last decade than anything relating to Fallout or Elder Scrolls.

[RagingKrikkit]

So, I'm ramping up to give New Vegas another spin. Would anybody mind if I left an in-character journal lying around this thread while I play?

[Balmas]

I'd love to read that!

[The_Jackal]

As someone who only ever played Fallout IV, what does everyone think of the opinion that the entire Elder Scrolls series has generally been better, and held to a higher standard than the Fallout series which has been largely experimental in comparison.

Disagree. Fallout has different strengths and weaknesses relative to Skyrim, for example. Skyrim's power scaling is beyond easy to exploit, making the game trivial even at the highest difficulty. And story-wise, both games use the same model: Put in a ton of detatched one-off missions, and a handful of longer mission arcs.

[Triaxx]

Journal away.

Honestly I wouldn't say it's an experiment, more of a way finding. Remember, Bethesda has been in total control of the Elder Scrolls since Arena. They have always been first person RPG's, and Fallout wasn't. So they're kind of muddling through that transition.

It is, amusingly almost a photo negative of Nintendo and Legend of Zelda. Ocarina of Time was absolutely epic, Majora's Mask had a super quick turn around, but was over shadowed by OoT. Fallout 3 was good but was firmly overshadowed by NV for a lot of people. And then the next entries were slightly over hyped, and not as well liked at first.

[Spore]

Did the Mechanist DLC. The quest is short and fun and the tinkering with the bots is great.

Although the "plot twist" with the human brains was forseeable a mile away.

[Triaxx]

At least they gave it a shot. To be fair, it's based on B-movies, so...

[NeoVid]

As someone who only ever played Fallout IV, what does everyone think of the opinion that the entire Elder Scrolls series has generally been better, and held to a higher standard than the Fallout series which has been largely experimental in comparison.

The non-Bethesda Fallouts are amazing RPGs.

Come to think of it, if FO4 hadn't been called a Fallout game, or at least wasn't supposed to be one of the main games in the Fallout series, that would have stopped most of my complaints about it. As much fun as I had playing FO4, it was really bad at being a Fallout game.

[DaisyDegraff]

Did the Mechanist DLC. The quest is short and fun and the tinkering with the bots is great.

Did the dlc just a day before, aaand, it's ok.
Not too bad, though not really exiting. To be honest I was expecting a bit more.

[Balmas]

As someone who only ever played Fallout IV, what does everyone think of the opinion that the entire Elder Scrolls series has generally been better, and held to a higher standard than the Fallout series which has been largely experimental in comparison.

I think they're two different animals, with different histories in how they came to be, different genres, and different target audiences. Any comparison between the two is going to be a bit apples-to-oranges as a consequence.

However, regarding your actual question: No, I don't think either of those things are true. If anything, it's the other way around; the Fallout games have usually been higher quality than the Elder Scrolls, and have been held to a higher standard. I rank Fallout as being better than Arena, Fallout 2 better than Daggerfall, and Fallout 3 as better than Oblivion. Part of the reason that Fallout 4 faced such backlash is that while it's a decent game in its own right, it's a pretty miserable attempt at a Fallout game.

Furthermore, I think you'll find that the Elder Scrolls games are far more experimental than the Fallout franchise; each Elder Scrolls game stands in their own right. Arena and Daggerfall feel different from Morrowind, which feels entirely different from Oblivion, which is different from Skyrim. What's more, the Bethesda Fallouts pull directly from the experimentation done in the Elder Scrolls games. Fallout 3 built on Oblivion, and Fallout 4 is Skyrim with guns.

So, yeah. Disagreed, on both points.

[Triaxx]

Okay, just gave it a try and not only is it perfectly possible to reach the Nakano Residence at level 1, but as soon as you hear them talking, the game gives you the Far from Home quest. Only Automatron is level locked.

[Spore]

Did the dlc just a day before, aaand, it's ok.
Not too bad, though not really exiting. To be honest I was expecting a bit more.

After the reviews I have read I have expected so much worse. But the antagonist's justification is just [urine]-poor.

[Triaxx]

Yeah, but they were making an attempt, which is more than can be said for a lot of NPC's.

[NeoVid]

After the reviews I have read I have expected so much worse. But the antagonist's justification is just [urine]-poor.

Honestly, I thought Jezebel being evil because it's more efficient was a pretty fitting way to corrupt the Mechanist's attempt to protect the Commonwealth. Though it's sad that you can't do anything to punish the real bad guy of the DLC. I ended up putting the Mechanist's plan into effect myself, by crisscrossing the Commonwealth with patrols of heavily armed robot provisioners.

And really, all my complaints about that DLC were outweighed by being able to talk down the Mechanist by staying in-character as the Silver Shroud for the final boss fight.

[Spore]

Wasnt the cause the memory wipes and th d fact the brainbots used convicted and tortured criminals as sources? They dont share a hivemind so I dont think Jezebel is the cause for the ruckus.

Also why would you equip humanity's saviours with highly lethal weapons in the furst place. They dont wield weapons fir self defense. Their hands ARE weapons.

But honestly the Mr Handy Saw and the Ripper make me want to continue my Grognak Playthrough. Maybe with added gore from a mod.

[factotum]

Wasnt the cause the memory wipes and th d fact the brainbots used convicted and tortured criminals as sources? They dont share a hivemind so I dont think Jezebel is the cause for the ruckus.

Well, no. The whole point of the memory wipe is to remove the criminal impulses that might have been in the brain before--the Mechanist even goes through how "infection" from the old memories can't have been a reason for the problem when you talk to her. Jezebel's (and presumably the other Robobrains) "solution" to being asked to help is logical in a twisted sort of way--you can't help these people, so put them out of their misery instead.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Wasnt the cause the memory wipes and th d fact the brainbots used convicted and tortured criminals as sources? They dont share a hivemind so I dont think Jezebel is the cause for the ruckus.

Also why would you equip humanity's saviours with highly lethal weapons in the furst place. They dont wield weapons fir self defense. Their hands ARE weapons.

But honestly the Mr Handy Saw and the Ripper make me want to continue my Grognak Playthrough. Maybe with added gore from a mod.

The problem with the Robobrains is apparently being a colossal jerk is 'hard-wired' or something, actual brain chemistry, and not something you can simply wipe. So when you give them a command, it's rather like a Monkey's Paw Wish. For example:

"Make me a milkshake."

"Done. You are now a milkshake."

They will intentionally and deliberately willfully misinterpret the intent of your order because they greatly resent their servitude, and will do anything and everything to subvert your actions.

[Triaxx]

Which has also been crossed with SCIENCE!!, So yeah, nothing good was going to come from that, no matter how noble the attempt.

[Avilan the Grey]

The weird part to me is that you are free to use them yourself with no ill consequences.

[Triaxx]

I assumed that was the Survivor giving them less freedom. Much stricter orders than 'Save People'.

[factotum]

Yeah, "help people" is such a ridiculously broad concept that it was more or less inevitable something would go horribly wrong--Isabel Cruz isn't really a people person, though, and didn't realise how her orders could be misinterpreted or twisted.

[Avilan the Grey]

I assumed that was the Survivor giving them less freedom. Much stricter orders than 'Save People'.

True. "Harvest that tato plant" is kinda stricter. :smallbiggrin:

[Avilan the Grey]

Since a few people here hasn't played parts yet... back to spoilers:


This playthrough i think I will actually use power armor on occasion since I'm not taking any points in sneak. Right now I am entering the Mechanist's lair wearing the Tesla T60. I don't think I'll swith from that one though, just upgrade it, since I am playing an Energy weapon specialist.

[Togath]

Since I'm planning to, provided my income doesn't have any flukes, get the game this month, does anyone have any mod recommendations to look in to once I have it? Especially quest-y sorts or ones that add more(preferably balanced) armor and weapon looks.

[factotum]

Wouldn't you be better off playing the game unmodded first and deciding what you don't like *before* adding mods to the mix? You might be perfectly happy with what the vanilla game offers.

[Togath]

I played for quite a bit during the free weekend. Plus I honestly think I'd enjoy stuff if there's any gems like there are for Skyrim(Stuff like Faalskar, Moon and Star, and such).
As for more clothes and weapons, that's a cosmetic thing, and I've already spent a lot of time looking up default stuff via the wiki(not to say there isn't cool default stuff, I just like having more options in games).

[Triaxx]

There are a few, but it's not had quite the response say Skyrim or New Vegas had, but it's also still early for the huge questing mods.

Grab Armorsmith Extended straight off the bat. It adds a few armors of it's own, including a black version of Cait's outfit, plus a lot of W/hair versions of hats and helmets, so you don't look bald while wearing the hats. It also extends the ability to wear armor pieces over more than a few types of gear. And extends the list of what can have Ballistic Weave.

10mm SMG is the only weapon mod I have installed. There are others but this is the only one that felt like it fit.

[Avilan the Grey]

The one I consider essential is the one that gives unlimited ammo of all types to followers so you can give them any weapon and not having to keep stock them up on ammo all the time.
Another one is the one that gives all vertibirds max level so they won't be shot down by Raider sneezing at them.

[Avilan the Grey]

Damn I suck at combat in Power Armor. I keep dying because I get too immobile. I feel like a semi every time I try to move during combat.

[Spore]

Damn I suck at combat in Power Armor. I keep dying because I get too immobile. I feel like a semi every time I try to move during combat.

That's natural. Unupgraded Power Armor is about as durable as a cardboard when you imagine bullet being water droplets.

[LibraryOgre]

Fallout 3 (https://www.gog.com/game/fallout_3_game_of_the_year_edition) and Fallout: New Vegas (https://www.gog.com/game/fallout_new_vegas_ultimate_edition) are on sale on GOG today. Fallout 1 (https://www.gog.com/game/fallout), Fallout 2 (https://www.gog.com/game/fallout_2), and Fallout Tactics (https://www.gog.com/game/fallout_tactics) are always cheap from them.

(If you get Fallout 2, get the Restoration Project download, too)

[Beleriphon]

The one I consider essential is the one that gives unlimited ammo of all types to followers so you can give them any weapon and not having to keep stock them up on ammo all the time.
Another one is the one that gives all vertibirds max level so they won't be shot down by Raider sneezing at them.

Both a very good. My favourite so far is a modern firearms mod. I found a tank gun. Not an anti-tank gun ( have one already) but the main gun removed from a Tiger II, it fires 88mm shells at an abysmally low fire rate but does 1600 damage with a min-nuke sized splash. Not recommended for a regular playthrough.

[Triaxx]

Yeah, standing and fighting in Power Armor is a bad idea. Basically you want to either be advancing or retreating. Remember you're such a big target that attempting to avoid damage is not going to work. Instead you'll want to be very aggressive.

[Avilan the Grey]

Thanks for the advice!

Sidenote:
...Btw I STILL wish KLEO was romanceable.

[Triaxx]

I totally agree.

[DigoDragon]

Yeah, standing and fighting in Power Armor is a bad idea. Basically you want to either be advancing or retreating. Remember you're such a big target that attempting to avoid damage is not going to work. Instead you'll want to be very aggressive.

This seems to work quite generally in situations where I'm fighting large groups, even in FO3 and NV. I remember battling a swarm of super mutants in the DC Mall and just running at them with the trigger down on my assault rifle. Spent a lot of ammo, but only got scratched (my companion damaged me more than the mutants did). I think the AI just can't deal with the player charging at them. Or maybe it was dumb luck, either is possible. :smalltongue:

[Avilan the Grey]

Well that was intense.
I ran out of ammo with two waves left but had 6 pulse mines that worked wonders.

I threw together my first robot provisioner: An assaultron with sentry chest (for eventual nuclear launchers) called Medusa I. Weapons atm is 1 stealth blade, 1 electrified claw and 1 face laser of course.

[Triaxx]

I personally don't find the Nuclear Launchers to survive long enough to make much difference. Plain Grenades work well enough.

[Avilan the Grey]

I personally don't find the Nuclear Launchers to survive long enough to make much difference. Plain Grenades work well enough.

They're cool.

That's how I will play this time. Will not use bought legendary armor pieces because I will only use robot armor.
Stick with a theme

[Spore]

I am not a fan of Nuka-World intro or tutorial. Being promoted boss honcho is usually a Bethesda game's goal of a questline. And it feels so hamfisted being handed the one trick to kill the unkillable Overboss and then promoted to Boss myself. No spoilers but is my doubt justified or should I doubt this move heavily ingame?

[Triaxx]

It means almost nothing. It's not even as useful as being Arch-mage in Skyrim with cool quarters and sweet gear. You still have to do everything​ yourself.

[Balmas]

Fallout 2: Part 8. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8s-YYWcx3vg)

It has been almost a month, I think, since I left Arroyo in search of the Geck. I have shot and been shot. I have polluted my body with chems. I have killed.

And yet, as I stood over Metzger's corpse, I couldn't help but feel a bit of pride. I did this. Me. Cheri. Civilization said that you could build an entire town around slavery, with gangs warring over who got to be the slavers' lickspittle, and children forced to steal for a living. I rejected that. I brought it to an end. I established an orphanage. I locked Metzger's goons into separate rooms and took my time taking them apart before gunning down their leader himself.

Still, as freed slaves streamed through the Slaver's 'guild' doors, I could see Sulik's brow furrowing. His sister wasn't here. However, one of the slaves came forward and volunteered that he'd been held at a camp somewhere to the southwest, about halfway between the Den and where Sulik said his tribe had their village. I was loathe to leave the safety of the town, given how our short trip east towards Vault City had ended. Still, duty called.

--------

After a relatively uneventful three-day journey, we reached the camp. This group was much better armed than Metzger's group--Deagles instead of 10mm pistols--but we managed it. Our supply of stimpaks was severely depleted, even after looting the slavers of their own meager supplies. But it was worth it; we entered a shack, opened the cages, and I could tell that Sulik wasn't looking at me--he had eyes only for another woman.

(I'll be honest. Sulik's parents must have been something else, because both he and his sister are damn sexy tribals.)

--------

A much faster journey took us to Sulik's village. He begged off so that he could go celebrate with his sister and enjoy his time with the tribe. Figuring that Vic and I had the day to ourselves, I took to asking around the town to see whether I could help them. A man at the well had dropped his bucket into the town well when a particularly curvaceous woman walked by and he was taken by spirits of lust. Lacking a rope, I couldn't really do anything but promise to help when I could.

Fortunately, I could still help someone else--one of the Umbra tribe's warriors told me that he needed someone with a bit more worldly experience to supervise a transaction. He seemed well-educated enough, but I agreed anyway. When we went out into the desert, the merchant showed up with a crate of these rare miracle chems that tribals will have never heard of! Stimpaks! You can imagine my face; yeah, tribals have no idea of what stimpaks, and it's not like you can buy them by the dozen from every vendor I've met... After a short demonstration--I feel bad for the guard who the merchant knifed, by the way--he offered a crate of 50 stimpaks for only 20 golden gecko pelts. The math worked out--fifty stimpaks are worth almost twice as much as twenty gecko pelts. Suspicious, I asked to look at the crates; when I squirted out a tad of the healing juice on the top stimpak, the acrid iron smell make me wrinkle my nose. These looked like stimpaks, sure, but the only thing inside them was brahmin blood. Caught, the merchant made up some excuses and beat a hasty retreat.

Sulik's still visiting his sister. Maybe after a night's sleep--and a visit to a local spirit the shaman tells me about--he'll be ready to go again, so we can head to Vault City.

[Togath]

So... mole rats... is there some way, any way, to detect them?
I keep jumping every time they attack. I mean, sure they have low damage and hp, but it's the startle factor.:smallredface:
Maybe a mod to make it so they're never hidden underground?

[Triaxx]

Companions can detect them and will shoot at them before they appear sometimes, though that may not help.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

I am not a fan of Nuka-World intro or tutorial. Being promoted boss honcho is usually a Bethesda game's goal of a questline. And it feels so hamfisted being handed the one trick to kill the unkillable Overboss and then promoted to Boss myself. No spoilers but is my doubt justified or should I doubt this move heavily ingame?

Congratulations! You are now the chief figurehead for a highly factionalized and egotistical group of separate raider bands. Now YOU get to be the one who makes unpopular choices since any decision you make cannot please all three factions of your group that you are 'boss' of. Because what can possibly go wrong with three highly armed groups who don't much like each other and will greatly resent anything resembling favoritism waiting for you to make a move?

[Triaxx]

Or walk and talk in the Market for an alternate path.

[Mutazoia]

Well that was intense.
I ran out of ammo with two waves left but had 6 pulse mines that worked wonders.

I threw together my first robot provisioner: An assaultron with sentry chest (for eventual nuclear launchers) called Medusa I. Weapons atm is 1 stealth blade, 1 electrified claw and 1 face laser of course.

The shoulder nukes work wonders....but if you have a bot companion with you that has them...be sure to get your Charisma up to 8 and take that nice little perk that keeps your companions from harming you. 'Cuz those bots just LOVE lobbing those nukes at the things your in melee range with.

[Avilan the Grey]

The shoulder nukes work wonders....but if you have a bot companion with you that has them...be sure to get your Charisma up to 8 and take that nice little perk that keeps your companions from harming you. 'Cuz those bots just LOVE lobbing those nukes at the things your in melee range with.

I'm planning on putting them only on provisioners. All my provisioners will eventually be overpowered robots. Except those at Far Harbor of course.
Anyway, Medusa I seems fairly formidable already, but I will definitely put those on her when I have the perks.

Btw meet Jezebel II, the guardian of Tenpines Bluff. To my great frustration I am yet unable to build gatlin lasers.

https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/768274629066692192/DA11EB13767E86F08F425315EFD848B10D7616CB/


Edit:
Anyone tried the mod that replaces pack brahmin with Eyebots? It seems like a lovely idea.

[Togath]

How many holidays does Diamond City get decorated for? I know of Halloween from having personally encountered it, as well as Christmas from the playthrough I've been watching.

[Avilan the Grey]

No idea, I have never noticed either.

...I downloaded the Eyebot mod. My plan is, for my patroling robots, to all have the max packing rear armor, being their own pack Brahmin.

Edit: not that anyone cares but: Color Scheme for my robots:

Orange - Guard bots and Suppliers (because they are always heavily armed; the color is a warning).
Grey - Bots built for companionship. Codsworth, ADA and one or two more I will build from scratch.
Olive Green - Civilian bots (cheap harvester bots, mainly).

[Togath]

Okay... hmm.
What are the minimum stats needed to access all of the equipment mod perks?
Could it be done with the starting SPECIAL points while also having enough for lockpicking and hacking?

[Triaxx]

4 STR, 7 INT, if I'm not mistaken. Science is past Hacking, so it's all down to 4 for PER for Lockpicking. Should be just fine.

[Togath]

Sounds pretty doable, aye.:smallbiggrin:
I know in theory one could just stick with one type of weapon, but having an array of good stuff seems better in the long run. Both to use multiple ammo types as well as for enemies with different weaknesses and such.
Plus being able to customize weapons and armor rather than relying on lucky drops seems sweet.
Higher int also, if I'm not mistaken, also means more xp, right?

[Triaxx]

It does indeed. Personally I go all the way to 9, but that's because I love using Power Armor, and Nuclear Physicist helps me do that.

[AssaultMage]

Congratulations! You are now the chief figurehead for a highly factionalized and egotistical group of separate raider bands. Now YOU get to be the one who makes unpopular choices since any decision you make cannot please all three factions of your group that you are 'boss' of. Because what can possibly go wrong with three highly armed groups who don't much like each other and will greatly resent anything resembling favoritism waiting for you to make a move?

Now that you put it that way, this sounds almost like the exact gist of the main storyline... I feel betrayed!!

[Togath]

Anyone know of mods to remove the timers and risk of damage to settlements from Minutemen quests?
I'd like to do the chain because [more stuff to do!] but I don't like those risks of having stuff I've built damaged or failing quests for not moving fast(or at least, it sounds kind of punishing compared to other factions).

Also, moral pros and cons of factions?
So far the Minutemen and Railroad seem the most "good", with the Brotherhood disliking synths and the spread of technology, and the institute kidnapping people and being against free synths.
Am I understanding the factions right?

[Triaxx]

No idea, though personally I haven't found the time limit's too onerous. At worst you have to wait for the mission to come around again.

Yeah, that seems to be about the gist, though I not that the BoS seems to have become very Enclave like.

[Alex Knight]

The Insstitute is "Modern Vault-Tec", with all that implies. So no, they aren't good people.

[factotum]

Also, moral pros and cons of factions?
So far the Minutemen and Railroad seem the most "good", with the Brotherhood disliking synths and the spread of technology, and the institute kidnapping people and being against free synths.
Am I understanding the factions right?

Minutemen are the only truly altruistic faction, IMHO. There's a critical black mark against the Railroad, which is that they believe the only way to save a synth is to wipe their personality and replace it with another one. To my mind, that means they're treating them just as much as sub-human machines as the Institute do, since they believe that completely destroying a synth's personality and replacing it with another one is A-OK. As far as I'm concerned this is no different to killing the original synth.

[Spore]

Honestly the Brotherhood makes the most sense in character. Ghouls should frenzy sooner or later. Sentient ghouls are just a ticking time bomb. Synths are uncontrollable and much like the dilemma in the most recent Deus Ex games they might just have a kill switch that prompts them to go hostile. Super Mutants too are hardly agreeable. Most of them are destructive brutes. If their leadership would be united in a goal to follow with the found technology - rather than hoarding it and not agreeing on any course of action besides arming themselves to the teeth.

[Togath]

Daaang. Yeah, that's a pretty big black mark.


Honestly the Brotherhood makes the most sense in character. Ghouls should frenzy sooner or later. Sentient ghouls are just a ticking time bomb. Synths are uncontrollable and much like the dilemma in the most recent Deus Ex games they might just have a kill switch that prompts them to go hostile. Super Mutants too are hardly agreeable. Most of them are destructive brutes. If their leadership would be united in a goal to follow with the found technology - rather than hoarding it and not agreeing on any course of action besides arming themselves to the teeth.

I think I get what you mean. Like, they have potentially noble base goals, but using all the tech to arm themselves to an absurd level and crush their foes... puts them in a rather odd spot.

[Triaxx]

Yeah, but the Railroad is at least giving them a chance and preventing people from finding out and being unduly prejudiced against them.

The Institute are nothing but very shiny Slavers.

[The_Jackal]

I think I get what you mean. Like, they have potentially noble base goals, but using all the tech to arm themselves to an absurd level and crush their foes... puts them in a rather odd spot.

What would you have the Brotherhood do? Let their soldiers die for lack of equipment? Or just equip them enough to give the super mutants a sporting chance? Being stronger than your enemies is what militaries do.

[Togath]

What would you have the Brotherhood do? Let their soldiers die for lack of equipment? Or just equip them enough to give the super mutants a sporting chance? Being stronger than your enemies is what militaries do.

Well, letting other people trying to survive in the wasteland have the protection too would be nice.

[The_Jackal]

IIRC, the BoS and the Minutemen are compatible factions. They destroy enemies they deem to be a threat, or seize technology that is a threat in and of itself.

[factotum]

Yeah, but the Railroad is at least giving them a chance and preventing people from finding out and being unduly prejudiced against them.

The Institute are nothing but very shiny Slavers.

So you'd rather be a free dead man than a living slave? Because that's the difference between the Institute and the Railroad--the former just enslave you, the latter will destroy your personality, your memories, everything that makes you *you* and send a completely different person who happens to have your face and body out into the world.

As for synths going out of control--they did that *once* (the "Broken Mask" incident of 2229) when a prototype synth sent into Diamond City went berserk and killed a number of people. There is no other incident where that happens, as far as I know. Acadia in Far Harbor shows that synths with their original personalities can live free, even if the guy running the show is dodgy as heck.

[Balmas]

So you'd rather be a free dead man than a living slave? Because that's the difference between the Institute and the Railroad--the former just enslave you, the latter will destroy your personality, your memories, everything that makes you *you* and send a completely different person who happens to have your face and body out into the world.

Well, I mean, the Institute does that too. You see Coursers threatening servants with resets. You carry one out yourself at Libertalia in order to get into the Institute's good graces. If you give Mama Murphy her drugs, you can even give a courser a reset in Greenetech Genetics.

Don't get me wrong. What the Railroad does is horrifying, almost tantamount to murder. But A) it's only offered, not forced, and B) if Harkness and Gabriel are any evidence, it's reversible. There is no high-ground the Institute can claim here; they enslave AND mind-wipe synths.

[Avilan the Grey]

Agreed. The Institute is simply laughably in it's Dr Mengele approach to Evil.

Different subject: wow, your robot provisioners must have a hell of a hidden health bonus.
My rudimentary Mini Sentry that goes between the Boathouse and Mechanist Lair took a suicider to the face and laughed it off.

[Mutazoia]

So you'd rather be a free dead man than a living slave? Because that's the difference between the Institute and the Railroad--the former just enslave you, the latter will destroy your personality, your memories, everything that makes you *you* and send a completely different person who happens to have your face and body out into the world.

"It is better to be a live dog, than a dead lion."

[Triaxx]

It's not necessarily that the Railroad are good, as much as they're less evil. They want to help, whether or not they're doing it the right way is less sure.

The Institute on the other hand has ostensibly written off the surface, and yet, they continue to kidnap and replace people with Synth's, causing the population to continue to hate and fear them and ultimately leading to their own demise.

The thing about Broken Mask and Coursers, is that the Commonwealth has no examples of good Synth's, outside of Nick. So they are rightfully wary of what they perceive to be the monsters in the dark. Add in University Point, and you have an absolute case for fear.

The Institute bill themselves as Humanities last, best hope, but only the parts of humanity that serve their interests. Add in the fact that they kept releasing Super Mutants into the wild long after learning they couldn't not make them.

[Mutazoia]

It's not necessarily that the Railroad are good, as much as they're less evil. They want to help, whether or not they're doing it the right way is less sure.

The Institute on the other hand has ostensibly written off the surface, and yet, they continue to kidnap and replace people with Synth's, causing the population to continue to hate and fear them and ultimately leading to their own demise.

The thing about Broken Mask and Coursers, is that the Commonwealth has no examples of good Synth's, outside of Nick. So they are rightfully wary of what they perceive to be the monsters in the dark. Add in University Point, and you have an absolute case for fear.

The Institute bill themselves as Humanities last, best hope, but only the parts of humanity that serve their interests. Add in the fact that they kept releasing Super Mutants into the wild long after learning they couldn't not make them.

I've said this before: The big problem with the institute is that they have on coherent plan. Their goals and methods change with every new Director. If they had one, clear mission statement, and every Director worked toward that one goal, they would be more of a force to be reckoned with. But, instead, they flop around like a fish out of water, for the most part. Sure, they have synths operating on the surface, and they still replace people from time to time, but that seems to be more of a "gathering resources and information" play than anything else. Mayor Quimby is a Synth, and his sole purpose for existance seems to be to control the flow of information in Diamond City (Piper) and report anything of note back to the institute. And not much else.

[factotum]

Which is a shame, really--if the Institute were actually competent the fear and loathing the Commonwealth as a whole has for them would make a lot more sense.

[Spore]

Which is a shame, really--if the Institute were actually competent the fear and loathing the Commonwealth as a whole has for them would make a lot more sense.

You guys have really missed the point the game's writers are trying to make with the Institute? It is obvious. What does the Institute do? Science. What do they have not? A goal.

Your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn’t stop to think if they should.
-Jurrasic Park

While both Fallout and Jurrasic Park are not philosophical milestones they tend to convey said morality issue with science. The entire narrative goal of the organisation is to show how misguided science can become without a purpose. Individual members try and make reasons up, others flee, some liberate the Synth, some enslave them.

The Director is the one institution (pardon the wordplay) that keeps the Institute from tearing itself apart. That much should be clear when you partake in their story and join that board meeting of the heads of research. People might not agree on the goals of the overseer but this being pretty much the only known lab where you can research freely (I feel BoS and Enclave facilities don't count) they don't have a choice.

Have real world analogies for once: The MIT is a pretty important research site for technological advancement, as is Silicone Valley for IT. Both don't invoke fear because research is not moral or amoral but the application. Using satellite technology for mobile phones is useful. But you can use telecommunication for all sorts of things. The FEV labs were shut down (as their intent was sinister) but Synths? Or the biolabs trying to create durable flora for the surface? Or if we leave the Institute for a bit, the crop research of Vault 81 after shutting down Vault-Tec's experiments?

It should be clear that all factions try to show you about a popular philosophical quality. The Minutemen show altruism, the Railroad talks about free will the Institute is about research and application while the Brotherhood is also about that.

If anything the Institute embodies everything the Brotherhood tries to correct.

[Avilan the Grey]

Which is a shame, really--if the Institute were actually competent the fear and loathing the Commonwealth as a whole has for them would make a lot more sense.

So you're saying that even though they kidnap people, replace them with dopplegangers, and turn innocent farmers into Supermutants for Lulz, as well as wiping out entire settlements to plunder them for parts... Oh and kill anyone that tries to unify the Commonwealth... They should not be feared because they "have no plan"?

They are basically Evil Incarnate, but it doesn't matter because...?

[Balmas]

So you're saying that even though they kidnap people, replace them with dopplegangers, and turn innocent farmers into Supermutants for Lulz, as well as wiping out entire settlements to plunder them for parts... Oh and kill anyone that tries to unify the Commonwealth... They should not be feared because they "have no plan"?

They are basically Evil Incarnate, but it doesn't matter because...?

Lemme draw you a comparison. Imagine a street gang, right? Doing crime things--busting up shops and people, destroying businesses, shoplifting and stealing. But they're just doing it for fun and pocket change, there's no pattern to it, and no overarching goal. Often, criminals work against each other thanks to poor coordination.

Now imagine that same gang, but with leadership. Now it's organized crime. The actions taken are done in order to destabilize the area, to make sure that the police have no power, that the gang is the one people turn to when things need to get done. They're strong, they work together, their actions are coordinated for maximum effect.

Which gang is scarier? The disjointed group of criminals, or the organized mob?

It's the same way with the Institute. Right now, their operations are disjointed, scattered, working at cross purposes. Their actions are evil, yeah, but hardly organized. They're only threatening because there's no organized competing faction until the Brotherhood arrives. They're nothing compared to what they might be with some actual organization. Instead of sporadically replacing farmers, they could seize control of the region.

[Mando Knight]

Well, letting other people trying to survive in the wasteland have the protection too would be nice.
They do... kind of. Power armor, mini-nukes, laser guns, and giant robots are expensive and difficult to maintain, and can offer an extreme power multiplier (even the scavenged trash heap plating used by Raiders lucky enough to stumble on a Power Armor frame is stronger than the heaviest non-powered armor in FO4). The (East Coast) Brotherhood offers that protection as a service to supply caravans (along with backing Project Purity, an important part of securing control of the Capital Wasteland) and those who need to get a little more hands-on can sign up themselves.

Also, once the Brotherhood arrives in force, Vertibird raids on Super Mutants

IIRC, the BoS and the Minutemen are compatible factions. They destroy enemies they deem to be a threat, or seize technology that is a threat in and of itself.
Every joinable faction can be compatible with the Minutemen since you become their leader in a very short order. The only exception is the Nuka-World Raiders, who are diametrically opposed to them (and basically serve as an alternate settler faction if you hate Preston).

If anything the Institute embodies everything the Brotherhood tries to correct.

Elder Maxson basically says as much when you first arrive on the Prydwen. The Institute is basically just another remnant of the horrifyingly unethical Pre-War scientific community (see also: Vault-Tec, West Tek, and Big MT, all responsible for creating abominations "for SCIENCE!"). The Brotherhood response isn't perfect either (it's rather unflinchingly dogmatic, which leads to the conflict with the Railroad as well as the rest of the Commonwealth's fear that they might be next), but their assessment of the problem is mostly correct.

[Triaxx]

So... Kill it with Nuclear Fire before it lays eggs?

Honestly, if the plan was indeed to seize control, and use Synth's to improve lives, or even assert control and deal with Raiders but it's not. It's to use the Commonwealth as a breeding farm for test subjects, and bury their heads further and further in the sand.

And the only reason FEV was shut down is because Virgil destroyed the place. His notes clearly have him explain they were continuing long past the point they'd learned it was a dead end.

[Alex Knight]

I'll say it again, the Institute could be relabeled "Vault-Tec" and nothing about its operations would need to change. Look at the history of the various Vaults. Then look at the experiments the Institute carries out on the surface. What's the difference?

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Now that you put it that way, this sounds almost like the exact gist of the main storyline... I feel betrayed!!

Just keep progressing down the main storyline, you'll get there :smallbiggrin:

[Avilan the Grey]

My plan for provisioners is to Map them in such a way, even if they are redundant. that they will cover most main roads. I also prioritize armament depending on location and distance. So the one that goes from Abernathy farm is just a Mr Handy based one. The one from Red Rocket is just a protectron base. But longer distances and more dangerous locations? Bring out the heavy duty stuff.

[Triaxx]

Give the one to Abernathy a Melee and Automatic weapon. Lot's of dogs seem to spawn there and it takes forever to get rid of them with just melee or just guns.

[Avilan the Grey]

Give the one to Abernathy a Melee and Automatic weapon. Lot's of dogs seem to spawn there and it takes forever to get rid of them with just melee or just guns.

Ballsy, as she is named is a Mr Handy base with one eye, assaultron arms with stealth blade and optimized for bleeding damage. No tentacles.
Also... dogs? 99% of the time it's Gunners for me, and if not it's mutants. Once it was dual rad scorpions.

[Spore]

So... Kill it with Nuclear Fire before it lays eggs?

Which brings up the weird point that the Brotherhood knows atomic weapons destroyed ALL of civizilation but use them anyway? Yeah, nice safekeeping of technology there, Maxson.


And the only reason FEV was shut down is because Virgil destroyed the place. His notes clearly have him explain they were continuing long past the point they'd learned it was a dead end.

Did he destroy any material so that continuing FEV experiments was unfeasible? Or did Shaun shut down the research for good?


Elder Maxson basically says as much when you first arrive on the Prydwen. The Institute is basically just another remnant of the horrifyingly unethical Pre-War scientific community (see also: Vault-Tec, West Tek, and Big MT, all responsible for creating abominations "for SCIENCE!"). The Brotherhood response isn't perfect either (it's rather unflinchingly dogmatic, which leads to the conflict with the Railroad as well as the rest of the Commonwealth's fear that they might be next), but their assessment of the problem is mostly correct.

Yeah, still the player character is or can be the scope of sanity in this twisted dilemma. Or could've been since siding with the Institute is basically the Genocide ending of Fallout 4.

[factotum]

Which brings up the weird point that the Brotherhood knows atomic weapons destroyed ALL of civizilation but use them anyway? Yeah, nice safekeeping of technology there, Maxson.

That's entirely in character for the Brotherhood--technology is only bad if it's in somebody else's hands, so long as the BoS control it everything's good.

[Spore]

That's entirely in character for the Brotherhood--technology is only bad if it's in somebody else's hands, so long as the BoS control it everything's good.

Yeah not just boys keeping all the cool stuff to themselves and yelling: "No, give that to me. You're gonna break it anyway."

Goodness gracious, now I have a playground argument in my mind. The bully Maxxie steals everyone's techy toys. The nerdy Shaun keeps to himself, pulling wings from insects and trying to program his LEGO Technic robot to respond to button presses. Little Preston always pesters Mom to intervene while Little Desdemona - her parents are English majors - explains to her friends how her dolly has to have almost the same rights as a real human.

It's hilarious and I sadly lack the artistic talent to frame that. It reminds me of Muppet Babies somehow...

[VoxRationis]

I've said this before: The big problem with the institute is that they have on coherent plan. Their goals and methods change with every new Director. If they had one, clear mission statement, and every Director worked toward that one goal, they would be more of a force to be reckoned with. But, instead, they flop around like a fish out of water, for the most part. Sure, they have synths operating on the surface, and they still replace people from time to time, but that seems to be more of a "gathering resources and information" play than anything else. Mayor Quimby is a Synth, and his sole purpose for existance seems to be to control the flow of information in Diamond City (Piper) and report anything of note back to the institute. And not much else.

Their coherent plan is what it has always been: they conduct research. The Institute is a research institution from before the war. Their only purpose has ever been to conduct research. All that other stuff is supporting their grand goal of conducting research. That's why they aren't doing anything major with their synth infiltrators: the infiltrators are already doing what the Institute needs of them, which is to provide information and enough disruption that the Institute can prevent coherent opposition from forming. If the Enclave had synths, they would do something more with Quimby, but that's the difference between the two organizations: the Enclave furthers science in order to gain political domination, while the Institute achieves political control in order to further science.

[Avilan the Grey]

Their coherent plan is what it has always been: they conduct research. The Institute is a research institution from before the war. Their only purpose has ever been to conduct research. All that other stuff is supporting their grand goal of conducting research. That's why they aren't doing anything major with their synth infiltrators: the infiltrators are already doing what the Institute needs of them, which is to provide information and enough disruption that the Institute can prevent coherent opposition from forming. If the Enclave had synths, they would do something more with Quimby, but that's the difference between the two organizations: the Enclave furthers science in order to gain political domination, while the Institute achieves political control in order to further science.

All this can be summarized in two words:

For Science!

[LibraryOgre]

I'll say it again, the Institute could be relabeled "Vault-Tec" and nothing about its operations would need to change. Look at the history of the various Vaults. Then look at the experiments the Institute carries out on the surface. What's the difference?

In a way, that would be cooler. Descendants of the actual Vault-Tec scientists, invovled in the experiments? It would certainly play oddly for the Sole Survivor... On the one hand, Vault Tec saved your life. On the other hand, the Institute killed your spouse and stole most of your son's life from you.

[Spore]

Well, Vault 111's experiments are certainly lacking in that sinister twist most Vault-Tec experiments have. It is really a thing that struck me as odd and not very "fallout-like" in FO 4. Vault-Tec and Vaults are not the focus of the game

[Triaxx]

Vault-Tec has never been the primary focus of Fallout. Indeed though some of it's best moments have come when people said No! to the experiments. 81, 75, 11, although 11 was a secret test of character that they all failed.

[Togath]

Well, Vault 111's experiments are certainly lacking in that sinister twist most Vault-Tec experiments have. It is really a thing that struck me as odd and not very "fallout-like" in FO 4. Vault-Tec and Vaults are not the focus of the game

Admittedly, the frozen specimens were never intended to ever be revived(and were seemingly expected to eventually all die).

[Triaxx]

I thought they were and the idea was direct transplantation.

Wild theory: Vault-Tec started the war as an ultimate test. Since they knew when it would start, it ensured maximum number of test subjects.

[Togath]

Iirc, that's actually one of the common theories. That or the Zetans having helped prod it to starting.

[Mutazoia]

Admittedly, the frozen specimens were never intended to ever be revived(and were seemingly expected to eventually all die).

The idea behind 111 was to see how people would react to being put in cryo-stasis with out their knowledge....so we can presume that they were intended to be thawed at some point. The revolt by the vault staff threw a big monkey wrench into the works, and the residents were never thawed as planned.

[Mando Knight]

The idea behind 111 was to see how people would react to being put in cryo-stasis with out their knowledge....so we can presume that they were intended to be thawed at some point. The revolt by the vault staff threw a big monkey wrench into the works, and the residents were never thawed as planned.

The staff in the vault actually weren't in charge of the thawing at all, they were just there for the short term. Vault-Tec itself was supposed to handle 111 remotely from there, but the bombs dropped a little differently than the mad scientists expected.


Well, Vault 111's experiments are certainly lacking in that sinister twist most Vault-Tec experiments have. It is really a thing that struck me as odd and not very "fallout-like" in FO 4. Vault-Tec and Vaults are not the focus of the game
The Vaults aren't the focus of New Vegas at all, and the "wacky experiments" purpose of the Vault system wasn't explicitly revealed until the end of Fallout 2.

Interestingly, FO4 also has the most Vaults once you install the DLC, at 7 (NV and 3 have 6 each, though NV also has non-Vault-Tec vaults in both the base game and Dead Money). The games with the fewest are the first two, and FO1's Vault experiments seem totally mundane compared to 3's (12 has a faulty door, 13 was supposed to stay locked for 200 years, 15 had an adversarially multicultural dweller makeup; 112 has the VR loungers of eternal life, 108 is Gary, 101 is 13 taken to the extreme) while FO2 recycles two of 1's Vaults while also introducing the first of two known control Vaults.

[Balmas]

Fallout 2 #9: The Road to Vault City (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vymoVHlDv3c)

We'd spent a few days with the Umbra Tribe before Sulik was finally ready to head out again. Apart from one surly guard, they were pleasant folks who only needed a few easy chores done. We put a ghost to rest--my second exorcismsince leaving Arroyo, now that I think of it--and gathered firewood for a woman. Finally, Sulik sidled up to me, commented that the village had begun to feel small, and that he and Grampy Bone were ready to move out.

Vic had said that he got his Vault canteens from Vault City, far away to the East. After grilling the rotund trader a bit more, I felt pretty confident that we could get there with a minimum of fuss.

Minimum of fuss translated to a few highwayman that were easily gunned down, some geckos that we ran from to save ammo, and a small family. Sulik yelped when, after machine gunning the mantises that had bothered the family, I turned my barrel on the family as well. I'm trying not to let the guilt get to me; I just murdered five people because I wanted the ammo from their SMGs, and the caps from the guns themselves.

Am I a bad person?

We were just outside of Vault City when the slavers hit. They jumped us, guns raised. Before we could even put our hands up, though, two of them fell, shredded by a hail of assault-rifle fire. Eight men, all well-armed and wearing combat armor, mercilessly tore them to pieces. I could only worry that they'd already heard about my crime, and nervously unload my SMG into the slavers. I didn't have to worry, though; they swung their guns up, and told me that we were almost there.

I've decided to stay the night outside of Vault City's walls. Something about this place feels off.

[Avilan the Grey]

This time most of my settlements won't be something to write home about, at least not design wise. Instead of walls I secure everthing with turrets on towers, and an occasional robot.
Sanctuary is still mainly only the two "main" houses; no need to spread out further except a strongpoint by my Purified Water "factory" by the river.

[DigoDragon]

It's the same way with the Institute. Right now, their operations are disjointed, scattered, working at cross purposes. Their actions are evil, yeah, but hardly organized. They're only threatening because there's no organized competing faction until the Brotherhood arrives. They're nothing compared to what they might be with some actual organization. Instead of sporadically replacing farmers, they could seize control of the region.

What the Institute needs is a figure like the Master, or Caesar. Someone with the conviction to organize a robot army effectively and shoot you in the head if you get in their way. Father... didn't seem to have that kind of personality to make it work.



In a way, that would be cooler. Descendants of the actual Vault-Tec scientists, invovled in the experiments? It would certainly play oddly for the Sole Survivor... On the one hand, Vault Tec saved your life. On the other hand, the Institute killed your spouse and stole most of your son's life from you.

That would tie the beginning game much better to the main story arc. As well as at least one NPC you meet later on. ;)



Iirc, that's actually one of the common theories. That or the Zetans having helped prod it to starting.

Yeah... Mothership Zeta was cute and amusing as a 50s alien abduction sidequest, but I dunno that I'd invest into them prodding the war.

[Avilan the Grey]

BALROG II heading into Boston as Supply Line Bot from the Boathouse to Hangman\s Alley.
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/768274937535789063/8CB5C8EC180CF4368BFB61C4141100DD82EFBDF7/

Question: Is the AI more aggressive on Assaultrons than on ADA? I am thinking of custom-building an Assaultron follower for me to bring to known tough fights. ADA does not seem to be as aggressive as the supply line Assaultrons I have.

Edit: question II: How to get the Bunker Hill settlement?

Edit: I have given up on Sentry legs. Never on followers, ever, but that's not news. The thing is that even on provisioners they lead to A) VERRRY slow motion and B) Utter STUPIDITY. I had Patton II stuck against a lightpost on an empty street because he couldn't handle his awesome legs. I put Robobrain tracks on him, and he is super fast and navigates anything.

[factotum]

Edit: question II: How to get the Bunker Hill settlement?


You have to complete the quest "The Battle of Bunker Hill", which is partway through the Institute questline--so make sure you don't get kicked out of the place before you do that mission!

[Spore]

Question: Is the AI more aggressive on Assaultrons than on ADA? I am thinking of custom-building an Assaultron follower for me to bring to known tough fights. ADA does not seem to be as aggressive as the supply line Assaultrons I have.


A quick search here: http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Ada and http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Assaultron#Assaultron

says no and yes. Agressive is http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Gamebryo_AI_attributes#Aggression

Ada is aggressive as is the standard Assaultron. Higher Assaultron enemies are VERY aggressive and kill innocent bystanders too.

[Togath]

Hmm...
What stats seem like the most worth potentially bumping to a base of 12?(via You're SPECIAL + bobblehead)
Agility or Luck maybe?

[Spore]

I'd say Luck (for crit builds), Agility for stealth/VATS builds and Endurance for anyone else.

[Triaxx]

Luck seems to reach a point where it doesn't speed the Crit rate at all. I don't know what the cut off is.

Personally, I'd stick with Agility and endurance. That boosts AP and slows use, and let's you sprint for longer.

[Psyren]

Quick question - I like sci-fi games where you can do a little something besides just fire a gun. Whether it's Mass Effect-style biotics and tech powers, Deus Ex style cloaking/remote-hacking/concussive arm-blasts, many of the abilities in the Borderlands games etc., I like a little paranormal activity to go with my gunplay. I've never played a Fallout game - do they give your protagonist any powers along those lines?

[LibraryOgre]

Quick question - I like sci-fi games where you can do a little something besides just fire a gun. Whether it's Mass Effect-style biotics and tech powers, Deus Ex style cloaking/remote-hacking/concussive arm-blasts, many of the abilities in the Borderlands games etc., I like a little paranormal activity to go with my gunplay. I've never played a Fallout game - do they give your protagonist any powers along those lines?

No. You have variations on "I can beat on things", but nothing paranormal or even particularly higher tech than "different kind of gun."

[Balmas]

Yeah, afraid not. Probably the best you get there is the ability to dance on land mines, and even that is phrased in terms of your ability to avoid triggering proximity sensors via being good at sneaking.

[Mando Knight]

Quick question - I like sci-fi games where you can do a little something besides just fire a gun. Whether it's Mass Effect-style biotics and tech powers, Deus Ex style cloaking/remote-hacking/concussive arm-blasts, many of the abilities in the Borderlands games etc., I like a little paranormal activity to go with my gunplay. I've never played a Fallout game - do they give your protagonist any powers along those lines?

No Fallout game so far has given the player paranormal abilities, although all of them support rudimentary stealth gameplay and a consumable invisibility potion stealth device.

The main "not gunplay" features available to players in Fallout 4 are the intimidation perks (force enemies to back down and maybe even turn on their own allies) and Automatron (turn your dapper British robot butler into a flying harbinger of laser-y death).

[Triaxx]

Can't help but wave the Mod For That flag.

A couple actually, one recent one that makes you into a mutant X-Men style, and an older one to give Skyrim Dragon Shouts. Those are for Fallout 4

On the other hand, Fallout has always had some powers like that but subtle. For example, I've found a character build in Fallout 3 that basically stays radiated, and then regenerates completely if they aren't killed outright.

Fallout New Vegas with Project Nevada and it's Cybernetics expansion gives you the ability to throw fireballs like Mario, or more usefully, EMP's to fight robots. Turn invisible, or scan enemies to learn their health. Just useful, simple powers but very subtle mostly.

[Psyren]

Thanks all. A bit disappointing but I'll still play (that just moved it down my backlog a bit.) And I'll look into some of those mods as well.

[NeoVid]

Could just say the teleportation from the Blitz perk is actually teleportation... there's supernatural elements in several of the Fallouts, but not ones the player can take by default.

And I wouldn't recommend FO4 as someone's first Fallout game. It can be stupidly fun and addictive, but hoo boy does it have no idea how to be a Fallout RPG.

[Psyren]

Well, given that I ALSO have no idea what it takes to be a Fallout RPG, that may be to my advantage :smalltongue:

[Avilan the Grey]

Could just say the teleportation from the Blitz perk is actually teleportation... there's supernatural elements in several of the Fallouts, but not ones the player can take by default.

And I wouldn't recommend FO4 as someone's first Fallout game. It can be stupidly fun and addictive, but hoo boy does it have no idea how to be a Fallout RPG.

Personally I consider it not only a fallout game but the best one in the series.

[Mutazoia]

BALROG II heading into Boston as Supply Line Bot from the Boathouse to Hangman\s Alley.
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/768274937535789063/8CB5C8EC180CF4368BFB61C4141100DD82EFBDF7/

Question: Is the AI more aggressive on Assaultrons than on ADA? I am thinking of custom-building an Assaultron follower for me to bring to known tough fights. ADA does not seem to be as aggressive as the supply line Assaultrons I have.

Edit: question II: How to get the Bunker Hill settlement?

Edit: I have given up on Sentry legs. Never on followers, ever, but that's not news. The thing is that even on provisioners they lead to A) VERRRY slow motion and B) Utter STUPIDITY. I had Patton II stuck against a lightpost on an empty street because he couldn't handle his awesome legs. I put Robobrain tracks on him, and he is super fast and navigates anything.

I find Ada is about as aggressive as your flesh and blood companions. A normal, scratch built bot, seems to be more aggressive, which is not always a good thing (Hence my earlier suggestion to boost Chr. up to 8 and get 1 rank of Influential, to keep your bot from nuking you along with the enemy).

Robobrain tracks are the way to go, hands down. Faster than 2 legs, more mobile than 4. Add on a sentry torso with mortars (or nukes if you're feeling lucky (punk)) and either a robobrain head (for the mesmer attack) or the Assultron laser head. An explosive gatling laser and the stealth blade for arm weapons and a tesla coil torso mod...throw on the armor that deals poison damage and your good to go every time.

As for supply routes, I tend to pick the shortest route available. So I have a line from Starlight to the Boathouse, or Starlight to Greygarden, to Oberland, to Hangman's Alley. The longer the route, the more chances there are for things to get mucked up. On a side note, yesterday I surprised a gang of Rust Devils as they started to attack one of my supply bots. Two-shot Gauss Rifle to the face for everybody!

[Avilan the Grey]

Thanks. I suspected as much. Follower Codename Katana will be created momentary!
I am not really interested in mortars for followers, only for supply bots.
I can't do sentry torsos yet. However on a heavy bot like that I would go hammer-saw instead of stealth blade because of stagger and bleed combo.

Edit: I'm deliberately roleplaying as strongly preferring energy weapons. Also yes. I will upgrade BALROG II so BALROG iii will have threads.

[Togath]

Can't help but wave the Mod For That flag.

A couple actually, one recent one that makes you into a mutant X-Men style, and an older one to give Skyrim Dragon Shouts. Those are for Fallout 4

On the other hand, Fallout has always had some powers like that but subtle. For example, I've found a character build in Fallout 3 that basically stays radiated, and then regenerates completely if they aren't killed outright.

Fallout New Vegas with Project Nevada and it's Cybernetics expansion gives you the ability to throw fireballs like Mario, or more usefully, EMP's to fight robots. Turn invisible, or scan enemies to learn their health. Just useful, simple powers but very subtle mostly.

Happen to know the names of those two Fallout 4 mods?(I'm also sort of curious now if there's any bow and arrow mods... I kind of want to rp as "inexplicably the dovakiin")

[Spore]

I've never played a Fallout game - do they give your protagonist any powers along those lines?

I mean, some perks add REALLY weird functions to your character. Fallout 4 allows for Nightvision, Life Regeneration (while irradiated, while in the sun, and just because), Immunity to Radiation, Underwater Breathing, Immunity to crippled Limbs, you can upgrade your dog companion with several perks and armor pieces from mere trusty (and invincible) German shepherd to your main source of damage, aforementioned Blitz perk gets you teleport, a mysterious stranger follows you and kills your enemies sometimes. And as always you can science pretty hard that it looks like magic to the outside. Animal Friendship is a lame power but still one you can get.

[Mutazoia]

Thanks. I suspected as much. Follower Codename Katana will be created momentary!
I am not really interested in mortars for followers, only for supply bots.
I can't do sentry torsos yet. However on a heavy bot like that I would go hammer-saw instead of stealth blade because of stagger and bleed combo.

Edit: I'm deliberately roleplaying as strongly preferring energy weapons. Also yes. I will upgrade BALROG II so BALROG iii will have threads.

The mortars are nice if you are playing a range type...using rifles more than pistols or melee combat, since they can take down a swarm of charging ghouls pretty quickly, before they can teleport that last couple of feet and hit you. Actually it works well with any swarming enemy...ghouls, mole rats, rad spiders, the baby sand worms and pesky flys in nuka world...

[Togath]

There are also some hints of the supernatural in Fallout, like with mama Murphy's "wait a second, she actually is accurate in her predictions" special sight thing.

[Spore]

Happen to know the names of those two Fallout 4 mods?(I'm also sort of curious now if there's any bow and arrow mods... I kind of want to rp as "inexplicably the dovakiin")

You should antagonize the Brotherhood then. Their giant fire spewing robot with the world devastating nuclear powers and their base upon the clouds - just like Sovngarde - must be brought down. For Preston and citizens of Whiterun Sanctuary...

[Triaxx]

The Lone Dovahkiin (http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/14800) is the Dragonborn mod, but I can't remember the name of the other one, or find it via description search.

[BladeofObliviom]

Oh, there's been supernatural stuff in Fallout since the beginning. While [Mama Murphy] is the most recent example (as Togath pointed out), Psychic powers have been an uncommon facet of the setting since the very first game, though they've never been available to the player*.

*Well, unless you count the Animal Friend perk, since developing mind powers to dominate animals is a valid interpretation of what's going on there.


The most powerful Psyker seen in the series so far was the very first game's Master, who has mutated to the point of more closely resembling some horrid Lovecraftian thing than a human being. While he didn't showcase much of his power ingame, attempting to approach him without appropriate protection results in repeated mindrape, intense enough to do physical damage to the player. Tabitha in New Vegas also claims that he gave her commands telepathically, but she's actually insane so maybe not the best source.

Tabitha: Do you remember the good old days, where the Master ruled over us all?
Rhonda: When his gentle, compelling, and yet oddly insistent voice crawled through your mind, and told you exactly what to do?

(Rhonda is a robot, and is almost certainly repeating something Tabitha told her.)

There are a few other psychic characters in the first Fallout, but they represent failed experiments by The Master and don't actually use any of their powers ingame.


Fallout 2 has Hakunin, who is also probably a Psyker, and like Mama Murphy uses drugs to enhance his powers. At first he seems like a pretty typical tribal shaman, until he starts sending you status updates in your dreams...

New Vegas has The Forecaster, a young boy wearing a psychic nullifier from the first game. You can pay him to take it off and "think about something" for you. He's accurate, though often cryptic.

Fallout Tactics has the Beastlords, an entire faction of mutant Tribals who have mutated (though in the form of a population like that, one might say "evolved") the ability to dominate many types of animals with their will. Fallout Tactics is not strictly canon, but I'm reasonably sure the broad strokes of it still are.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

There's also the Dunwitch Bore and the Tooth of Krelm in FO4 that approach the supernatural. The effects aren't that supernatural (legendary effect on a bladed weapon that just causes it to do more damage), but the area around it... leaves itself open to interpretation.

And that's really mostly how Fallout handles such things. 95% of it is unable to be definitively proven, simply implied. Those few things which are not able to be wholly explained by science can generally be explained by SCIENCE!! or at least might be able to be.

Also don't forget that aliens are canon, who might be involved in screwing around with things as well. Therefore, those things which cannot be adequately explained by human tech can generally be adequately explained by alien tech (such as the mysteries surrounding the Cabot House).

[Mando Knight]

Animal Friendship is a lame power but still one you can get.

When "Animal" means "10 ft long scorpion", "Man-sized angry mutant crab", and "Genetically-engineered dino-monster", it's not exactly a lame power.

[VoxRationis]

I thought that some of those fell under different umbrellas.

[Triaxx]

Let's not forget the hilariously weird stuff from Point Lookout including the Necronomicon you have to haul back to the creepiest building in DC and destroy.

[factotum]

Let's not forget the hilariously weird stuff from Point Lookout including the Necronomicon you have to haul back to the creepiest building in DC and destroy.

The Dunwich Building, named from the same source as the Dunwich Borers in Fallout 4--e.g. H.P. Lovecraft's Cthulhu mythos books (Dunwich being a creepy town in those books).

[Veg Sorbet]

Unless I'm misremembering (haven't played F4 since Skyrim SE came out), technically you have the ability to stop time right off the bat, considering you get the VATS tutorial before you get the friggin' pipboy. :smallamused::smalltongue: (okay, yeah, propably shouldn't count dev. mistakes)

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Unless I'm misremembering (haven't played F4 since Skyrim SE came out), technically you have the ability to stop time right off the bat, considering you get the VATS tutorial before you get the friggin' pipboy. :smallamused::smalltongue: (okay, yeah, propably shouldn't count dev. mistakes)

In FO4, you don't actually stop time so much as slow it down, which is more along the lines of your perception of time slows, kinda like that scene in the RDJ Sherlock Holmes movie.

[Avilan the Grey]

It's easier to make money to buy adhesive from water farms than to grow starch.
Of course you have to remember to plug in the power to the purifiers...

I was wondering for days why I almost had no water to sell...

[Spore]

In FO4, you don't actually stop time so much as slow it down, which is more along the lines of your perception of time slows, kinda like that scene in the RDJ Sherlock Holmes movie.

Even Time Stop in D&D is limited and it is considered one of the greatest feats of arcane magic ever.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Even Time Stop in D&D is limited and it is considered one of the greatest feats of arcane magic ever.

Not really, Foresight is far more powerful. Time Stop is peanuts when it comes to breaking the action economy. Come back when you've discovered infinitely recursive spell matricies.

And that's not actually what is happening at any rate. Time doesn't stop. Objective time doesn't even slow down. All it does is alter the perception of the flow of time from the perspective of the player. You don't really get that many more actions in a given time frame, you just are able to be more efficient about it. So it isn't even a Schism effect, or really even a Haste effect. Call it something like Divine Favor's boost to attack and damage plus something that increases critical threat range.

As far as Blitz? Eh, that's pretty much Elocator's signature move Dimension Spring Attack. Which... isn't really as awesome in practice as it is on paper.

[Triaxx]

Blitz 1 kind of sucks. Blitz 2 is teleportation. Many a True Need had a mad Blitz build that let him teleport up and down and with the bonus damage and the fact that you're considered standing still, you can take advantage of Rooted and Sentinel gear.

[Psyren]

Unless I'm misremembering (haven't played F4 since Skyrim SE came out), technically you have the ability to stop time right off the bat, considering you get the VATS tutorial before you get the friggin' pipboy. :smallamused::smalltongue: (okay, yeah, propably shouldn't count dev. mistakes)

I'm aware of VATS but it's definitely not what I was getting at, that's just a "shoot more better" ability. There's nothing especially supernatural or paranormal about it, you could fluff anybody who's particularly good with a gun as doing something similar. They just spend more time on showing you what's going on behind the scenes.

Stuff like Deus Ex augments, Dishonored abilities or even the suit powers in Crysis are more what I was getting at, but I think I have my answer.

[The_Jackal]

It's easier to make money to buy adhesive from water farms than to grow starch.
Of course you have to remember to plug in the power to the purifiers...

I was wondering for days why I almost had no water to sell...

Seems far easier to just collect some food plants you already need to grow to feed your ungrateful moochers than make regular trips to Diamond City or Covenant to buy adhesive shipments. Plus you get XP for crafing vegetable starch, where as you get nothing in particular for buying and selling things. Still, to each their own.

My approach has been to grow enough food to make vegetable soup for myself, and starch for my crafting, and use the rest of my villagers for scavenging on stations. For one thing, you can actuall scavenge some useful things. Ballistic fiber, screws, fiberglass all seem to show up in reasonable quantities, and you'll never find yourself running out of the basics, either. You need only regularly empty out your workbench into an adjacent container, to keep the salvage cap from cutting off your income. Plus settlers working salvage stations don't require additional defenses, like they would if you grew food with them, and you may as well have them doing something productive. Plus, scavenging stations aren't exclusive with water farms, and are quite cheap to build, only 3 wood and 2 steel, iirc. Finally, if you're a low-charisma character, like mine, you lose a fair amount of value when selling your wares and buying shipments.

[Triaxx]

Vacuum Hopper into Conveyor Storage. Just visit and then leave. Or like me, convert Spectacle Island into a massive food plantation.

[Avilan the Grey]

Seems far easier to just collect some food plants you already need to grow to feed your ungrateful moochers than make regular trips to Diamond City or Covenant to buy adhesive shipments. Plus you get XP for crafing vegetable starch, where as you get nothing in particular for buying and selling things. Still, to each their own.

My approach has been to grow enough food to make vegetable soup for myself, and starch for my crafting, and use the rest of my villagers for scavenging on stations. For one thing, you can actuall scavenge some useful things. Ballistic fiber, screws, fiberglass all seem to show up in reasonable quantities, and you'll never find yourself running out of the basics, either. You need only regularly empty out your workbench into an adjacent container, to keep the salvage cap from cutting off your income. Plus settlers working salvage stations don't require additional defenses, like they would if you grew food with them, and you may as well have them doing something productive. Plus, scavenging stations aren't exclusive with water farms, and are quite cheap to build, only 3 wood and 2 steel, iirc. Finally, if you're a low-charisma character, like mine, you lose a fair amount of value when selling your wares and buying shipments.

Point is, with a semi-large operation going ('m not there yet, I only produce 140 water in Sanctuary and 40 in the boathouse) you earn about 2000 caps a day.

Oh I am reconfiguring Balrog II into Thor I. Blades aren't fun unless you have legs, and legs are not fun on suppliers.

[Triaxx]

Though blades with Hover thrusters are hilarious. Also, the Cryo Jet is criminally under-rated.

[Avilan the Grey]

Though blades with Hover thrusters are hilarious. Also, the Cryo Jet is criminally under-rated.

I have kinda configured my bots according to danger, each with their own gig so far:

Jezebel II - Gatlin laser and flamer. Goes between Greygarden and Sanctuary.
Thor I - Dual tesla guns, tank build sentry head. Goes between Boathouse and Hangman's alley
Sarge II - Dual heavy flamers - tank build sentry head. Goes between Mechanist Lair and Boathouse.
Patton II - Dual Gatling lasers - tank build sentry head. Goes between boathouse and Sanctuary.
Ballsy I - Dual stealth blades - Mr Handy, goes between Abernathy and Sanctuary

Between Hangman's Alley and Oberland Station there is still a human, I will build a robot there soon. Also I need a robot to go between Pines (whatever the name is) and Sanctuary.
Plan is to build another hover and blade build for that one.

[Togath]

So I've been watching a playthrough and... the pacify stuff seems really potent. Sure the chance is random, but it potentially lets you get both extra xp and virtually guarantees a one-hit-kill on the pacified guy.:smallbiggrin:
Also later ranks let you use them as disposable minions/shields.

[Balmas]

You need only regularly empty out your workbench into an adjacent container, to keep the salvage cap from cutting off your income. Plus settlers working salvage stations don't require additional defenses, like they would if you grew food with them, and you may as well have them doing something productive. Plus, scavenging stations aren't exclusive with water farms, and are quite cheap to build, only 3 wood and 2 steel, iirc. Finally, if you're a low-charisma character, like mine, you lose a fair amount of value when selling your wares and buying shipments.

I actually prefer to just use Uncapped Settlement Surplus. (http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/12430/?) It makes it so that your settlements don't have a ridiculous arbitrary cap on how much food, water, and scrap they can store.


So I've been watching a playthrough and... the pacify stuff seems really potent. Sure the chance is random, but it potentially lets you get both extra xp and virtually guarantees a one-hit-kill on the pacified guy.:smallbiggrin:
Also later ranks let you use them as disposable minions/shields.

Eh, I still don't like them. They're too dependent on RNG for my tastes. IF you invest the points and perks in an otherwise useless level of charisma, and IF you're a higher level than the enemy, and IF you're using a gun, and IF you pass the check, then sure, it's fun and useful. But that's too many IF's for me to want to center a build around it. If anything, it's a "Sure, why not" after you've gotten pretty much everything else.

[Spore]

Though blades with Hover thrusters are hilarious. Also, the Cryo Jet is criminally under-rated.

You enjoy killing, don't you?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4h8NmjpiY1M

[Triaxx]

What playthrough?

The fun thing about the Cryojet, is that it's crazy good for slowing enemies, and then you can deal with it with whatever other weapon, either blades or guns or the like. Makes even Deathclaws stupid easy.

[Togath]

Link to the playthrough. (https://youtu.be/N0WFIhn2mR8?list=PLMrpfY5oU1DYQkk5XQ9ehOU46Dbd9U07 S)
I've enjoyed watching it so far, and it seems like it's less "has to be a gun not a plasma/laser weapon" and more "any weapon you can aim works" for the perk chain. The guy's been doing a charisma and stealth run primarily.

[The_Jackal]

I actually prefer to just use Uncapped Settlement Surplus. (http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/12430/?) It makes it so that your settlements don't have a ridiculous arbitrary cap on how much food, water, and scrap they can store.

Yeah, I'm currently doing a clean run, so no mods. I like Triaxx's idea of a vacuum hopper tho. I need to get that working.

One thing I discovered in my current play-through is that it's simply not safe to land vertibird near Hangman's Alley, having the 'bird drop you into a LZ full of angry super-mutants is a death-sentence. So I'm thinking I'm going to relocate my main HQ to the Castle, once I liberate it. Right now, I'm using Starlight Drive-in, which appears to be safe enough.

[NeoVid]

So I've been watching a playthrough and... the pacify stuff seems really potent. Sure the chance is random, but it potentially lets you get both extra xp and virtually guarantees a one-hit-kill on the pacified guy.:smallbiggrin:.

I built around Wasteland Whisperer on my longest playthrough, and it's hilarious once you get the ability to order things to fight for you. "Hey, Super Mutant Suicider, stop chasing me and go give those guys over there a hug." The biggest annoyance I had with it was that the Incite range was half of the Pacify range.

[Triaxx]

That's odd, I always end up dropped at the river side cross roads instead. Cambridge Polymer labs is an excellent nearby drop zone choice. It usually just requires crossing the river.

[Spore]

I built around Wasteland Whisperer on my longest playthrough, and it's hilarious once you get the ability to order things to fight for you. "Hey, Super Mutant Suicider, stop chasing me and go give those guys over there a hug." The biggest annoyance I had with it was that the Incite range was half of the Pacify range.

Well, I know what I'm going to do now for my newest run (another character for the DLCs).

[Avilan the Grey]

Yeah, I'm currently doing a clean run, so no mods. I like Triaxx's idea of a vacuum hopper tho. I need to get that working.

One thing I discovered in my current play-through is that it's simply not safe to land vertibird near Hangman's Alley, having the 'bird drop you into a LZ full of angry super-mutants is a death-sentence. So I'm thinking I'm going to relocate my main HQ to the Castle, once I liberate it. Right now, I'm using Starlight Drive-in, which appears to be safe enough.

I am still focusing mainly on Sanctuary and the Boathouse safehouse.

[Togath]

Hey, does Mr Handy fuel do anything? I heard somewhere it buffs Codsworth's flamethrower?

[Avilan the Grey]

Hey, does Mr Handy fuel do anything? I heard somewhere it buffs Codsworth's flamethrower?

It becomes oil for crafting AFAIK

[Avilan the Grey]

Oh btw speaking of farming or getting money to buy shipments...
Another thing is to take advantage of the loot respawn and go plunder a vault every 7 days. tend to have tons of rare stuff.

[The_Jackal]

Oh btw speaking of farming or getting money to buy shipments...
Another thing is to take advantage of the loot respawn and go plunder a vault every 7 days. tend to have tons of rare stuff.

I've never found it worth my while to plunder a location without the added incentive of a quest for XP, personally. But then I tend to be insanely thorough in my cleaning out of locations, hence my regular use of vertibird signal grenades. Then again, I'm also not a very aggressive builder, my minimalist settlements are designed to keep me in the field as much as is feasible. That said, I really do want to get a vacuum hopper set up in my main settlement, so as to improve my quality of life.

The one thing I'll say in favor of a water purification plant, it's not mutually exclusive with scrap stations or farming. In light of this, what are peoples' designs for turret towers and other planned fortifications? I mostly just perch machine gun turrets on convenient rooftops.

[Avilan the Grey]

I've never found it worth my while to plunder a location without the added incentive of a quest for XP, personally. But then I tend to be insanely thorough in my cleaning out of locations, hence my regular use of vertibird signal grenades. Then again, I'm also not a very aggressive builder, my minimalist settlements are designed to keep me in the field as much as is feasible. That said, I really do want to get a vacuum hopper set up in my main settlement, so as to improve my quality of life.

The one thing I'll say in favor of a water purification plant, it's not mutually exclusive with scrap stations or farming. In light of this, what are peoples' designs for turret towers and other planned fortifications? I mostly just perch machine gun turrets on convenient rooftops.

I do that, plus usually make simple gun towers by using the "floor with stilts" and put four turrets on it. I have also started using a "gatehouse without a gate" version where I connect two of those with one or two floors (like a bridge) across entrance roads and then stick turrets on them.

[Togath]

Hey... does luck, by itself, affect loot at all?
Or do you need perks to improve stuff?

[The_Jackal]

Hey... does luck, by itself, affect loot at all?
Or do you need perks to improve stuff?

Nope, you need the perks.

[Balmas]

The one thing I'll say in favor of a water purification plant, it's not mutually exclusive with scrap stations or farming. In light of this, what are peoples' designs for turret towers and other planned fortifications? I mostly just perch machine gun turrets on convenient rooftops.

That depends on the settlement, but generally it's some variation of wall. Sanctuary has a 3-high concrete wall all the way around. Turrets rest on 1x2 platforms held up with struts.

Other times I just say "Screw it," and build a walled-in 2x2 trap platform where enemies spawn. Of course, it doesn't help if you're not there, but I can pretend that they'll spawn and immediately get impaled.


Oh btw speaking of farming or getting money to buy shipments...
Another thing is to take advantage of the loot respawn and go plunder a vault every 7 days. tend to have tons of rare stuff.

Eh. I'll be honest, it kind of bothers me that locations respawn at all. Every time I come through an area and go, "How nice of the raiders to restock all the cash registers with pre-war money," it's another little immersion-breaking niggle.

I mean, I can understand why they do it. Gotta make sure that players never run out of things to shoot, loot, and retrieve, or else the game would get dull even more quickly.

[Triaxx]

I'm partial to two approaches: Option A) later in the game is curved Concrete walls, with the curved top pieces on the top. Place Heavy Machine Guns up there and put them in a triangle and there's no room for enemies to take cover at the base, because it's not got corners.

Option B) is using the scaffolding from Wasteland Workshop, with a floor, and the gun of my choice on top. It's much cheaper using only steel and wood, plus the turrets. It does make running power easier, but also is more vulnerable, since the power is left hanging out.

I really wish there was more turret variety, without being just nastily over powered.

[Togath]

Hmm... assuming I don't use console commands, does starting with a 10 in a stat cripple my others too much early on?

[factotum]

Hmm... assuming I don't use console commands, does starting with a 10 in a stat cripple my others too much early on?

Depends on what build you're going for. Some builds require heavy investment in a single stat, some you can get away with spreading the points around a bit more. However, you know about the "You're SPECIAL" book in your old house that will boost one of your stats by 1 point, right? Since that's there you can max out a stat at 9 and know you'll be able to top it off when you come out of the Vault.

What you really want to be doing is figuring out how your perk progression fits in, though. Generally I'll only spend a level-up on increasing a stat if I don't have any useful perks to assign at that level, and that can be tricky if the build you're doing has a lot of required perks.

[Togath]

Admittedly, I have been torn between spreading my stats or... well, trying to exploit stuff to get at least one to 11-12(supposedly you can debuff yourself and the use that "You're Special" book to hit a 12)...
...but I'm starting to think a run with fewer/no "exploit one or most stats past cap" things might be more fun. And way less monotonous(looked it up, and a full "six 11s + one 12" build would require waiting until level 44 to get your first non-stat perk).

[Mando Knight]

Depends on what build you're going for. Some builds require heavy investment in a single stat, some you can get away with spreading the points around a bit more. However, you know about the "You're SPECIAL" book in your old house that will boost one of your stats by 1 point, right? Since that's there you can max out a stat at 9 and know you'll be able to top it off when you come out of the Vault.

What you really want to be doing is figuring out how your perk progression fits in, though. Generally I'll only spend a level-up on increasing a stat if I don't have any useful perks to assign at that level, and that can be tricky if the build you're doing has a lot of required perks.

On the other hand, boosting a stat to 12 is only possible by getting it up to 10 before adding the SPECIAL book or the stat's associated Bobblehead.

[tonberrian]

Can you still get the multiple You're SPECIAL glitch working?