Lien == Near-Human (spoiler)

[brionl]

Based on nothing at all other than her shark mount, I now proclaim Lien to be a Water Genasi. They have Water Breathing and a natural 30ft swim speed, so it would make sense for her to have a shark mount, and hang out near the waterfront a lot.

[bluish_wolf]

Which is why she would ride on a shark, forsaking her improved swim ability and stay above the surface of the water, despite the fact she can breathe water. Makes perfect sense.

[RedfortheRogues]

She probably got micheal jackson surgery to turn her skin normal color:smallbiggrin:

[MReav]

Don't water Genasei have penalties that make being a paladin hard?

I'm guessing more a part sea elf...

[LoopyZebra]

Since when does she have to be an aquatic race to have an aquatic mount? Her parents were fishermen. She grew up next to the water and probably spends time there. That's it.

[brionl]

Which is why she would ride on a shark, forsaking her improved swim ability and stay above the surface of the water, despite the fact she can breathe water. Makes perfect sense.

Just like humans ride horses and forsake their natural land speed. Just because she's on top of the water, attacking the octopus that is *also* on top of the water doesn't mean she wouldn't submerge when it's appropriate.

Water Genasi: 30 ft swim speed.
Giant Shark: 60 ft swim speed.

Planes-touched vary a lot in their apperance, from almost elemental to, I dunno, a human with maybe blue hair.

[brionl]

Don't water Genasei have penalties that make being a paladin hard?

I'm guessing more a part sea elf...

+2 Con, -2 Cha. If a cleric, needs to choose a deity that grants access to the water domain. Favored class fighter. Doesn't seem to be anything too restrictive there.

[holywhippet]

Would being a Water Gensai compensate for the fact that she's wearing metal armour? You'd need to be a heck of a good swimmer to swim with that kind of weight and movement restriction.

IMO, a shark is a pretty crappy mount. It's only useful if you get attacked by something actually in the water. And it has to be in seawater for the shark's sake, and it needs to be above the water so that she can breathe.

It would be cool if her mount was a bulette (sp) ie. a lank shark.

[Ithekro]

I could see her has a Sea Spirit Folk, but not much anything else. Aside from human that is.

[Yeril]

Would being a Water Gensai compensate for the fact that she's wearing metal armour? You'd need to be a heck of a good swimmer to swim with that kind of weight and movement restriction.

Accualy going by the shape of her hips shes probaly wearing leather/ chain shirt.

[Krellen]

Would being a Water Gensai compensate for the fact that she's wearing metal armour?
Yes. She has a swim speed. For most purposes, she doesn't need to make Swim checks. When there's some water-based obstacle to overcome, she gets a +8 to her check. A Water Genasi (or any aquatic creature, really) can wear metal armour just fine.

[StickMan]

I don't see it. Main reason is because I don't think Rich would use not SRD info or he would get sued. And I don't think Genasei are SRD.

Second, there realy is no reason to think this, she said her parents are fishermen and You don't have to be aquatic to select a aquatic mount. She spends time on the water so she has a shark over a horse makes sense to me.

[Scarab83]

It's just as feasible that she's a human whose entire life revolves around the sea. Her parents were fishermen, she can wield a spear/gaff better than anyone around, and she just so happened to pick an aquatic creature as her paladin mount since she planned on never being away from the sea.

Not every little interesting bit of flavor has a huge hidden mystery behind it.

[fangthane]

If I were a human with an aquatic mount, I'm sure I could come up with some way (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#bottleofAir) to deal with breathing underwater. And especially if it were something fundamental to the city's defense plan (even if only as implemented by the Sapphire Guard, as opposed to the civic government as such) I'd requisition something more convenient (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#helmofUnderwaterAction) if possible. Of course, not every government has the resources for a 24k magic item, so I'd content myself with something more reasonably priced (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#pearloftheSirines) if necessary. And of course if even that proved too costly, I'm sure there'd be something even cheaper (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#necklaceofAdaptation) which might do the trick, as well as carrying with it some additional benefits.

Not that she can't possibly be a demi-human or near-human... But there's really no need that she be anything else. Not with the range of options that a strong organisation can provide to one of its contingency defenders.

[MReav]

+2 Con, -2 Cha. If a cleric, needs to choose a deity that grants access to the water domain. Favored class fighter. Doesn't seem to be anything too restrictive there.

I guess I was thinking of the 3.0 version, or a different Genasi.

[Daimbert]

It's arguments like these that make me think things would have worked out SO much better if she'd been written to have an Orca (killer whale) as a mount instead of a shark. A shark is a fish, and so has to be underwater to breathe, or at least to breathe properly. All whales are mammals, and so breathe on the SURFACE of the water (they have to surface to breathe). So as long as she keeps the whale wet, she can fight with it on the surface of the water and only submerge for tactical considerations. And killer whales are pretty tough themselves.

[Porthos]

I don't see it. Main reason is because I don't think Rich would use not SRD info or he would get sued. And I don't think Genasei are SRD.

Last time I checked, neither the Eye of Fear and Flame (Book of Vile Darkness), Death Knight (Monster Manual II), nor Huecuva (Fiend Folio) were in the SRD. :smallamused:

[Callista]

Or she could just be a human with a ring of Water Breathing...

[brionl]

But that wouldn't be as interesting. :smalltongue:

Anybody else ever play Teenagers From Outer Space? They had four races, Human, Near Human, Not-Very Near Human, and Real Weirdos.

[Wyvern_55]

Last time I checked, neither the Eye of Fear and Flame (Book of Vile Darkness), Death Knight (Monster Manual II), nor Huecuva (Fiend Folio) were in the SRD. :smallamused:

neither were the beholder, the illithid, the Displacer beasts, quite a lot actually, I doubt very much that this is a concern.

[Chronos]

Fangthane, you forgot about an irridescant spindle Ioun Stone on your list. Though I suspect that if we ever see anyone in Stickworld with an Ioun Stone, the Giant will draw it, because a stone spinning around someone's head is too much fun to not draw it.

[David Argall]

I'll vote for the mundane theory. She's the human daughter of human fishermen and selected a shark because she expected to be on the coast or sea all the time.

The idea that characters have some hidden exotic racial ancestry has a long history, and so far, no successes. Lien looks unlikely to be the first.

[Yoritomo Himeko]

I'll vote for the mundane theory. She's the human daughter of human fishermen and selected a shark because she expected to be on the coast or sea all the time.

The idea that characters have some hidden exotic racial ancestry has a long history, and so far, no successes. Lien looks unlikely to be the first.

I'll have to say I like the "Lien is an ordinary paladin with an aquatic mount" theory the best. She's used to the sea, and she works there, so naturally an aquatic mount would work for her. I don't know what she'd do if she ever had a quest on land, though.

[malakim2099]

If she's anything not human (doubtful), she's probably an aasimar.

Charismatic, paladin, funky hair color... it fits for me. I'm sure a paladin on Lien's level would have a ring of water breathing or something, yes.

[factotum]

-2 Cha would be a penalty for a Paladin, right? Don't they need Cha for all their special abilities?

Anyway, there's absolutely no evidence she's a Water Genasi. Even blue hair doesn't indicate it, because we've seen a number of other Azure City denizens with that feature!

[mockingbyrd7]

If she's anything not human (doubtful), she's probably an aasimar.

Charismatic, paladin, funky hair color... it fits for me. I'm sure a paladin on Lien's level would have a ring of water breathing or something, yes.

Agreed. That said, I still think she's most likely human.

[mockingbyrd7]

-2 Cha would be a penalty for a Paladin, right? Don't they need Cha for all their special abilities?

Anyway, there's absolutely no evidence she's a Water Genasi. Even blue hair doesn't indicate it, because we've seen a number of other Azure City denizens with that feature!

ZOMG! It's all clear now! Hinjo is a water genasi with human tendencies!

[Gez]

Based on nothing at all other than her shark mount, I now proclaim Lien to be a normal Human woman who was raised in a port city, has a job that requires her to wear armor, and thought it would be clever if she could use her job-granted combat pet to get one that could help her when out at sea because, for example, swimming in armor sucks and drowning is not a very cool death.

[Snake-Aes]

if (Lien == Near-Human)
print "Okay...";
else
print "Earth to Dreamer! Earth to Dreamer!";

[Rajhiim]

Dont be so hard on the OP =)

After all... Lien pulled that shark out of a Pokemon ball... So clearly some "laws" are being bent. I mean, come on, like a giant shark would fit in such a small ball? *wink*

If we are going to debate the shark's water breathing, lien's water breathing... why dont we start with the Pokemon ball? :smallsmile:

Truth is - that's not a shark. It's a mechanical shark from the movie Jaws. Lien is actually a Dragon in human form and I am talking utter nonsense. Thank you, drive through.

[factotum]

After all... Lien pulled that shark out of a Pokemon ball... So clearly some "laws" are being bent. I mean, come on, like a giant shark would fit in such a small ball? *wink*


Which is exactly how every other paladin mount we've seen in OotS has been summoned. Does that mean both Miko and Hinjo are non-human?

[Yoritomo Himeko]

Which is exactly how every other paladin mount we've seen in OotS has been summoned. Does that mean both Miko and Hinjo are non-human?

Well, that does explain a lot about them. :smalltongue:

[Kurald Galain]

I don't see it. Main reason is because I don't think Rich would use not SRD info or he would get sued.

Don't worry, he's got a good lawyer (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0282.html).

[malakim2099]

Well, that does explain a lot about them. :smalltongue:

They ARE paladins, remember. :smallamused:

[Miraqariftsky]

Ockham's Razor--- rule of philosophical simplicity: the philosophical and scientific rule that simple explanations should be preferred to more complicated ones, and that the explanation of a new phenomenon should be based on what is already known

Microsoft® Encarta® 2007. © 1993-2006 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.

I agree that she's most probably simply a human paladin who grew up and lives on the waterfront and was raised by fisherfolk parents.

Btw, do y'all think she wears some sort of armor for her lower body? Surely she needs protection there since that's the part that's most in contact with the shark's skin of denticles?

[Scarab83]

I agree that she's most probably simply a human paladin who grew up and lives on the waterfront and was raised by fisherfolk parents.

Btw, do y'all think she wears some sort of armor for her lower body? Surely she needs protection there since that's the part that's most in contact with the shark's skin of denticles?

Well, to continue with the theme, I propose that under her armor is nothing but fishnet. Maybe that's just my fantasy though.. *cough* :smallbiggrin:

[StickMan]

Last time I checked, neither the Eye of Fear and Flame (Book of Vile Darkness), Death Knight (Monster Manual II), nor Huecuva (Fiend Folio) were in the SRD. :smallamused:

Fine find the massive flaw in my argument.

[sparkey477]

Lien is not a human, none of the paladins are. at the end of a paladin's training, they undergo a a twenty-four-hour period of fasting and meditation, followed by an other 24 hour ritual to remove the last traces of humanity, at the end of which, a 3-foot dowel is inserted up the paladin's ass:smallyuk:.

Also, Lien could be an Aventi

[Tyrmatt]

I think it's just one of those at the DM's discretion, you can have an aquatic mount in a water based campaign, just like rangers can have aquatic animal companions in aquatic settings.
I'm more curious as to the statement of "O-Chuul was the toughest of us all". He survived being hurled what? a mile? By an exploding castle. Just how tough can a person be to survive that. Miko, the supposed most powerful paladin of the Guard was ripped in half by the force. Is it some subtle joke on an often used paladin build? Or is it to perhaps see the return of O-Chuul as a Death Knight of incredible power and stamina?

[Lord Fullbladder, Master of Goblins]

IMO, a shark is a pretty crappy mount. It's only useful if you get attacked by something actually in the water. And it has to be in seawater for the shark's sake, and it needs to be above the water so that she can breathe.


The common Bull Shark has been known to travel miles up freshwater rivers. It's not actually that much of a stretch.

Also, Tyrmatt, Miko was cut in half by the sharp edge of the throne. She might have survived the blast, for all we know, had that damnable throne not been flung in the same direction.

[factotum]

I'm more curious as to the statement of "O-Chuul was the toughest of us all". He survived being hurled what? a mile? By an exploding castle. Just how tough can a person be to survive that. Miko, the supposed most powerful paladin of the Guard was ripped in half by the force.

He could have made his Reflex save to avoid damage from the actual explosion, in which case it would just be the falling damage he'd have to worry about--that tops out at 20d6. As for Miko, I don't believe she WAS ripped in half--if you look carefully at the strip where she dies, it looks more likely that she was sliced neatly in half by a fragment of the throne that happened to fall on her. (And even then she was still conscious and still able to talk to Soon for a few moments before she actually died).

[Miraqariftsky]

I think it's just one of those at the DM's discretion, you can have an aquatic mount in a water based campaign, just like rangers can have aquatic animal companions in aquatic settings.
I'm more curious as to the statement of "O-Chuul was the toughest of us all". He survived being hurled what? a mile? By an exploding castle. Just how tough can a person be to survive that. Miko, the supposed most powerful paladin of the Guard was ripped in half by the force. Is it some subtle joke on an often used paladin build? Or is it to perhaps see the return of O-Chuul as a Death Knight of incredible power and stamina?

Maybe it's just the Giant's poke at the attribute scores?
As in:
Miko's got the highest Str in the SG with Hinjo next to her.
O-chul's got the highest Con...

And Lien's got a marine backstory, marine-oriented skills, feats and equipment--- and so she's the primary paladin defender of the waterfront.

[David Argall]

I'm more curious as to the statement of "O-Chuul was the toughest of us all". He survived being hurled what? a mile? By an exploding castle. Just how tough can a person be to survive that. Miko, the supposed most powerful paladin of the Guard was ripped in half by the force. Is it some subtle joke on an often used paladin build? Or is it to perhaps see the return of O-Chuul as a Death Knight of incredible power and stamina?
The comment likely was simply intended to be supporting evidence, showing that it was not quite so unlikely that O-Chul survived the blast. And by the rules, it is not too unreasonable that he could have survived. We have more problems saying why Miko didn't. High level PCs have huge numbers of hp and high saves.

[Studoku]

He could have made his Reflex save to avoid damage from the actual explosion, in which case it would just be the falling damage he'd have to worry about--that tops out at 20d6. As for Miko, I don't believe she WAS ripped in half--if you look carefully at the strip where she dies, it looks more likely that she was sliced neatly in half by a fragment of the throne that happened to fall on her. (And even then she was still conscious and still able to talk to Soon for a few moments before she actually died).

I know It's been said before but:

In Azure City, throne Bisects you.

[Chaotic Judge]

My guess is that Lien is some odd species that means we get to see a cool shark, closely followed by a joke about devilfish, while resolving the question of how the good guys will deal with Pointy The Octopus.
So she can only be a polymorphed owlbear. Nothing else fits.

[A Large Bear]

Bah, I can't believe you guys haven't seen this yet. Lien is Xykon. He could mimic that appearance in any of a hundred ways, he got bored and decided to thwart Red Cloak 'cause there was nothing on.

[Ampersand]

Which is exactly how every other paladin mount we've seen in OotS has been summoned. Does that mean both Miko and Hinjo are non-human?

Everyone in the strip who appears to be a normal human is obviously concealing some secret heritage. I mean, just look at Haley. Not a shred of evidence that she's anything other than a normal human (and, in fact, quite a bit to support the normal human theory, most notably the new intro strips in Dungeon Crawlin' Fools where she makes specific note of how she spent her extra skill points) and yet you have theories that she's everything from an aasimar to a tiefling to an avatar of the Snarl.

[Scarab83]

Everyone in the strip who appears to be a normal human is obviously concealing some secret heritage. I mean, just look at Haley. Not a shred of evidence that she's anything other than a normal human (and, in fact, quite a bit to support the normal human theory, most notably the new intro strips in Dungeon Crawlin' Fools where she makes specific note of how she spent her extra skill points) and yet you have theories that she's everything from an aasimar to a tiefling to an avatar of the Snarl.

Kinda funny, isn't it?