PDA

View Full Version : Pirates?



dyslexicfaser
2007-08-02, 09:20 PM
I was wondering if there were any piratical base classes, for those of us who prefer the low levels. I've seen a number of PrC's, like Dread Pirate and Captain (or whatever it's called), and several homebrewed PrC's with that good ol' pirate flavor, but I don't recall any base classes on the same idea.

Well... I suppose there's swashbuckler... he'll do if there's nothing else.

SilverClawShift
2007-08-02, 09:37 PM
Well... I suppose there's swashbuckler... he'll do if there's nothing else.

A dashing Sword fighter who specializes in light armor, light weapons like rapiers, and cunningly precise strikes. Skills including balance, bluff, escape artist, jump, profession (sailing), swim, and tumble, and you can have all those skills with an INT of 16 (and with INT to damage, why wouldn't you?)

Really, I'm not trying to sound rude at all, I'm just curious how much more pirate you want? :smallbiggrin:

*edit*

The swashbuckler is also considered weak at high levels, but works great if you prefer low levels. You could burn a feat to become proficient with hand crossbows too.

dyslexicfaser
2007-08-02, 09:45 PM
I'd never played swashbuckler before, actually - I've never done more than heard of it.

Never realized how well it fit what I was looking for :smallsmile:

Tor the Fallen
2007-08-02, 09:51 PM
A dashing Sword fighter who specializes in light armor, light weapons like rapiers, and cunningly precise strikes. Skills including balance, bluff, escape artist, jump, profession (sailing), swim, and tumble, and you can have all those skills with an INT of 16 (and with INT to damage, why wouldn't you?)

Really, I'm not trying to sound rude at all, I'm just curious how much more pirate you want? :smallbiggrin:

*edit*

The swashbuckler is also considered weak at high levels, but works great if you prefer low levels. You could burn a feat to become proficient with hand crossbows too.

Because you want to play a pirate?

SilverClawShift
2007-08-02, 09:59 PM
Because you want to play a pirate?

Not sure if I know what you mean, I'm not trying to assume the worst here.

Is this a "Ninja Class Vs. a Rogue calling itself a Ninja" thing? "Pirate" is a career (albeit an illicit one). A fighter could be a pirate. A rogue could be a pirate. A sorcerer could be a pirate if they really wanted to.

But if you're going for a "Pirates of the Carribean" image of a pirate, a swashbuckler is pretty much dead on...

Fishies
2007-08-02, 10:49 PM
A barbarian could be a Viking pirate.

Quietus
2007-08-02, 10:59 PM
A barbarian could be a Viking pirate.

Or just an angry, drunken pirate.

ArmorArmadillo
2007-08-02, 11:01 PM
Most fighters are probably low level warriors and commoners with higher level pirates being fighters or rogues; pirate is a distinction similar to thief or vagrant, not a class choice. The only real distinction is that they all probably have Profession (Sailor) and Use Rope.

dyslexicfaser
2007-08-02, 11:10 PM
So, 'pirate' is a state of mind?

If you walk like a pirate and say 'Arr' like a pirate, then yes, you are a pirate.

Thinker
2007-08-02, 11:13 PM
What if you only say Arr like a pirate, but find walking like a pirate to be too taxing?

Matthew
2007-08-02, 11:34 PM
So, 'pirate' is a state of mind?

If you walk like a pirate and say 'Arr' like a pirate, then yes, you are a pirate.
Yes, exactly. Pirates are Fighters, Warriors, Experts, Rogues, etc...

You may need to swap a few Skills around, but that would be a minor tweak.

SilverClawShift
2007-08-03, 12:00 AM
The biggest aspect of being a pirate is...

....wait for it....

...ENGAGING IN PIRACY!

The Definition of Piracy (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/pirate)
Notable is the first definition. A person who robs or commits illegal violence at sea or on the shores of the sea.

Piracy is literally "Robbing people blind in international waters". Go so far out that you can't see legal land, find another ship, swing over there en masse, loot everything not nailed down (and pry out the nails on stuff that looks valuable), and kill anyone who tries to stop you. That's pirating. If you have a trained parrot and an eyepatch, even better.

Now, by default, being a pirate means you are a very bad person. Chaotic or Neutral Evil. The most common pirates are going to be ruthless thugs, murderers, and unrelenting theives. Savages who know how to sail a boat.
That's by default. You could arguably be a neutral pirate, or even a GOOD pirate if you really worked at it. Being a pirate who specifically pirated other pirates, or who targetted evil foreign nations (maybe even during war time) would be neutralish, and arguably even good depending. The shady side of good, but you could be the Robin Hood of the Seven Seas if you really set down and meant to.

Letter of Marque (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Letter_of_marque)
Get a Letter of Marque? And you are officially a lawful pirate. Targetting enemy ships and generally doing as you please.

We've romanticized pirates mainly because they are not the threat to countries at large that they once were (oh yeah, they totally still exist, and going out to sea can totally get you robbed and killed by real pirates, no joke), but by default, piracy is a Bad Thing.

Still. The concept of Pirates rules.

*edit*

Also, see my sig for a Ninja Pirate prestige class. Meant for level 6 + though.

Matthew
2007-08-03, 12:07 AM
That last one is Privateering, the legal form of Piracy, if I am not mistaken.

dyslexicfaser
2007-08-03, 12:21 AM
Ninja pirates? I can't help but feel that this was a line man was not meant to cross. Is humanity really ready for so much awesome gathered in one place?

It sounds like a fun time, though.

BardicDuelist
2007-08-03, 12:22 AM
I made up a naval campaign, and had several pirates. The breakdown I used was a 50/50 warrior/rogue mix. The captain was either a rogue or a swashbuckeler. I usually had either a cleric (of a sea god, or a thief god) or a druid aboard the ship.

For a character:
Swashbuckler from CW has a decent amount of skills, works well in light armor, and uses light weapons (like the cutlass or rapier). Because they generally have high Dex, they make decent ranged combatants as well, which is well suited to naval combat.

Scout from CAd is a good class choice if you want somone who swings around ropes and charges across the deck of a boat. They also use light armor and tend to have lots of skills. The main disadvantage is that somtimes the deck of a ship is too small or cluttered to make good use of their skirmish. The variant in PHB2 is good as it lets you climb rigging better.

Rogue makes an awesome pirate as they have lots of skills, use lighter armor, evasion (for avoid cannon/ballista/magic bombardments), uncanny dodge, and their sneak attack. The last one, combined with fienting, is woderful on a ship, because you deal much more damage. It is easy to flank, or catch an opponent having to make balance checks as well, so you can almost always find a way to do the extra damage.

Ranger also makes a good choice. For this TWF has better flavor than archery, and with quick draw, some hand crossbows, and two cutlasses makes a formidable opponent. For flavor, have him have a "love of the sea" and worship it to grant his spells. His animal companion (generally being squishy at the level he gets it) works great as a bird of some sort (parrot?), as this can be used as a scout. A monkey is annother good choice, as it can maneuver amongst rigging better than most. Your Wis scores helps with spot checks and Profession (sailor), and you tend to have a high dex anyway, since you prefer the lighter armor. You also have several skills which prove very useful (such as survival letting you predict the weather). If your DM allows you to pick an organization as a favored enemy, Navy is an excellent choice as well.

Barbarians, Ninjas, Bards and Marshalls also make good pirates, the latter being good choices for captains.

Fighters tend to have too few skills to be really good aboard a ship, and Monks are just too lawful. A single spellthief to neuturalize enemy casters isn't bad, and a warmage can replace the ship's artillary. As always Wizards, Sorcerers, Druids, and Clerics are very useful. Especially Druids and Wizards.

Accolon
2007-08-03, 12:24 AM
I would suggest that a pirate is any character who engages in larceny on the high seas. I don't think it needs to be its own class, although Swashbuckler fits it well. I think a pirate can be a fighter, rogue, wizard, sorcerer, etc so long as the character opts for the right skills and feats.

And the term pirtate isn't always evil. People seem to forget that a lot of our 18th century navy was composed of pirates. In Elizabethian England, one of the nation's greatest heros, Sir Francis Drake: pirate. Sir Walter Raleigh's brother: pirate, and certifiable moron, but pirate none-the-less. Privateers: paid, state sponsored pirates who helped Thomas Jefferson fight pirates throughout his 2nd term, and who were used to fight against him, and who composed the bulk of the US Navy outside of the Great Lakes in the War of 1812, and who composed the "navy" that defeated the Sp. Armada in 1598.

The problem that I always see with a Pirate/Privateer based campaign, who is the captain? PC's don't like to be ordered around, especially not by other players, and if the DM is the captain, it can feel like you're leading the party around by their noses. I was always thought that such a campaign would lead to mutiny and hard feelings.

I guess if you wanted to make up a class, you could call it the Buccaneer or the Privateer and adjust the things that you think are important from, say, the Swashbuckler and the Rogue and make up your pirate that way. I would think that Privateers have a more good leaning, "offering" their services to a leige, and Buccaneers are more chaotic.

A pirate's code, by the way, and a great one, is printed in Peter Benchley's amazing book, "The Island." If you're into pirates, read it. Besides the fact it's written by one of the best action/thriller authors of the 20th century, it's a text on pirates and their way of life.

horseboy
2007-08-03, 12:31 AM
Especially Druids and Wizards.

Ya gotta have a druid, somebody's got to grow all that corn!

bugsysservant
2007-08-03, 12:37 AM
So, 'pirate' is a state of mind?

If you walk like a pirate and say 'Arr' like a pirate, then yes, you are a pirate.

So all those poor mute, cripple pirates have been stripped of their status? :smallfrown:

But I do agree with you. Most sailors would probably be experts or even commoners, with enough levels to be decent in a fight. There would probably also be scouts, fighters, swashbucklers, and virtually any lawless type represented. I find the WoTC emphasis on core classes mildly upsetting, though they are out to make money. With enough work core classes can be just about anything.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0209.html

BardicDuelist
2007-08-03, 12:40 AM
Experts make good sailors, and this good pirates, but I find rogues make the combat encounters more challenging and interesting, but then almost every humaniod I put the PCs against has class levels to throw them off.

Tor the Fallen
2007-08-03, 12:47 AM
I can see magic at mid levels really messing up a campaign with boats. Namely polymorph/wildshape form: giant sea beast, and the Wall of spells. Nothing like throwing a wall of force in front of the enemy vessel and dashing it to splinters.

Starsinger
2007-08-03, 01:00 AM
I can see magic at mid levels really messing up a campaign with boats. Namely polymorph/wildshape form: giant sea beast, and the Wall of spells. Nothing like throwing a wall of force in front of the enemy vessel and dashing it to splinters.

I actually did that with Wall of Ice infront of another ship.. "Ice Berg dead ahead!"

Tweekinator
2007-08-03, 08:17 AM
What if you only say Arr like a pirate, but find walking like a pirate to be too taxing?

Then you would be talking the talk, but not walking the walk.

Zim
2007-08-03, 09:19 AM
With all this pirate talk, I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned the Flying Spaghetti Monster or Pastafarianism yet.

Arrr! Do your part to stop Global Warming. Become a pirate!

AtomicKitKat
2007-08-04, 06:11 AM
Legendary Captain and Scarlet Corsair from Stormwrack, and Dread Pirate from Complete Adventurer. You could probably also use the "Legendary Leader" or something, from Heroes of Battle.

Jarlax
2007-08-04, 08:07 AM
its really more how you build your PC that makes them more of a pirate. for a fighter take ranks in climb, swim and profession(sailor) for sailing checks and amour no heavier than light so that he can act effectively in the ship and not sink if hes knocked into the water. even though fighters can wear any amour a pirate with the fighter class would take dodge and some lighter amour since the high weight and skill penalties of heavy amour would be impractical for ocean combat.

for your caster, because any great pirate ship has a ship's artillery mage. take spells that let you breath underwater, walk over water and create wind along with the usual spells these are spells that are critical to ocean combat even if they would be impractical compared to other spells normally.

while there are classes that say "pirate" or have a pirate feel to them it really comes down to how you play your class. even the dread pirate prestige could just as easily be used as a fearsome ocean mercenary open to the highest bidder since the class itself only requires a boat and to be nonlawful, not that the PC actually engage in piracy. its not the name of the class that decides if a PC is a pirate.

Arbitrarity
2007-08-04, 10:23 AM
Arrr. My wizard showed them pirates. You cannot hope to hide from scrying, nor to avoid the wall of force, or to survive the cloudkill and black tentacles! Alas, my Captain was a scurvy rascal who had some silly notion of honor or somesuch.

Arrr, shooting the other wizard out of the crow's nest with a lightning bolt be stylish!
Arr, me back be actin' up.

:smallbiggrin:

qube
2007-08-04, 12:03 PM
ranger, rogue, swashbuckler, ...

averagejoe
2007-08-04, 01:46 PM
So all those poor mute, cripple pirates have been stripped of their status? :smallfrown:

It isn't the "Arr" on the outside, it's the "Arr" on the inside.

ArmorArmadillo
2007-08-04, 04:05 PM
ranger, rogue, swashbuckler, ...

Generally only the Captains and "Right hand Men" will have PC class levels, most are likely experts, warriors, and commoners.

Pirates aren't well-trained and equipped usually, they're brigands with little training who scrounge for what they can by attacking poorly defended vessels with their superior numbers.

Any decent pirate ship will turn tail at the sight of an equally equipped naval vessel.

Sornjss Lichdom
2007-08-04, 10:18 PM
go ahead and laugh, but sor make great pirates, alot of there spells are usually nerfed by the DM, but gust of wind, fireball, lightening bold, summon water elemental, fly, wall of force, and sleep and what not, all come in great on the sea. Not to menchine the really cool stuff you can do with magic items on the open sea, also freezing spells take on a whole new meaning. makes me wish i was still on a pirate campign.

the reason to use a sorceror is because the rocking ship sucks if you a low lvl wiz, you have to make a concentration check like once an hour.

take a few lvls in rogue or swash and your good.

Macrovore
2007-08-05, 12:35 PM
Arrr. My wizard showed them pirates. You cannot hope to hide from scrying, nor to avoid the wall of force, or to survive the cloudkill and black tentacles! Alas, my Captain was a scurvy rascal who had some silly notion of honor or somesuch.

Arrr, shooting the other wizard out of the crow's nest with a lightning bolt be stylish!
Arr, me back be actin' up.

:smallbiggrin:

actually, it's not the best idea to use some battlefield control spells like clouds and evards black tentacles (or even V's disturbing version), because they don't move with the ships. Oddly enough, some of the best spells for naval combat are wall of force (ships crash into invisible wall in front of them), and damage spells (blow up the ship and it sinks).

Were-Sandwich
2007-08-05, 02:47 PM
Spectral Hand + Passwall. Reach out and touch someone.

Nevermore
2007-08-05, 05:12 PM
Call Lightning is great for this, but yopu all have forgotten one rock star of a spell.... Warp Wood

dyslexicfaser
2007-08-06, 12:45 AM
According to Stormwrack, though, Warp Wood can't be used to hole ships. What would it be good for?

Leon
2007-08-06, 04:39 AM
Warp the Rudder, Warp the Spars, Warp the Wheel, Warp the Etc

TranquilRage
2007-08-06, 05:23 AM
According to Stormwrack, though, Warp Wood can't be used to hole ships. What would it be good for?

Warp the mast so it cracks under pressure from its weight and the pressure on the sail from the wind.

Or warp the oars into right angles, causing the oarsmen to get smacked in the face/chest when they cant hold the weight.

BardicDuelist
2007-08-06, 12:07 PM
Sea battles: when evocation doesn't suck!