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View Full Version : Optimization How to nonlethally take out a Balor in a direct fight using evil outsiders only?



RoboEmperor
2017-06-01, 12:11 PM
My group and I have been deviating away from the standard Planar Binding Cheese, and for fun we decided to create a thought experiment of subduing a Balor to enslave with Mother Cyst using only evil outsiders.

So there you have it. A trapped Balor in a calling diagram.
1. We cast Dimensional Anchor on the Balor.
2. We break the circle and try to knock him out!
3. Outsiders deal lethal/nonlethal damage, while the players ensure that the Dimensional Anchor stays on him.

So what's the best strategy? All 3.5 books are allowed.

Pit Fiends are allowed but no wish. Same with Efreetis, Glabrezus, etc.

As an additional challenge, try to keep all the outsiders in the same alignment. Mixing lawful and chaotic might cause problems.

Any number of evil outsiders is allowed, but we want the absolute minimum.

Probably need to start with a grappler so he doesn't fly away.

magicalmagicman
2017-06-01, 01:55 PM
Fiendish Codex I Mature Nabassu, 15hd, at-will Enervation, +20 ranged touch. That's a start. Can't miss. Kills his saves and max hp.

It might be easier to just bind a Pit Fiend. That way you can have Balors grapple the Pit Fiend while Nabassus kill his saves because of your same alignment restrictions.

RoboEmperor
2017-06-02, 12:02 AM
Fiendish Codex I Mature Nabassu, 15hd, at-will Enervation, +20 ranged touch. That's a start. Can't miss. Kills his saves and max hp.

It might be easier to just bind a Pit Fiend. That way you can have Balors grapple the Pit Fiend while Nabassus kill his saves because of your same alignment restrictions.

Pit Fiend's wish makes it unbindable because it can use it to escape.

That Nabassu is a great idea though. Unless Balor gets lucky with the vorpal sword, the Pit Fiend and Balor can't kill each other, letting the Nabassu debuff unhindered.

Yogibear41
2017-06-02, 12:47 AM
Considering the Pit Fiend has regeneration it would be within a DM's rights to say that even having its head severed by a vorpal weapon would only stop it long enough for its head to regenerate.

RoboEmperor
2017-06-02, 02:26 AM
Considering the Pit Fiend has regeneration it would be within a DM's rights to say that even having its head severed by a vorpal weapon would only stop it long enough for its head to regenerate.

Ok, wow, you're right. Pit Fiends are invincible. Good god! An instant death attack can only kill a creature with regeneration if the attack is capable of dealing lethal damage. Balor's weapons are not good or silvered so not a chance in hell.

Seriously, why is there such a huge gap between Pit Fiends and Balors.

RoboEmperor
2017-06-02, 08:14 AM
Alright, I scoured Fiendish Codex II, and found one monster that can help with the cause.

Orthon (Devil, 7hd)

he has an ability called Dimensional Interference that creates a 20ft radius sphere that acts like a Dimensional Anchor to everyone inside. It's at-will and lasts 4 rounds.

Alright so we got the Debuffer Nabassu, we got the grappler/Knockout Pit Fiend, and the anti-teleport Orthon.

Things are coming along nicely. Maybe there's a better grappler out there.

But I forgot that the Balor could summon a second Balor.

magicalmagicman
2017-06-02, 10:21 AM
Nice find!

Also, the summon isn't a problem. Just have the pit fiend spam his at will greater dispel at it.

RoboEmperor
2017-06-02, 11:01 AM
Seems like I'm gonna need more than 1 pit fiend then. Hmm, maybe a Paeliryon...