Ragnorra and divine buffs? (3.5)

[flappeercraft]

So here is a question I have, could Ragnorra lower his immunity to divine spells to receive buffs from divine spell and then not get affected by divine spells but remain affected? Also, what if he cast them himself somehow?

[Nifft]

So here is a question I have, could Pandorym lower his immunity to divine spells to receive buffs from divine spell and then not get affected by divine spells but remain affected? Also, what if he cast them himself somehow?

Wouldn't that be a bit ... out-of-character?

I mean, even if Pandorym could do that, why would Pandorym want to do that?

[Lazymancer]

So here is a question I have, could Pandorym lower his immunity to divine spells to receive buffs from divine spell and then not get affected by divine spells but remain affected?
FAQ explicitly mentions that golem cannot lower his immunity to be affected by spells. The same should apply to Pandorym.

Either way, what immunity are you talking about? It's a long list, but I see only Anathematic Secrecy - which makes mind shard of Pandorym immune to all divine divination spell effects.

[flappeercraft]

Ah crap, got mixed up. It was ragnorra who was immune to divine spells not pandorym

[Lazymancer]

Ah crap, got mixed up. It was ragnorra who was immune to divine spells not pandorym
Yeah, I see. It's a bit ... nuts.

Ragnorra is not going to lower it's immunity to get buffs from divine caster - that much is certain. But, I'm not sure what the RAW should be on the self-cast buffs.

Using Magic Immunity as a precedent (i.e. treating Impervious to the Divine like perfect Spell Resistance) would be the easiest approach and it would allow Ragnorra to self-buff (since personal buffs ignore Spell Resistance).

However, IttD is not functioning like Magic Immunity: it explicitly grants immunity to supernatural abilities which are not subject to spell resistance (and, therefore, ignore magic immunity). Consequently, Ragnorra could be treated as immune even to "SR:No" effects. If that is the case, then no buffs for Ragnorra, regardless of the source.


To preserve some sanity, I'd rule IttD to work like Magic Immunity when it comes to divine spells and spell-like abilities, and treat supernatural abilities like spell-like. I.e. do not allow Ragnorra to ignore "SR:No" effects. This would mean that self-buffing would work.

[Mnemnosyne]

PHB 177 says "A creature can voluntarily forego a saving throw and willingly accept a spell's result. Even a character with special resistance to magic (for example, an elf's resistance to sleep effects) can suppress this quality."

Therefore, unless the entry detailing their immunity has some rule that contradicts that general rule in the specific case, or the spell has some similar limitation, then yes, any creature can voluntarily suppress such an immunity and be affected by the spell.

[Lazymancer]

PHB 177 says "A creature can voluntarily forego a saving throw and willingly accept a spell's result. Even a character with special resistance to magic (for example, an elf's resistance to sleep effects) can suppress this quality."

Therefore, unless the entry detailing their immunity has some rule that contradicts that general rule in the specific case, or the spell has some similar limitation, then yes, any creature can voluntarily suppress such an immunity and be affected by the spell.
I see your PHB quote and raise you more recent version:

Immunity: A creature that has immunity to an effect is never harmed (or helped) by that effect. A creature cannot suppress an immunity in order to receive a beneficial effect.

[Mnemnosyne]

Hmm, that's a pretty awkward disagreement, too. The Monster Manual is primary source for monsters. The PHB is primary source for characters. This sets up an odd situation where primary sources disagree, depending on if you're talking about a monster or a character. Usually the rules are the same. This gets more confusing if you're talking about a PC monster.