Challenge rating adjustment for guns

[TheManicMonocle]

So I was wondering, using the stats for modern guns listed in the DM's guide, what's the best way to adjust the challenge rating that a party armed with modern guns can handle?

[mgshamster]

No more than if you gave them just a few too many magic items as a power upgrade.

That is, treat their level as 1 or 2 higher than they are when calculating XP budgets.

But I wouldn't​ start doing that until they have a few levels under their belt, just because of how swingy the low levels are. Plus, it'll make them feel a bit more badass with the guns before the challenge really kicks in. :)

[Squiddish]

The obvious choice is to give the monsters guns as well, creating balance.

If not, just figure out how much better than their normal weapons the guns are and work from there.

[Cl0001]

I've found that just using higher cr monsters can get really hairy because they get more, and stronger attacks and can start to easily overwhelm most parties. So when I have to offset my group dealing a much higher amount of dpr than normal I just increase the monsters health.

[Slipperychicken]

Mechanically they're very loud bows with an extra die of damage, and the automatics get an okay AoE. So for guns alone, slightly better ranged damage is all you really need to worry about; just about anything you could do with a rifle in dnd could have been done with a bow. What I'd be concerned about is that the players' real-life knowledge of firearms might inspire them to use more creative tactics than the typical dnd group, and how modern explosives could change things.

A lot depends on the setting here. If they get to requisition unlimited free explosives for use against traditional D&D enemies that have no concept of modern firearms and will never adapt, then they have the potential to make things a little easier for themselves. If the party doesn't get cheap easy explosives, or if the setting's monsters and NPCs are incorporating modern weapons into their styles of violence, then there's less to worry about.

[Thrudd]

Meh - same as how you should always figure this out - throw some stuff at them that seems reasonable and see how it goes. If they mop the floor with something you thought would be hard, good for them. If the next challenge is way too hard, then maybe it gets hairy and they run away. Or someone dies, and then they run away, and now you know better what they can handle. CR's are just very loose ideas anyway. Be willing and ready to adjust things on the fly, try out different combinations of enemy groups, and you'll see what they're good at handling and what they aren't, and it'll give them a chance to practice tactics for different sorts of situations, too. There's nothing wrong with encounters sometimes being really easy or too hard.

[ad_hoc]

No more than if you gave them just a few too many magic items as a power upgrade.


CR assumes no magic items. (also average stats, etc.)

[mgshamster]

CR assumes no magic items. (also average stats, etc.)

True, but not all magic items give a power upgrade to combat, and of those that do, not all of them give enough of a boost to justify any real change in the XP Budget calculations.

"A few too many magic items as a power upgrade" could mean "more than zero," but it could also mean "more than three." It entirely depends on the magic items and how much of a power upgrade they provide.

There really isn't a blanket statement to provide here. It's more of a "it just depends on your group, adjust as you play."

Note that this isn't just for magic items. I've done the same adjustment when using Goober's NPC Companion system. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?459858-NPC-Companion-System-Idea)

[Sigreid]

The obvious choice is to give the monsters guns as well, creating balance.

If not, just figure out how much better than their normal weapons the guns are and work from there.
How could you not want to roll out a dragon with a Vulcan gatling gun.