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suplee215
2017-06-26, 09:38 PM
This is more a theory question than a question on an actual character. For every thread about the Champion I see, I see melee (usually Heavy Weapon) builds. I was wondering how viable or unviable a range champion is. I figured one of the reasons range champions are rare is that advantage is easier to get on melee. But Volo's release of Kobolds give range an easy way (assuming you can work around daylight). Honesty, Pack Tactics on a PC is probably insane. But, just how viable is a Kobold Champion, no multiclassing but feats? I will think the most optimal way to build it without houserules (tables I play at usually allow small races to use heavy weapons) is crossbow expert, sharpshooter and a hand crossbow. Heavy Crossbow is out of the question due to disadvantage and I think the lost of damage from a Light Crossbow is made up with the bonus action attack. Is the 1d6 too small to compete against the 1d12 or 2d6 melee builds? Or does the Half-Orc add more with the extra crit dice than the Pack Tactics add? How else would you make the "perfect" Kobold Champion? Let's assume standard array or point buy (don't think there will be too much of a difference on such a SAD character with feats to spare).

Naanomi
2017-06-26, 09:40 PM
I mean... it would do fine as a hand crossbow build; probably your best bet. Not really playing into the strengths of the kobold or champion that way but it would work just fine

suplee215
2017-06-26, 10:19 PM
I mean... it would do fine as a hand crossbow build; probably your best bet. Not really playing into the strengths of the kobold or champion that way but it would work just fine

What strengths are you talking about? The first thing every champion should do is find a way to get advantage and a kobold has a way to get advantage.

Naanomi
2017-06-26, 10:47 PM
A crit with a d6 just isn't that impressive even if it is easy to get

suplee215
2017-06-26, 10:54 PM
A crit with a d4 just isn't that impressive even if it is easy to get

It's a d6 although fair enough. Only other option is a d8 for light crossbow, which doing the math seems like the better option. Heavy Crossbow will certainly be worth it if allowed without the downside.

Findulidas
2017-06-27, 02:29 AM
Another quirk of constantly having advantage is that you can abuse it to ignore all disadvantages. Since once you have advantage from something and disadvantage from something else all you will ever get is a normal attack roll, no matter how many additional disadvantages/advantages you stack on it (PHB p.173). This means that you can just pick up a heavy crossbow, attack an invisible creature and be completely blind while still getting a normal attack against it if its within 5 feet of one of your allies. Which is why I really dont like the kobold advantage to begin with.

MrStabby
2017-06-27, 02:36 AM
I like range on a Kobald champion; more freedom on where to stand lets you stay in the shadows more easily.

As it is, whenever you feel you want more damage from your critical hits you can start to add rogue levels - that might add a bit more punch.