Help to find rules

[Yklikt]

You've intermixed advancement by HD and advancement by class levels, which the DMG specifically says you shouldn't do.

Concerning monsters. I want to know where is the rules for this quote. Please tell if know.

[Naez]

I guess that depends on context but the clarification you're looking for may be in the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/improvingMonsters.htm).

[Yklikt]

I have looked but not found it so it would help if someone can quote the actual rules part

[Yklikt]

So that guy I quoted wasnt technical correct

[Yklikt]

Perhaps they're referencing a portion of the Dungeon Master's Guide that isn't part of the System Reference Document. But, if we just go off the SRD, then giving class levels and increased hit dice to an intelligent monster with a humanoid shape is not allowed.

Ok thanks. Anyone knowing what part of DmG this might being then?

[Mike Miller]

Ok thanks. Anyone knowing what part of DmG this might being then?

Have you looked?

[Yklikt]

Have you looked?

As I said earlier yes. But I cannot see it.

[KillianHawkeye]

But, if we just go off the SRD, then giving class levels and increased hit dice to an intelligent monster with a humanoid shape is not allowed.

I'm not sure if you're misreading the text you quoted, but the sections on "Class Levels" and "Increased Hit Dice" are separate options. It very clearly says that reasonably humanoid-shaped intelligent creatures advance by gaining class levels (which includes gaining a Hit Die) as indicated by the line saying "By character class" in their Advancement entry.

Other creatures who do not qualify to enter a character class are forced to advance by gaining additional monster Hit Dice, also as indicated by their Advancement entry.

Example: A lizardfolk's Advancement entry says "By character class." They start with 2 humanoid Hit Dice (their "monster class"), but to gain any more Hit Dice they need to gain actual class levels, and they do so just like any other creature who gains a level in a class.

Example 2: A monitor lizard's Advancement entry says "4-5 HD (Medium)." It starts with 3 animal Hit Dice, and can only advance by gaining more of these (up to a maximum of 5, and then it simply cannot advance any further). The parenthetical note tells us that the lizard, which is Medium size to begin with, does not increase in size by gaining Hit Dice as some other creatures do.

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@OP, unless you provide more context about what mistake you were making, we really can't find the exact rules quote you need to verify the other person's claim. Hopefully the examples I've provided can start to clarify the difference between advancing by Hit Die and advancing by character class.

[Anxe]

DMG page 172: Even if the creature is of a kind that normally advances by Hit Dice rather than class levels, such as a gargoyle, a PC (as an exceptional individual) can gain class levels rather than Hit Dice.

PCs can do both, but the language indicates that is an exception to the usual rules which only allow advancement by HD if it is available. It's reasonable that the DM could make other exceptions when designing NPCs though.

[bekeleven]

I'm not sure if you're misreading the text you quoted, but the sections on "Class Levels" and "Increased Hit Dice" are separate options.
It also says "most commonly."

[Deadline]

Improving Monsters
Each of the monster entries describes a typical creature of its kind. However, there are several methods by which extraordinary or unique monsters can be created using a typical creature as the foundation: by adding character classes, increasing a monster’s Hit Dice, or by adding a template to a monster. These methods are not mutually exclusive—it’s possible for a monster with a template to be improved by both increasing its Hit Dice and adding character class levels.

Class Levels
Intelligent creatures that are reasonably humanoid in shape most commonly advance by adding class levels. Creatures that fall into this category have an entry of "By character class" in their Advancement line. When a monster adds a class level, that level usually represents an increase in experience and learned skills and capabilities.

Increased Hit Dice
Intelligent creatures that are not humanoid in shape, and nonintelligent monsters, can advance by increasing their Hit Dice. Creatures with increased Hit Dice are usually superior specimens of their race, bigger and more powerful than their run-of-the-mill fellows.

Bolded and underlined the most important bits. Bolded and italicized the other items that people are mistaking for iron clad direction. Neither of those bold, italicized bits say that it can only be one way.

Extraordinary or unique monsters, regardless of shape, can be advanced by either or both methods. I'm unaware of an answer to the OP's question (can you mix the type of advancement you do on a critter - i.e. advance by a level in a class, then advance a RHD, then a class, etc.). It strikes me as a bit inelegant to do unless the monster has a special method for HD advancement (like a barghest), but I'm not well-versed enough in all things Monsters to have a rules quote handy. Is Ur-Priest still floating around? Perhaps he can help.

For the OP, if i were judging in the Villainous Competition and you mixed advancement like that without a special advancement method, I'd ding you in the Build Elegance category. For what it's worth.

[KillianHawkeye]

It also says "most commonly."

What's your point? :smallconfused:

That really doesn't have anything to do with my comment.