Warlock or Rogue as level 1? (Extra skill point VS Having prof in Will)

[Prince_Vorrel]

Okay simple question that i need feedback on.

Do i start as a rogue as level 1? or Warlock? I am a variant human so i do have a free skill point which may be important and a feat giving me prof in con!

Warlock benefits: Warlock gives me prof in Will saves and with will. With it being a 10 as it's useless for me otherwise, this is a nice defensive boost on a lot of SAVE OR DIE checks.

Rogue Benefit: amazing AF dex saves as i will be prof in them and have it as my main stat. But i get a flat 0 to my will saves which can be dangerous. BUT i also get a extra skill a rogue gets at level one which is one more skill then i would have if i multiclassed into a rogue.

please halp!

[Naanomi]

How high do you plan on going in each?

[Prince_Vorrel]

How high do you plan on going in each?

Pretty equal honestly. Level 6 warlock minimum for dark one's own luck and thirsting blade.

Rogue 5 min for that sweet sneak attack damage and a reaction that halves damage from attacks.

after that, i'm a bit undecided.

[Khrysaes]

9 Swashbuckler gets you that awesome feature that they have, and 10 gets you an ASI.

14 Warlock is the final archetype feature.

Alternatively, 14 Rogue is free Wis Save Prof, though deep in, it may be better to get resilient Dex or Wis instead.

[Snowfalcon]

Rogue first is always my vote. The WIL save can be managed either with the 5th level Rogue feature which is more reliable than a save or the fear that lets you pick up proficiency in a save of your choice.

There is great synergy between Arcane Trickster and Warlock. Swashbuckler has potential too if you're thinking a Hexblade. Even without, the boost to Initiative is very nice.

I favor the first combo. Consider Darkness on an object. Devils Sight + mage hand.

[Prince_Vorrel]

Rogue first is always my vote. The WIL save can be managed either with the 5th level Rogue feature which is more reliable than a save or the fear that lets you pick up proficiency in a save of your choice.

There is great synergy between Arcane Trickster and Warlock. Swashbuckler has potential too if you're thinking a Hexblade. Even without, the boost to Initiative is very nice.

I favor the first combo. Consider Darkness on an object. Devils Sight + mage hand.

Going with swashbuckler for that ability to sneak attacks on lone targets and cha to initiative. Also i will not being using darkness all that often...it's too much of a giant middle finger to the rest of my party who would also like to see things. and i'm going fiend patron warlock as i will be putting all ASI's into dex making light armor my best option and enjoying all that free temp hp.

also how does uncanny dodge save me from something that targets my will saves? having damage doesn't help when it's against something trying to Mind Control me.

[PhantomSoul]

If getting at least 7 Rogue levels, I'd favour starting as a Rogue (or getting Resilient: Dexterity, which is reasonable anyway given how useful Dex is) -- you get added mileage from the Dex saving throw because of Evasion. (Granted, I'm a big fan of evasion, so consider this a very biased reply!)

[Prince_Vorrel]

9 Swashbuckler gets you that awesome feature that they have, and 10 gets you an ASI.

14 Warlock is the final archetype feature.

Alternatively, 14 Rogue is free Wis Save Prof, though deep in, it may be better to get resilient Dex or Wis instead.

the level 9 feature is fairly meh imo no point in going any more levels after 8 imo...7 for evasion and 8 for one last ASI

[Kane0]

Dex saves: Roll vs damage
Wis saves: Roll vs nasty effects ranging from forced movement to loss of actions or worse

Your Dex is already decent and Rogue gets evasion at 6 to help with dex saves even if you fail. Add to that the level 5 rogue reaction to halve damage plus cuninng action to get you out of trouble and you should be OK in the HP department. The free prof to Wis saves from Rogue comes too late to help you
You can rely on your party to pick up that last skill unless you are supposed to be the skill guy.

I'd pick Warlock at level 1 unless you intend on getting the resilient feat (odd wis score on a variant human for example).

[Zene]

If you're going to take one level in each first, it's just a question of what order ... then definitely warlock. That Wis save is going to be far more useful to you as a melee'r than the dex save, especially with evasion.

But if there's a specific milestone in one class you want to hit first (like the warlock's invocations, or the rogue's subclass features at 3)... then take that class first, and stay in it til you hit thay milestone. Having a fun feature a level earlier is always great, and outweighs any save/skill considerations.

[Citan]

Okay simple question that i need feedback on.

Do i start as a rogue as level 1? or Warlock? I am a variant human so i do have a free skill point which may be important and a feat giving me prof in con!

Warlock benefits: Warlock gives me prof in Will saves and with will. With it being a 10 as it's useless for me otherwise, this is a nice defensive boost on a lot of SAVE OR DIE checks.

Rogue Benefit: amazing AF dex saves as i will be prof in them and have it as my main stat. But i get a flat 0 to my will saves which can be dangerous. BUT i also get a extra skill a rogue gets at level one which is one more skill then i would have if i multiclassed into a rogue.

please halp!
Hi!

Warlock, no doubt.
As a DEX build you will have decent save, plus Uncanny Dodge on fail and Evasion on success, so you're pretty well covered already.
Having a WIS save at 0 means you have the potential to become the worst threat of your pals, or at least be severely crippled one way or another. Very bad thing.
Go Warlock. You don't care about one extra skill considering you will have already Expertise in 2 and proficiency in at least 4 other.

[Naanomi]

I'd go with rogue. Yes WIS saves are slightly more important than DEX (though less common, and evasion works better when you make that save consistently)... but losing out in a proficiency isn't worth it to me for a rogue-type character (unless you are already proficient in everything you care about, which I doubt)

[JeffreyGator]

You may not care about the rogue weapon proficiencies if you're a bladelock and using a pact weapon rapier otherwise that's a consideration as well.

If you start Warlock and don't go to warlock 3 before rogue, you'll be using a dagger until then to get SA.

[djreynolds]

You could begin as a fighter at level 1 and grab all of the goodies, all armor, all weapons, con and strength saves. You may think who cares about strength saves... but since you are probably placing an 8 there....

You want both wisdom and con saves covered, because as DM this is what I am targeting. Fear, charm, poison, paralysis, hold, stun, etc

Dex is huge but it is damage and I'm not wasting a fireball on the lone rogue or warlock off in the corner

You will likely have a 20 in dex, and evasion at 7th level.... you'll live

Now the majority of that type of damage is based on elements, so get fire resistance somehow, or cold, or lighting

Just stay away from beholder's and traps

So I agree with Citan grab warlock out of the gate