AD&D 3.5ED to 2nd ED castle building

[Bozo5084]

Need conversion for prices

[Bozo5084]

3.5ed stronghold book is excellent, but problem is the price difference. 2nd ed cost for caste about 100,000gp, 3.5ed it is 2.6million, can anyone suggest a conversation ratio between the two from 3.5 back to 2nd price. The other problem is DM is a tightwad. We have adventures for years, he thinks 45,000gp is fifty rich, so I do need a good ratio, example 1 to 10, or 10 to 1 whatever works, but at 2.6 million. Ithe will need to be 100 to 1. But I would like to hear experienced options. Of course using less fancy versions, and using magic will help, but let hear just what people think about the price conversion between the 2 system so I can tell my DM. Thanks guys

[hamlet]

Why not just take a look at the 2nd edition castle book? It has all the prices listed right there.

As does the DMG for at least 1st edition AD&D and possibly 2nd edition. I'm away from my books so I can't tell for sure.

[LibraryOgre]

Never built a castle; always refurbished them. I don't think there's a direct conversion rate available; as Hamlet said, you'd be better off looking at 2e sources.

[Bozo5084]

Why not just take a look at the 2nd edition castle book? It has all the prices listed right there.

As does the DMG for at least 1st edition AD&D and possibly 2nd edition. I'm away from my books so I can't tell for sure.
Yes it does, but doesnt have the Fancy room, other stuff, articlial spell like effects and stuff. I mean I can Piss of MY DM and say Here is what I want, Price it please.

[Bozo5084]

{{Scrubbed}}

[Knaight]

I wouldn't use a direct conversion - a bit part of what makes the prices different is that the scale has changed, where low level 2e is if anything richer than low level 3e, and high level 3e is way richer than high level 2e.

This suggests an exponential function, A*Px, where P is the 3e price, x is somewhere between 0 and 1, and A is above 1. 3(P0.7) is looking decent on a really cursory approach, but to do this right I'd want to actually fit the function to a number of points, and while I've seen the books and seen them quoted often enough to have a vague understanding I don't have the actual data points to do the fit. Actually giving full listings would be giving out pieces of the book against forum rules, but if you strip the label and just give the numbers it should be fine. To explain

Not Good (assuming you use actual values, I'm just making these up):
2e Tower: 10,000 gp
3e Tower: 50,000 gp
2e Moat: 15,000 gp
3e Moat: 80,000 gp
2e Fortified Gate: 20,000 gp
3e Fortified Gate: 150,000 gp

Totally fine:
[2e,3e]
[10,000;50,000]
[15,000;80,000]
[20,000;150,000]

If you've got the mathematical background/software to just run the fit yourself, just ignore this. Otherwise, give me at least 10 data points and I'll do some curve fitting, and if the exponential model doesn't work I'll fit something else to it.

[Bozo5084]

I wouldn't use a direct conversion - a bit part of what makes the prices different is that the scale has changed, where low level 2e is if anything richer than low level 3e, and high level 3e is way richer than high level 2e.

This suggests an exponential function, A*Px, where P is the 3e price, x is somewhere between 0 and 1, and A is above 1. 3(P0.7) is looking decent on a really cursory approach, but to do this right I'd want to actually fit the function to a number of points, and while I've seen the books and seen them quoted often enough to have a vague understanding I don't have the actual data points to do the fit. Actually giving full listings would be giving out pieces of the book against forum rules, but if you strip the label and just give the numbers it should be fine. To explain

Not Good (assuming you use actual values, I'm just making these up):
2e Tower: 10,000 gp
3e Tower: 50,000 gp
2e Moat: 15,000 gp
3e Moat: 80,000 gp
2e Fortified Gate: 20,000 gp
3e Fortified Gate: 150,000 gp

Totally fine:
[2e,3e]
[10,000;50,000]
[15,000;80,000]
[20,000;150,000]

If you've got the mathematical background/software to just run the fit yourself, just ignore this. Otherwise, give me at least 10 data points and I'll do some curve fitting, and if the exponential model doesn't work I'll fit something else to it.
Thanks, I believ you answered it, & confirmed my Suspision. once again thanks, but anyone else keep on comintiong

[Knaight]

Thanks, I believ you answered it, & confirmed my Suspision. once again thanks, but anyone else keep on comintiong

So, are we doing data points or what?

[Bozo5084]

So, are we doing data points or what?

I have to read the site info again, i do not understand what adata points are, sorry

[Knaight]

I have to read the site info again, i do not understand what adata points are, sorry

You're looking at two variables (2e costs, 3e costs), and looking for a way to relate them. There's not going to be a perfect equation for them, but what we can do is find individual coordinate points, then find a curve of best fit to use for conversions. These points are the two prices for various things in both systems, but actually listing the things in both systems is putting out commercial information. Stripping that data down to just a bunch of pairs of numbers on the other hand reveals nothing about the systems, then can be used to produce a conversion equation.

[Mutazoia]

As others have said, the 2nd ed "The Castle Guide" is going to give you all the info you are looking for. Basic google-fu will find you want you need. (https://www.google.com/search?q=AD%26D+2nd+ed+castles&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiI3qeT96jVAhVjzVQKHYRLBfMQ7xYIIygA&biw=1280&bih=918)

[Lord Torath]

Thanks, I believ you answered it, & confirmed my Suspision. once again thanks, but anyone else keep on comintiongDon't thank him yet; he hasn't done anything but make up some numbers:



Not Good (assuming you use actual values, I'm just making these up):
2e Tower: 10,000 gp
3e Tower: 50,000 gp
2e Moat: 15,000 gp
3e Moat: 80,000 gp
2e Fortified Gate: 20,000 gp
3e Fortified Gate: 150,000 gp

Totally fine:
[2e,3e]
[10,000;50,000]
[15,000;80,000]
[20,000;150,000]Knight was asking you to provide the values from the 3e and 2e sources for similar pieces of castle architecture, and then he would come up with a formula for pricing the items available in 3.5e that don't appear in 2e. And asking that you strip the names of the architecture from the data you provide. Using the [10,000;50,000] format.

[Khedrac]

Yes it does, but doesnt have the Fancy room, other stuff, articlial spell like effects and stuff. I mean I can Piss of MY DM and say Here is what I want, Price it please.
You seem to be suffering from a major misunderstanding about the nature of AD&D...

In 3E and 3.5 everything magic has a price, usually easy to calculate or look up and the expectation is that there are 'magic marts' where you can buy and sell magic items and effects to your heart's content.

However, you are now playing AD&D where this situation simply does not apply. Look at the magic item creation rules (if you can find them), or simply look at the magic item tables. Magic items don't have prices - if you try to sell one you get what you can convince people to pay for it (subject to what they can afford). If you able to buy one, you will be paying whatever the merchant can extract from you.
As for making them, the rules are not fixed, ingredients need to be gathered by adventure (e.g. the feath of a phoenix) and they take whatever the DM decides is appropriate.

So, if you want magical effect son your stronghold, you are going to have to create them in character, you can't just pay someone else N thousand gold and get a permanent pocket dimension for the armory that all the guards have access to by touching their badge to a plate on the wall, it doesn't happen that way.

So, you won't annoy your DM by asking him to price it, (s)he will probably just explain that you cannot buy what you are aksing for, period.