How can i be more ruthless while blacksmithing?

[Draconi Redfir]

So some context:

I am playing a Hobgoblin who is trying to teach his people how to be less primitive. Farming, steel-foring, construction out of stone, etc. but that seccond part, forging, has been really kicking our butts. How it works is i need to decide i'm going to spend a week blacksmithing, them make a leadership roll. Five weeks in a row i rolled a five or lower. this following week, i also added this for roleplaying bonuses.


We have tried making steel the way the humans have done it, we have tried, and tried again and resulted in failure. Now it is time for a new approach, a more ruthless approach.

The pool of tempering water had been drained, instead replaced with a barrel of Goblinoid blood, freely given by every individual who currently stood in the room, or who wished to see this project done. Ten individuals stood in the smith together, Four hobgoblins, two bugbears, two Goblins, Gorsh himself, and his bodyguard Norg. Every one of them wielding large smithing hammers, Behind them were several Boggard assistants wearing heat-resistant outfits.

The Ritual began as a human prisoner was dragged into the room, her arms bound behind her, and her mouth gagged shut. The Bugbears forced the girl to her knees over the central Anvil, and tore her gag away. She looked on in fear as Gorsh set an unholy symbol of Asmodeus up on a pedestal before her.

The group allowed the prisoner to scream in pain and terror as the dull knife was slowly dragged across her throat, her blood spilling onto the anvil before her in full view of the unholy symbol. When it became clear that the girl would scream and bleed no more, her body was thrown into the forge to act as fuel for the flames. Some claim to have seen her writhing about in pain, some semblance of life still in her mind as she burned.

From there the lot of them began their work, for seven days straight they worked the metal over and over, forging iron into steel, molding steel into the desired form. Their quest; A single suit of full-plate amour, masterfully forged by Goblinoid hand and blood, with the will of Asmodeus watching, and the blood of an innocent fuelling the flames and glossing the anvil.

Day in and day out the lot of them worked, often cycling their workload so some would work the steel while others slept. Soon war-drummers are brought in to play their drums just outside the door as he hammers work the metal in time to the beat, An estabilshed Bugbear barbershop quartette later comes in to chant hyms of war and death, Even Turon gets in on the action, as Gorsh asks him to use a large hammer to smite the metal with negitive energy, chasing away any "good" that may reside within it. As seven days of non-stop hammering and tempering passed, the armour slowly took shape. And finally, when the dawn of the eighth day came, they dunked their project one final time into the barrel of Goblinoid blood and pulled out... *Cue dice roll*

Gorsh = Me, Norg = My bodyguard, and Turon = A large-sized hill giant anti-paladin/blackguard NPC who has "smite good" abilities.

this time i rolled a four. then i threw a man out of a window and got a seccond chance at rolling. i still got a four. i got a higher total score because of roleplay bonuses, and the DM said he had some ideas for bonuses the armor would get if it had sucseeded, but as is, i just barely passed, only managing to "make progress" on the project rather then outright completing it.

in the interest of trying to retain the "ruthless forging" thing for next time, what are some more cruel / ruthless things i could do that wouldn't be a copy-paste of this? i tried to pull all the stops i could for this one and i'm fresh out of ideas now. help me freinds! how to i be more ruthless and/or evil while forging this dang fullplate armor that i can't seem to roll higher then a five for!?

[Haldir]

Kidnap a dwarf blacksmith and make him teach your hobgoblins.

Edit- Kidnap many dwarf and human blacksmiths bring hobgoblins into the steel age.

[Wartex1]

Kidnap a dwarven blacksmith, put them in those spiked manacles, and have a smith-off, and then stab them with the swords each of you make.

[TheCountAlucard]

"Quenching" a fresh-forged sword in blood, or worse, in a living body, is actually really likely to be bad for its quality. (http://www.cracked.com/personal-experiences-1238-6-things-movies-get-wrong-about-swords-an-inside-look.html)

[Bohandas]

make a servant carry red hot pieces of metal to you from the fire with their bare hands

[Guizonde]

it's thought vikings discovered crucible steel and pattern welding by adding bones in the coal. why not find a damn good blacksmith, chop off his hands, and use his handbones as a carbon and mineral content in your forge? while he's watching, of course.

[Sredni Vashtar]

I'd question why exactly you're being made to roll for this. That description alone is worth a success. It seems to me that the question isn't a matter of ruthlessness, but rather why there's even a chance of failure to begin with.

[Draconi Redfir]

Kidnap a dwarven blacksmith, put them in those spiked manacles, and have a smith-off, and then stab them with the swords each of you make.

all we've managed to make so far are three metal frizbees and a shoulder pad of a full plate armor set.


I'd question why exactly you're being made to roll for this. That description alone is worth a success. It seems to me that the question isn't a matter of ruthlessness, but rather why there's even a chance of failure to begin with.

yeaahh no idea. i'd really preffer it if it's either "sucsess" or "fail" myself. but apparently we're doing a "silver peices worth of progress" or something. so in silver peices, i've apparently currently done 33gp worth of a 2000gp project...


Kidnap a dwarf blacksmith and make him teach your hobgoblins.

Edit- Kidnap many dwarf and human blacksmiths bring hobgoblins into the steel age.

already tried that. plus had a human ally teach them as well.

evidently it has not been sticking.

[Blackhawk748]

Dude, its a Craft check (im guessing in 3.5, considering how you mentioned SP for crafting) so just Take a 10. With all those helpers thats like a 20+ right there.

[Draconi Redfir]

up until just last night i didn't have any ranks in a craft skill, since it'd been a long time since we last leveld up. i've not maxed our craft arms-and-armor, plus a skill focus, so i'm hoping it's at least easier from now on.

and pathfinder for the reccord, but close enough.

[Blackhawk748]

up until just last night i didn't have any ranks in a craft skill, since it'd been a long time since we last leveld up. i've not maxed our craft arms-and-armor, plus a skill focus, so i'm hoping it's at least easier from now on.

and pathfinder for the reccord, but close enough.

Same basic concept. You don't need ranks when you have *checks OP* holy crap, nine assistants. Each one of them Takes a 10 to assist, which will give you a +18, thats before tools and before the DM Rule of Cool Bonus. This should be virtually impossible to screw up.

[Draconi Redfir]

yeaahh tried asking the dm about that, followers like that aren't able to do things like that apparently, a vast majority of those guys are minions, not actual characters. only the three named characters are actual characters, and even then i was only able to add the strength score of myself and my bodyguard since the giant was an NPC.

on top of that this isn't even supposed to be my character's project. the minions are supposed to be the ones blacksmithing while i do other things, the only reason my character is geting involved at all is because i rolled three fives in a dang row.

[Blackhawk748]

yeaahh tried asking the dm about that, followers like that aren't able to do things like that apparently, a vast majority of those guys are minions, not actual characters. only the three named characters are actual characters, and even then i was only able to add the strength score of myself and my bodyguard since the giant was an NPC.

on top of that this isn't even supposed to be my character's project. the minions are supposed to be the ones blacksmithing while i do other things, the only reason my character is geting involved at all is because i rolled three fives in a dang row.

Ok, thats an odd system, but whatever, at least your DM is consistent. Anyway, go get Dwarf bones, doesnt matter if you killed them or not, get them, then us them with the charcoal and your Blood Quenching (you should probably water that down, at the minimum to prevent it from coagulating) and then go make yourself some Heavy Metal Swords.

Also, just go look at Klingons, cuz thats basically what Hobgoblins are stock

[hymer]

Each one of them Takes a 10 to assist

You can't Take 10 on Aid Another checks.

I'm just the guy who does the thing.

@ OP: How about going in a different direction? Roll with it, decide that this smithing business is not for you. Or realize that the gruesomeness wasn't actually helping. Try refinement instead.

[VoxRationis]

You could cut down a forest full of dryads and treants and use the wood for your forges, though that might have negative consequences...

[Draconi Redfir]

@ OP: How about going in a different direction? Roll with it, decide that this smithing business is not for you. Or realize that the gruesomeness wasn't actually helping. Try refinement instead.

we tried doing things the human way, that just got us three shiny frizbees to play with. and we want to make steel and other metal things because metalworking is one of the few things keeping the goblinoid races primitive and the humanoids advanced. my main goal here is to catch up the goblinoids to the humans so we can survive on something other then raiding humans and taking their stuff. Because when we kill all the humans, then what?

[johnbragg]

we tried doing things the human way, that just got us three shiny frizbees to play with. and we want to make steel and other metal things because metalworking is one of the few things keeping the goblinoid races primitive and the humanoids advanced. my main goal here is to catch up the goblinoids to the humans so we can survive on something other then raiding humans and taking their stuff. Because when we kill all the humans, then what?

TAke max ranks in Craft (Jerky)?

[Blackhawk748]

TAke max ranks in Craft (Jerky)?

I was gonna say then you'd have all the time in the world to figure out steel craft. Another idea would be to summon some Efreet or Azer and have them instruct you. I mean, Efreet are about as Ruthless as it gets.

[Arbane]

So some context:
Five weeks in a row i rolled a five or lower.
this time i rolled a four. then i threw a man out of a window and got a seccond chance at rolling. i still got a four.

in the interest of trying to retain the "ruthless forging" thing for next time, what are some more cruel / ruthless things i could do that wouldn't be a copy-paste of this?

Put your dice in a blender, one at a time.

This isn't an RP problem, this is a 'the Dice Gods have it in for you personally' problem.

[Braininthejar2]

Cut down a beautiful forest for fuel.

Smelting iron requires high temperatures - use slaves to work the bellows day and night.

[rs2excelsior]

The problem is that you're throwing puny humans into the forges--you need good, goblinoid stock. Have every goblin present help feed the forge--throw an ear, a finger, a toe--or even a hand if you're really dedicated--into the fire. And sure, toss a human or two in there too for good measure. Alive, if you like.

[Kane0]

Your ruthlessness needs to be more efficient.

Gather the best materials available. Deep mine ore and proper worked stone, not bog iron and piles of fieldstone. Dwarves may need to be killed for this, but whatever.
Slaughter anyone in the way of the best wood to make charcoal with. Kill any slaves that fall asleep watching the charcoal being made.
Kill any slaves that flag on the bellows. Drain their blood for the quenching water, throw the bones on the fire and toss the rest to the cattle. The air must flow.
Sacrifice only the best. Successful blacksmiths of other races are a good start, worthless peasants gets you worthless slag. bring in a professional priest.
Location, location, location. Success can be reliant on a good place of worship that is also practical in terms of access to slaves, materials and other logistical concerns.

[Draconi Redfir]

Put your dice in a blender, one at a time.

This isn't an RP problem, this is a 'the Dice Gods have it in for you personally' problem.

roll20 sadly. can't blend virtual dice :P


Your ruthlessness needs to be more efficient.

Gather the best materials available. Deep mine ore and proper worked stone, not bog iron and piles of fieldstone. Dwarves may need to be killed for this, but whatever.
Slaughter anyone in the way of the best wood to make charcoal with. Kill any slaves that fall asleep watching the charcoal being made.
Kill any slaves that flag on the bellows. Drain their blood for the quenching water, throw the bones on the fire and toss the rest to the cattle. The air must flow.
Sacrifice only the best. Successful blacksmiths of other races are a good start, worthless peasants gets you worthless slag. bring in a professional priest.
Location, location, location. Success can be reliant on a good place of worship that is also practical in terms of access to slaves, materials and other logistical concerns.

Some of this isn't viable for reasons. but others give me some options :P

[LibraryOgre]

Why isn't your anvil made out living dwarves?

[Draconi Redfir]

Why isn't your anvil made out living dwarves?

that would make a very innefective anvil.

[DuctTapeKatar]

Capture a master blacksmith and their family. Kill their spouse and use them as kindling for the furnace. Force him to forge new blacksmith's tools. Every time they refuse, throw one of their children into the furnace, force them to watch.

Once the tools are forged, take the blacksmith and toss them into a massive kiln and bury them with raw iron. Smelt the blacksmith into a massive ingot with the flames kindled by their lover. Use the resulting mass of steel to make an anvil.

Celebrate your new hobgoblin forge by kidnapping, pillaging and raiding. Toss a few more people onto the flames and make some cool stuff. Maybe get your wife a new battle axe, or something.

[Tipsy_Pooka]

It looks to me that you don't have a problem with role-playing ruthlessness... you have a problem with an unruly program. My recommendation is to visibly, and brutally, sacrifice some real d20s to show Roll20 that you mean business...

[Draconi Redfir]

It looks to me that you don't have a problem with role-playing ruthlessness ruthlessness... you have a problem with an unruly program. My recommendation is to visibly, and brutally, sacrifice some real d20s to show Roll20 that you mean business...

snrk. sounds viable. but how would a website be able to see me smashing a dice in real life?:smalltongue:

[Tipsy_Pooka]

snrk. sounds viable. but how would a website be able to see me smashing a dice in real life?:smalltongue:

Meh... your device probably has a webcam... It'll know... :smalltongue:

[Ashes]

FWIW, I think what you described was really awesome, and I'd have given you maybe +20 for that description if I even asked for a roll.
Maybe ask your DM if it could be handwaved or if he actually needs the roll for anything? If there is no consequence to failure, which it sounds like there isn't, there's no point in rolling.

[Draconi Redfir]

all i know is had i rolled high enough, the armor probably would have been blessed by asmodeus and magical or something idk. that's the main thing i'm sad about :P

[GungHo]

Don't forget to quench the swords in angel tears and to do "proofing strokes" on stacks of ducklings.

[Lord Torath]

Maybe punch an bunny (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0916.html) or two, as well.


Or realize that the gruesomeness wasn't actually helping. Try refinement instead.Because whipping the slaves doesn't really make the food taste better (
[url=http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0511.html). Maybe make some offerings to the Smithing god? That might get some extra bonuses from the DM to your next check, even if it's a dwarven or human god. Maybe include the argument that the God of Smithing is probably more concerned about the smithing itself, rather than the race or species doing the smithing.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

Have you tried using any part of a unicorn yet? An anvil of its bones maybe?

[Deliverance]

Sounds like the real problem is that the hobgoblins suffer from a lack of knowledge of metallurgy and a severe case of missing common sense. (Not that such are typically well represented in RPGs.)

Have you considered confounding your DM by addressing your real problem "we don't know how to make steel, we need the knowledge and the experience, how about we do some adventures that leads to us learning these skills from somebody who knows how", or perhaps, "since we do have some knowledge, if we spend all our time trying to create small steel ingots based on the knowledge we do have, varying the experiment slightly with each experiment and taking careful notes of the result, can we roll for how long time it will take to succeed?" rather than "how well do I need to roll dice to craft a full set of steel plate armour, when we don't know how to make steel yet"?

Anyhow, for a more ruthless approach, punish your own hobgoblin. Anybody can be ruthless to others - being it to oneself shows true determination.

So whenever an attempt fails, it is time for a bit of self-mutilation. In order of failed attempts, chop off: foot, hand, head. Three strikes and you are out - your hobgoblin's problem will be solved one way or the other.

[Lord Torath]

...perhaps, "since we do have [I]some[I] knowledge, if we spend all our time trying to create small steel ingots based on the knowledge we do have, varying the experiment slightly with each experiment and taking careful notes of the result, can we roll for how long time it will take to succeed?" rather than "how well do I need to roll dice to craft a full set of steel plate armour, when we don't know how to make steel yet"?Considering your recent rolls, this might be the best bet.

[Draconi Redfir]

Have you tried using any part of a unicorn yet? An anvil of its bones maybe?

not sure we have any unicorns unfortionately. There is a silver dragon somewhere though...


Sounds like the real problem is that the hobgoblins suffer from a lack of knowledge of metallurgy and a severe case of missing common sense. (Not that such are typically well represented in RPGs.)

Have you considered confounding your DM by addressing your real problem "we don't know how to make steel, we need the knowledge and the experience, how about we do some adventures that leads to us learning these skills from somebody who knows how", or perhaps, "since we do have some knowledge, if we spend all our time trying to create small steel ingots based on the knowledge we do have, varying the experiment slightly with each experiment and taking careful notes of the result, can we roll for how long time it will take to succeed?" rather than "how well do I need to roll dice to craft a full set of steel plate armour, when we don't know how to make steel yet"?

Anyhow, for a more ruthless approach, punish your own hobgoblin. Anybody can be ruthless to others - being it to oneself shows true determination.

So whenever an attempt fails, it is time for a bit of self-mutilation. In order of failed attempts, chop off: foot, hand, head. Three strikes and you are out - your hobgoblin's problem will be solved one way or the other.

offically the hobgoblins already know how to make steel. making something out of steel is something completely different.

plus, rolling less then a five isn't helping.

[Corsair14]

What part of the armor were you building out of curiosity? Hobgoblins in the fluff are quite good at smithing being on par with humans being as militaristic and disciplined as they are. Building a suit of plate over a few months would certainly be within their ability. With shamans around to assist in the various rites as they come along and a high level shaman to do the final "blessing" a magical suit shouldn't be that hard. Its more of a time and materials thing.

[Kane0]

Alternatively, come up with some way to roll more often (by splitting up the work for example) so you're more likely to roll something well, then progress from there.

[Draconi Redfir]

Alternatively, come up with some way to roll more often (by splitting up the work for example) so you're more likely to roll something well, then progress from there.

wouldn't work. we only get one roll per action per week. and i only have the one action.

[CharonsHelper]

Don't forget to quench the swords in angel tears and to do "proofing strokes" on stacks of ducklings.

More bonuses for using puppies which are especially happy and rambunctious.

[Xuc Xac]

Adding a lot of extra detail is nice, but it doesn't help when the detail is wrong. All of the "ruthlessness" is counterproductive because it's just bad smithing technique. Blood is a horrible thing to quench steel in but that's probably the least worst of your attempted "bonuses". If I were GM, all of these ruthless things would give you large modifiers to your roll but they would be negative modifiers.

If you want special magic armor, first make good armor then enchant it. Use good metalworking techniques to make the armor, then do all your "ruthless" stuff for the enchantment.

[Draconi Redfir]

Adding a lot of extra detail is nice, but it doesn't help when the detail is wrong. All of the "ruthlessness" is counterproductive because it's just bad smithing technique. Blood is a horrible thing to quench steel in but that's probably the least worst of your attempted "bonuses". If I were GM, all of these ruthless things would give you large modifiers to your roll but they would be negative modifiers.

If you want special magic armor, first make good armor then enchant it. Use good metalworking techniques to make the armor, then do all your "ruthless" stuff for the enchantment.

again, i tried making steel the normal way. never rolled higher then a five. DM said i could try using my ruthless stat instead of my connections one, and i have more points in ruthless, so i gave that a shot instead.

[Hypersmith]

take it as a sign you're only partway to true ruthelessness.

The hammer has to be made from the skull of a troll (or something)
The anvil has to be made of some big beasts shoulder blades. Maybe a troll.
Take normal metal and add dried and crumbled bone marrow from something powerful. Like a troll.
In the core of the blade, work in a long bone or a a sliver of tooth or whatever to create a "powerful base".

Tie a human by the arms and legs, stab them with a tube so you that you can see clear through them, use a funnel to pour the molten mixture literally through their bodies, into a mold. Take it over to the bone forge and with the bone hammer, make the edges, put it under the human again, then rip out the tube so that the blood cools the blade. Done!

might want to try a ritual sacrifice irl to get rid of the luck problems.

[Hypersmith]

Adding a lot of extra detail is nice, but it doesn't help when the detail is wrong. All of the "ruthlessness" is counterproductive because it's just bad smithing technique. Blood is a horrible thing to quench steel in but that's probably the least worst of your attempted "bonuses". If I were GM, all of these ruthless things would give you large modifiers to your roll but they would be negative modifiers.

If you want special magic armor, first make good armor then enchant it. Use good metalworking techniques to make the armor, then do all your "ruthless" stuff for the enchantment.

I mean come on, it's game with giant spiders that should suffocate, not to say a thing about undead and like 90% of everything. I'm pretty sure reality is meant to be thrown out the window.

[goto124]

DM said i could try using my ruthless stat instead of my connections one, and i have more points in ruthless, so i gave that a shot instead.

Wait, what? What game is this?

[Draconi Redfir]

Wait, what? What game is this?

Way of the Wicked. it's a leadership feat thing. we get

ruthless, secrecy, survivability, connections, espionage, and loyalty.

my stats are 4, 1, 2, 2, 0, and 6 respectively. Making steel the normal way is a connections roll, so i get more of a bonus by being ruthless.

[cullynthedwarf]

Love the opening description, but your trying to make a jump from stone to steel with out hitting some of the steps along the way.

Copper, yes its a soft metal but you NPC smiths should batter this up to get some kind of expierence

Bronze/brass, alloys at its finest. Still not as good as steel but on the cusp.

And iron. Straight pig iron would be good for first attempts for your suit before you do it for real.

As for ruthless.
Track a dryad down. Look in the area for her animal protector and capture it. Threaten to cut her tree down and eat her sacred beast if she does not show her self. Clap her in cold iron manacles when she does. Then cut the tree down any way. Take your animal prize, the dryad, and as much of the tree as you can pack back to the goblin warren. Build you fire with her tree. Slaughter the beast in front of her to drive her to dispair. Use its bones to give coal/carbon to you metal. Call upon the smith god to bless you forge and anvil. Call upon the greatest devil to bless the work. Cast your sheets of steel and hammer them in to shape. When the last of the wood is gone, push the dryad into the heart of the fire to built up heat for the final quench. Her dispair well make the armour extra potent. A warning though, the dryad must remain pure of body so that her pure spirit can be fully corrupted by Asmodean. He does not want your soiled seconds.

At least that is what I would suggest

[Draconi Redfir]

As for ruthless.
Track a dryad down. Look in the area for her animal protector and capture it. Threaten to cut her tree down and eat her sacred beast if she does not show her self. Clap her in cold iron manacles when she does. Then cut the tree down any way. Take your animal prize, the dryad, and as much of the tree as you can pack back to the goblin warren. Build you fire with her tree. Slaughter the beast in front of her to drive her to dispair. Use its bones to give coal/carbon to you metal. Call upon the smith god to bless you forge and anvil. Call upon the greatest devil to bless the work. Cast your sheets of steel and hammer them in to shape. When the last of the wood is gone, push the dryad into the heart of the fire to built up heat for the final quench. Her dispair well make the armour extra potent. A warning though, the dryad must remain pure of body so that her pure spirit can be fully corrupted by Asmodean. He does not want your soiled seconds.

At least that is what I would suggest

don't think we have acess to dryads anywhere nearby, but i am DEFFINATELY showing this to my DM and partymembers. they'd get a kick out of this:smallbiggrin:

[cullynthedwarf]

Well I'm glad I could bring a smile to your dark heart ;)

[Xuc Xac]

again, i tried making steel the normal way. never rolled higher then a five. DM said i could try using my ruthless stat instead of my connections one, and i have more points in ruthless, so i gave that a shot instead.

Is this really how you should be trying to do things with ruthlessness?

"I pound on the hot metal really hard."
"Make a Strength roll."
"Only 5. Darn."
"You can try again with Charisma."
"I pound on the hot metal really hard while yelling at it."
"That's still Strength..."

Maybe you should treat it as an HR problem instead of an engineering problem. Vader didn't get the Death Star construction back on schedule by counterproductively smashing the equipment. He did it by threatening the foremen with a telekinetic tracheotomy.

[cullynthedwarf]

"I pound on the hot metal really hard."
"Make a Strength roll."
"Only 5. Darn."
"You can try again with Charisma."
"I pound on the hot metal really hard while yelling at it."
"That's still Strength..."


If I'm understanding this, ruthlessness is the STR equivalent for this system. And connection is a INT equivalent. So instead of using his INT a 2 he is getting to use his STR instead.

But I haven't played this system and I'm just guessing.

[cullynthedwarf]

I am curious to the conclusion of your story, how have you managed to up the grisly factor?

[Deliverance]

Way of the Wicked. it's a leadership feat thing. we get

ruthless, secrecy, survivability, connections, espionage, and loyalty.

my stats are 4, 1, 2, 2, 0, and 6 respectively. Making steel the normal way is a connections roll, so i get more of a bonus by being ruthless.
Err, I don't know the game in question any further than that it is about evil organizations, so this infusion of common sense may be completely missing the point, but...

If those are leadership feat thingies for your organization, if making steel the normal way together with your assistants is a connections roll and represents one area of leadership, and if the GM suggests you use your ruthless stat instead, which is also about leadership, why on earth are you use bizarre materials and being comically evil towards others that you want to use as materials in an attempt to get a bonus, something that on the face of it has little to do with leadership, rather than being ruthless towards your assistants, who are the ones you are exerting leadership over? Or being ruthless towards others who have the information you need, as your means of acquiring it?

I mean, "work harder or I'll punish you severely" is one expression of ruthless leadership as is "send my goons to forcibly abduct a smith who knows how, and force him to teach us" and both of them might achieve the goal, whereas "drown a puppy in molten steel and sacrifice a dryad on the anvil" most definitely is not and will not*: It is just stupid.

If you were told you could use your espionage skill instead, you wouldn't try to gain a bonus to succeed by playing a game of cluedo on the anvil or sacrificing a statue of a maltese falcon, would you? No, you'd send out spies to obtain information by covert means and write up some awesome story to get your GM's approval.

* Unless, of course, the rules of the game says so. But it does sound really weird, if so.

---

Don't take me wrong, but re-reading the OP again I can't help recall the joke about the boss who is told that the company has a real security problem with hackers penetrating security and the company's servers crashing on a weekly basis - and decides to remedy the situation by ordering security personnel to wear condoms and helmets while working, on the grounds that it is more secure so it just might work.

[Lord Torath]

Heck, you've got a 6 in loyalty. Can you inspire greater loyalty in your followers, and use that skill in your forging attempts?

[Herobizkit]

Forget the surface dwarves.

Y'all need Droskar (http://pathfinder.wikia.com/wiki/Droskar).

[Angelmaker]

Break down the project into different workgroups. One experimenting with bones as a source for carbon, another experimenting wit prayers to the dark gods, another one doing whatever,

This way you cana rgue that you ar allowed to roll severall roles of dices, and then promoting the project wit the best outcome thus never rolling dice anymore.

Honestly, a SINGLE dice roll for a week long project? Pssst, yeah. 5% chance of blowing up yer base.