[3.5] Monstrous Lycanthrope

[Thurbane]

I asked this in the RAW thread, but it was possibly outside of its scope:


Q 080

Hopefully not too far outside the bounds of this thread...is there any Lycnathrope (or similar) template that can be applied to a Monstrous Humanoid? Preferably without having to jump through hoops like Human Heritage on the base creature.

...so, what are my options?

For a NPC/monster build, so LA doesn't really matter.

Also, I would rather not Rule 0 it - I like my encounters to be as RAW as possible.

Cheers - T

[Buufreak]

I don't remember what the typing is, but MM has lycan slapped on a hill giant. They aren't humanoid, right? I'm afb or is have a better answer.

[ranagrande]

The easiest way is to add the Half-Troll template from Fiend Folio. It changes the type to Giant, which makes it legal for a lycanthrope.

[torrasque666]

I don't remember what the typing is, but MM has lycan slapped on a hill giant. They aren't humanoid, right? I'm afb or is have a better answer.
Requires Humanoid or Giant.

[Buufreak]

Requires Humanoid or Giant.

Totally forgot giant is a type. Go me.

[The Viscount]

Is there a specific creature you were going to apply the template to? It might be easier to mimic it with a unique monster or something other than lycanthrope, like Divine Minion.

[Thurbane]

The easiest way is to add the Half-Troll template from Fiend Folio. It changes the type to Giant, which makes it legal for a lycanthrope.

Good idea. The CR increase sucks, but it's workable.


Is there a specific creature you were going to apply the template to? It might be easier to mimic it with a unique monster or something other than lycanthrope, like Divine Minion.

Maybe for Tibbit, Goatfolk or Lupin? But MH in general would be good to know.

[Remuko]

I know you dont want to rule 0 it but I always thought that was a silly rule. I see no good reason that template shouldnt be able to be applied to anything except like constructs and oozes and maybe vermin.

[Celestia]

I know you dont want to rule 0 it but I always thought that was a silly rule. I see no good reason that template shouldnt be able to be applied to anything except like constructs and oozes and maybe vermin.
Anything? Even animals?

We fought dragons. We fought aberrant monsters. We even fought the lords of Hell, itself. But the one thing we could not fight, the one horrific creature that made us flee in terror was the Bear Were-Bear!

[Dragonexx]

I made a homebrew lycanthrope template that could be applied to humanoids, monstrous humanoids, giants, and native outsiders. A lot easier to apply than core's bizarre lycanthrope rules.

http://tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?p=403038#403038

[Wristlet Eater]

This is sorta a hoop, but less I think than Human Heritage. Half-Troll, the template makes anything a Giant. Then you can apply Lycanthrope.

[Crake]

I would just take the "Humanoid or giant" and replace it with "Any creature humanoid in shape"

[Wristlet Eater]

I made a homebrew lycanthrope template that could be applied to humanoids, monstrous humanoids, giants, and native outsiders. A lot easier to apply than core's bizarre lycanthrope rules.

http://tgdmb.com/viewtopic.php?p=403038#403038


I would just take the "Humanoid or giant" and replace it with "Any creature humanoid in shape"

Is everyone forgetting the part where he wanted it to be RAW? Because all the homebrew suggestions are not RAW at all.

[Remuko]

Is everyone forgetting the part where he wanted it to be RAW? Because all the homebrew suggestions are not RAW at all.

I mentioned it in my comment. I was just giving my opinion on the RAW lycanthrope not really giving a suggestion, persay.

[Zanos]

I would just take the "Humanoid or giant" and replace it with "Any creature humanoid in shape"
That would allow undead and constructs though.

[Wristlet Eater]

I mentioned it in my comment. I was just giving my opinion on the RAW lycanthrope not really giving a suggestion, persay.

I guess that is true. Still it is weird how OP says RAW and people are suggesting homebrew.

[Baby Gary]

That would allow undead and constructs though.

how about any adding any living creature?

[Wristlet Eater]

That would allow undead and constructs though.

Not really a problem since type is not changed by Lycanthrope. It would just be a undead or construct that can become an animal, which there already is with vampires, in the case of undead.

Constructs don't really have anything like that but I guess it would be kind of like a Transformer that becomes an animal. It is weird but this is D&D.

[Dancingdeath]

I tend to ignore rules that make no sense to me or get in the way of my creation. If I wanna make a monstrous humanoid a werewolf then it's gonna be a werewolf. As the DM the rules are mine to break. Just as long as I'm cognizant of what I'm making and keep it balanced for the party.

[daremetoidareyo]

Anything? Even animals?

We fought dragons. We fought aberrant monsters. We even fought the lords of Hell, itself. But the one thing we could not fight, the one horrific creature that made us flee in terror was the Bear Were-Bear!

It's all fun and games until you encounter the roc weremegalodon. Land or sea, you gawn get bit.


That's a bit silly, but a bear warrior/sentinel of bharrai/primeval can become a triple bear. Polymorph into a bear, bear warrior polymorph into a bear for strength bonuses, then do it again with primeval. Could you imagine an awakened bear werebear in hybrid form beartotem barbarian/ sentinel of bharrai/primeval/bear warrior? That's quintuple bear! Bear^5!

(You can also do berserk 3 and become a sextuple bear, but you only get +2 str and con)

[Crake]

That would allow undead and constructs though.


how about any adding any living creature?

I thought that part would be implied by the fact that lycanthropy is transmitted via disease, and undead/constructs aren't susceptible to disease due to their lack of con score.


Is everyone forgetting the part where he wanted it to be RAW? Because all the homebrew suggestions are not RAW at all.

It's less homebrew than houserule, but he said "As RAW as possible". Suggesting a minor houserule still keeps it mostly RAW, and without resorting to unecessary template stacking, there is no answer in RAW.

Libris mortis introduced the monstrous vampire, why not just houserule a monstrous lycanthrope too, after all, the trope is werewolves vs vampires, why not give them the same toys.

[Baby Gary]

It's all fun and games until you encounter the roc weremegalodon
can I sig? this is pure gold

[Wristlet Eater]

Bear^5

You mean BearX5. What you said is Bear to the power of five, which is different.

Also, you can do this as an Anthropomorphic Bear.


I thought that part would be implied by the fact that lycanthropy is transmitted via disease, and undead/constructs aren't susceptible to disease due to their lack of con score.

It can be inherited too, though.


It's less homebrew than houserule, but he said "As RAW as possible". Suggesting a minor houserule still keeps it mostly RAW, and without resorting to unecessary template stacking, there is no answer in RAW.

Something is either RAW or not RAW. What you suggested is not RAW, and that is not what the OP wants.


Libris mortis introduced the monstrous vampire, why not just houserule a monstrous lycanthrope too, after all, the trope is werewolves vs vampires, why not give them the same toys.

Just because they are adversaries doesn't mean every aspect of their existence has to be a carbon copy of the other one. They can be different. And monstrous vampires were actually introduced in Ghostwalk.

[Crake]

It can be inherited too, though.

Yeah, it's inherited from, at some point in it's ancestry, an afflicted lycanthrope. So how does a construct have afflicted lycanthrope parents? Undead lycanthropes are already technically possible anyway as long as you become a lycanthrope first, then become an undead, but not the other way around, so that's honestly irrelevant anyway.

[Thurbane]

So it appears besides Rule 0/homebrew, my best options are Half-troll or Human Heritage (where it can be applied)?

[ShurikVch]

How about the Tauric Creature template? If base humanoid have Lycanthropy, he's still legal...
(Also, any other template which change type from Humanoid to Monstrous Humanoid)

[Wristlet Eater]

Yeah, it's inherited from, at some point in it's ancestry, an afflicted lycanthrope. So how does a construct have afflicted lycanthrope parents?

Well, don't know about the parents, but a construct could get it if he had Greater Humanoid Essence cast on him.


How about the Tauric Creature template? If base humanoid have Lycanthropy, he's still legal...
(Also, any other template which change type from Humanoid to Monstrous Humanoid)

I think there is an existing Monstrous Humanoid he wants to put the template on.

[Tamorlin]

How about Monstruous Lycanthrope from Green Ronin's Advanced Bestiary?

[Wristlet Eater]

How about Monstruous Lycanthrope from Green Ronin's Advanced Bestiary?

That is 3rd party though.

[ShurikVch]

I think there is an existing Monstrous Humanoid he wants to put the template on.Then how about the Polymorph spell? Turn into Humanoid (or Giant), infect, spell wears off, infection stays...

[Dancingdeath]

Then how about the Polymorph spell? Turn into Humanoid (or Giant), infect, spell wears off, infection stays...

That could work from a thematic standpoint. Not sure about the RAW. I like it though.

[ben-zayb]

That could work from a thematic standpoint. Not sure about the RAW. I like it though.
Would Polymorph change your type to Humanoid or Giant? If yes, then that's clear cut RAW as far as the afflicted version is concerned. Cheesy as hell, certainly, but within RAW nonetheless.

Of course, just make sure you are within one size category of the base animal if you want to be afflicted.

[daremetoidareyo]

can I sig? this is pure gold

Go for it.

[Vaern]

Anything? Even animals?

We fought dragons. We fought aberrant monsters. We even fought the lords of Hell, itself. But the one thing we could not fight, the one horrific creature that made us flee in terror was the Bear Were-Bear!
I don't see why not. By RAW, a half-dragon dragon is perfectly okay.

[Crake]

Would Polymorph change your type to Humanoid or Giant? If yes, then that's clear cut RAW as far as the afflicted version is concerned. Cheesy as hell, certainly, but within RAW nonetheless.

Of course, just make sure you are within one size category of the base animal if you want to be afflicted.

Arguably, gaining a template while under the effects of polymorph, when the spell expires and you return to your normal form, you would lose the acquired template, because it was not part of your normal form. Kinda like, if you lose a limb while under the effects of polymorph, you still have all your limbs when you go back to your normal form.

[ben-zayb]

Arguably, gaining a template while under the effects of polymorph, when the spell expires and you return to your normal form, you would lose the acquired template, because it was not part of your normal form. Kinda like, if you lose a limb while under the effects of polymorph, you still have all your limbs when you go back to your normal form.
"Arguably", the way that you arguably autodisqualify yourself on your first Ur-Priest level, and on all your templates that change type (e.g. to undead, magical beast, aberration, construct, outsider, etc.) while requiring another type (e.g. humanoid, animal, vermin, etc.)

[zergling.exe]

"Arguably", the way that you arguably autodisqualify yourself on your first Ur-Priest level, and on all your templates that change type (e.g. to undead, magical beast, aberration, construct, outsider, etc.) while requiring another type (e.g. humanoid, animal, vermin, etc.)

Not really the same I'd say. You return to your base form, and your base form doesn't have the template. Your polymorphed form had it.

[The Viscount]

So it appears besides Rule 0/homebrew, my best options are Half-troll or Human Heritage (where it can be applied)?

For cleanest application of the lycanthrope template, I think so.

Mulhorandi Divine Minion (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20050209a) can give you some of it, namely turning into one animal at will, but it won't get hybrid form.

I never quite understood why Lupin is monstrous humanoid, since they're supposed to be either descended from lycanthropes or Gnolls, and both are humanoids.

[Wristlet Eater]

I never quite understood why Lupin is monstrous humanoid, since they're supposed to be either descended from lycanthropes or Gnolls, and both are humanoids.

We all know the answer is 'because the designers are terrible at consistency'. In fact, that's the answer to many things involving D&D, just replace consistency with an appropriate word.