Unusual Mounted Combat Build

[MidgetMarine]

For an upcoming campaign, I'm helping two of the other players optimize their builds. Except that these builds are rather unusual, as the two players have elected for a Voltron-Style tag team. The build began with the first player's preferred build:

Knight Fighter - using Two Weapon Fighting and Mounted Combatant to dual wield lances while mounted and off-hand a d12 weapon.

However, after discovering that having a good mount means decreasing combat efficacy and that increasing combat efficacy means having a less functional mount, we were at an impasse.
Until the idea hit.
What if your mount could shift forms to fit the situation?
What if your mount wasn't an NPC statblock, and instead had the full capabilities of a PC?
What if your mount was a PC?

Enter Moon Druid.
Mounted combat specifies "Creature", therefore allowing your Mount to be a Wild-Shaped Druid. The more we thought about it, the more some absurd synergies seemed to emerge.
By using the Druid as a mount, not only does the fighter give himself advantage on attack rolls and significantly increased damage with the lances, but Mounted Combatant allows him to hyper-effectively tank for the Druid with no-save redirects of attack rolls and free Evasion, the fighter becomes a free meat shield directly on top of your primary caster, even deep in melee, not to mention the Knight's incredible zone control with Implacable Mark and just how difficult it is to unseat the Knight due to Born in the Saddle makes for a pretty powerful combo.

I'm sure we've all joked about the Halfling using a party member as a mount, but I'm convinced this is the best implementation of the build, as your mount is an S-tier 9th level spellcaster with a fully loaded array of PC abilities in the times when you don't need it, and can become any of a menagerie of beasts on command when combat does start.

So here's my question to you, GiTP.
How do we iterate on this?
What Wild Shapes should the Moon Druid be looking at?
Are there additional synergies we should be aiming to incorporate?
Should we buy the DM beer for what we're about to put him through?

[PeteNutButter]

Generally the druid just goes bear (Brown or Cave/Polar) form until he hits CR 3 creatures. Dinosaurs start to get better, then earth elemental.

Mounted Combatant is a must for the rider, and if you want to do dual wield lance cheese you need dual wielder feat as well, making variant human an almost must-have. IMO the rider is better off using a shield for more AC, since he can direct all attacks towards himself. Also the rider may have to spend some rounds taking the ready action, waiting for the druid to move up, meaning that off-hand lance attack does nothing.

The druid can benefit from free evasion, and NEVER being attacked. Sentinel feat is another great way to cheese for the druid, as he is almost guaranteed to get that attack, as even if foes "try" to attack him they are still attacking the rider.

All in all a solid cheesy combo. I prefer the rider to be a paladin as his auras are always affecting the druid, and the advantage from mounted combatant makes crit smites more often.

[Flashy]

It's also worth remembering that the lance suffers disadvantage on melee attacks within 5 ft, so larger forms for the Druid are always better since they'll allow the rider to overcome the disadvantage against large sized enemies.

I'll also second Paladin given how often the rider is likely to need to take the ready action while they wait for the Druid to advance on their turn.

[Jamesps]

All in all a solid cheesy combo. I prefer the rider to be a paladin as his auras are always affecting the druid, and the advantage from mounted combatant makes crit smites more often.

A rogue might also be good, though you couldn't use the lance. Always having advantage, and being able to do all your damage with one attack is pretty handy when you're holding your action to wait for the druid to engage. You'd have to do something about rogue defenses, but a single level in a shield using class would help with that.

[nickl_2000]

So, if you were the Moon Druid in this scenario. What feats would you consider at level 4? Say one that already has Large size shapes like Cow, Draft Horse, Riding Horse, Tiger, Warhorse, and Zanskaran Viper,

(now I'm imaging he man riding the Moon Druid as a tiger).

Mobile? Sentinel? Something else?

[Flashy]

A rogue might also be good, though you couldn't use the lance. Always having advantage, and being able to do all your damage with one attack is pretty handy when you're holding your action to wait for the druid to engage. You'd have to do something about rogue defenses, but a single level in a shield using class would help with that.

Having recently tried a mounted rogue it's...okay. I've found you run into a lot more large opponents than you'd expect simply because that's a pretty popular size for creatures in the monster manual.

[MidgetMarine]

Paladin would have totally been our first choice, the only reason for erring towards fighter is that this is a group I've been playing with for years and years and the Fighter has yet to play a single Martial Character with no Casting or SLAs, so this build came out of us trying to approach a non-casting tank from an interesting direction. I'll reconsider it though, as it is a really potent combo.
Perhaps Knight Fighter 3 for Implacable Mark and then crossing back into Paladin would be a better idea, Action Surge, Implacable Mark & Born in the Saddle are all really useful, though fighter's ASIs are worth considering.

Sentinel on the Druid is definitely something we've considered, but Sentinel feels underwhelming when not paired with Tunnel Fighter, and dipping for that costs the druid Wild Shape power and spellcasting progression. Though Implacable Mark + Sentinel Tunnel Fighter + Mounted Combatant do make a hilarious effective Zone Control Tank between the two characters.

[MidgetMarine]

As for the "ready" action, we looked at this, and realized that it was more likely for the Fighter to simply Delay his turn and reinsert himself back into the initiative after his mount in most scenarios, as awkward as that can be if he goes first.
When going after the Druid, it's far less of an issue.

[Aett_Thorn]

As for the "ready" action, we looked at this, and realized that it was more likely for the Fighter to simply Delay his turn and reinsert himself back into the initiative after his mount in most scenarios, as awkward as that can be if he goes first.
When going after the Druid, it's far less of an issue.

Well if you're allowing that, then I'll offer up a really odd choice for the "Tank" part of this combo: Monk. Sure, you don't get Lances, but a Spear is on the Monk list, so it will still end up doing decent damage. Who cares if most of of the Monk features don't seem to make any sense if you're riding bear-back (sorry for the pun), it might be a fun little pairing. If you get Mounted Combatant, you can force any missile weapon attack against the Druid to go to you instead, and then deflect it. You both get Evasion with that feat, too.

You get to stab people with the spear, and then kick them with your riding boots. Open Hand is probably the best tradition for you, as knocking enemies prone helps both you and your mount out.

Sure, you don't get the great AC of a Plate+Shield fighter, but depending on starting stats, you won't be bad off.

[nickl_2000]

As for good beasts

CR1 and below: Crag Cat, Dire Wolf, Giant Spider, Tiger, Lion, Warhorse, Riding Horse
CR2: Giant Boar, Giant Elk, and most others frankly
CR 3+: pretty much anything

[MidgetMarine]

Well if you're allowing that, then I'll offer up a really odd choice for the "Tank" part of this combo: Monk. Sure, you don't get Lances, but a Spear is on the Monk list, so it will still end up doing decent damage. Who cares if most of of the Monk features don't seem to make any sense if you're riding bear-back (sorry for the pun), it might be a fun little pairing. If you get Mounted Combatant, you can force any missile weapon attack against the Druid to go to you instead, and then deflect it. You both get Evasion with that feat, too.

You get to stab people with the spear, and then kick them with your riding boots. Open Hand is probably the best tradition for you, as knocking enemies prone helps both you and your mount out.

Sure, you don't get the great AC of a Plate+Shield fighter, but depending on starting stats, you won't be bad off.

Here would be my arguments for Fighter over Monk:
To be effective as a an off-tank on this Druid, we're going to be wanting a decently high Con and Str, and pushing it to Monk requires us to start looking at Dex and Wis as our ways of getting an effective AC since we can't plate up.
This makes it less efficient to use Mounted Combatant since the delta between your AC and your Druid's will be less large and therefore less worth using because we know we have less Ability Score points due to at least 1 feat, if not more.
Monk's Missile Deflection is useful, for sure, but I'm not sure it outweighs the sheer defensive speed of the Knight. Being able to inflict disadvantage to protect both your mount and the rest of your party helps keep enemy aggro focused exactly where you want it, on you. Fighter's hit point total is higher and Two Weapon Fighting style (along with the feat) helps make your lance attacks even more effective.
The issue with using unarmed strikes is that once the wild shapes start growing in size, the Monk starts losing out of on target selection while the Fighter can still use 2 reach weapons to peel effectively.
Over all I think Paladin or Fighter would be the most efficient classes, as they provide the greatest defensive boon, which is really all you want when your build is centered around wading into melee with your primary caster and tanking for them.

[Mortis_Elrod]

Two things


1. Have you considered Barbarian. Any would do for this, there are a few benefits you would enjoy. Ancestral Gaurdian would be top notch, on a mounted combatant. Rage means you only lose out on a little damage with two lances, and you make up for that even more with resistances, and the AC wouldn't be as far behind as Monk.

2. What if you go one step above? Put one more person on top. What happens when you have a say an archer or buffer on top of a barbarian, on top of a moondruid ????

[MidgetMarine]

Two things


1. Have you considered Barbarian. Any would do for this, there are a few benefits you would enjoy. Ancestral Gaurdian would be top notch, on a mounted combatant. Rage means you only lose out on a little damage with two lances, and you make up for that even more with resistances, and the AC wouldn't be as far behind as Monk.

2. What if you go one step above? Put one more person on top. What happens when you have a say an archer or buffer on top of a barbarian, on top of a moondruid ????

1. Barbarian was considered, but I think it has the same problems as Monk in that while not being actively bad, Paladin and Fighter offer more consistent advantages to the Druid. Barbarian is better when you can split off from the party to mano-e-mano a problematic enemy, it's a lot easier to drop your rage when you're mounted.

2. I'm playing the party buffer/battle field control mage as a Stone Sorcerer/Hexblade Warrior.
The issue is that unless you're another Mounted Combatant tank, you don't really want to be on top. I want to be able to skirmish around the Druid and Fighter, or operate from a range while they Zone Control. The duo's purpose is to clog up the enemy's frontline while allowing the support and artillery to function without as much pressure.