Can you wish to have your spell slots refilled?

[Sapreaver]

Topic title lol just curious

[ColorBlindNinja]

Technically, Wish can do anything, but that would fall into the "unsafe" Wish effects, and thus your DM could potentially screw you over.

You could Wish for Spell Engine to swap you prepared spells, but doesn't refill your spell slots. Edit: That would be a safe Wish.

Edit 2: You can cast Absorption, and then have an ally with an SLA at will use it on you. That effectively refills your spell slots.

[CharonsHelper]

Technically, Wish can do anything, but that would fall into the "unsafe" Wish effects, and thus your DM could potentially screw you over.


Yeah - as DM I'd probably do something where your slots are refilled, but they're all refilled with Identify. Or you don't know what spells they are until you cast them (needing to choose a target before you know).

etc.

[ColorBlindNinja]

Yeah - as DM I'd probably do something where your slots are refilled, but they're all refilled with Identify. Or you don't know what spells they are until you cast them (needing to choose a target before you know).

etc.

If that player paid 5000 XP for that wish, they might chuck something at you.

[RoboEmperor]

Technically, Wish can do anything, but that would fall into the "unsafe" Wish effects, and thus your DM could potentially screw you over.

You could Wish for Spell Engine to swap you prepared spells, but doesn't refill your spell slots. Edit: That would be a safe Wish.

Edit 2: You can cast Absorption, and then have an ally with an SLA at will use it on you. That effectively refills your spell slots.

Absorption doesn't refill your spell slots. It creates a pool of energy you can use to cast spells with. i.e. if you absorb 9 spell levels, you can use it to cast a prepared Dominate Monster without it disappearing from your prepared spell list, but it does not make spells you already cast reappear onto your prepared spell list.

[CharonsHelper]

If that player paid 5000 XP for that wish, they might chuck something at you.

1. Blame the monkey's paw.

2. I generally play Pathfinder and the OP didn't specify - so I was just thinking the 25k diamond

[Segev]

You are best off finding a spell effect that wish can safely mimic to get what you want. Because yes, it can do it, but it is vulnerable to twisting. That said, if the player is really burning the material/xp cost (depending on edition), I'd probably let it go at least the first time, as long as he wasn't utterly stupid in how he worded it. To warn him that it might twist unpleasantly if he abused it, I might do something like tell him that he finds himself waking up in his sanctum, refreshed, with his spellbook ready to go for preparation. When he finished preparing, he'd snap back to where he was when he made the wish, and I wouldn't tell him this was going to happen until he was done preparing.

The second time, I'd twist it again, still in a way that gets him (mostly) what he wants, but differently, just to make sure he understands that using reality-warping magic this way is not the safest thing in the world.

[ColorBlindNinja]

Absorption doesn't refill your spell slots. It creates a pool of energy you can use to cast spells with. i.e. if you absorb 9 spell levels, you can use it to cast a prepared Dominate Monster without it disappearing from your prepared spell list, but it does not make spells you already cast reappear onto your prepared spell list.

I know that, but it's the closest method I can think of to refill spell slots.

[Aracor]

I know that, but it's the closest method I can think of to refill spell slots.
I'd just allow partial fulfillment. Simply have it mimic a higher level version of mnemonic enhancer, and allow them to prepare an addition 7 levels of spells. That's absolutely within the power of wish.

Somewhat off-topic: I don't understand why people always want to screw over the wish so badly. It's a 9th level spell that costs 5,000 experience points or 25,000 gold pieces. Give them a fair return on that, assuming they're casting it themselves. If they're binding efreeti or something, then go nuts and monkey's paw it.

[Fouredged Sword]

I would have a crystal of arcane might appear in his or her hands. I would inform the character that is practically throbs with wild and unsafe magic. If they choose to use it it restores all spent spell slots as if by pearls of power. The crystal then crumbles to dust. I tell them their magic circuits feel overcharged and raw, and that drawing on their magic feels painful on a fundamental level. If they choose to cast any spell from a previously expended spell slot it burns, locking the slot for spell level days. 1st level spells would be unable to be restored the next day, but available the day after that. 9th level spells would require 8 hours of rest a day for 9 days to allow themselves to be filled again.

I feel this strikes the right balance between "You get what you asked for" and "This has a cost." without screwing the player over with randomness. You borrow from your future spells, with a significant loss.

Yes, you could get double your spells for a day. In return it cost you and hurt you in a way that would take a Faerun week to recover from.

[Afgncaap5]

If that player paid 5000 XP for that wish, they might chuck something at you.

I think that's part of the difference for me, actually.

If a player has just cast wish, ie. used the mechanical spell Wish, including spell slot and XP expenditure, in order to gain more game resources (more spell slots) then I would definitely, absolutely consider the ramifications of those refilled slots (I'd probably refill slots of up to fifth level automatically, and then maybe refill slots for sixth, seventh, and eighth level spells with randomly picked things.)

However... if a player is at a crucial portion of the game's story, and isn't using a wish mechanically but is actually appealing to the flavor of wish by finding a plot mcguffin that lets him or her plea to a super-genie or otherworldly being for aid right when it's most needed... well, absolutely. Take back those spell slots and get back into the battle. Make 'em em maximized while we're at it, no charge.

[icefractal]

I'd have it refill one of each level up to 8th.

Reasoning:
Wish cost: equivalent to 25k gp
One shot vs 1/day: 1/8th the cost
1st-8th Pearl of Power: 204k / 8 = 25.5k
Close enough

That's assuming a non-malicious granter.

[inuyasha]

If you're at such a high level that you can cast wish, and you actually manage to run out of spells, I'd allow that wish to work no problem. There's twisting, which can be fun, but then there's just being mean. I wouldn't allow it to restore the slot used for the wish though, and might even limit it to just 8th or 7th level spells and lower.

[Psyren]

I'd say this is unsafe because it is strictly better than the 8th-level spell Greater Spell Absorption, thus you are creating an effect greater than that spell.


I'd just allow partial fulfillment. Simply have it mimic a higher level version of mnemonic enhancer, and allow them to prepare an addition 7 levels of spells. That's absolutely within the power of wish.

Somewhat off-topic: I don't understand why people always want to screw over the wish so badly. It's a 9th level spell that costs 5,000 experience points or 25,000 gold pieces. Give them a fair return on that, assuming they're casting it themselves. If they're binding efreeti or something, then go nuts and monkey's paw it.

Pathfinder actually has a guideline like this - it says that there is a sliding scale of "screw you over probability" for wishes depending on the source (e.g. a deity, your own power, a magic item and a bound outsider.) I'm trying to find the book that guideline is in.

Also. to be honest, if you don't want your wishes screwed over then wishing for force multipliers like refilling your spell slots or wishing for more wishes is not the way to go about it. I think it's useful as a desperation tactic if the dice went against you last combat and you ended up burning through more spell slots than you intended to before the big showdown, but I like the "random spells" idea as a way to keep that from being a go-to strategy. If you want wishes to go off without a hitch, the best way is to simply use Wish as "Super Anyspell" for that one high-level effect you really need but nobody else prepared or can cast. Stuff like "oh crap, three people just got obliterated by bad saves and one of them was the cleric, we need a resurrection or time rewind pronto." Or "oh crap, we've got to find the macguffin now and can't wait for a night's rest, gimme a Discern Location". If you stick to duplicating existing spells, Wish is still powerful, but no more powerful than simply preparing those spells would have been so balance is less of a concern.

[Slithery D]

Pathfinder actually has a guideline like this - it says that there is a sliding scale of "screw you over probability" for wishes depending on the source (e.g. a deity, your own power, a magic item and a bound outsider.) I'm trying to find the book that guideline is in.


It's a backmatter article in The Last Wish, volume 6 in Legacy of Fire, the last AP they published with 3.5 rules.

[Psyren]

It's a backmatter article in The Last Wish, volume 6 in Legacy of Fire, the last AP they published with 3.5 rules.

Nah, they reprinted it in a PF source; it's in one of my books, and I don't have that AP. I'll keep digging.

EDIT: I found it - Gamemastery Guide pg. 116, there's a whole section there on adjudicating wish.

[Crake]

Yeah - as DM I'd probably do something where your slots are refilled, but they're all refilled with Identify. Or you don't know what spells they are until you cast them (needing to choose a target before you know).

etc.

Even if they worded it more specifically, something like "I wish to regain the prepared spells I have cast today" instead of just "I wish to refill my spell slots"

[Cosi]

Think at the very least you should be able to wish for an 8th level spell slot back. That doesn't seem notably better than emulating an 8th level spell, and that is something wish can do. Given that, you could reasonably argue for being allowed to fill multiple lower slots instead of the basis of the functioning of Psionics or the Spell Points variant.

I think it's probably balanced to give more, but that runs into a problem with wish as a whole -- not all wishes come from slots. Cast by a PC paying the costs, it's probably fair. Essentially, you give up the bulk of the day's XP to avoid resting. It seems hard to argue that's broken. On the other hand, it also means that if you can cast planar binding, you never run out of spell slots.

[BWR]

You can wish for whatever you want, it probably won't come true just by wishing. You can Wish anything you want but the results may not be as intended. I would allow one or more low-level slots to be filled, at least a total of 9 spell levels, maybe as many as 18 since you are paying a hefty sum of xp or gold (depending on system). All of them only in very strange circumstances or with significant side effects.

[icefractal]

I think it's probably balanced to give more, but that runs into a problem with wish as a whole -- not all wishes come from slots. Cast by a PC paying the costs, it's probably fair. Essentially, you give up the bulk of the day's XP to avoid resting. It seems hard to argue that's broken. On the other hand, it also means that if you can cast planar binding, you never run out of spell slots.Wish without the cost is already fundamentally broken. It can give you unlimited magic items, minions, and personal power, for instance. Sure, some people use it for less broken stuff, but really that's like being Pun-Pun and choosing to only make yourself the equivalent of a War Troll - it's purely an arbitrary stopping point.

Therefore, balance Wish results with the cost in mind, and ban free Wishes unless you want a freeform deity+ game.

Or make Wish more limited, as PF does, but that ends up a bit underwhelming - more of an emergency utility spell than real ultimate power.

[Cosi]

Wish without the cost is already fundamentally broken.

Not really. Unbounded wish for items without paying the XP cost is fundamentally broken. The real issue is that the game is bad at pricing minions. Also genies are weird.