Help with building my bard

[IIzak]

So I've recently jumped into 5e, coming from 3.5 and I was very happy to see the changes made to the bard class, so I picked it up and started running with it. I've gotten all the way to level 3 and chose to be a lore bard because I'm a fan of the flavor and the spellcasting that it gives, plus our party needed some sort of dedicated caster. I've heard from my DM and from looking up some stuff that the capstone for bard isn't great, so its a good idea to multiclass into something else, which is what I'd like to do. I'm thinking of going with 2 levels of warlock, however I don't know when to take them. Do I take them as my level 4 and 5 and delay my ability score bonus and increase in bardic inspiration die, along with missing out on higher level spells? or should I wait until later? I don't know what would be better since I'm not as familiar with the system. Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.

[Specter]

If you do multiclass (which you may not need if the campaign doesn't reach 20), do it after level 5. 3rd-level spells and short-rest inspiration shouldn't be delayed.

[KnotaGuru]

I'm playing a 14th level lore bard. He's fricking awesome! MC really hurts your bard progression and I'd advise against it. You'll be fine as a straight lore bard. Most campaigns don't make it to level 20 anyway. Bard has a lot of class features mid-game and magical secrets allows you to shore up any weaknesses. I play my bard as a controller who shuts enemies down. My magical secret spells (in the order I selected them): counterspell, conjure animals, spiritual weapon, wall of force, circle of power, simulacrum. Find familiar would've been my choice instead spiritual weapon, but the party had that covered. After boosting CHA to 20, I took the spell sniper feat for eldritch blast. I was going to take inspiring leader, but our party had that covered. Alert was other choice. I use my inspiration dice mainly for cutting words to reroll DM crits or initiative. I have an instrument of the bards and use hypnotic pattern a lot, emenies have disadvantage on the save since it's a charm effect. I'm a halfelf and have a ton of skills with expertise in perception, persuasion, arcana, investigation. Stealth would've been a good choice instead of arcana but our group isn't very stealthy and we're lacking an arcane expert. Lore bards don't do much for damage, but that's not their job. I usually cast a debilitating concentration spell, that see what needs to be done in the following rounds. I can deal respectable damage with spiritual weapon and eldritch blast, or use the help/dodge action. Vicious mockery was my go to in the early/mid levels and still use it from time to time if I've got nothing better to do.

[Theodoxus]

Depending on your stats, my recommendation is Life Cleric. Lore Bard has a big glaring problem: lack of adequate defense.

Life Cleric's healing boon is icing on the cake (making you one of the best healers in the game, and freeing up 3+ spells (bless being obtainable only from magical secrets normally) and adding 3 cantrips that can boost your offense (sacred flame to add a Dex save to compliment the Wis save from Vicious Mockery) as well as guidance (highly useful, and since it's Concentration, having multiple in the party is never a waste).. Spare the Dying helps if you don't have a decent Medicine, Mending if your DM is a stickler on gear wear and tear, or even Thaumaturgy to augment your bardic performances.

Adding a shield to a bard is just iconic to me, YMMV. Having access to medium and heavy armor boosts your survivability.

In one game I'm playing, I went Cleric 1/Bard 3, while the other bard (yeah, we ended up with 2 bards...) went straight Bard 4. But he has to stay in the back, playing controller while I get to melee in my breastplate, with rapier and shield. He has swapped out his healing spells for more offense and control; I keep our paladin alive with well timed Healing Words and between the paladin and I, keep the whole party Blessed when facing a challenge.

It's by far my favorite full caster build I've played (after trying out Life Cleric 10, Land Druid 5 and Wizard 4).

I get the appeal of warlock 2, and if you need the boost to arcane power, totally go for it, but I definitely recommend looking at a single cleric dip. It's really good.

[nickl_2000]

As others have mentioned it really depends on your play style.

A dip of 2 levels into Warlock can give you some interested options for Invocations or give you blasting with EB and Hex
A dip of 2 levels into Cleric gives you more staying power with better armor and sword and shield

(note, this can be a problem if you have a DM who cares about free hands for casting. A bard's focus needs to be a musical instrument and you need a free hand for somatic components. If your DM doesn't care, go nuts)

A several level dip into sorcerer can give you sorcery points, which are awesome.

[Galactkaktus]

If you are going to multiclass do it after you've gotten 3rd level spells.

[lunaticfringe]

If you are going to multiclass do it after you've gotten 3rd level spells.

Yup. So Bard 5, but you get additional Magical Secrets @ 6 so if it were me I'd wait till then. That's if you are Multiclassing Warlock.

If you decide to MC another Full Caster class I would do so at Bard 5. The reason is because you would be a 8th level Spellcaster with a 4th level slots when you took your 6th Level of Bard. That gives you more options for your Additional Magical Secrets.

[Galactkaktus]

I'm guessing that the two levels of warlock is for eldritch blast with agonizing blast. With that in mind is it maybe more useful to take 9 levels of bard first to be just in time for the three beams version? Is the one beam and two beam version worth the slower early spellprogression?

[lunaticfringe]

I'm guessing that the two levels of warlock is for eldritch blast with agonizing blast. With that in mind is it maybe more useful to take 9 levels of bard first to be just in time for the three beams version? Is the one beam and two beam version worth the slower early spellprogression?

A very valid point. Depends on the party and most importantly Player Enjoyment. The Lore Bard is potent but I have noticed players finding the lower tiers a slog. You don't get a whole lot combat glory. Depending on spell choice you can get stuck with very little to do while concentrating on an important spell except spamming Vicious Mockery against a target that keeps making saves.

It can be frustrating for some. Agonizing Eldritch Blast @ Character level 7-8 makes you the equivalent of a Fighter chucking Pikes 150ft. Which can help a lot in alleviating Support/Control Caster feelings of combat impotency.

At the end of the day i don't think matters too much, this is 5e. You pretty much have to actively try to **** up your toon.

[kingheff1]

I'd say a single level dip into fighter will get you a lot of survivability and is probably worth taking at level four before going back to pure bard, though action surge might be a tempting bonus later on.
Getting medium armour, shields and martial weapons gives you a lot more options.
I'm guessing your Dex is decent, so a breastplate plus a shield and the defence fighting style gets you a very respectful 19 AC which will come in very handy when your opponents get up in your face.

[KnotaGuru]

I'd say a single level dip into fighter will get you a lot of survivability and is probably worth taking at level four before going back to pure bard, though action surge might be a tempting bonus later on.
Getting medium armour, shields and martial weapons gives you a lot more options.
I'm guessing your Dex is decent, so a breastplate plus a shield and the defence fighting style gets you a very respectful 19 AC which will come in very handy when your opponents get up in your face.

1 level in cleric is a better dip for armor proficiencies. Can maintain full spell slot progression with some extra spells/cantrips to boot. Does require a 13 Wisdom though, not many bards have it that high, especially with point buy.

[MarkVIIIMarc]

My Lore Bard is Level 5. Each level has given more more toolz. I have looked forward to all, especially Level 6 and the additional magic secrets.
Level 7 I think it is looks blah. I had considered a Level or two of Warlock for roleplay and EB if I don't magical secrets it or Rogue for melee and skills.

Still eventually I'd end up having to take that blah Bard upgrade to 7 to make it to more neat levels.

[KnotaGuru]

My Lore Bard is Level 5. Each level has given more more toolz. I have looked forward to all, especially Level 6 and the additional magic secrets.
Level 7 I think it is looks blah. I had considered a Level or two of Warlock for roleplay and EB if I don't magical secrets it or Rogue for melee and skills.

Still eventually I'd end up having to take that blah Bard upgrade to 7 to make it to more neat levels.

True that level 7 (and level 11) aren't exciting, but you do gain access to 4th & 6th level spells, respectively, and you'll only need 1 more level for an ASI. The higher level magical secrets (levels 10, 14, & 18) are just too good to wait for by delaying bard progression with MC. Wall of force, simulacrum, wish...

[Yagyujubei]

personally, since I like skill monkey builds alot I think knowledge cleric would be a nice dip. yeah warlock is great for solid at-will dmg but if your party doesn't need that then I dont see it as being required. Life cleric is also a valid choice for some extra healing. but I like the idea of extra skill masteries and being able to be proficient with literally any tool/skill in the game when you need it in a pinch. I'm more of an out of combat guy though so its just my preference.