Master Thrower and Splash Weapons

[creakyaccordion]

Hey y'all! I was just wondering if Master Thrower's Throw Tricks work with splash weapons as well as more "normal" throwing weapons, and if so are there any builds that could make a splash weapon slinging Master Thrower work? Obviously a build like this wouldn't be optimized but I more just wanted to know if a build like this would significantly lag behind other players.

[Gruftzwerg]

Imho it would depend on the specific splash weapons entry and description.

E.g. Alchemist's Fire:
while being a "splash weapon", it fails to be a "martial/ranged weapon". You can't use it in melee like other ranged weapons and so on. So, you can assume that the tricks won't work either.

But if you could find a "real" weapon that just happens to be also a splash weapon, it would work (dunno if there is such a weapon?).

Regarding the optimization:
If your intention is a thrower build, there are ways to optimize em with Bloodstorm Blade. BSB let's your ranged attacks count as melee and enables ubercharger cheese for throwing builds. Have a look at my top 3 signature builds. They are all somehow ranged and are highly optimized at what they do.

But can't say much about splash weapons in general as said. If you can specify the splash weapon I could say maybe more.

[Zsaber0]

I believe complete adventurer has rules for putting alchemical items inside vials inside weapons. That might be helpful.

[creakyaccordion]

How do the bombs in the renaissance weapons section of the DMG fair in regard to this splash weapon/real weapon stuff?

[Lvl 2 Expert]

I would allow it, unless anyone has a RAW written thing that explicitly forbids it. It's a weapon, and it's thrown. Good enough for me. The Pathfinder alchemist also gets bonuses to his bomb throws from thrown weapon feats, as far as I know.

[Gruftzwerg]

How do the bombs in the renaissance weapons section of the DMG fair in regard to this splash weapon/real weapon stuff?

could you give me the page? I can't seem to find it^^.

To explain it in another ways:
Most important part is, which kind of attack roll is involved, since feats/abilities that enhance "attacks" don't normally work for "touch attacks". The same can be said about "spash weapons", if they use a (melee/ranged) tough attack it won't work with most stuff. But if it has a regular attack roll, it is open for all regular improvements.

Imho that is the more important part to keep track of. Other than that, just just need to be aware of abilities/feats that only work with certain weapon types (e.g.: light, melee, ranged, piercing..).

[Drakevarg]

How do the bombs in the renaissance weapons section of the DMG fair in regard to this splash weapon/real weapon stuff?

Alchemist's fire is a thrown object; it's listed on an adventuring gear table. Bombs are thrown weapons; they're listed on a weapons table.

[creakyaccordion]

Alchemist's fire is a thrown object; it's listed on an adventuring gear table. Bombs are thrown weapons; they're listed on a weapons table.

So the Master Thrower's tricks would technically apply to bombs?

[Drakevarg]

So the Master Thrower's tricks would technically apply to bombs?

Near as I can tell, yes. It might necessitate deliberately lobbing bombs at people's heads rather than just the square they're standing in, but once it goes off that's rather moot.

[SirNibbles]

Splash weapons are generally bad. You could use them with 4 levels of Alchemical Savant, a PrC from Magic of Eberron, page 53 to have your splash weapons also trigger (targeted) spells.

In that case, you'd be able to essentially cast as many spells in a round as you could throw alchemical splash weapons. Alchemist's Fire of Shivering Touch sounds pretty nice when you're throwing half a dozen every round.

I'd avoid Master Thrower since its abilities don't synchronise well with splash weapons and it has steep entry requirements.

Mystic Ranger 6/Alchemical Savant 4 is the fastest way I can think to qualify with maximum BAB (using Sword of the Arcane Order from Champions of Valor, page 34). It also gives you quite a nice list of spells (5th level Ranger and Wizard spells).

[DrMotives]

The only splash /melee weapon I'm aware of is the aspergillum, which was in some 3.0 splatbooks but not 3.5 as far as I can remember. It's a simple weapon though, so nearly everyone is already proficient. Basically a mace with reservoir in the haft, and holes in the head to allow holy water to sprinkle out when you shake it. In real life they're used to sprinkle things with holy water, but other liquids can be used to fill the things.