PDA

View Full Version : Collegiate Wizard



BardicDuelist
2007-08-10, 12:20 PM
Out of curiosity, is there really any reason to not take this (except for the obvious RP reason of not having gone to a wizarding colledge)?

Fax Celestis
2007-08-10, 12:21 PM
IIRC, it prevents you from specializing.

Manave_E_Sulanul
2007-08-10, 12:22 PM
Care to explain, Fax? I don't have my book on hand, and I don't recall that.

Fax Celestis
2007-08-10, 12:32 PM
I r le wrong.

Looks like the only downside is that you don't get any opener metamagics.

Ulzgoroth
2007-08-10, 12:32 PM
I don't see any indication of that...

Um, there's the usual reason. It costs a feat. The same reason as you'd have for not taking weapon focus. Though it's certainly better.

bosssmiley
2007-08-10, 12:34 PM
Collegiate Wizard (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Collegiate_Wizard,CAr)

:smallconfused:

Looks pretty good, 2 extra spells known/lvl, and the Knowledge(Arcana) buff is a nice little fillip. Nothing about it being restricted to generalists though...

Manave_E_Sulanul
2007-08-10, 12:35 PM
Whew. But yes, Collegiate Wizard really is one of those things you really just ought to take if you are role playing something appropriate. I'm not as much of a fan of Precocious Apprentice though.

But then, I tend to have bad luck rolling the check for that, if I recall.

Recursive
2007-08-10, 01:13 PM
Out of curiosity, is there really any reason to not take this (except for the obvious RP reason of not having gone to a wizarding colledge)?
Since you ask for reasons not to take it, I'll play devil's advocate:


If magic scrolls are freely available for purchase, then you could just buy and scribe two extra spells per level...so essentially you've traded a feat slot for some cash. That might be really convenient when your wizard is going through a cash-starved phase, but in the long run money is replaceable and feats aren't.

Granted, you also get a watered-down version of Skill Focus: Knowledge (arcana), but it can't be used as a prereq for prestige classes like an actual Skill Focus feat could.

Now, with devil's advocate mode turned off, let me say that I actually love this feat. Great flavor for any research-oriented wizard, college-educamated or not. The knowledge bonus stacks with skill focus, so a real know-it-all scholar can take both...and the extra spells are highly valuable in campaigns where magic is mysterious and not available at your corner spell shop.

Fax Celestis
2007-08-10, 01:16 PM
It also means you have one feat less with which to qualify for PrCs.

Tellah
2007-08-10, 01:26 PM
Assuming that you'd be filling up your spellbook by copying them (for a fee) from other Wizards' spellbooks, the feat saves a Wizard 58,800 gp by the time he hits 20. That's pretty decent, I think.

Pink
2007-08-10, 01:48 PM
Assuming that you'd be filling up your spellbook by copying them (for a fee) from other Wizards' spellbooks, the feat saves a Wizard 58,800 gp by the time he hits 20. That's pretty decent, I think.

It'd be a foolish wizard who doesn't get a blessed book as soon as possible to reduce that fee.

Morty
2007-08-10, 02:03 PM
It'd be a foolish wizard who doesn't get a blessed book as soon as possible to reduce that fee.

Or a wizard who doesn't want to buy ridiculous magic items just to be even more overpowered.
As for Collegiate Wizard, it's seriously overpowered feat. It saves a lot of money and effort, and is even stronger if your DM is stingy about scrolls.

Saph
2007-08-10, 02:13 PM
That's not even the best thing about the feat. The best thing is that it makes the wizard no more dependent than any other class on getting to town.

Many campaigns feature long stretches in dungeons/the wilderness/other hostile areas where you can't go shopping. Wizards are normally at a disadvantage doing this, because they only get two spells with each level up and can't develop the big spellbook which gives them so much of their effectiveness. But with Collegiate Wizard, they get four, which is enough to cover most bases.

- Saph

Pink
2007-08-10, 02:17 PM
Hmmm...If this somehow stacked with the elf generalist wizard, that'd be overpowered. Course no possible way for it to stack like that by it's wording, just a thought.

I actually like that generalist wizard variant, so upon hearing about this, I like this feat as well. More spells is always good. It's a power boost sure, however knowing spells only does so much in the long run. You still need to prepare them, to pick only a handful of them to memorize.

Fax Celestis
2007-08-10, 02:18 PM
Hmmm...If this somehow stacked with the elf generalist wizard, that'd be overpowered. Course no possible way for it to stack like that by it's wording, just a thought.

I actually like that generalist wizard variant, so upon hearing about this, I like this feat as well. More spells is always good. It's a power boost sure, however knowing spells only does so much in the long run. You still need to prepare them, to pick only a handful of them to memorize.

And why doesn't it stack?

Pink
2007-08-10, 02:21 PM
Well, the feat doesn't stack so much as replaces it. The feat doesn't say double the spells added to spellbook each level, it says it bumps up to four, specifically. The only thing that'd remain of the variant is that bonus highest level spell slot.

psychoticbarber
2007-08-10, 02:23 PM
The only question I have is "Why didn't somebody tell me about this feat sooner?" :smallbiggrin:

Tellah
2007-08-10, 03:00 PM
Well, the feat doesn't stack so much as replaces it. The feat doesn't say double the spells added to spellbook each level, it says it bumps up to four, specifically. The only thing that'd remain of the variant is that bonus highest level spell slot.

I'm running an elf generalist with Collegiate Wizard right now, and we've ruled that it stacks. He gets five spells each level--two for being a wizard, one for elfism, and two for Collegiate Wizard. Is this not the correct interpretation?

Arbitrarity
2007-08-10, 03:02 PM
Wrong order if you want that to work. 2 base, switch to 4 for collegiate, add one for elven generalist. :smallbiggrin:

Cause Collegiate sets spells/level at 4, instead of 2, not adds 2, or doubles.

Pink
2007-08-10, 03:02 PM
My mistake. I thought elf wizard had it set as three instead of 2. In reality it's one bonus.

I really need to stop working from memory.

Fhaolan
2007-08-10, 03:25 PM
Wow. That's a seriously good feat. I never noticed that one before.

It really points out that the various officially published feats do vary a lot in the cost/benefit analysis, though. I've got a weird idea... I'm going to start a new topic for it, though, so as to not completely derail this one.

TheOOB
2007-08-10, 03:25 PM
It's a nice feat, but it doesn't really let you do anything you couldn't do, or make you more powerful then you could be without the feat. It's a nice feat, saves lots of money, but the feat could also be a metamagic feat or spell focus or something.

Seatbelt
2007-08-10, 03:31 PM
The Wizard in my Ravenloft game is using it, because I dont give out much in the way of loot. My players are equiped as 6th level characters, are 10th level characters, and adventure as if they were 12th level characters, and they do ok.

Clove
2007-08-10, 11:59 PM
Eh, I wouldn't take it.

You'll find enemy spellbooks on the corpses of evil spellcasters anyways, right? Cost=Free

And if you aren't spoon-fed an evil spellcaster, your party can always seek one out. You would do this to slay and evil-doer of course... with the added benefit of getting the wizard some new toys.

The only campaign that I see this being useful in would be an extremely low magic campaign where magic is truely rare.

And if it is that bad, you might consider just being a Sorceror instead.

Pink
2007-08-11, 12:02 AM
You'll find enemy spellbooks on the corpses of evil spellcasters anyways, right? Cost=Free

Actually, first you have to decipher, then you have to copy (which costs time) and then there is the 100 gp per page cost.

ClericofPhwarrr
2007-08-11, 12:16 AM
You'll find enemy spellbooks on the corpses of evil spellcasters anyways, right? Cost=Free
Sure, unless they're a cleric, or a druid, or a sorcerer, or a warmage, or...

CasESenSITItiVE
2007-08-11, 12:44 AM
Sure, unless they're a cleric, or a druid, or a sorcerer, or a warmage, or...

ya, but the subject is saving money for the wizard for not having to copy spells

Manave_E_Sulanul
2007-08-11, 01:42 AM
I ran a Loremaster with this feat. The skill bonus was nice and what is said about being out in the wilderness is very true. Those extra spells saved my life.

Jack Mann
2007-08-11, 01:47 AM
I'm playing a gestalt wizard//archivist. Only needing to purchase spells for one side helps out immensely.

I wish I'd had it in other games, where there was a dearth of downtime and ability to purchase new spells.

EndgamerAzari
2007-08-11, 11:57 PM
I too am beginning a gestalt wizard, though mine is a shadowcaster. The odd thing, though... I saw this feat, thought: "Cool, I'll show the DM this, he's got Complete Arcane".... guess what? It's not in there.

Pink
2007-08-12, 12:01 AM
It's in a variant bar on some other page than with the main feats. at a wild stab...148? Somewhere in the hundreds at the bottom of some page. Too lazy to look myself atm.

Jack Mann
2007-08-12, 12:52 AM
A bit further on towards the end of the hundreds, actually, on page 181 along with precocious apprentice.

TheOOB
2007-08-12, 01:19 AM
One must wonder how that layout got past the editors.

MeklorIlavator
2007-08-12, 01:44 AM
One must wonder how that layout got past the editors.

:smallbiggrin: Editors? In a Wizard's Product? Bwahhahahahahaha...ooo that tickles.

TheOOB
2007-08-12, 02:12 AM
:smallbiggrin: Editors? In a Wizard's Product? Bwahhahahahahaha...ooo that tickles.

Actually, WotC books have some fairly decent editing as far as RPG books go, try looking at some third party d20 material some time, the OGL unfortunately doesn't require all d20 content to be legible in their written language.

Doc_Outlands
2007-08-12, 11:34 PM
And where is the Elf Wizard variant while folks are being helpful?
And the Exemplar?

Dhavaer
2007-08-12, 11:42 PM
And where is the Elf Wizard variant while folks are being helpful?
And the Exemplar?

Races of the Wild and Complete Adventurer.

Doc_Outlands
2007-08-13, 08:50 AM
Thankee muchly!