On Topic Opinions?

[Sylence]

Hi,
I've had this comic book idea in my head for a few years and I wanted to shoot it by you all to see how to apply it. First, please stay on topic. What I'm looking for is for you to basically have a look at some of my characters and give me your in game feed back or suggestions as to their correctness or something better with in the flavor of the character. The Adventuring group shall be monotheolistic. To this effect they shall out of game / in game be down with the real GOD. Their mission shall be to kill anyone claiming to be him or represent him in dnd. I've chosen the name "The Pantheon Killers" for them for obvious reasons. Due take note that the characters haven't been fully fleshed out so feel free. Now, on to the meat of the issue...
The characters:

Using a standard stat array:

Strength:12
Intelligence:14+(2)+(2)=18
Charisma:15+(2)=17
Wisdom:8+(2)=10
Dexterity:13+(2)=15
Constitution:10-(2)=8

Base Attack: 18/13/8/3

F:11 R:7 W:15

1. Name
(The Left Hand)
Madame Ma'am:

Race:
Fey'ri

Type:
Undying/Lesser Native Outsider/Fey/Feign

Class:
Warlock/Mind Bender/Swashbuckler

Level: 24
Warlock: 20 / Mind Bender:1 / Swashbuckler: 3 / LA +1 Lesser Native Outsider / +4 Lich

Armor:
+5 Lich

Speed:
30 (land) / 40 (poor fly speed)

Special Abilities:
Baelnorn Ability / Feign Ability / Fey Ability

Special Qualities:
Fey:
Elf Blood (+2 Dex and +2 Int), (-2 Con), Dark Vision 60ft., Low Light Vision, Immune to Sleep Spells and Effects, (+2) against Enchantment Spells and Effects.

Fey'ri:
Alternate Self, Fly, (1/day) Suggestion, Charm Person, Detect Thoughts, Fire Resistant 10.

Baelnorn:
Projection (3/day), Immune to electricity, cold, polymorph, mind effects, (+4) turn resistance, (+2) intelligence, charisma, wisdom, (0) con, 15/+1 damage reduction.

Special Attacks:
Lich:
Touch (1d8 negative energy/will), Paralyzing Touch (permanently paralyzed, unless cured by a remove paralist / remove curse / fort).

Warlock:
Eldritch Blast:
Spear and Glaive (9d6)

Fey'ri: (Character level is charisma based)

Lich: (Character level is charisma = 10 + 1/2 hd)

Skills:
Fey'ri:
(+2) listen, spot check, hide, search, bluff.

Lich:
(+8) hide, listen, move silent, search, sense motive, spot check.

Feat: Practiced Spellcaster


This is week one's offering and they'll be 7 more to come in the future. I have chosen this method so that we could fully discuss each character's need. Thanks, in advance for all of your help.

[Mike Miller]

Perhaps post this in homebrew subforum?

[Sylence]

Reason, being? I ask for pardon because I'm a noob? But I figured since there is no homebrewing involved then it is fine where it is at. Am I wrong?

[Sylence]

I beg you're pardon, was moving a little too fast. Just for your info I'm using all books for these builds. Most are of a Good alignment or Chaotic Nuetral. I've only forbidden Evil characters.

[KillianHawkeye]

The Adventuring group shall be monotheolistic. To this effect they shall out of game / in game be down with the real GOD. Their mission shall be to kill anyone claiming to be him or represent him in dnd.

This sounds like a bad idea for a comic.

First of all, mixing D&D with real world religions (Christianity, I'm assuming) isn't such a great thing, not to mention something we're not supposed to discuss on these forums. Secondly, there's nobody in any standard D&D setting who claims to be or to represent your "real" God, so there'd be nobody for your "heroes" to murder. Thirdly, murdering people for their beliefs isn't generally what readers want to see in their comic protagonists. Are you sure they aren't the villains?


Ultimately, I'd love to see them in a shared universe where they could knock off your favorite hero's / villians in DC and Marvel who possess this unique problem.

That's never going to happen.

Also, what problem? The problem of having people claiming to be or to represent the "real" God? How is that even a problem that needs solving? :smallconfused:



Fey'ri

Native Outsider

Lich

The standard Lich template can only be applied to Humanoids, and this character isn't one. There are other versions of the template, but I can't think of any that a Fey'ri would qualify for. Of course, you can always fiat away that technicality as the DM or as an author, but then why even have character builds for comic characters at all? Rich doesn't have all the stats for the characters of OOTS written out except for one or two important details, and the comic ends up being all the better for it.



As for the build, you didn't really post much of one at all. The ability scores look okay, but one feat and two Warlock invocations isn't much to give feedback on. You haven't really told us anything about the character's personality, either. Who are they? What abilities do you want them to have? Why do you even need Practiced Spellcaster on a level 20 Warlock? How do you even have an animal companion?

Finally, based on the DR, you appear to be mixing 3e with 3.5, which is an odd choice considering an updated version of the Lich template is freely available online.



I know I'm being a bit harsh here, but I'm not trying to discourage you. I just feel like you've sorely underestimated how much work goes into storytelling and are more in need of writing advice than help with your character builds.

[Menzath]

Secondly, there's nobody in any standard D&D setting who claims to be or to represent your "real" God, so there'd be nobody for your "heroes" to murder.

I think pholtus disagrees with that 😜

[Sylence]

Apologize, for any confusion. But the reason I choose to make the character a Lich is because of the fact that a "Baelnorn" Lich is a Lich of elven nature in "dnd 3.5" . Hence, the fey'ri being a elven creature, qualifies. And, as far as her using the "Practiced Spellcaster" it is because of needing to have the ability to cast a spell with the level requirements the warlock to due so. Now, although you're correct in gathering that it is an issue we are not supposed to broach ..." Religion "... it didn't say we couldn't use it as a bases for our delivery or motives. I appreciate the guess but I had said "Monotheolistic" and the belief system you had quoted isn't. The thing with Marvel was just wishful thinking so, please don't take it to serious. Also, I'm thinking about removing the "Animal Companion". It was kind of a shot in the dark that really isn't worth it in the end. Especially, with the (image three times per day) of the baelnorn. I will defiantly take your advice on submitting a background on her, was just a little tired yesterday. Thanks

[Sylence]

Also, the reason for the mission is because I'm a dnd player who represents Monotheolistic beliefs and wanted to engage others who have the same or similar situations when it comes to play. So, their were times when the DM would be like make a GOD call and internally I'd be like no... No matter the situation. I'd play a strictly in game "Ur Priest" to avoid any situation instead of designing a team to deal with the issue at hand. So, I felt it was finally time to attack head on.

[Remuko]

Also, the reason for the mission is because I'm a dnd player who represents Monotheolistic beliefs and wanted to engage others who have the same or similar situations when it comes to play. So, their were times when the DM would be like make a GOD call and internally I'd be like no... No matter the situation. I'd play a strictly in game "Ur Priest" to avoid any situation instead of designing a team to deal with the issue at hand. So, I felt it was finally time to attack head on.

Its monotheistic. monotheolistic isn't a word.

[KillianHawkeye]

It doesn't matter which real world religion you're planning to use. I still don't see how it would make a good story for a comic book. Or how your band of would-be murderers can claim to be on the side of Good.

But hey, if you don't care about little details like that, then I won't bother anymore about it. It's not like I'm ever going to read this story. :smallsigh:

[Sylence]

A dreary day was on the horizon in the Evermeet when she preciously stepped onto the tarmack. You see, to most her race was just a race who'd made the wrong choices in a forgotten time and had been subjugated to enternally pay for their ancient mistakes. This wouldn't due not even for a second.
Because Madam wasn't your averaged Fey'ri. Madam wanted to prove herself in this world of hypocrisy and in doing so, she knew the road would be long and arduous. If it wasn't for the constant running for her life from her despicable surface cousins or trying to show that just because you come from a certain stock doesn't mean that you are trapped in their makings. It was the unlikely notion that those of her race were inherently evil. Not so.
She had no doubt as to her moral fiber and her whys and won'ts because it was settled at birth with her nature being "chaotic" and her resolve being "neutral". It caused many a situation during her time amongst her people's. So, as soon as she could she left knowing that the hate and atrophy of her situation was only due to grow into murderous proportions.
She used her inherit ability to mask her true form to go forth adventuring in search of a treasure she'd use to payback the very source of the problem. And, pay them back she would.
For she'd heard of a method of achieving a state of existence that would have her set for Life or Undeath to propagate her message to those who'd listen and listen well. Her mission was to become a "Baelnorn".
Her surface cousins had already subjected her and her kind to a harsh and step objective in this world because of the choices their parents had made many moons ago. Rightfully, so. In concerns of the direct offenders not the legions of children who've been born into it. What about their chances or choices. Who was to look out for them if they differed from them?
Her parents didn't care they were just as evil as their elven cousins had described but this wouldn't side track her it would only make her more determined.
She'd heard of the Dark Elf who against all odds made his way to the surface and even changed the minds of many, although it was a road hard fought and plagued with love and lost.
So, she gathered her belongings and started out on the road looking like a very non decript elven Sorceress. This guise would get her into the village of the Sun Elves where their was a particular elven maid being bantered about the local tavern who'd been marred by battle and who'd been fitted with a battle mask to cover her face. She wore it with honor and dignity. Her name Taryn and she'd been chosen for the honor of becoming a Baelnorn. To protect her people was her call. And, her life would be given to prove that point just not in the way intended. For Madam had watched and watched and watched until her time was at hand. This wasn't going to be a battle that would be won easily by no means of the imagination. It was just that she'd been extremely lucky if you believe in it because Taryn lived on the edge of the village and appreciated her privacy. Madam approached Taryn as a elven courier of male decent to further throw off the suspension in case anyone had seen and up until this point she'd spied Taryn craft as being one who's extremely adept at casting spells with an uncanny ability. Not one she wouldn't be able to surpass but Taryn was nice with it to say the least. But not as nice as Madam. For the fight was over from the beginning when Madam slashed Taryn across her body with a "Glaive" shaped "Vitriolic Blast" over and over. Taryn tried to re organise herself with a spell "Wail of the Banshee" but Madam made her save as she would have. But fortunately Taryn had an additional spell it was "shades" in which she had cast on herself. Now she'd have to fight four additional versions of her due to her failed save. The day keeps getting better thought Madam. Next, she impaled her body with racks of infinite pain when she successfully hit a copy with a Glaive of "Sudden Swarm" for the kill. She found success again with her next swing.To say that the kill was spectacular would have been underwhelming. Three were left as the battle kept raging with the next caster casting "weird" to no end for she made her save. They cast "power word kill" to no success & Taryn herself tried to " imprison" her with no success. The next round ment a successful casting of "noxious blast" and then a follow up of "vitriolic blast" for the finish. This had been a very hard fought fight.
She quickly transformed into an exact copy of Taryn and started living her life. First thing stealing her commission amongst all things. This was the first step to getting everything she wanted and more. After a days rest at the residence she got back to the work of impersonating Taryn. Years had rolled by and no one ever suspected. Then the day was at hand in which Taryn was to become an "Baelnorn" first she was asked what her reasons and motives were to be with this great gift bestowed? She said to protect her people's. They excepted... really bad mistake. For Madam was speaking of a different people all together. Then the ceremony was performed and Madam arose as a Baelnorn complete to follow her mission.

[Sylence]

Well that's the way my phone spelled it😊

[Sylence]

Well Killian, no problem I still appreciate your views and hope the best for you and your gamers in the near future😶

[Sylence]

Now that the dirty work is done. Is there anyone who'd help on the character development?

[Lvl 2 Expert]

It doesn't matter which real world religion you're planning to use. I still don't see how it would make a good story for a comic book. Or how your band of would-be murderers can claim to be on the side of Good.

I don't know, fantasy terrorism, might turn out a hit.

EDIT: Note: This is sarcasm.

[KillianHawkeye]

Well Killian, no problem I still appreciate your views and hope the best for you and your gamers in the near future😶

Okay, I'm just going to continue to give a bit of writing advice as I see it.

First of all, was that a vague reference to Drizz't in your character's backstory? The story of the "Dark Elf who against all odds made his way to the surface and even changed the minds of many, although it was a road hard fought and plagued with love and lost"? Are you planning on borrowing any more ideas from fantasy authors without their permission?

Secondly, your character is not Good. She's Evil. She murdered a war hero in order to steal her identity and become an undead abomination, not to help all the elven people, but to selfishly aid only her own kin at the expense of others.


Now that those two points are out of the way, you really need to improve your spelling and grammar and learn how paragraphs work if you want to be a writer. You frequently use wrong words which sound like the words you meant to use. Your posts are a wall of text. Your description of the fight between Madam and Taryn was, to be honest, almost painful to read. And your use of quoted spell names is a bit cringe-inducing.

Is English not your primary language? Are you going to be writing this story in some other tongue? You have a good grasp of punctuation, so that's something at least.

[Sylence]

Thank you, again Killian. I must admit you are a treasure trove. First I believe you missed the fact that she killed her enemy who would have killed her in a heart beat. Remember, it's on site with the Elves. So, she's in the midst of fighting her own personal War.
Secondly, you are right I need help in the writing section... And, you seem to be doing an excellent job. Want a job?

[Sylence]

Thirdly, where as I truly appreciate your response. We still haven't gotten into the meat of my request... Which was to develope the character. Anybody?

[daremetoidareyo]

Why such a crazy high level? Your start point asks a prospective reader to identify with religious fanatic demigods. My suggestion is to Halve the start level so they aren't one shotting dragons. Your description and power level preference seems to suggest that this team is more akin to the four horsemen of the apocalypse than the lightbringers of goodness to the common peasant.

[Sylence]

My submission is fleshed out untill 29 level. But the story is all the way from first.

[Sylence]

I'm just trying to get a little help on character tips.

[Sylence]

Next up, on the Q is a character I'd like to call (The Tailbone).

Standard Array, as usual for all characters.

Str:16 (+4 Minotaur), (+4 Goliath), (+4 Enervating Arm), (×2 Haugling Back)=28
Wis:12
Int:8 (-2 Minotaur)=6
Char:10
Con:15 (+2 Goliath), (+2 Minotaur)=19
Dex:13 (-2 Goliath)=11

Name: Mule Kick

Race: Half Minotaur / Goliath /
Necropolitian

Type: Undead /Monstrous Humanoid

Class: Barbarian / Ranger /Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian / Occult Slaying / Hulking Hurler

Level: (29)1+la Minotaur / 1+la Goliath
(27) 5+Ranger /5+Occult Slayer /6+Barbarian /3+Hulking Hurler /8+Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian

Size: Large (8'3"-12)( when in rage)
Weight: (833-1,999)
Speed: 40

A.C. (+2)( Natural Minotaur)

Stat Boost/Dip:
Str: (+4 Goliath)
(+4 Minotaur)
(+4 Enervating Arm)
(×2 Hauling Back)
Con:(0 Necro)
(+2 Goliath)
(+2 Minotaur)
Int: (-2 Minotaur)
Dex:(-2 Goliath)

Special Quality: Dark Vision (60ft), (+4) Minotaur Cunning (always knows North, verse escaping mazes), Scent(+2 Sense Motive), Acclimate (no penalty verses altitude), Resist Control (+2 profane Bo. V control undead), Turn Resistance (+2), Unnatural Resilience (heal like the living except with negative energy), Undead Immunities.

Bonded Weapon:
Colossal + (weight) Spiked Triangular Shot Put (Flesh Grinding / Called)

Secondary Weapons:
(2) Gargantuan Spiked Lance's (Flesh Grinding & Wounding)

Feats:
Sub Level (1/5/7) Powerful Build
Acclimated
Minotaur Cunning
Mountain Rage
Mountain Movement
Frenzy
Track
Improved Grab
Constrict
Turn Resistance
Improved Bullrush
Resist Control
Unnatural Resilience
Scent
Two Weapon Fighting

Favorite Enemy:
Undead

Grafts:
(Illithid)
Haughling Back (2 × carrying capacity) 2,000
Rending Claws (2d8/×2) 5,000
Goring Horn (1d8) 8,000
Grasping Mandibles (3d6) 15,000

(Undead)
Enervating Arm (+4 Strength / 2 per day Enervation) 40,000
Vampire Fangs (1d6) 25,000
Eye Of The Flame (1 per day Fire Ball that does 10d6 Divine/Fire) 10,700
105,700 Total.

Natural Weapons:
Minotaur Horns (2d6)

Animal Companion:
Wolf

[Deadline]

So ... I'm confused. I'm not really aware of any D&D deity or creature that claims to be (or represent) the (I'm guessing) Judeo-Christian deity. So who is this team supposed to be fighting? Are you claiming that any deity or cleric in the fictional D&D world fulfills that criteria?

That aside, are you aware that fey'ri aren't elves? They are descended from demons and elves, sure, so it's not a stretch to apply the Baelnorn idea to them (DM permitting).

Are you looking for character help from an optimization/performance perspective, or from a storytelling perspective? From an optimization perspective, Epic Spellcasting makes anyone that isn't an Epic Spellcaster irrelevant, and that includes Warlocks. From a storytelling perspective, all-powerful protagonists are both boring and uninspiring. So it's kind of difficult to do both.

There's a pretty easy method for writing some halfway decent stories: The Lester Dent method (http://www.paper-dragon.com/1939/dent.html) is decent, but I'm sure any number of the professional writers on this forum can give better guides.

You may want to visit the Arts and Crafts (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?27-Arts-and-Crafts) subforum, as that's probably the area they frequent the most.

[Sylence]

Thanks, so much for your response. As to your first question. Yes, I knew the fey'ri were half breeds. Kind of makes the concept of what she did a little freakier.

Second, I'd like a little help on both of them if you don't mind. Opt/Write, until your heart is content. I'm all for it.

Also, any cleric etc.,etc. will do. It'll make the mission that much more interesting.

Further more, I included each particular class into the mix not for opting for the most powerful but more so, to tell the story of each character and their choices to become what they have and how it all fits into the greater scheme in the end

[Sylence]

Yeah, a group that is made up of cohesive parts that must work together to put an enemy down.
I really wouldn't mind a little focus on the military behalf of the writing. I mean like where, how, and when to do a thing. Like on a chess board. If you gather my meaning that is?
Writing with a full use of spells, minuvers, displays of mental acts as well as physical.

[ZamielVanWeber]

So ... I'm confused. I'm not really aware of any D&D deity or creature that claims to be (or represent) the (I'm guessing) Judeo-Christian deity. So who is this team supposed to be fighting? Are you claiming that any deity or cleric in the fictional D&D world fulfills that criteria?.

Christ (the Messiah of the highly influential religion) is mentioned as visiting Faerun from time to time.

[Sylence]

While I'm at it. He has a rider on his back...
He is known as the (Left Hemisphere):

Name: Head Stone

Race: Gnome

Type: Undead, Humanoid

Size: Small

Speed: 20ft.

Class: Shadow Craft Mage / Dread Necromancer

Level: (29) (5)Shadow Craft Mage, (24) Dread Necromancer

Feats: Racial Emulation
(Illithid)

Familiar: Raven

He rides in a Spiked Battle Egg on his (Mule Kick's) back.

[Sylence]

I reinstate that I'm not a Christian. But thanks, tho.😶

[Sylence]

Hello, I'm back with another. It is known as (The Neck Bone).

Name:
Grind aka The Platform

Level:
29

Race:
Warforged Juggernaut

Type:
Construct

Class:
Psy Warrior, Lion Totem Barbarian, Barbarian, Monk, Warfoged Juggernaut, Hulking Hurler

Level:
14 Psy War, 2 Barbarian, 3 Lion Totem Barbarian, 2 Monk, 5 Warforged Juggernaut, 3 Hulking Hurler

Size:
Large (Long) (Warforged Arachnid Chassis) (12ft)

Speed:
60ft (50ft climb)(Warfoged Arachnid Chassis +30ft/+20ft)

AC: (+2)

Special Qualities:
Spider Climb, Construct Immunities.

Weapons:
Colossal + (weight) Squared Shot Put (Spiked, Called, Flesh Grinding)

Secondary:
Huge Spiked Chain (Flesh Grinding, Wounding)

Natural Weapon:
Arachnid Chassis ( +20/+30 Climb/Natural speed increase) (1d8+on one attack with your leg at your highest attack bonus), plus Spider Climb 30,700

Scorpion Brand:
You grow a 10ft. Scorpion Tail that makes natural attacks (fortitude dc14) initial 1d6 Dam & 1d6 Dex secondary. Makes 10 × attacks per day. AC 20-30. 17,500

Iron Toothed Girdle:
makes attacks at (3d6) piercing damage and had No grappling penalties also, it is considered a magical weapon for DR. 15,000

Battle Fist:
bludging /piercing for (2d6) damage. 2,600

Jaws of Death:
(1d6) biting damage / piercing damage (20/3) crit.

Shoving Arm:
(5ft. Bullrush + 1ft for every point over. 2,000).

Shudder Plate:
(Tremor Sense 15ft). 8,000

Stone Spittter Box:
(1d6 regular damage / Increase 6× per day / 1d8+1 Large Bullets range 50ft. / 50 × per day). 2,000 × 2

Armored Spikes:
(1d8) piercing damage.

Extra Leg Attack + Two Battle First: Covered with Mummy Wrappings to confer mummy rot.

Feats:
Tashalatora
Monastic Training

Grand Total: 78,800

[Sylence]

(The Right Hemisphere)

Name:
Think Tank

Level:
29

Type:
Construct

Race:
Warfoged Scout

Size:
Small

Speed:
20ft.

Special Quality:
Psiforged Body

Class:
Psionic Artificer

Abilities:
(+2 Dex), (-2 Str)

Skills:
(+2 acrobatics)

Construct Familiar:
Ethereal Filcher

He likewise rides in a Spiked Battle Egg on his (The Grind's) back.

[Sagetim]

Aren't fey'ri inherently evil? And quite a few of these characters are pretty undead. I can't remember if Necropolitan forces an alignment shift, but if this is the protagonist party, and they are supposed to be heroic good guys going around slaying all the pretenders to divinity, it starts undermining their whole shtick if they come riding into town smelling of rot, decay, and looking like they're going to fall apart and leave a mess on the carpet.

I suppose what I'm saying is, this seems a lot more like a 'villains are the protagonists' line up, than a heroic line up. Which would make Balenorn a moot point, since you could just be a regular lich, etc.

If you're looking for ways for the characters to avoid dying of old age, there are a number of not-undead options in 3.5. One of them you've already hit upon with those Warforged (they have no maximum age), Elan are another player character race with no maximum age (and they are also ecl +0). And while I'm not going to list all the paths to 'not dying of old age', one that bears mentioning is a vile spell. If you cast it on someone during the full moon, you can de-age yourself and force the target to take on the years you shed for every point of ability score damage you deal to them. It's rather absolutely horrible, but effective.

[Venger]

Aren't fey'ri inherently evil? And quite a few of these characters are pretty undead. I can't remember if Necropolitan forces an alignment shift, but if this is the protagonist party, and they are supposed to be heroic good guys going around slaying all the pretenders to divinity, it starts undermining their whole shtick if they come riding into town smelling of rot, decay, and looking like they're going to fall apart and leave a mess on the carpet.

I suppose what I'm saying is, this seems a lot more like a 'villains are the protagonists' line up, than a heroic line up. Which would make Balenorn a moot point, since you could just be a regular lich, etc.

If you're looking for ways for the characters to avoid dying of old age, there are a number of not-undead options in 3.5. One of them you've already hit upon with those Warforged (they have no maximum age), Elan are another player character race with no maximum age (and they are also ecl +0). And while I'm not going to list all the paths to 'not dying of old age', one that bears mentioning is a vile spell. If you cast it on someone during the full moon, you can de-age yourself and force the target to take on the years you shed for every point of ability score damage you deal to them. It's rather absolutely horrible, but effective.

necropolitan imposes no alignment shift and is open to characters of all alignments. you can stay whatever you were before if you feel like it.

the spell you're thinking of is steal life. it's an 8th and won't let you siphon years, only a few weeks depending on your supply of fuel

[Sagetim]

necropolitan imposes no alignment shift and is open to characters of all alignments. you can stay whatever you were before if you feel like it.

the spell you're thinking of is steal life. it's an 8th and won't let you siphon years, only a few weeks depending on your supply of fuel

Ouf, weeks. Still, get the right supply of victims and you can keep that gravy train going (after all, if it only does ability score damage, that can be fixed with lesser restoration or what have you, so you can keep draining them, right?).

Also, neat. It's been a while since I looked close at Necropolitan. Still seems like you'd be running into social stigma's against undead as one though.

[Venger]

Ouf, weeks. Still, get the right supply of victims and you can keep that gravy train going (after all, if it only does ability score damage, that can be fixed with lesser restoration or what have you, so you can keep draining them, right?).

Also, neat. It's been a while since I looked close at Necropolitan. Still seems like you'd be running into social stigma's against undead as one though.

bodies are probably the easier thing to get your hands on. the real limiting factor is how many 8th level slots you have, especially since each one can only target one person.

probably, a lot of people are bigoted against undead. that's why a lot of necropolitans live in the necropolis so they can hang out together.

[Florian]

So far, a totally uninteresting bunch of "freak" characters that we could name Mary and Garry. Monstrous races going undead to serve a higher purpose? The World of Darkness called, it wants its power gamers back.

[Sylence]

True, the characters are overpowered. Remember, I'm doing this to write it down as a graphic novel. So, I'm just showing their full growth ahead of time. But I'm still asking for help?

I'm terms of what they are ( undead ). I chose them because of the contradictions they create, and because some characters like Mule Kick benefit from his ridder on his back while also, still being able to be a tough fight for his opponent. Look at the Warforged Juggernaut with the Warforged Scout on his back who specializes in Psionic Artificery. He's relevant for his character to keep going.

It's like I said, this is a team made up of true team work. The next, installment will have a question attach to it. I want to get it right for character creation. It's a doozy.

[Florian]

True, the characters are overpowered. Remember, I'm doing this to write it down as a graphic novel. So, I'm just showing their full growth ahead of time. But I'm still asking for help?

It´s just not interesting. Maybe you know the damn cool french comic "Black Moon Chronicles"?
That´s one of the very few comics that managed to capture the feel of a D&D characters rise to power and how their world changes at each new power-level.

The characters you presented are not overpowered, they´re mostly boring and look like what some gamer dreams of as his "ideal high-level party" that no-one will ever play. There´re no hooks, no drama, no personality, no conflict.

[Sylence]

And, naw Fey'ri aren't inherently evil their only restricted to non good alignments.

[Sylence]

Well, they very well may be boring as of now. Given that I haven't written a back story on them, yet.
But it'll come, hence the reason for me asking for help.
You got any character opts or cool back stories?

[Sylence]

Also, the reason for the baelnorn was because of Madame being Fey'ri and this particular Lich being 1. Elf 2. Able to be chaotic 3. The eternal hate between Elves and their cousins. As well as the word play that could be constructed between the two within the telling of the tale. I like the fact that I could expose the dark underbelly of elven society with their racist, bigoted, classist, ridged, etc.,etc. world views. Sounds like a very controversial epitaph to me.

[Florian]

Well, they very well may be boring as of now given that I haven't written a back story on them, yet.
But it'll come, hence the reason for me asking for help.
You got any character opts or cook back stories?

You´re asking the entirely wrong questions.

1) Telling a good story is something that can be learned but needs repeated exercise to end up on a passable level.
2) Graphic novels are an interesting case because they handle information more similar to movies, are good at "show", not good at "tell".
3) Basing something on D&D is interesting, but will only make the points 1 and 2 harder without any real gain beyond pleasing the fans.

So, the question is, what story do you want to tell, how are different "arcs" structured, what exact place to the different characters have in it and how do you want to pencil it to fit the mood and tempo of the story?

[Sylence]

Question, a character of the Dolgrim type. What happens to the character levels each goblin had before they were joined. Or better yet after if you play that way also? Do they gain separate or together?

[Deadline]

necropolitan imposes no alignment shift and is open to characters of all alignments. you can stay whatever you were before if you feel like it.

You will, however, radiate evil when someone sweeps you with detection magic though, just like every other undead creature. So it does make you evil, to a certain extent, it just doesn't change your alignment.

Also, I'm not sure I understand the rationale given for why the one character is a Baelnorn. Of the three reasons given, all of them lend themselves more to the regular lich template than anything else. Baelnorns are good liches, and with the motivations and descriptions you've given us so far, these characters don't seem to reside anywhere other than the evil end of the alignment spectrum.

[ben-zayb]

The template that you are looking for is Lichfiend from Libris Moryis, not Lich, since Fey'ri is an Outsider

[Sylence]

From the baelnorn page a passage about it's alignment:
LG NG CG
LN N CN
LE NE CE

Third row is no good but do you see the CN.

[Sylence]

A baelnorn could be of any non-evil nature, mainly lawful good, retaining whatever alignment it had in life. Straight from the page.

[Galacktic]

Stats literally don't matter. Builds don't matter. If you're writing something, just write: but you're not going to write it because you don't have characters. Write backstories, create a setting, and then just start writing/drawing. It'll be garbage. Your first work always is. But you can use that to improve and do better with later works.

[Sylence]

Personality[edit]

MonFaePG73.jpg
Most Fey'ri live for revenge. They feel wronged by other elves, particularly Moon Elves, and feel superior to other humanoids. A Fey'ri is patient, calculating, and suspicious, but their fiendish blood makes her prone to acts of cruelty and rage. Independent Fey'ri are usually marked for death by their brethren, and must live their lives more cautiously than their kin, lest they be discovered and destroyed.

Alignment[edit]

Most Fey'ri are Chaotic Evil. However, some Independent Fey'ri have been known to be Chaotic Neutral or True Neutral. None have been found Lawful or Good.

See

[Sylence]

Much appreciation on the writing tip. But I'm just laying the characters out for you all to review and potentially help me with. And, to this point all I've recieved was.... But it's good. I'm still trying to find out my Dolgrim question 7 rows up? Can you help me?

[Galacktic]

As an author, you don't care about the stats of your characters. That's it. Period. And this is an awful premise for a webcomic - a mostly dying genre now anyway - but you might get some views out of the really edgelord premise. You need to have motivations and good hooks for your characters, get the audience to empathize with them.

Right now, you have a group of villains who want to kill god because ???. You need to work on motivations and why X needs to happen before anything. Outline. Make a plot, then make characters that suit the plot.

And to reiterate: the readers, if you ever get any, will literally never see the stats of your characters. Ever. Write a few notes on them, maybe make a spell list, but never tie yourself to needing to live or die by their sheets. It's best to just not make them.

But seriously, go make an outline.


E: And as for the Dolgrim, the answer is "nothing" because it's an entirely new race and not a template. Story-wise it's literally whatever you want. You're the author.

[Sylence]

Thank you, Galacktic.

[Sylence]

Taking your advice into account. I'm still going to list all of the focus groups stats because of the gamers reading the script.
But I'll definitely be aware of the first rule of d&d.

[Sylence]

Now for (The Feet).

Race: Dolgrim

Type: Aberration

Size: Small

Name: The Open First & The Closed Slap

Level: 27 (-2 la)

Racial Boost / Retard:
Str: (+2)
Dex:(+2)
Int:(-2)
Char:(-2)

Class:
(TOF)
Cleric & Dry Lich (top) / Bear Warrior & Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian & Frenzied Berserker &The Fist of The Forest (bottom)

(TCS)
Wu Jen & Spell Thief (top) / Dusk Blade & Dragon Disciple & Spellfire Weilder (bottom)

Animal Familiar: Raven

" " ": Wolf

[Sylence]

Oh, and in terms of the undead you were mentioning.... Robes of Gentle Repose for everyone Madame, Mule Kick, Left Hemisphere, The Open Fist. It sounds like a winner. Plus, permanent Remove Scent.

[Venger]

Oh, and in terms of the undead you were mentioning.... Robes of Gentle Repose for everyone Madame, Mule Kick, Left Hemisphere, The Open Fist. It sounds like a winner. Plus, permanent Remove Scent.

That's not one of the spells you can permanency.

[Sylence]

And, finally last but not least in the line up is a character I call (The Right Hand).

Name:
Sir

Race:
Daelkyr Half Blood

Type:
Aberration, Seelie Court Fey, Dragon Touched

Speed:
30

Size:
Medium

Class:
Impure Prince, Hex Blade, Osteomancer, Dragon Adept

Level:
6 Impure Prince / 8 Hex Blade / 10 Osteomancer / 5 Dragon Adept

Feats:
Symbiot Mastery

Breath Effects:
Lighting, Weakening

Weapon:
(Deep Crystal) Great Sword
(2d6)

[Sylence]

Good looking, on the info. Well then they'll have to have many wands of it then.

[The Viscount]

How can this character be a Changeling, a Daelkyr Half-Blood, and a Doppleganger? These are all separate races.

[Sylence]

Let's see, 1. Changling is an offset of a Doppelganger. 2. Since, he was altered in the womb by magic it added dealkyr half blood to the equation when he was born. But I believe I understand what you are getting at hold on..... give me one second..... How's that a little better for you?

[Sylence]

A much needed, thanks is due to "The Viscount" for the corrections.

[Venger]

Let's see, 1. Changling is an offset of a Doppelganger. 2. Since, he was altered in the womb by magic it added dealkyr half blood to the equation when he was born. But I believe I understand what you are getting at hold on..... give me one second..... How's that a little better for you?

daelkyr half-blood is still a race, not a template. you can't be two races at once. you need to be either a changeling or a daelkyr half-blood

[Sylence]

Mind you that these are works in effect and that I'll be going back to them to finish em up. Please, keep coming with the info to help straighten them out. Gratitude ☺

[Sylence]

Venger, so if I'm understanding you if a mother whose about to have the baby in an area where the dealkyr are wouldn't have a dealkyr half blood if they the dealkyr reached out and touched her. Or am I putting it in the wrong place?

[Sylence]

I just went back and reread the entry and haven't found what you're speaking on? Could you direct me?

[Venger]

daelkyrs' corrupting influence does affect pregnant women and sometimes causes them to give birth to daelkyr half-bloods. if this happened, then the baby would be a daelkyr half-blood and not a changeling. these are two mutually exclusive things. you cannot be a member of both races at the same time.

[Sylence]

So then the changling goes the way of the dinosaur? He gets no further use of his birth from it?

[Venger]

So then the changling goes the way of the dinosaur? He gets no further use of his birth from it?

He can be either a daelkyr half-blood or a changeling. You can only have the traits of one race at a time. If he has the traits of daelkyr half-blood, then he does not have the traits of a changeling. If for whatever reason you needed changeling's minor change shape, it's replicable through transmuter 5

[JustIgnoreMe]

I think this story needs a 1st level Marshall who becomes a Sorcerer/Tainted Sorcerer and tries to kill all Wizards.

[Swaoeaeieu]

Might i ask why you are building these all at such a high level?
epic level make for silly builds, wich are powerfull to hunt gods, if these are hunting people "claiming" to be god(s) i think about clerics, cultists and charlatans, wich all seems very underpowered for these characters.

apart from that, i see you warforged melee build has 2 levels of Barbarian, and 3 levels lion totem barbarian. wich is impossible, you cant have a class and then start over with alternate class features.

[Sylence]

From my understanding, you need levels in Barbarian to trade in the fast movement for the lion totem barbarian. If I'm wrong please correct me.

[Venger]

From my understanding, you need levels in Barbarian to trade in the fast movement for the lion totem barbarian. If I'm wrong please correct me.

lion totem barbarian is what's known as a substitution level.

you take the first level, which gives you pounce, at level 1. that means instead of taking "barbarian 1" your character is taking "lion totem barbarian 1"

if you leave the class and come back later (though ew why would you, barbarian is 1 lvl long) then you do not have to start over again by taking "barbarian 1." you continue on and take barbarian 2.

does that make sense? you seem to have double dipped and taken the same few levels more than once:


Ur Priest & Dry Lich (top) / Barbarian & Bear Warrior & Lion Totem Barbarian plus The Fist of The Forest

what is your actual level breakdown?

[Faily]

What is even the setting? Baelnorns are from Forgotten Realms, and Daelkyr are from Eberron.

At this point, you're probably better of trying to focus on an individual character, rather than a large group. Pick one of your characters, write about that one instead.

[Sylence]

Also, a few paragraphs back I had said to the fellas that I was basically laying the characters out for all the gamers to see. But that the story would start them at a way way lower level than what's been exposed. But I'm very interested in what you have to say on the Barb tip?

[Venger]

Also, a few paragraphs back I had said to the fellas that I was basically laying the characters out for all the gamers to see. But that the story would start them at a way way lower level than what's been exposed. But I'm very interested in what you have to say on the Barb tip?

What in my above explanation did not make sense to you?

[Sylence]

Scratch the last post. I'd just read your answer and thanks for the info... I'll break down "The feet" in a little while for you, bro..

[Sylence]

Apologize, Venger. I speaking to Swoaeaeieu.

[Sylence]

But in terms of the breakdown it is:

12 levels of Cleric and 10 of Walker in the Waste.(top)

5 Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian 9 Frenzied Berserker 3 Fist of the Forest and 5 Bear Warrior.(bottom)

7 Wu Jen 20 Spellthief. (top)

7 Dusk Blade 10 Spellfire Weilder 10 Dragon Disciple. (bottom)

[Swaoeaeieu]

why do you build them all way into epic levels if you plan on starting them at a low level? Most builds only go to level 20 and truth be told, it doesnt look like you have much practice building characters. Would it not be easier to start with a lower goalpost?

[Faily]

What is even the setting? Baelnorns are from Forgotten Realms, and Daelkyr are from Eberron.

At this point, you're probably better of trying to focus on an individual character, rather than a large group. Pick one of your characters, write about that one instead.

Repeating this, and adding:

Readers do not care about the stats of characters in a book unless they care about the characters themselves. You should focus more on developing characters that are interesting to the readers, in terms of personality and plot, rather than a stat-block. By setting a character's abilities in stone, you are intentionally writing yourself into a corner as you develop the story afterwards, as it automatically limits what you can do with the characters. Just look at the Order of the Stick: one of its strengths in storytelling is that Burlew has not given us the characters' "character sheets", as that leaves him free to introduce new hooks or solutions as he pleases.

This seems more like an excersise in creating the edgiest of edgelords than it is about creating characters in a story.

[Sylence]

Note taking.

[Sylence]

Swaoeaeieu, look up five post to find your answer.

[Swaoeaeieu]

Swaoeaeieu, look up five post to find your answer.

i dont know what you are pointing at, maybe quote your answer to clear things up?

[Sylence]

Also, a few paragraphs back I had said to the fellas that I was basically laying the characters out for all the gamers to see. But that the story would start them at a way way lower level than what's been exposed.

[Sagetim]

That's not one of the spells you can permanency.

At least one locket in Dragonlance disagrees with you, as it casts a permanent duration Gentle Repose on the body of it's wearer when they die. Which is more the provenance of custom magic items, which I think is what they meant by those robes.

An Eternal Wand of Gentle Repose would cover their needs, but it does bring up the question: Does Gentle Repose work on undead? Gentle Repose specifies the target as a corpse. Are all undead counted as corpses, are they counted as undead, etc? I always assumed that it works on undead just fine as a stay fresh charm, but it seems worth mentioning.

And in response to Faily: I've done this before when writing posts for a free form play by post star wars game. I wanted to introduce some randomness and back and forth to the combat scene I was writing as part of a character talking about the past and wound up statting up the npcs involved and using the resulting dice rolls to get an image in my head of how the combat went, before the momentum of it picked up and the rest of the encounter flowed from there. So, having actually done this before, it Can work as a writing tool. It's kind of a lot of work though, and as mentioned, the epic level builds aren't going to be helpful for writing the start of the story.

So, I'll wrap this post up by seconding the opinion that Sylence should be starting with lower level character builds. Maybe not first level builds (depends on how skilled the characters are starting in the story) but level 3 to 5 is a pretty solid starting point for protagonists of a story, especially if it's going to be a long running story where they continue to follow that upward arc in power. It also means that you don't have to worry about the story getting the character to some build that you wrote before you wrote the story, and that the later build can instead reflect the way the story and characters have grown since you first incepted* them.

*No, I don't care that incepted probably isn't a word.

[Sylence]

Sagetim, nuff respect my man. Thanks, a lot sir. 😎

[Sylence]

Hey Venger, check this it right here;


Xuldarinar said:
2013-03-15 01:45 AM
Default [D&D 3.5] PC race hybrid template
Take any two player character races of the same level adjustment and plug them in.

-Size: If the same, keep the same. If different by one step, use either. If different by two steps or more, average. If different by more than 2, but of an odd number, average then use either middle result.
-Type: If both are same, keep the same. If they are different, use the highest value of the following.
1: Animal, Humanoid, Vermin
2: Magical Beast, Monsterous Humanoid
3: Fey, Giant
4: Dragon, Humanoid (Shapechanger)
5: Aberration
6: Elemental, Ooze, Plant
7: Construct, Outsider, Undead
Example If one parent is a giant, and the other is a humanoid, the resulting hybrid is a giant for the purposes of type.
Exceptions: (I know this section might fill up fast.. But nothing here -just- yet)
-Subtypes: Only keep shared subtypes.
Exceptions: (Living Construct, Native, Shapechanger)
-Ability Score Modifiers: Average. Subtract 1 from odd numbered scores. If there are more than 2 negative odd numbered scores, for every 2, add 1 point to any negative prior to evening out scores. If there is no positive, remove any one negative > -2
-Speed: Average between the two.
-Vision: In most cases, add together.
-Immunities and resistances: keep from both parents
-Natural Armor: average
-Natural Weapons: The resulting creature gains the natural weapons of both
-Other Racial traits: Drop from both sides unless any are shared. Spell like abilities, if held by both sides, have shared uses
Example: if one parent can use Darkness 1/day, and the other can use Daylight 1/day, the hybrid may use Darkness or Daylight 1/day
Exception: in cases of creatures with a level adjustment. Compile a list of the abilities of both creatures that fall under this category that would be otherwise removed. Select a number of them equal to the averaged LA of the resulting creature. Traits with ranks, such as regeneration, cost one LA point per rank up to the maximum of that of one of the base creatures. If both share a trait but of different ranks, take the average.

-Blood: The resulting race gains the Blood traits associated with parents (Elf Blood, Orc Blood, ect.)
-Racial skill bonuses: Divide all by two and add together.
-Languages and bonus languages: Add together, in most cases.
-Favored Class: Use the favored class of either
-Level Adjustment: Average**

**Note: This template is not quite ready to properly handle differing level adjustments. You may use it as such but the results will vary. In cases where the average is not a whole number, typically round down at least for the purposes of trait selection, listed above.
Last edited by Xuldarinar; 2013-08-31 at 12:14 PM.
Extended Signature

Guide to becoming a demon in Pathfinder

Special thanks to Gurgleflep for creating my Avatar

[Venger]

that's homebrew

[Sagetim]

that's homebrew

To build on this: Unless it's got a page number and book cited, something is probably homebrew. Furthermore, there's a rather strong difference between First Party books* and Third Party books** in 3.5. While there are good Third Party books out there for 3.5, there's also a lot of really bad ones that just kind of drag the entirety down with them. Similar to how the glut of crappy video games in the 80's nearly destroyed the industry, until we started getting first party exclusivity from publishers with seals or guarantees of quality on them.

And that's not even getting started on people who throw out whole sections of the First Party books for various reasons. But when it comes to tiers of quality control, a general guideline is First Party > Third Party > Homebrew.


*those published by Wizards of the Coast

**those published by anyone else

[KillianHawkeye]

I've been away from this thread for a while (real life stuff), and I see a lot of new characters have been posted, but not a one of them has any backstory or personality or anything at all that makes them a writable character. And as expected, the cast looks like something out of an ultimate villains team-up comic. Are you planning on telling the story of how these disparate misfits become a team and triumph against all odds? That's almost the only way I could see a decent story coming out of what you've got so far.

Have you got anything planned out for the antagonists yet? Anything at all? Because I can tell you right now that the personalities, backstories, and character arcs of a story's major antagonist(s) are usually just as important as those of the main characters.



Question: A character can't become a lich until they're level 11 or 12, and I assume the same is true for a baelnorn since it's just a lich without the Evil alignment restriction. So, if you're really starting the story when the characters are lower level, is the backstory you gave for your first character a backstory at all? How are you planning on writing this character spending years impersonating somebody else and have her have any sort of interaction with the other characters in the party?

Or is this character just higher level than the rest? You mentioned throwing around some big spells in your description of the magic fight that ensues when your protagonist jumps out to murder the target of her identity theft, so that can't really happen at a low level after all.

I think statting all the characters at high level is skewing your thoughts a bit. You need to think carefully about your story's starting point and the journey your characters are going to embark on, and really plan out how they're all going to meet and function as a group and develop into what you're envisioning them eventually becoming. Also, do the same for the antagonists and any other important side characters.



Finally, just a random thought, but why do all your characters have code names and not some appropriate-sounding fantasy names? I guess it could be a stylistic choice, but it kind of gives your characters an impersonal feeling that's making it even harder for me to find anything in common with them (which was already a challenge because they're a collection of unrelatable circus freaks).

[RedMage125]

i think this story needs a 1st level marshall who becomes a sorcerer/tainted sorcerer and tries to kill all wizards.

bwahahahahahahaha