Arguing with trogladites again...

[Buufreak]

So, on a facebook page dedicated to 3/3.5/pf, someone made the bold claim that rolling an natural 1 on an attack roll provokes AoO from everyone nearby. I obviously believe this to be horsecrap, but I'm open to someone who can actually cite me something. Cite, here, of course means not just finding me some quote off the internet, but giving me an actual citation, such as an official webpage or a book and page number.

[Inevitability]

Sounds like your typical short-sighted 'I need to counterbalance crits' houserule.

[Anxe]

Nope, not a thing. Sounds like a reasonable enough house rule. Or it could be a feat that someone takes so they can do this to others

[mattie_p]

From the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/combatStatistics.htm)

Automatic Misses and Hits
A natural 1 (the d20 comes up 1) on an attack roll is always a miss. A natural 20 (the d20 comes up 20) is always a hit. A natural 20 is also a threat—a possible critical hit.

Full stop.

Nor is it a reasonable house rule, as it impairs mundanes even more than usual, and they need more help not less.

[Pleh]

Sounds like a personal twist on the fumble rules.

Fumble rules, while technically official content, are optional, and are not generally well liked around here.

[Buufreak]

From the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/combatStatistics.htm)


Full stop.

Nor is it a reasonable house rule, as it impairs mundanes even more than usual, and they need more help not less.

I'm in full agreeance. In fact, I quoted him not just that line, but sent him the link to the entire page. He continued to argue stating "his copy" said what he is claiming as rules.

[mattie_p]

I'm in full agreeance. In fact, I quoted him not just that line, but sent him the link to the entire page. He continued to argue stating "his copy" said what he is claiming as rules.

It's possible, as Pleh says, he's referring to p28 of the DMG:



VARIANT: CRITICAL MISSES (FUMBLES)

If you want to model a chance that in combat a character could fumble his weapon, then when a player rolls a 1 on his attack roll, have him make a DC10 Dexterity check. If he fails, his character fumbles. You neeed to decided what it means to fumble, but in general, that character should lose a turn of activity as he regains his balance, picks up a dropped weapon, clears his head, steadies himself, or whatever.

Fumbles are not appropiate to all games. They can add excitement or interest to combat, but they can also detract from the fun. They certainly add more randomness to combat. Add this variant rule only after careful consideration.


Even that variant rule doesn't go so far as to have a fumble provoke an AOO, though.

[Buufreak]

It's possible, as Pleh says, he's referring to p28 of the DMG:



Even that variant rule doesn't go so far as to have a fumble provoke an AOO, though.

Negative. He claimed it came from chapter 5 of his copy of the PHB.

[mattie_p]

Chapter 5 is the chapter of feats. Maybe he'd like to give a page?

[Buufreak]

Chapter 5 is the chapter of feats. Maybe he'd like to give a page?

Now we both know that is asking too much of anyone on the internet.

[TheIronGolem]

Negative. He claimed it came from chapter 5 of his copy of the PHB.

Ask him to take a photo of that page and see what excuse he comes up with for not doing it. My money's on "I don't have a camera".

[Hackulator]

I once created a character who got up to 40 attacks in a round before discovering the DM used the OPTIONAL critical fumble rule, meaning I basically killed myself in one round.

[DeTess]

I once created a character who got up to 40 attacks in a round before discovering the DM used the OPTIONAL critical fumble rule, meaning I basically killed myself in one round.

Not to sound too disparaging of your build, but unless each of those attacks did like 5 damage maximum, that's taking a borderline TO build into real play, which is just asking for trouble.

[Dr_Dinosaur]

Not to sound too disparaging of your build, but unless each of those attacks did like 5 damage maximum, that's taking a borderline TO build into real play, which is just asking for trouble.

Still points to the core problem with fumble rules