3.P - How Does The Magic Get In?

[unseenmage]

When crafting how exactly does the magic get into the Magic Item or Construct?

I suspect opinions may differ and that this gets handled differently at every table when it does come up.

This is something that gets glossed over by the crafting rules, which I have no problem with.
However, when roleplaying this aspect or even simply explaining how it works in your gameworld how does infusing magic into items or Constructs work?

Are there canon examples in adventure paths or novels of how it all goes down?


For my part I once had a goblin artificer who'd gnaw and chew on magic items to Retain Essence them.
When crafting he'd make sure to get his snot or spit or even blood on or even in the materials, to him every magic creation was akin to a homunculus.

Also had a gnome techsmith who would hire NPCs to assist with crafting who had the necessary feats or skills he wanted to imbue in a given Construct.

[rel]

I figure the process is somewhere between fantasy chemistry and fantasy smithing.
Lots of smoking or glowing potions to pour over or dip the item in, the application of heat and hammers and the etching, carving or striking of precise runes and diagrams.

Breaking things down you spend xp and GP first then take time so the costly part of the process is probably at the beginning.
First you make the item able to hold the spell (takes xp and GP)
then you cast the spell on the item
then you modify the magic (since a magic item is not an item with a spell cast on it)
finally you 'solidify' the magic preventing further changes and making the item usable.

[Kayblis]

The fluff isn't specified anywhere, so it really varies with the DM.

I imagine it as a process of combining many magical ingredients(inks, liquids, glowing powders, pastes and gases) in many different layers and forcing magic reactions akin to chemical reactions to bind a spell's essence into a mundane material. You could see it like welding, where you have a hot wire conducting heat and being consumed to weld two pieces of metal, along with a gas creating a special atmosphere(so the material doesn't react with oxygen). The end product would be a mix of different magic components that reacted in a very specific way you don't see anywhere else unintentionally. The GP and XP costs are paid upfront because you can't really start the work without all components at hand, and are consumed in a myriad of procedures through the many hours/days of work.

[Eldariel]

In olden days, Permanency was used to create magic items. If you choose to follow that fluff, at the beginning of the enchantment process you cast the required spells and then just spend rest of the time making the magic take the shape you wish and making it permanent. I mean, what else would you do in making a magic item? You start from a basic masterwork weapon/armor or other nondescript item and imbue it with power: thus I'd say it's only logical that the whole creation process is about the magical energies, not the physical crafting. particularly since physical labour is hundreds of times cheaper than making magic items.

[Afgncaap5]

I think this would vary widely by setting and by DM and by the nature of what, exactly, makes magic work. A Faerunian weapon smith in the Forgotten Realms might forge a bit of magic into a weapon with every rune etched or hammer struck against the item in question, perhaps imparting some of the magic also by burning certain rare alembics in the fires of the forge. A Zil binder in Eberron, on the other hand, might dedicate almost all of their time crafting a similar weapon through just making entreaties and deals with various elemental or spiritual forces, with the final moment of crafting being when the fire elemental chooses (or is forced) to be bound to the weapon, with a lesser amount of time spent attuning eberron shards to the spells known to make these things work.

Either way, the end result is a +1 Flaming longsword (heck, the Zil smith might've gone the extra mile and made it a +1 Burning longsword), but the magic at work is different. It feels almost identical to those of us in the real world who just have these plug-n-play ways of describing magic, but the nature of the thing requires different skills and different energies.

Fun fact, though: canonically, a Flaming weapon requires access to either the spell Fireball, the spell Flame Blade, or the spell Flame Strike. This suggests that Druids might have an easier time getting their magic to work properly for making a flaming sword, followed by wizards, followed by clerics. This probably means different things for different campaign worlds, but in a broad sense it suggests that willingly asking nature for the gift of fire is easier than alchemically binding the combustive power of bat guano and sulfur, which in turn is easier than turning to a god and asking them to make a weapon burn people even if someone other than you wields it. (I think as a GM, I'd probably houserule it so that Clerics of a Fire deity could make it work with the Produce Flame spell as well. I can see why this might be a tougher sell to just any ol' god, but I feel like a god of fire who you worship enough to get the fire domain, probably grants fire more easily, and with that house rule a Fire Cleric would be able to make one of these just as easily as a Druid.)

[Sagetim]

The magic gets in when you cast the spell(s) required for the item on it. Which is part of the crafting process (and why you need access to the spell, either by casting it yourself or from someone else). So at some point in the process, you are casting the spell or spells involved on the item/into the item.

I tend to think of magic item crafting as being a process of prepping the item with various little processes until it's just right to act as a receptacle for the spell or spells involved, and to place the finishing touches on whatever spells are involved so that they act the way the magic item is supposed to, instead of simply how they would as if they had been cast normally. For a mental image, most of the time you spend crafting the magic item is like hard wiring the programming for a computer, and leaving some large, complex pockets to be filled in by outside software (the spell or spells in question) that, after being cast into those pockets, also become hardwired and integrated into the resulting magic item. The end result being an item that has very set parameters in how it operates and what it does, as compared to spells that have more variable effects based on things like training (caster level) and talent (casting ability score).

[unseenmage]

The magic gets in when you cast the spell(s) required for the item on it. Which is part of the crafting process (and why you need access to the spell, either by casting it yourself or from someone else). So at some point in the process, you are casting the spell or spells involved on the item/into the item.

...
This one is weird to me because magic item materials are rarely going to be legal targets for the requisite spells.

My first thought was that 'prepping the object' could include weaving a mouse into it so spells that require a living creature to target could be cast...
An amusing thought which made me chuckle.

[rel]

In olden days, Permanency was used to create magic items. If you choose to follow that fluff, at the beginning of the enchantment process you cast the required spells and then just spend rest of the time making the magic take the shape you wish and making it permanent. I mean, what else would you do in making a magic item? You start from a basic masterwork weapon/armor or other nondescript item and imbue it with power: thus I'd say it's only logical that the whole creation process is about the magical energies, not the physical crafting. particularly since physical labour is hundreds of times cheaper than making magic items.

But for some reason making the much cheaper mundane item takes vastly longer than the process of enchantment

[Ravens_cry]

I had the thought that varies, both by class and individual. Every magic and every magic user have their own metaphor for the power they use, and this is in reflected in the magic items they create. A bit of a non-answer, but I like the idea that magic is personal.

[Eldariel]

But for some reason making the much cheaper mundane item takes vastly longer than the process of enchantment

If anything, enchanting takes longer than I'd assume since it's basically just the process of casting some spells on the item vs. the mundane crafting process of putting pieces together.

[rel]

If anything, enchanting takes longer than I'd assume since it's basically just the process of casting some spells on the item

Now I'm curious. If you view enchanting as just casting spells on an item then how do you see the massive gold cost of enchanting getting spent?
Does the wizard doing the enchanting just grind all the gold up and snort it?

[the_david]

There are some more details in Pathfinder Unchained under the dynamic item creation rules. It's still pretty vague.

[Eldariel]

Now I'm curious. If you view enchanting as just casting spells on an item then how do you see the massive gold cost of enchanting getting spent?
Does the wizard doing the enchanting just grind all the gold up and snort it?

Well, clearly it's just imbuing the spells into the item and the gold cost is related to difficulty or something. But still, fundamentally it feels like an unnecessarily long process; then again, things have changed a lot since AD&D.

[unseenmage]

Having asked the same question over at Candlekeep (http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=21891) I'm reading that the general consensus is that while older editions made magical crafting more nuanced and interesting 3.x made it more accessible to both the NPCs and the players.

Makes me wonder what the middle ground is.