Multi-classing as Warlock questions...

[samcifer]

So I'm playing a Favored Soul Sorc (the revised version from the UA revised subclasses article), and am considering multi-classing into warlock for at most 6 levels, going with the Celestial Pact (from the UA Revised Class Options article) and have a few questions:

Eldritch Blast... Does the damage scale up only for Warlock levels, or does it scale up for total levels of the character? In other words, would it only level up the 6 warlock levels, or if I made it to Sorc 14/War 6 would it scale up to max damage dice?

Radiant Soul adds my charisma mod as extra damage to one target of a spell I cast that deals fire or radiant damage, which my character will have many of in the end. Is the effect worth going for?

My reasoning for the Celestial Pact is that it seems the only way my sorc can gain the Flaming Sphere spell and that's one I really want my character to have as he's a pyromaniac type of character.

[Aett_Thorn]

1) Cantrip damage scales with CHARACTER level, not class level. So a Sorc 18/Warlock 2 will still be able to deal the full 4d10 (+5 per if you take that invocation) damage with Eldritch Blast.

2) Yes

[samcifer]

1) Cantrip damage scales with CHARACTER level, not class level. So a Sorc 18/Warlock 2 will still be able to deal the full 4d10 (+5 per if you take that invocation) damage with Eldritch Blast.

2) Yes

My concern is that at most, I'd only be doing and extra 5 damage per turn. Is that little amount of extra damage really worth it at higher levels? (this is my first time playing 5e, so I'm not as familiar with combat as I am in my experience with 4e).

[rbstr]

Yeah it's not a super strong feature:
On Cantrips EB+agonizing is still the best by a lot. But you will have a slightly better Sacred Flame if, for some reason, Dex saves are worth targeting or there's cover or Radiant is highly preferred as a damage type.
On decently placed AOE +3/4/5 damage to one target isn't really that much.
On single-target damage spells...You've got EB (and quicken!), I'm not sure you'll pick up much of these. Guiding Bolt and Scorching Ray are pretty decent with it I suppose you could have those.

So, really, I'm not sure it's going to get a lot of use and when it does come in to play it's not a game changer.

Now, if you get the ruling that you can apply the extra damage every turn you use Flaming Sphere's bonus-action move/damage though...that's more worth it!

[samcifer]

Actually, after looking over other articles in the UA, I discovered in the Light, Dark, Underdark a better pact option, the Undying Light Pact that lets me add my charisma mod to ALL fire and radiant damaging spells, not just a single target and I can do so from first level. It also grants access to the Flaming Sphere spell, wouldn't be redundant to Favored Soul and even let me keep 2 extra levels of sorcerer, though I'll go to warlock lv. 4 for the extra stat boost as I was already willing to forego lv. 9 spells anyways. This seems like the better option for me to choose. I'd even gain resistance to radiant damage and as I'm playing a tiefling, that'll twin well with the race's fire resistance.

[Aett_Thorn]

Actually, after looking over other articles in the UA, I discovered in the Light, Dark, Underdark a better pact option, the Undying Light Pact that lets me add my charisma mod to ALL fire and radiant damaging spells, not just a single target and I can do so from first level. It also grants access to the Flaming Sphere spell and wouldn't be redundant to Favored Soul and even let me keep 2 extra levels of sorcerer, though I'll go to warlock lv. 4 for the extra stat boost. As I was already willing to forego lv. 9 spells anyways, this seems like the better option for me to choose. I'd even gain resistance to radiant damage and as I'm playing a tiefling, that'll twin well with the race's fire resistance.

Just FYI: The Undying Light Patron is widely believed to be massively OP in part because of that. Make sure that your DM is okay with you using it.

[samcifer]

Just FYI: The Undying Light Patron is widely believed to be massively OP in part because of that. Make sure that your DM is okay with you using it.

He might be, seeing as how he's letting another player play Rick from Rick and Morty as an artificer who can't remember life before he came into the game.

[Millstone85]

You should be aware that the very first thing Unearthed Arcana told us about the Celestial is that it was "formerly known as the Undying Light".

So you are actually considering using a previous version of the same patron.

[samcifer]

You should be aware that the very first thing Unearthed Arcana told us about the Celestial is that it was "formerly known as the Undying Light".

So you are actually considering using a previous version of the same patron.

Damn... I DID miss that part. Okay then. Guess I'll have to go 6 and 14 after all and skip the last meta-magic upgrade as well as the lv. 8 spells as well then. :(

[bid]

My concern is that at most, I'd only be doing and extra 5 damage per turn. Is that little amount of extra damage really worth it at higher levels? (this is my first time playing 5e, so I'm not as familiar with combat as I am in my experience with 4e).
+5 per beam, up to 4 beams. Same damage as a Dex20 fighter/archer.

[rbstr]

He's not talking about agonizing blast but the level 6 feature "radiant soul".

I'm really not convinced a whole 6 levels is worth it. Just up to 3 for Flaming Sphere (or 4 for the ASI) is worth it to you, plus you can get a pact boon but after that I dono if you're gaining much to make up for the lost sorc levels.

[bid]

He's not talking about agonizing blast but the level 6 feature "radiant soul".
Oh, that was a reply to the "2)Yes"...
I missed that, thanks for clarifying.

[DarkKnightJin]

Cantrips indeed scale with character level.

As far as Flaming Sphere is concerned.. You could ask your DM if your character could learn it during downtime in place of another spell. Perhaps find a scroll or spellbook that has the spell, and they pour over it over and over until they have it all memorized, and they've learned the spell.
Could be some nice RP angle. If you have a DM that loves it when you RP stuff out, that could help you get access to a spell or skill you wouldn't normally be able to.

Can't check right now, but Celestial Patron doesnsound like it would be the easiest way to gaining access to the spell without explicit DM fiat. Outside of UA being allowed, obviously.

[samcifer]

Well, I can work it into the story. My character comes from a wealthy family with strong ties to the arcane in various forms (several wizards, sorcerers, bard and warlocks in the family. His father, seeing his talent with music, wants him to become a bard, but he loves the idea of setting people on fire as opposed to charming them into submission and after an argument, went out for the day and when some bullies tried to beat him up, his sorcerous power awoke to defend him. A mercenary in the area was drawn to the commotion and took him in, seeing his potential. He rarely sees his father and still resents the idea of being a bard, and is tempted to form a pact to increase his power instead of becoming a bard like his father wants him to.

The next game session is on Saturday, so I can talk over the warlock angle with him then as he knows about the bardic part of the character's story.

[samcifer]

Well, I can work it into the story. My character comes from a wealthy family with strong ties to the arcane in various forms (several wizards, sorcerers, bard and warlocks in the family. His father, seeing his talent with music, wants him to become a bard, but he loves the idea of setting people on fire as opposed to charming them into submission and after an argument, went out for the day and when some bullies tried to beat him up, his sorcerous power awoke to defend him. A mercenary in the area was drawn to the commotion and took him in, seeing his potential. He rarely sees his father and still resents the idea of being a bard, and is tempted to form a pact to increase his power instead of becoming a bard like his father wants him to.

The next game session is on Saturday, so I can talk over the warlock angle with him then as he knows about the bardic part of the character's story.

My reasoning for this is that as a Favored Soul sorc, I lack any defensive or damage boosts, so multi-classing into a Celestial Pact warlock and getting to warlock 6 would compensate for that as well as get me the flaming sphere spell I want to have.

[samcifer]

Okay, settled on only doing 2 multi-class levels as a hexblade warlock for the improved gear proficiencies as well as some Eldritch blast goodness with Agonizing blast and either Burning Hex (+CHA mod fire damage to target of hexblade curse) or Eldritch Sight to get use out of Detect Magic, which might be useful - tho Burning Hex sounds like I'd get more use out of it.) and choose Hex and Shield as my spells so I can get reliable use out of them using my refreshable warlock spell slots.

Tonight is the next game session and I'll discuss this with my dm tonight.

[samcifer]

Alright, the DM was okay with it all. I hit lv. 2 and multiclassed into hexblade warlock. Love the extra AC with medium armor and a shield, putting my AC at 17, which I think is really good for a spellcaster. We had to go through a side-quest rescuing some kidnapped kids before I could get a long rest whre he rped me meeting my patron in a dream and formed a pact with it. I think me loves RP-ing my patron because in the next battle (my first with warlock abilities) I missed two times in a row with Eldritch Blasts and the patron whispered in my ear "Stop sucking."

Really liking the multi-classing so far. :)

[Naanomi]

If you are an aasimar, you can add radiant damage to any Spell... so make your 'radiant soul' damage boost also apply to eldritch blast?

[Millstone85]

If you are an aasimar, you can add radiant damage to any Spell... so make your 'radiant soul' damage boost also apply to eldritch blast?Yo dawg I herd you like radiant souls, so how 'bout using yo protector aasimar's Radiant Soul on yo spell so you can use yo celeslock's Radiant Soul?

An aasimar favored celeslock would be some super redundant combo too. The nice thing is that you can just play an aasimar. Of course you have innate holy magic, you are an aasimar. Of course you have an angelic patron, like all aasimar.

[samcifer]

Yo dawg I herd you like radiant souls, so how 'bout using yo protector aasimar's Radiant Soul on yo spell so you can use yo celeslock's Radiant Soul?

An aasimar favored celeslock would be some super redundant combo too. The nice thing is that you can just play an aasimar. Of course you have innate holy magic, you are an aasimar. Of course you have an angelic patron, like all aasimar.

I'm playing a tiefling, actually.

[Degwerks]

Don't forget to use your Tiefling's free Hellish Rebuke ability when you take damage. I focused a lot on not getting hit and sometimes forgot that I had a 1/day use of it.

[samcifer]

Don't forget to use your Tiefling's free Hellish Rebuke ability when you take damage. I focused a lot on not getting hit and sometimes forgot that I had a 1/day use of it.

True, but that'll be next level as I'm only at two. Looks like we're pushing next session up a week since my fiance will be out of state to visit his relatives, so maybe I'll hit lv. 3 then.

After going over the campaign so far, there's been a few times when I needed to hit npcs outside my range of attack, such as when our fighter blabbed to a pair of gnomes who were hero-worshipping us that we killed a group of warriors when we wrongly assumed they were bandits, the gnomes panicked end ran away. We got one of them, but the other was still running so my turn was wasted and the ranger had to shoot him down with his bow instead.

Last night's session had me standing helpless out of range of a dozen enemies on a ship that was leaving with child slaves and I couldn't risk getting close enough to attack, so maybe taking the eldritch invocation to give EB 300' reach is worth it as the DM seems to like large encounter areas.

.....


Yeah, after having slept on it and realizing that I'd rather have it and not need it rather than needing it and not having it and taking in the size of many of the non-area testing/trial combats we've had, I'll go with the Eldritch Spear invocation for the added range. That'd let me attack from a nice safe range most bowmen can't reach without disadvantage. Besides, other than Agonizing Blast, I couldn't make up my mind on which invocation to pick as my second.

[samcifer]

So the thread on warlock/sorc multiclassing got me wondering and since I didn't want to hijack that thread, I'll ask here (makes sense anyways to do so here)...

Would getting a familiar with the Pact of the Chain be worth going for? I mean I'd get a 4th spell as well as lv. 2 spell slots so if I were to cash them in, I'd get 3 sp for each slot. Also, as a hexblade warlock who now has melee options and decent AC (18 with medium armor and shield), would having a familiar be tactically helpful? And what about it's use outside of combat? Wondering if going for it after I hit character lv. 5 (2 warlock / 3 sorc) would be worth it. IT also looks like a fun addition to my character. I was thinking of going for it at char lv. 7 (after I get sorc to 4 for the feat or +2 CHA which would max out CHA).

[Byke]

So the thread on warlock/sorc multiclassing got me wondering and since I didn't want to hijack that thread, I'll ask here (makes sense anyways to do so here)...

Would getting a familiar with the Pact of the Chain be worth going for? I mean I'd get a 4th spell as well as lv. 2 spell slots so if I were to cash them in, I'd get 3 sp for each slot. Also, as a hexblade warlock who now has melee options and decent AC (18 with medium armor and shield), would having a familiar be tactically helpful? And what about it's use outside of combat? Wondering if going for it after I hit character lv. 5 (2 warlock / 3 sorc) would be worth it. IT also looks like a fun addition to my character. I was thinking of going for it at char lv. 7 (after I get sorc to 4 for the feat or +2 CHA which would max out CHA).

There is a ton of value in invisible, intelligent flying scout with opposable thumbs to pick up small things (and make them invisible as well), pour potions down your throat or even aid you in combat (giving you advantages on attacks). They also open up a lot of potential RP and social interactions.

Also as it is a ritual spell you can switch out pets as well when needed. (If you have an hour).

Chain pact is probably the most useful/strongest at earlier levels, but doesn’t scale as well as Tome or Blade. The pet’s stats remain stagnant as you level up, while higher levels enemies have better perception and means of detections.

You also fall two level behind in your Sorcerer spell levels. There are pros and cons either way. Play what is most fun to you.

[samcifer]

There is a ton of value in invisible, intelligent flying scout with opposable thumbs to pick up small things (and make them invisible as well), pour potions down your throat or even aid you in combat (giving you advantages on attacks). They also open up a lot of potential RP and social interactions.

Also as it is a ritual spell you can switch out pets as well when needed. (If you have an hour).

Chain pact is probably the most useful/strongest at earlier levels, but doesn’t scale as well as Tome or Blade. The pet’s stats remain stagnant as you level up, while higher levels enemies have better perception and means of detections.

You also fall two level behind in your Sorcerer spell levels. There are pros and cons either way. Play what is most fun to you.

Oh, so a sprite with only 4HP will be very vulnerable later on, even with invisibility? Guess I'll go tome instead then for the extra cantrips. (I'll use a feat for rituals as my EI choices are already set in to focus on EB.)

[Byke]

Oh, so a sprite with only 4HP will be very vulnerable later on, even with invisibility? Guess I'll go tome instead then for the extra cantrips. (I'll use a feat for rituals as my EI choices are already set in to focus on EB.)

Well if you get the ritual caster feat, you can pick up Find Familiar and snag an owl for "Fly by attack / aid " for adav on attacks.

[samcifer]

Well if you get the ritual caster feat, you can pick up Find Familiar and snag an owl for "Fly by attack / aid " for adav on attacks.

True enough. :)