Help with Battleaxe using Oath of Vengeance vampire hunter build

[NiklasWB]

Hi playgrounders,

I recently rewatched the movie Abraham Lincoln - Vampire Hunter, it despite being a pretty mediocre movie, the 'hunting vampires with a woodcutter's axe' parts got my creative juices flowing. So I started thinking about a backup character in case my current one dies. Please note that this is an 'optimize within the bounds of the concept' build, so I'm aware he will not be super optimal. I just need to make him as good as possible while not straying from the concept.

Anyway, I am a sucker for humans, so I'm pretty sure I will go with Standard Human (or maybe Vhuman if I really need more Feats early).

I really love Paladins, but I almost always pick Oath of Devotion, so I figured I could switch things up with an Oath of Vengeance character for this build. I'm thinking the like: father and husband picks up woodcutter's axe from the chopping block after he finds his wife and children murdered by vampires spawns.

It seems that the Oath of Devotion is better on paper against vampires though, being immune to charm and having automatic Protection from Evil and Good at higher levels.

While the optimal weapon would obviously be a heavy two hander (maul, axe or sword) with Great Weapon Master, or a polearm with Plearm Master, I wanted to try to realize the Abraham Lincoln - Vampire Hunter 'visual' - fighting vampires with a fairly mundane tool/weapon, i.e the woodcutter's axe. Seeing as it is not quite a handaxe (beeing longer and heavier, and not really throwable despite what the movie shows us), I think it would be plausible to give the axe the same stats as a battleaxe, i.e. 1d8 (1d10 versatile). The character would pretty much always use it two handed, seing as it would be somewhat odd to weild a shield with it.

We use point-by 27, so the starting ability scores would probably be:

STR: 16
DEX: 10
CON: 14
INT: 10
WIS: 11
CHA: 16

So, give the above mentioned, how would you build a vampire hunter Oath of Vengeance paladin who uses a Battleaxe (versatile)?

Seeing as I use a STR weapon I kind of have to use Heavy armor, so starting with Chainmail and moving to Splint and Plate as soon as possible.

Which fighting style should I pick? Defensive or Two Weapon Fighting? I know Dueling is better statistically, but like I mentioned, he will be two-handing the axe.

Will I be gimping myself too much by not using a heavy two hander or a shield? Or could I take another Feat that makes up for not having GWP or PAM.

Would Sentinel be good? It does that become redundant because of Relentless Avenger? What Feats would you say are especially good against vampires (other than the obvious 'do more damage' ones)?

Should I get Resilient CON and try to always have Protection from Evil and Good prepared?

I toyed with the idea of taking Tavern Brawler (and talk to the DM about having the woodcutter's axe be an improvised weapon but it still doing 1d8 (1d10 versatile), and be able to grapple the vampire with the free hand as a bonus action). But I'm not sure grappling a vampire is really worth it without also taking the Grappler Feat... Realistically with point-by 27 I'll only get to take 1 Feat (the rest of the ASI going into STR, CHA and maybe CON), so I feel like it has to be a good one.

Any ideas are welcome.

[djreynolds]

Would you multiclass?

I only ask because I ran a paladin/ranger(yes very MAD but cool) and I would concentrate on lightning arrow. I would use a thrown weapon like a javelin... you could thrown hand axe with the lightning arrow spell as your first attack and then go in and land your second attack and still smite

AFB should work with Hail of thorns, conjure barrage/ conjure volley

[Talionis]

I'd just say the woodcutting axe is equivalent to a Battle Axe. It doesn't have reach but it's effective and built to split big trees. I'd say GWM is the goto feat. You can make up for Accuracy with your Oath. GWM is also very thematic of that characters attack style as does Smite.

Carry some hand axes for chucking. You throw with Strength.

The shotgun axe was like a spellstoring axe and it could also be like Spell Smites. Just any magical distance attack.

You already get Charisma to Saves and your proficiency is in Wisdom saves so you should handle Charm effects well enough. And protection from Evil is on your spell list.

You could add Bard levels at some point since Abraham Lincoln is such an accomplished speaker it would thematically make sense and grant access to any spell you might not otherwise have access to.

[Specter]

If you're sure you don't want to make the axe a Greataxe, and you don't want to use a shield either, then go two-weapon fighting. Even without the fighting style (unless your DM allows it), that bonus attack is good when you have Hunter's Mark and/or Vow of Enmity active, and especially good once Improved Divine Smite comes online.

[PeteNutButter]

If you're sure you don't want to make the axe a Greataxe, and you don't want to use a shield either, then go two-weapon fighting. Even without the fighting style (unless your DM allows it), that bonus attack is good when you have Hunter's Mark and/or Vow of Enmity active, and especially good once Improved Divine Smite comes online.

To his point, a lot of historical great axes, or rather 2 handed axes quite resemble a wood cutter's axe. It's things like video games that make us thing a great axe must be this massive thing. Flavoring the weapon as a great axe seems totally in line.

Diverging from optimization, I really like the revised ranger with favored enemy undead for this build. It might not be optimal when combined with the paladin, but it fits the theme.

[Armored Walrus]

A woodcutter's axe is definitely not a versatile weapon, IMO. You're not going to accomplish much swinging one of those one-handed. I, too, vote for making your weapon a greataxe for this build solely based on that ;)

[GlenSmash!]

A woodcutter's axe is definitely not a versatile weapon, IMO. You're not going to accomplish much swinging one of those one-handed. I, too, vote for making your weapon a greataxe for this build solely based on that ;)

Agreed. A woodcutter's axe is definitely not designed to be swung in one hand.

[Scathain]

Agreed. A woodcutter's axe is definitely not designed to be swung in one hand.

And honestly, greataxe opens up GWM, which IMO explains this:

https://youtu.be/KhAcWii_TAY

I mean, that's what OP wants in level of badass right? Tell me that isn't a vengeance paladin MC Undead favored-enemy ranger. Or maybe Abraham Lincoln's favored enemy was trees idfk...

I mean, Restitution from the OoV reads: "If my foes wreak ruin on the world, it is because I failed to stop them. I must help those harmed by their misdeeds."

[NiklasWB]

Thank you all so much for your input!

Making the woodcutter's axe a greataxe never crossed my mind since I just assumed that everyone would cry foul at the idea that a simple 'tool' could do 1d12 damage. However, since there seems to be an overwhelming consensus for the idea here, maybe I'll just suggest this to the DM when the time comes. It would undoubtedly make things alot easier build-wise, opening up for a pure two handed build and GWM.

And I never really thought about multi-classing with Ranger... I'm not sure it is worth delaying the paladin progression, at least not until after like lvl 6-7. The Favored Enemy ability is extremely fitting however... If anything I think it would have to be the Revised Ranger, since that one actually gives some bonus damage to Undead, and probably not more than 3-4 levels? If so, should I go Hunter (for Colossus Slayer), or a re-fluffed Deep Stalker (for Underdark Scout and Deep Stalker Magic). The Hunter is more straight forward, just do more damage every round... But fighting vampires the character could really use darkvision (since he is human), extra attack at the start of combat and extra speed... all from the Deep Stalker. Hmmm, I'm actually leaning more toward Deep Stalker now, refluffed as a "Crypt Stalker".

Ok, now we're cooking!

The Stats would be very MAD though (seriously, why is 13 DEX required for Ranger, it should really be DEX or STR), but it could work I suppose.

Starting stats?

STR: 16
DEX: 13
CON: 14
INT: 9
WIS: 13
CHA: 14

Or should I lower some stat and get 14 in DEX and WIS?

STR: 14
DEX: 14
CON: 14
INT: 11
WIS: 14
CHA: 14

In what order should I level the character? Paladin lvl 1 as a start and then Ranger 1 to get favored enemy, followed by Paladin to lvl 6, then Ranger to lvl 3 or 4? It will delay ASI on an already MAD character... What do you guys suggest?

[Saiga]

I think the Ranger multiclass only works if you're rolling for stats, and you roll well.

As for the axe situation - I want to repeat the sentiment that a Greataxe is a perfectly acceptable template for your woodcutter's axe, however if you still want to use a Battleaxe it should also be fine. The damage die aren't that different (d8 vs d10 vs d12) and that's only a 1 point difference on average between them. The real loss is not being able to use GWM, but there's the UA Brawny feat that can give you a niche neither Sword & Board or GWM users have: grappling. With a greataxe is one hand, and a free hand to grapple people, you can have a lot of battlefield control and easy advantage for when you can't vow of enmity someone.

Have you considered an Oath of Ancients? Since your character is a woodcutter, you might also want a stronger connection to the forest. Vampires are also unnatural creatures, so an Oath of Ancients has plenty of reason to hunt them down.

[Talionis]

I thought about Ranger for Favored Enemy the UA version is much better, but I don't recommend it. It's too MAD. You want a good Constitution, Charisma and Strength getting Wisdom 13 is just too hard.

Thematically it works but Paladin is a very strong choice. If you want Ranger Spells pick them up with Lore Bard. You already have Hunters Mark from Vengence.

[coyote_sly]

Honestly, I'd probably think Fighter over Ranger for multiclass. Conceptually, you want this character to be really, REALLY good at wrecking single targets (vampires specifically), and adding Action Surge and the Champion's expanded crit range would make a fight very, very short - bonus action Vow of Enmity for advantage, two attacks, actions surge, two more.

Odds are very good you'll roll a crit somewhere in 8 attack rolls (about 66% off the top of my head) for a huge Divine Smite, and you can dump as many as four spell slots into that initial burst.