Tiefling in oots [Archive] - Giant in the Playground Forums

grandpheonix

2017-09-10, 03:08 PM

Anyone seen one yet? I can't recall seeing one yet.

factotum

2017-09-10, 03:50 PM

I think Haley being one (or am aasimar, the angelic equivalent) is a popular fan theory, but I don't think we've ever officially seen one.

Fyraltari

2017-09-10, 04:42 PM

Is there any reason why you ask if those in particular have appeared ?

I asked because I might have missed some subtle clue about them since I have never played DnD in my life. SHAAAAAAAME !

Or is it just your favorite race ? I am just curious. :elan:

alwaysbebatman

2017-09-10, 06:01 PM

They got added as a PC race at some point. Playable races are generally more prevalent. But OOTS seems to stick mostly with the OG 6.

Goosefarble

2017-09-10, 06:34 PM

IIRC, tieflings were in 3rd edition but not as a core race. They only got introduced as one in 4th edition (and are also very prominent in 5th edition)

Goblin_Priest

2017-09-10, 06:38 PM

IIRC, tieflings were in 3rd edition but not as a core race. They only got introduced as one in 4th edition (and are also very prominent in 5th edition)

Indeed. Also Savage Species gave them a +1 LA I think, making them garbage.

ti'esar

2017-09-10, 07:23 PM

If you're just wondering what a tiefling would look like in OOTS-style, there's a number of them in the PC figures from the Monster for Every Season collections.

I think Haley being one (or am aasimar, the angelic equivalent) is a popular fan theory, but I don't think we've ever officially seen one.

Wait, is that seriously still around??

factotum

2017-09-11, 01:28 AM

Wait, is that seriously still around??

I have no idea, I just remember it being a thing at one point.

Gift Jeraff

2017-09-11, 01:53 AM

It died around here (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0772.html) because it showed Haley's mom and killed the idea that "Mommy want to heaven" (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0681.html) was alluding to a celestial literally returning to the Upper Planes.

Mad Humanist

2017-09-11, 02:15 AM

Lord Torath

2017-09-11, 01:19 PM

They got added as a PC race at some point. Playable races are generally more prevalent. But OOTS seems to stick mostly with the OG 6.I think they were added in the 2E Planescape setting (never played that setting, so I can't tell for sure). There was a Tiefling NPC in Baldur's Gate II.

KorvinStarmast

2017-09-11, 02:11 PM

I think they were added in the 2E Planescape setting (never played that setting, so I can't tell for sure). Yep. I prefer tieflings as NPC's, if they must exist. (Then again, with all of the sex succubi and incubi have with humans, there are bound to be a few hybrids running about ...)

and are also very prominent in 5th edition (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?5=22371043&postcount=5)) A regrettable choice by WoTC, along with gnomes.

Gift Jeraff

2017-09-11, 03:46 PM

So a fan theory was born; a fan theory died. A study in miniature. It's so beautiful.

As far as I know, this is more-or-less the full breakdown of the "Haley isn't (fully) human" fan theory:
-Haley jokes about being half-dragon in #131 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0131.html).
-In Book 1's commentary, Rich says "Honestly, though, Sabine hasn't really yet shown all her true colors, and neither has Haley, so I'll keep quiet about another key way in which they are opposed." I'm told that the 2015 Afterword in the PDF confirms that this was referring to their hidden motives regarding the IFCC and Ian, respectively.
-A [half-?]celestial with a palette swap of Haley's hair appears in #193 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0193.html).
-Various ideas that Girard Draketooth was part dragon due to his name and related to Haley due to his hair and persona.
-Haley's unfinished "Elan, it turns out I may not be exactly what you would call-" from #309 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0309.html).
-The aforementioned "Mommy went to heaven" line in #681 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0681.html).
-While it pretty much killed the half-celestial idea, Panel 4 of #772 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0772.html), if interpreted a certain way, did somewhat add fuel to the general "non-human heritage Haley" idea.
-Maybe somewhere out there someone clings on to the idea and interpreted Roy's line at the end of #965 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0965.html) as a hint from Rich that Haley has extraordinary or psionic abilities.

Jasdoif

2017-09-11, 08:28 PM

Anyone seen one yet? I can't recall seeing one yet.If we saw one of the tieflings that are indistinguishable from humans (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/planetouched.htm#tiefling), would we know? o_o

facw

2017-09-11, 08:45 PM

Anyone seen one yet? I can't recall seeing one yet.

There are male and female Tiefling Wizards in the Summer A Monster for Every Season. They have red skin tones, colored eyes, and prominent horns. The female wizard has a tattoo or other marking of some sort on her back.

Edit: AMfES: Autumn has Tiefling Paladins and Tiefling Clerics as well. They are similar, though one lacks horns, and two have tails. One has "beast" legs. The paladins both have normal eyes, while the clerics get colored eyes like the wizards.

archon_huskie

2017-09-11, 09:23 PM

As far as I know, this is more-or-less the full breakdown of the "Haley isn't (fully) human" fan theory:
-Haley jokes about being half-dragon in #131 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0131.html).
-In Book 1's commentary, Rich says "Honestly, though, Sabine hasn't really yet shown all her true colors, and neither has Haley, so I'll keep quiet about another key way in which they are opposed." I'm told that the 2015 Afterword in the PDF confirms that this was referring to their hidden motives regarding the IFCC and Ian, respectively.
-A [half-?]celestial with a palette swap of Haley's hair appears in #193 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0193.html).
-Various ideas that Girard Draketooth was part dragon due to his name and related to Haley due to his hair and persona.
-Haley's unfinished "Elan, it turns out I may not be exactly what you would call-" from #309 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0309.html).
-The aforementioned "Mommy went to heaven" line in #681 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0681.html).
-While it pretty much killed the half-celestial idea, Panel 4 of #772 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0772.html), if interpreted a certain way, did somewhat add fuel to the general "non-human heritage Haley" idea.
-Maybe somewhere out there someone clings on to the idea and interpreted Roy's line at the end of #965 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0965.html) as a hint from Rich that Haley has extraordinary or psionic abilities.

One other thing in the Haley something else theory. Some like myself saw the tattoo on her back as scar tissue of where her wings used to be.

With Sabine being an evil outsider it would make her more of an evil opposite if Haley was a good outsider.

But it is too late in the story to introduce the Haley's mother as a half-celestial who had her wings clipped and then died a mortal death. If that was going to be a thing, the moment to introduce it has past.

martianmister

2017-09-12, 02:51 PM

-Haley's unfinished "Elan, it turns out I may not be exactly what you would call-" from #309.

We still didn't get an answer on that. :smallfrown:

thereaper

2017-09-13, 08:14 AM

She most likely meant "a good person".

littlebum2002

2017-09-13, 09:04 AM

She most likely meant "a good person".

I cheat at solitaire. I have a tattoo you've never seen. I kissed a girl once. OK, OK, more than once!

<Geez, we're gonna be here all night at this rate!>
<Oh. Oh, no, it couldn't be THAT, could it? Even V doesn't know that one.>

Elan, it turns out I may not be exactly what you would call a good person

I mean, do you really think that makes sense? It seems like much deeper of a secret than that.

JbeJ275

2017-09-13, 09:58 AM

We still didn't get an answer on that. :smallfrown:

Some people were theorising "straight" after Haleys bisexuality showed up but they evidently didn't know what latent means. Also just after the kissed a girl thing it doesn't make much sense as it's basically the same secret.

Zyzzyva

2017-09-13, 10:01 AM

Some people were theorising "straight" after Haleys bisexuality showed up but they evidently didn't know what latent means. Also just after the kissed a girl thing it doesn't make much sense as it's basically the same secret.

Also, she already said "I kissed a girl once... ok, ok, more than once" which covers a big chunk of that.

Whatever she was going to say, though, I agree it was most likely her trying to be open about her insecurities rather than anything more directly plot-related.

KorvinStarmast

2017-09-13, 10:19 AM

Also, she already said "I kissed a girl once... ok, ok, more than once" which covers a big chunk of that.

Whatever she was going to say, though, I agree it was most likely her trying to be open about her insecurities rather than anything more directly plot-related.

Wasn't Rich riffing on that Katy Perry song (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Kissed_a_Girl)? (It was released on April 28, 2008) I think that was before Haley's scene with that line, but I may recall that timeline incorrectly.

Quebbster

2017-09-13, 11:29 AM

Wasn't Rich riffing on that Katy Perry song (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Kissed_a_Girl)? (It was released on April 28, 2008) I think that was before Haley's scene with that line, but I may recall that timeline incorrectly.

Strip 309 was published in 2006...

martianmister

2017-09-14, 07:09 AM

Strip 309 was published in 2006...

So, Katy Perry was riffing on Haley. I know it.

Zyzzyva

2017-09-14, 07:15 AM

So, Katy Perry was riffing on Haley. I know it.

Fun fact: Firework is referring to Elan's attention span.

hroþila

2017-09-14, 07:24 AM

I mean, do you really think that makes sense? It seems like much deeper of a secret than that.
Agreed. It might start with "...a good person" (or something along those lines), but she'd have to be talking about something more concrete than that (the story of how all those people in her life left her, perhaps?) or it makes no sense for it to be a big secret even V doesn't know about. I mean, it wouldn't be a huge revelation to hear that the Good-aligned thief is hesitant about the ethics of what she does, would it, and she had no problem saying aloud (even if as gibberish) that she was "Good-ish".

goodpeople25

2017-09-14, 07:27 AM

Strip 309 was published in 2006...
So? Didn't stop unseen university from ripping off hogwarts.

martianmister

2017-09-14, 07:50 AM

So? Didn't stop unseen university from ripping off hogwarts.

And the Worst Witch.

littlebum2002

2017-09-14, 08:26 AM

goodpeople25

2017-09-14, 09:06 AM

It's a LOT easier to parody things that have already happened than to parody things that aren't going to happen for another 2 years.

I mean, it's possible that Rich was a time traveler from the future, then traveled pack in time to 2006 to parody a song that wasn't made until 2008, it's just not very likely. It is, however, trivially easy to write a strip in 2006 parodying a book written in 1997. Doesn't even require time travel.
If there's some in-joke or something I'm missing I apologize. Anyway Unseen University is an institution in the discworld series novels that was there from the start. I was recalling (so not completely certain about details or if it actually happened) an incident where it was said it was ripping off hogwarts. (Newspaper, interview? Can't remember) You'll sadly have to time travel yourself to ask the late author on the ease (or lack there of) of time travel to 1997 or later to get an idea for his 1983 book.

Basically the time travel was what I was referring to.

Zyzzyva

2017-09-14, 09:11 AM

So? Didn't stop unseen university from ripping off hogwarts.

It's a LOT easier to parody things that have already happened than to parody things that aren't going to happen for another 2 years.

I mean, it's possible that Rich was a time traveler from the future, then traveled pack in time to 2006 to parody a song that wasn't made until 2008, it's just not very likely. It is, however, trivially easy to write a strip in 2006 parodying a book written in 1997. Doesn't even require time travel.

...Unseen University is not Warthog's School of Wizardry and Sorcery (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0253.html). It is, rather, Discworld's premiere magic academy (https://wiki.lspace.org/mediawiki/Unseen_University). goodpeople is making a joke about the fact that some Harry Potter fans with a poor grasp of chronology accused Pratchett of ripping off Rowling, even though UU was first written about in, IIRC, the late 80s. (And of course they're both really just independent references to the English Public School/University system, rather than each other.) Just like Rich cleverly ripped off Katy Perry several years before she wrote the song.

ETA:

If there's some in-joke or something I'm missing I apologize. Anyway Unseen University is an institution in the discworld series novels that was there from the start. I was recalling (so not completely certain about details or if it actually happened) an incident where it was said it was ripping off hogwarts. (Newspaper, interview? Can't remember) You'll sadly have to time travel yourself to ask the late author on the ease (or lack there of) of time travel to 1997 or later to get an idea for his 1983 book.

Basically the time travel was what I was referring to.

Ninja'd!

The quote is: "Ponder Stibbons was indeed first drawn in 1996. I, of course, used a time machine to 'get the idea' of Unseen University from Hogwarts; I don't know what Paul [Kidby, the illustrator] used in this case. Obviously he must have used something." I don't have an original source, though, just the Annotated Pratchett (https://www.lspace.org/books/apf/the-last-hero.html).

AceOfFools

2017-09-15, 11:44 AM

Riftwolf

2017-09-15, 12:06 PM

I'd always assumed the end of Haley's statement was "I am not exactly a virgin."

Granted, OotS seems way more cavalier about that sort of thing than even contemporary American fiction, let alone time periods and setings DnD tends to emulate. But I can see that being something Haley would be embarrassed to reveal to a crush (or V).

I also thought "... not exactly a member if the thieves guild," would work considering it means she's been lying to him from the moment they met.

Rich has referred to this cavalieriness before; the population of the Oots world, and indeed any high fantasy world, live under 'we could die tomorrow' conditions. And even the most sexually conservative member of the Order* (Durkon) was understanding of pregnancy outside wedlock.

*I'm not including V as I think there's a difference between having conservative values and being gender-neutral/possibly asexual.

KorvinStarmast

2017-09-15, 02:01 PM

Thanks to you all for getting my timeline squared away in re Katy Perry stealing that song idea from Rich. :smallbiggrin:

factotum

2017-09-15, 03:16 PM

I'd always assumed the end of Haley's statement was "I am not exactly a virgin."

She was talking to Elan, a man who tried to seduce the sorceress who kidnapped them back in the bandit camp. I really don't think he would care if she was a virgin or not, or that she would believe that he *would* care.