Best ranged martial?

[Spacehamster]

If you wanted to make the "best" ranged toon how would you class him? I'm thinking 12 battle master, 4 assassin and 4 hunter ranger with horde breaker, wood elf with alert, mobile and sharpshooter, expertise in stealth and perception, feats and 3 ASI towards maxing AGI and putting WIS to 18. Stats after racials at level 1: 8/17/15/8/16/8 after ASIs: 8/20/16/8/18/8.

Combat styles: archery and mariner

He would be fast, deadly and accurate, v stealthy, would almost always go first due to 10 initiative which would let him attack with advantage the first combat round due to assassin levels. Could do insane damage when managing a surprise round as well as a now and then bonus. :)

What are your thoughts on what would make the best ranged toon?

[TheUser]

5 Ranger/ X Arcane Trickster

2 attacks, +2 to hit, bonus action hide, hunters mark, wounded prey and sneak attack bonus dice

Shield spell, ensnaring strike, disadvantage against your saves when hidden after Arcane Trickster 9

It does the damage of a battlemaster without needing to sharpshooter all the time.

[Specter]

I would go Ranger 13/Battlemaster 4/Arcane Trickster 3. Battlemaster tends to be diminishing returns after level 3, while Ranger always gets you cool spells and spell slots.

[Mortis_Elrod]

I like Hexblade 12/(revised)Hunter 4/Arcane Archer 4 For a very magical archer. You only need 4 invocations for the pact bow: Eldritch Smite, Improved Pact Weapon, Thirsting Blade, Lifedrinker

Lets add up what you get
-3 5th level slots from the warlock
-11 spells (with some optional paladin like spells) from the warlock
-4 cantrips
-ranges smites
-Proficiency, dex, AND cha to damage as well as favored enemy bonus
- at least a +1 bow, and +1 arrows AND archery style for accuracy
-2 attacks with bow
-Natural explorer
-primeval awareness
-3 1st level ranger spells, 3 1st level slots
- your choice of hunter's prey ability
- your choice of 2 more invocations
- plenty of ASIs for stats and feats
- mystic arcanum (6th level)
-Action Surge
-Second Wind
- ANOTHER fighting style,
-Arcane shots.
-Shadow Hound
-Armor of Hexes
-possibly destructive wave (if you want)


This is all very good, when you can stack alot into 2 attacks. Bonus action curse someone Then unload Smite+Arcane shot+ +1bow +1arrow + dex + cha + proficiency + colossus slayer + favored enemy, oh then attack again. You could spend a couple turns stacking up hex +curse or curse + branding smite. oh and sharpshooter whenever you feel like it.

[Easy_Lee]

Best for what? And do you get to build the character out of whole cloth, or do you have to actually play this character from level 1? Knowing nothing about the request, a CE + SS Battle Master or Arcane Archer (if allowed) are both good. You can multiclass into rogue or whatever at some point for additional damage or capabilities.

[SharkForce]

I would go Ranger 13/Battlemaster 4/Arcane Trickster 3. Battlemaster tends to be diminishing returns after level 3, while Ranger always gets you cool spells and spell slots.

battlemaster loses steam pretty quick, but baseline fighter is pretty awesome clear up until level 11 at least.

[Spacehamster]

Best for what? And do you get to build the character out of whole cloth, or do you have to actually play this character from level 1? Knowing nothing about the request, a CE + SS Battle Master or Arcane Archer (if allowed) are both good. You can multiclass into rogue or whatever at some point for additional damage or capabilities.

Guess I should have been bit more specific, let's say it has to be pretty good through its whole career, good enough mobility to keep out of melee most of the time, not too magicky(hence martial ranged), consistent dpr and fairly useful outside combat(decent at skills and such). This is why I did not take crossbow master and go with longbow instead to always be able to use my 35(later 45) movement as a bonus action to keep out of harms way.

Only printed material no UA.

[Easy_Lee]

Guess I should have been bit more specific, let's say it has to be pretty good through its whole career, good enough mobility to keep out of melee most of the time, not too magicky(hence martial ranged), consistent dpr and fairly useful outside combat(decent at skills and such). This is why I did not take crossbow master and go with longbow instead to always be able to use my 35(later 45) movement as a bonus action to keep out of harms way.

Only printed material no UA.

Thief or Mastermind rogue with a short bow fits the bill. Add some fighter levels for extra attack and action surge if you desire.

[Specter]

Guess I should have been bit more specific, let's say it has to be pretty good through its whole career, good enough mobility to keep out of melee most of the time, not too magicky(hence martial ranged), consistent dpr and fairly useful outside combat(decent at skills and such). This is why I did not take crossbow master and go with longbow instead to always be able to use my 35(later 45) movement as a bonus action to keep out of harms way.

Only printed material no UA.

I'm sticking to Ranger/Rogue then.

- Good through its whole career: Start as Ranger for 5 levels and you'll never be bored.
- Good mobility: Cunning Action (and maybe Escape the Horde) gets you there.
- Not too magicky: since you mentioned Ranger, I guess they're not too magical.
- Consistent DPR: Sharshooter, Archery FS, Colossus Slayer, Extra Attack and Sneak Attack. Add ranger spells to that and you get a further boon.
- Out-of-combat: the best at sneaking and tracking, plus help from spells like Pass Without Trace, Alarm, Silence and Water Breathing.

[Spacehamster]

I'm sticking to Ranger/Rogue then.

- Good through its whole career: Start as Ranger for 5 levels and you'll never be bored.
- Good mobility: Cunning Action (and maybe Escape the Horde) gets you there.
- Not too magicky: since you mentioned Ranger, I guess they're not too magical.
- Consistent DPR: Sharshooter, Archery FS, Colossus Slayer, Extra Attack and Sneak Attack. Add ranger spells to that and you get a further boon.
- Out-of-combat: the best at sneaking and tracking, plus help from spells like Pass Without Trace, Alarm, Silence and Water Breathing.

Yeah with not too magic-y I meant no high level spells pretty much. :)

[greenstone]

Warlock 20, agonizing blast invocation, eldritch spear invocation, spell sniper feat.

I can reach out and hit you from 600 feet away, ignoring any cover you have. I can do this every round, all day, with no need to track ammo.

[JNAProductions]

Warlock 20, agonizing blast invocation, eldritch spear invocation, spell sniper feat.

I can reach out and hit you from 600 feet away, ignoring any cover you have. I can do this every round, all day, with no need to track ammo.

First off, few DMs track ammo.

Second off, martial. This is pretty heavily magical.

Third off, this completely lacks Sharpshooter, the Archery Fighting Style, and various other goodies. It's good baseline DPR, but a far cry from the best.

Fourth off, how often do you get to start from 600' away rather than nearby?

[Kane0]

UA Arcane Archer Fighter is pretty good, gets Auto +1 arrows and archery style to offset sharpshooter penalty. Add in a couple trick shots and maybe a dip into ranger, rogue, or whatever to round yourself out and you should be gold without getting too complex.
Also something in my sig might interest you but I don't want to go tooting my own horn.

[Naanomi]

I've had a lot of fun with both a halfling battlemaster 20 (handcrossbow); and a 'Sniper' woodelf fighter 1/Assassin 19... and I've never played it but I'm sure a hunter 11/(some combo of rogue/fighter/ranger) works great as well

[Citan]

If you wanted to make the "best" ranged toon how would you class him? I'm thinking 12 battle master, 4 assassin and 4 hunter ranger with horde breaker, wood elf with alert, mobile and sharpshooter, expertise in stealth and perception, feats and 3 ASI towards maxing AGI and putting WIS to 18. Stats after racials at level 1: 8/17/15/8/16/8 after ASIs: 8/20/16/8/18/8.

Combat styles: archery and mariner

He would be fast, deadly and accurate, v stealthy, would almost always go first due to 10 initiative which would let him attack with advantage the first combat round due to assassin levels. Could do insane damage when managing a surprise round as well as a now and then bonus. :)

What are your thoughts on what would make the best ranged toon?
Well, it really depends on how you want him to be the "best".

In all cases, Sharpshooter and max DEX is a given.

SUSTAINED DAMAGE 1
Battlemaster 11 / Devotion Paladin 4 / Sorcerer 5
Sorcerer for Haste or Fly, Devotion for +CHA on weapon and Bless or Divine Favor.

SUSTAINED DAMAGE 2
Eldricht Knight 11 (3 attacks) or Hunter Ranger 11 (Volley) paired with Devotion Paladin 9: different feeling here, you get much better defense and Elemental Weapon.
You could get Sacred Weapon then swith to Lore Bard though, to get more spellcasting, but you don't get all the Paladin goodies (prepared 2nd and 3rd level spells, Auras).

AMBUSH DAMAGE 1
Eldricht Knight 11 / Wild Magic Sorcerer 9: Quicken and whatever.
Single target? Action Surge Attack, Quickened Hold X (with disadvantage), Attack.
Multi-target? Action Surge Attack, Quickened Slow, Attack.

AMBUSH DAMAGE 2
EK 11 / AT 9: only low level spells sadly, but decent casting. You can more fluidly combine spells and weapons, since you can also use Magical Ambush.

AMBUSH DAMAGE 3
Hunter Ranger 6 / AT 9 / Fighter 2 / Land Druid 3.
Not necessarily better than the previous, but extremely thematic. Cast Pass Without Trace, Hide, then cast an Entangle before enjoying unleashing arrows with advantage.

Well, there are many combinations revolving around this, I think you get the picture. ;)
Also there are the magical ranged but there are beyond your topic so (maybe all the gish were beyond your perimeter in fact?).

For the road, a funky one...
Barbarian X / Champion 4 / Assassin Rogue 3 (optional: Druid 3), with Dual Wielder and Sharpshooter.
Prepare your ambush then unleash a rush of rage-powered javelins (note: this is not RAW or RAI because of object interaction and Rage not working on thrown attacks, but your DM has no reason to forbid such a cool character XD), racking up the criticals. ;)

[djreynolds]

If you wanted to make the "best" ranged toon how would you class him? I'm thinking 12 battle master, 4 assassin and 4 hunter ranger with horde breaker, wood elf with alert, mobile and sharpshooter, expertise in stealth and perception, feats and 3 ASI towards maxing AGI and putting WIS to 18. Stats after racials at level 1: 8/17/15/8/16/8 after ASIs: 8/20/16/8/18/8.

Combat styles: archery and mariner

He would be fast, deadly and accurate, v stealthy, would almost always go first due to 10 initiative which would let him attack with advantage the first combat round due to assassin levels. Could do insane damage when managing a surprise round as well as a now and then bonus. :)

What are your thoughts on what would make the best ranged toon?

This is fine the way it is.

But remember you only need to max out dexterity.

If you are using sharpshooter, like GWM, its nice to have a 3rd attack. So 11 fighter

Rogue for expertise and cunning action at least, since archers really have no bonus action. So 2 rogue

Ranger is good for pass without a trace, hunter's mark, horde breaker (a possible 4th attempt to land sharpshooter) but that could be 5 levels for that spell. So that's 3-5 ranger.

So 11 fighter/3 ranger/ 6 rogue is looking sweet, but what ranger really giving you here... just horde breaker and hunter's mark

You could try 11 fighter/ 4 war cleric/ 5 rogue

Now you have 3 attacks, access to bless, divine favor, magic weapon, protection from evil, etc. and when needed with a 16-18 wisdom, gives 3 to 4 BA's a day. And Guided strike which is channel divinity which recharges on a short rest

And uncanny dodge and 3d6 sneak attack

Still got 5ASI, 2 to dex, Sharpshooter, and two more.

[Rowan Wolf]

I like Hexblade 12/(revised)Hunter 4/Arcane Archer 4 For a very magical archer. You only need 4 invocations for the pact bow: Eldritch Smite, Improved Pact Weapon, Thirsting Blade, Lifedrinker

You'd need a magic bow and/or a dm house rule for it to function as without the fey pact boon moonbow invocation.

[Chugger]

This is fine the way it is.

But remember you only need to max out dexterity.

If you are using sharpshooter, like GWM, its nice to have a 3rd attack. So 11 fighter

Rogue for expertise and cunning action at least, since archers really have no bonus action. So 2 rogue

Ranger is good for pass without a trace, hunter's mark, horde breaker (a possible 4th attempt to land sharpshooter) but that could be 5 levels for that spell. So that's 3-5 ranger.

So 11 fighter/3 ranger/ 6 rogue is looking sweet, but what ranger really giving you here... just horde breaker and hunter's mark

You could try 11 fighter/ 4 war cleric/ 5 rogue

Now you have 3 attacks, access to bless, divine favor, magic weapon, protection from evil, etc. and when needed with a 16-18 wisdom, gives 3 to 4 BA's a day. And Guided strike which is channel divinity which recharges on a short rest

And uncanny dodge and 3d6 sneak attack

Still got 5ASI, 2 to dex, Sharpshooter, and two more.

Lucky is a feat to consider higher up. Three chances to reroll misses.

[Citan]

Hey ;)

Back for a pure martial (no magic, only brawn) proposition.
Still only official source (no UA).

Because of that limitation, Ranger is out (because it still gets spellcasting) as well as Paladin (same).
In fact, the list is pretty limitative: Barbarian, Fighter, Monk, Rogue.
Taking that into account...

Battlemaster 12 / Thief Rogue 4 / Monk 4

Monk is here mainly to give you better base mobility, decent to good unarmored potentially, decent close combat in case of but more importantly Dodge as bonus action for a Ki for extra defense, Deflect Arrows and Slow Fall. Plus archetype benefits (I'd be really tempted to say Shadow, but no spells so... ^^).

Thief brings Cunning Action, Expertise in Stealth and whatever else you want, a bit of extra damage. Reason of taking Thief and not Assassin is that I prefer building a good all-around, and Thief is better in that regard thanks to all the mundane items you can use, but also the Healer feat.

Battlemaster brings everything else, including 3 attacks, Trip Attack, Menacing Attack, Precision Strike etc...

With 6 ASI, you can easily pick any race you want, max DEX, then still pick Sharpshooter, Healer, Mage Slayer and a last one to round up among Martial Adept (one more die), Ritual Caster (I know it shouldn't be here ^^), Magic Initiate (same), Alert (be sure to strike first), Mobile (for those times where enemy closes in too much), Skulker (if you always stay hidden), Defensive Duelist (keep a dagger handy) or the classic Resilient: Wisdom.

Note that I didn't put Crossbow Expert here, as a full-awareness choice.
It is certainly a good feat but forces you to go with hand crossbow, for lesser range.
Moreover, between Dodge, Flurry of Blows, Dash, Disengage, Hide, Heal (Healer), Use an Object (Thief), Second Wind (Fighter), rare should be the occurences in which you really have nothing useful to do with the bonus action.

Even if more options will be used rarely (Dodge, Flurry, Disengage) since you are supposed to stay at range, just the Hide (imo you should spend every chance you have to Hide in the first place, since it would provide advantage to your attacks), Use an Object (caltrops, oil flask, torch, poison, whatever else), Healer kit (it's not for you only -unless you are are sorry, egoistical ass-)
For this reason, I find Mage Slayer much more interesting as an "automatic pick" together with Sharpshooter.

This build can be easily tweaked around too: if you have really low WIS and don't care about 6th feat, go Rogue 5 for Uncanny Dodge.
If you have high WIS, Open Hand becomes a great archetype, with 4E (push effects, close AOE) becoming a decent alternative.

--
As a fun fact, a high level Monk with 4-5 levels put in dips could make a pretty decent ranged martial thanks to Martial Arts. Not great obviously, because you only get 2 attacks per action then you are bothered a bit with draw rules, and you cannot apply the +10, but with Sharpshooter and Dual-Wielder you can consistently shoot 1d8 javelins up to 120 feet while still being fully able in close combat (still a Monk), without need for Crossbow Expert. So you are really versatile.

[djreynolds]

I think war cleric is fairly easy, and works well with an archer. Its not too magical

[JNAProductions]

I think war cleric is fairly easy, and works well with an archer. Its not too magical

It's a full caster-how is that not too magical?

A War Cleric DIP I can see. But not full War Cleric.

[Citan]

I think war cleric is fairly easy, and works well with an archer. Its not too magical


It's a full caster-how is that not too magical?

A War Cleric DIP I can see. But not full War Cleric.
Well, it seemed intuitive enough to me that djreynolds was talking about a dip, or limited multiclass. ;)

Like up to a 3rd level War Cleric to get enough slots to last all days with Bless/Divine Favor, although I'd personally pick another Domain because...
- Divine Favor, IIRC, adds radiant damage but does not make the weapon damage itself magical, so it's not like it would resolve the problem of resistant monsters.
- Magic Weapon is available to War Clerics, but you would have only 2 slots for the whole day unless you push the multiclass further.
- Meanwhile, Bless helps you land Sharp heavy arrows, and unless you are in a 3-man party using it with your 2nd level slots is not really a drawback since it affects more party members.

[greenstone]

I've been thinking about this challenge a bit; it turned out to be interesting.

Let's make it a bit more formal!

The dreaded tarrasque has woken from its centuries-long sleep and is now trying to eat the capital city. Each round, it advances 10 feet and destroys another building. Your archer is the only one there who has any hope of defeating the monster. You have your trusty magical bow (no bonuses, but is considered magical for the purposes of overcoming resistance) and any mundane equipment you wish. The monster isn't really interested in you and will just continue munching on the city.

So, defeat the tarrasqe and tell us how many buildings it destroyed before you defeated it.

Rules: a martial archer means a PHB/EE/SCAG character with no spell slots.

[djreynolds]

It's a full caster-how is that not too magical?

A War Cleric DIP I can see. But not full War Cleric.

War cleric gets a nice perk with bonus action attacks time wisdom/day.

For archers they don't get many bonus actions, so war cleric gives up to 5 day with a 20 wisdom. Even without spells for a 1 level dip.

So as long as you have a 13 in wisdom, grab a level of war cleric

[JNAProductions]

War cleric gets a nice perk with bonus action attacks time wisdom/day.

For archers they don't get many bonus actions, so war cleric gives up to 5 day with a 20 wisdom. Even without spells for a 1 level dip.

So as long as you have a 13 in wisdom, grab a level of war cleric

Oh, I definitely agree with that. The War Cleric dip is great, IF you have good Wisdom. (Without good Wisdom, it's not as worth it.)

But a full War Cleric is against the spirit of this thread.

[Chugger]

A rogue 2 dip is an obvious and easy way for a ranger or BM fighter archer to deal with what is probably the main problem this class faces - having meleers come up and get on you. The other easy way to deal with that is to go xbow expertise early (feat) and just shoot them at close range. I'd say Cunning Action and keeping away from them is better - or you can do both.

But what about other non magic ways to get away from meleers in your face?

I've looked through the BM list and am not sure what would work. You can pull out a rapier if you don't have xbow exp and a meleer is on you - and try a maneuver, like the one that makes the target fear you. The problem is you (1) have to hit with the rapier (without the +2 fighting style, or use xbow exp to shoot them close range and do the fear maneuver) ---- but then it gets to roll to save. So there are a lot of "ifs" there - a lot of chances for the target to not be affected.

Whereas cunning action is certain - I disengage and move here, then shoot him x times.

A monk dip w/ flurry and the remove reaction option ... that's a possibility, but going monk (3?) is too big a sacrifice for me. I'd just go rogue 2 at that point.

I'm thinking some of the Volos monster races might have a racial ... but those aren't fresh in my head.

Unless someone can point out something I'm missing, there's really only magic (misty step and so on) and a rogue dip to get away from meleers - and rogue seems vastly superior to me. Is there a better option?

[Easy_Lee]

A rogue 2 dip is an obvious and easy way for a ranger or BM fighter archer to deal with what is probably the main problem this class faces - having meleers come up and get on you. The other easy way to deal with that is to go xbow expertise early (feat) and just shoot them at close range. I'd say Cunning Action and keeping away from them is better - or you can do both.

But what about other non magic ways to get away from meleers in your face?

I've looked through the BM list and am not sure what would work. You can pull out a rapier if you don't have xbow exp and a meleer is on you - and try a maneuver, like the one that makes the target fear you. The problem is you (1) have to hit with the rapier (without the +2 fighting style, or use xbow exp to shoot them close range and do the fear maneuver) ---- but then it gets to roll to save. So there are a lot of "ifs" there - a lot of chances for the target to not be affected.

Whereas cunning action is certain - I disengage and move here, then shoot him x times.

A monk dip w/ flurry and the remove reaction option ... that's a possibility, but going monk (3?) is too big a sacrifice for me. I'd just go rogue 2 at that point.

I'm thinking some of the Volos monster races might have a racial ... but those aren't fresh in my head.

Unless someone can point out something I'm missing, there's really only magic (misty step and so on) and a rogue dip to get away from meleers - and rogue seems vastly superior to me. Is there a better option?

You can sacrifice one attack to push the target away from you. But that's an athletics check, and rogues with their expertise are still better at those. Plus, as a ranged fighter, strength is probably not your highest stat.