What would you use to get rid of this?

[Calthropstu]

A ghost with a permanent anti-magic field around it.
I thought this up a while back, and short of smacking it with a god, demigod or artifact, I can't really think of much that would affect it.
Please note, this is Pathfinder not 3.5

[Geddy2112]

Although the ghost is nearly unstoppable, it can do absolutely nothing to harm you while in a field, so it is just a ghost wandering around unable to hurt a fly.

The best way would be to somehow get it to walk through a prismatic wall/sphere, as these effects function normally in an AMF. The best hope here is that you manage to kill it with the elemental damage, otherwise hope you send it to a good aligned plane and let a deity fix it. You could also put it in a forcecage, although that does not destroy it.

Wish and miricale can get rid of an AMF, as can mages disjunction(but at a low chance to succeed).

[Grod_The_Giant]

An instantaneous conjuration plus Ectoplasmic Spell ought to work. Anything from Acid Splash to Clashing Rocks.


(The effects of instantaneous conjurations are not affected by an antimagic field because the conjuration itself is no longer in effect, only its result.)

[Anxe]

Pull out my 3.0 adamantine sword and go to town.

[dascarletm]

Figure out why the ghost can't move on and solve the mystery Scooby-Doo style. That includes running in hilarious fashion when the ghost shows up. Either it is ol' man Jenkins in a costume, or you set it right and the ghost moves on.

[Mr Adventurer]

A creature with DR/magic (Ex)?

[Anxe]

AHA! Holy Water. It works on incorporeal undead if you pour it directly on them. Easy enough solution that's available to any level character.

[Arael666]

AHA! Holy Water. It works on incorporeal undead if you pour it directly on them. Easy enough solution that's available to any level character.

Simple, yet brilliant. Well played sir.

[flappeercraft]

A bow made of Serren Wood can kill it. Serren wood is from BoED.

Edit: Noticed this is for PF so just ignore this

[PacMan2247]

Pathfinder isn't my thing, so I'm assuming the PF version of antimagic field doesn't include the clause about suppressing spells, spell-like abilities, and supernatural abilities, or the one about incorporeal undead winking out within the range of an AMF. If those are a part of the PF version as well, a ghost with an AMF has effectively gotten rid of itself.

[Zanos]

An instantaneous conjuration plus Ectoplasmic Spell ought to work. Anything from Acid Splash to Clashing Rocks.
Orb of Force works without metamagic.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Right in the spell description (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/antimagicField.htm): Summoned creatures of any type and incorporeal undead wink out if they enter an antimagic field.

So by existing, the ghost would cause itself to be removed from existence.

[Deadline]

Assuming it doesn't self-negate, as per the above post, a slightly more expensive alternative to holy water are Ghostblight alchemical weapon capsules. Coat the barbarian's greatsword and have him power attack away. One full attack ought to do it.

[Knaight]

Another incorporeal creature that isn't undead can work here - nonmagical incorporeal attacks hit incorporeal creatures, and the antimagic field only affects incorporeal undead. I'm not sure if there's any way to exploit that, but it's worth pointing out.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Orb of Force works without metamagic.
Unfortunately, I couldn't turn up any instantaneous conjuration force damage effects in Pathfinder.

[torrasque666]

Right in the spell description (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/antimagicField.htm): Summoned creatures of any type and incorporeal undead wink out if they enter an antimagic field.

So by existing, the ghost would cause itself to be removed from existence.
Pathfinder lacks that line, and as noted in the OP, this is for pathfinder.

[Telok]

The PF soulknife retains the ability to manifest a mindblade in a null-psi field with a check. I didn't look too deep but it probably also still counts as a magic weapon there too.

[Grod_The_Giant]

The PF soulknife retains the ability to manifest a mindblade in a null-psi field with a check. I didn't look too deep but it probably also still counts as a magic weapon there too.
I don't think it even needs to; they can give it Ghost Touch if they really want.

[Calthropstu]

Notes:
Pf does NOT have the "incorporeal winks out" clause.
Adamantine is not magical, has no effect.
The holy water might work, it's debatable. I'll have to look it up.
Soulknife works, but is 3rd party.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Notes:
Pf does NOT have the "incorporeal winks out" clause.
Adamantine is not magical, has no effect.
The holy water might work, it's debatable. I'll have to look it up.
Soulknife works, but is 3rd party.
As I mentioned upthread, Ectoplasmic Spell plus an instantaneous conjuration does the job. Unless there's some other restriction?

[Psyren]

Unfortunately, I couldn't turn up any instantaneous conjuration force damage effects in Pathfinder.

You don't actually need force, any InConj energy will do - it will just do half damage instead of full, so you'll need a few more hits/buffs.

(Or you can Ectoplasmic it as you stated, for the full damage.)



The holy water might work, it's debatable. I'll have to look it up.


Holy Water does indeed work. There is magic involved in its creation, but it is not itself magical.

[Kallimakus]

Notes:
Pf does NOT have the "incorporeal winks out" clause.
Adamantine is not magical, has no effect.
The holy water might work, it's debatable. I'll have to look it up.
Soulknife works, but is 3rd party.

I had to check, because the pfsrd has rules for Antimagic that mention incorporeal creatures winking out, but that is lifted from d20srd, so it probably isn't actually applicable.
I seem to recall that antimagic field also suppressed conjuration spells where effects disappear when the spell ends, even if the duration was instantaneous, but I cannot find it (this means that Acid Splash for instance would be negated as the acid disappears after 1 round).

Holy water should work normally.

[Grod_The_Giant]

You don't actually need force, any InConj energy will do - it will just do half damage instead of full, so you'll need a few more hits/buffs.

(Or you can Ectoplasmic it as you stated, for the full damage.)
Oh hey, even better! As usual, magic wins.


I seem to recall that antimagic field also suppressed conjuration spells where effects disappear when the spell ends, even if the duration was instantaneous, but I cannot find it (this means that Acid Splash for instance would be negated as the acid disappears after 1 round).
Nope. Explicitly works because "the effect is no longer magical" or some such. See my first post for the exact text.

[Knaight]

Notes:
Pf does NOT have the "incorporeal winks out" clause.

In that case, an easy option is just to sic a bunch of ghosts on the ghost giving you problems.

[Calthropstu]

You don't actually need force, any InConj energy will do - it will just do half damage instead of full, so you'll need a few more hits/buffs.

(Or you can Ectoplasmic it as you stated, for the full damage.)



Holy Water does indeed work. There is magic involved in its creation, but it is not itself magical.

But it's a splash weapon, and incorporeal are immune to nonmagic weapons. I would have to look really hard at it, and I don't have that luxury right now.
InConj... depends how it works. Does it conjure a missile and fire it? Or does it conjure it over someone's head? I will have to look at it.
Just checked, acid arrow isn't instantaneous. And the orb spells don't exist. Are there any spells that fit this bill?

[AvatarVecna]

But it's a splash weapon, and incorporeal are immune to nonmagic weapons. I would have to look really hard at it, and I don't have that luxury right now.

I just want to clarify that you're stating that a thing explicitly stating it can be used on incorporeal creatures (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment/weapons/alchemical-weapons/#TOC-Holy-Water) due to its own specific rule for doing so, can't be used on incorporeal creatures due to the general rule about how splash weapon interact with incorporeality?

[Calthropstu]

I just want to clarify that you're stating that a thing explicitly stating it can be used on incorporeal creatures (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment/weapons/alchemical-weapons/#TOC-Holy-Water) due to its own specific rule for doing so, can't be used on incorporeal creatures due to the general rule about how splash weapon interact with incorporeality?

Well that answers that question. Guess it works.

[AvatarVecna]

Just checked, acid arrow isn't instantaneous. And the orb spells don't exist. Are there any spells that fit this bill?

A quick check of the spell database on the PFSRD returns a number of instantaneous conjuration spells...the vast majority of them healing-related, from the looks of it (and the rest being teleportation stuff and planar binding kinda stuff). I'm assuming you need to cast the spell from outside the AMF, so you'd likely need to throw Reach onto a Cure Critical or a Heal or something. Acid Splash is an instantaneous Conjuration, but you'd probably need a lot of cheese and metamagic BS to make a 1d3 cantrip relevant in what is likely an at least mid-level fight.

EDIT: Worth mentioning that the Reach Heal idea only really works if they're undead. If they're like, some kinda incorporeal elemental/fey/outsider/aberration/whatever, that wouldn't hurt them and you'd basically be limited to Acid Splash.

[Psyren]

Note that holy water, while it does work, can be dangerous to use in this way as you'll need to enter the field yourself. Of course, the ghost will have very little it can do to you itself besides run away either.



Just checked, acid arrow isn't instantaneous. And the orb spells don't exist. Are there any spells that fit this bill?

There aren't as many in PF because orbs are closed content, but we still get Snowball, Acidic Spray, Ice Spears, and Caustic Eruption. You can also use the cure spells - normally these won't work because you can't cast them within the field, but with Reach Spell (or a rod of same) you can stand outside it and aim them in. This would make Reach Heal probably the heaviest hitter, especially since positive energy does full damage to incorporeal undead like force does.



EDIT: Worth mentioning that the Reach Heal idea only really works if they're undead. If they're like, some kinda incorporeal elemental/fey/outsider/aberration/whatever, that wouldn't hurt them and you'd basically be limited to Acid Splash.

See above for heavier-hitting options than the 1d3 cantrip.

[NecroDancer]

Have the ghost look into a haunted alleyway that takes the souls of only those who look into it.

[CharonsHelper]

The easiest way is just to get a monk of level 4+ to punch it to death.


At 4th level, ki strike allows his unarmed attacks to be treated as magic weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.

I have seen RAW arguments that monks' unarmed damage doesn't work on incorporeal, but while RAW is debatable, RAI seems pretty obviously in favour of it. IMHO

[Zanos]

The easiest way is just to get a monk of level 4+ to punch it to death.
I have seen RAW arguments that monks' unarmed damage doesn't work on incorporeal, but while RAW is debatable, RAI seems pretty obviously in favour of it. IMHO
This case isn't debatable in the slightest. Ki Pool(PF) and Ki Strike(3.5) are Supernatural abilities, and suppressed in an antimagic field.

[AvatarVecna]

This case isn't debatable in the slightest. Ki Pool(PF) and Ki Strike(3.5) are Supernatural abilities, and suppressed in an antimagic field.

And even then, the RAW is pretty straightforward: the monk's fists aren't magic weapons, they just count as magic weapons for the purpose of bypassing DR. If there was an ability letting people's attacks count as silver for the purpose of bypassing damage reduction, it'd be a **** move to make them eat the silvered weapon damage penalty.

EDIT: Especially considering that would be a pretty lame ability anyway.

[Grod_The_Giant]

But it's a splash weapon, and incorporeal are immune to nonmagic weapons. I would have to look really hard at it, and I don't have that luxury right now.
InConj... depends how it works. Does it conjure a missile and fire it? Or does it conjure it over someone's head? I will have to look at it.
Just checked, acid arrow isn't instantaneous. And the orb spells don't exist. Are there any spells that fit this bill?
There's no actual question-- Instantaneous Conjuration explicitly works in an AMF, and incorporeal creatures are explicitly affected by spells (albeit at half damage). As for applicable spells, from a quick look...

Acid Splash
Corrosive Touch (plus Reach Spell)
Snowball
Gloomblind Bolts would work if it wasn't an undead creature
Ice Spears
Pellet Blast*
Silver Darts*
Conjure Deadfall**
Acidic Spray
Caustic Eruption
Rain of Arrows**
Clashing Rocks



*By RAW these work, since they're spells dealing damage, but they might be argued because they talk about DR applying normally.
**Same as above, but there's no talk about DR or anything.

[Calthropstu]

There's no actual question-- Instantaneous Conjuration explicitly works in an AMF, and incorporeal creatures are explicitly affected by spells (albeit at half damage). As for applicable spells, from a quick look...

Acid Splash
Corrosive Touch (plus Reach Spell)
Snowball
Gloomblind Bolts would work if it wasn't an undead creature
Ice Spears
Pellet Blast*
Silver Darts*
Conjure Deadfall**
Acidic Spray
Caustic Eruption
Rain of Arrows**
Clashing Rocks



*By RAW these work, since they're spells dealing damage, but they might be argued because they talk about DR applying normally.
**Same as above, but there's no talk about DR or anything.

Reach spell wouldn't work. It's holding a magical charge. Just because you're throwing it, it's still a magical charge. I might want to ask for a paizo response though, cuz it's an odd case.

[CharonsHelper]

This case isn't debatable in the slightest. Ki Pool(PF) and Ki Strike(3.5) are Supernatural abilities, and suppressed in an antimagic field.

See - the way I read it


An antimagic field suppresses any spell or magical effect used within, brought into, or cast into the area, but does not dispel it.

the monk can't USE ki points within the magic field, but he still has them. He doesn't need to use ki points, only have them to overcome DR with his extraordinary ability of overcoming DR.

But - I can see your argument. It's an wonky corner case of the rules when putting it all together.

[Crake]

See - the way I read it



the monk can't USE ki points within the magic field, but he still has them. He doesn't need to use ki points, only have them to overcome DR with his extraordinary ability of overcoming DR.

But - I can see your argument. It's an wonky corner case of the rules when putting it all together.

The ki pool ability itself is suppressed within an antimagic field, meaning, while he has ki points, the benefits of having them are suppressed, including the ability to overcome DR/magic.

Pathfinder also has ghost salts which are a mundane way to allow your weapons to strike an incorporeal creature, albeit for only a single attack. Works on ammunition though, so it can be useful to carry around a few ghost salted arrows at all times.

There was actually a whole thread about this, in which I was arguing that the fact that incorporeal creatures not winking out was a really bad change, because, while there are ways to beat such a thing, holy water and ghost salts being the primary methods, not having those very niche options at hand basically means a party wipe if the creature has some means of attacking corporeal creatures without Su abilities.

Ghost is a really bad example to use though, because all their abilities are suppressed, including their rejuvenation ability. Something like a shadow demon, which has Ex/natural abilities it can use, such as it's natural touch attack, and it's DR10/cold iron or good, would be nigh unkillable while being able to endlessly harass the party. Heavens forbid you put it on something incorporeal with Ex fast healing.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Reach spell wouldn't work. It's holding a magical charge. Just because you're throwing it, it's still a magical charge. I might want to ask for a paizo response though, cuz it's an odd case.
Sure it would. A Reach Spell Corrosive Touch is now an instantaneous conjuration with a range of Short that does 1d4 damage/level with a ranged touch attack. There's nothing about a "magical charge." Point, zap, bam, acid.

[Psyren]

Reach spell wouldn't work. It's holding a magical charge. Just because you're throwing it, it's still a magical charge. I might want to ask for a paizo response though, cuz it's an odd case.

Of course it works. You're standing outside the field, so you can cast the spell without it being suppressed at the moment of casting. The spell is an instantaneous conjuration, so it can extend inside the field. It's cut and dry.

[Anxe]

While Reach Touch spells are RAW legal they break with how I interpret the game. I'd interpret the Reach spell as summoning a ghostly hand and then conjuring the acid (or whatever) on the ghostly hand which the wizard then magically commanded to touch the target. That's a magical effect and it shouldn't be allowed to work in an antimagic field.

Conjuring acid and then throwing it in seems cool. So maybe that's the way Reach works? You turn it into a ranged touch attack? I dunno. It's possible that this is why some people are nervous about letting Reach spells affect the ghost.

[Grod_The_Giant]

While Reach Touch spells are RAW legal they break with how I interpret the game. I'd interpret the Reach spell as summoning a ghostly hand and then conjuring the acid (or whatever) on the ghostly hand which the wizard then magically commanded to touch the target. That's a magical effect and it shouldn't be allowed to work in an antimagic field.

Conjuring acid and then throwing it in seems cool. So maybe that's the way Reach works? You turn it into a ranged touch attack? I dunno. It's possible that this is why some people are nervous about letting Reach spells affect the ghost.
If the hypothetical GM in this situation is going to houserule in their own interpretation of things, then the exercise is fruitless; we're either shooting blindly (if there's a list of houserules that just wasn't shared), or we're playing "mother may I" with an unseen force and asking for a rules-based solution is useless.

(Also yes, Reach Spell works in the second fashion: you make a ranged touch attack, out to short range. "Spells modified by this feat that require melee touch attacks instead require ranged touch attacks (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/metamagic-feats/reach-spell-metamagic/)." Your visualization of a floating hand works, but so does my visualization of a guy tossing an orb of acid like a softball, or of his firing it like a stream, or...)

[Crake]

If the hypothetical GM in this situation is going to houserule in their own interpretation of things, then the exercise is fruitless; we're either shooting blindly (if there's a list of houserules that just wasn't shared), or we're playing "mother may I" with an unseen force and asking for a rules-based solution is useless.

(Also yes, Reach Spell works in the second fashion: you make a ranged touch attack, out to short range. "Spells modified by this feat that require melee touch attacks instead require ranged touch attacks (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/metamagic-feats/reach-spell-metamagic/)." Your visualization of a floating hand works, but so does my visualization of a guy tossing an orb of acid like a softball, or of his firing it like a stream, or...)

The question is about where the magic is being manifested. Something like acid splash, or the old 3.5 orb of X spells weren't actually targetted spells, but rather effect spells that were then fired at a target. Note that antimagic field says that the effects of instantaneous conjurations are not affected by an antimagic field, but corrosive grasp doesn't have an effect, it is a target spell. The magic is cast on the creature, which is then affected by the spell, thus the magic is being created inside the antimagic field, and is thusly unable to work, because the antimagic field stops the spell from manifesting.

Edit: To put it another way, by your logic, a reach healing spell should also work (it doesn't specify conjuration (creation) after all), but how does someone "throw" a heal at someone else.

[Psyren]

Edit: To put it another way, by your logic, a reach healing spell should also work (it doesn't specify conjuration (creation) after all),

Yes. Yes it would.


but how does someone "throw" a heal at someone else.

Metamagic.

[Crake]

Yes. Yes it would.



Metamagic.

I notice you ignored the rest of my post? Healing spells are not effect spells, they are targeted spells. Reach spell doesn't change that. Magic cannot be manifested inside an antimagic field, but the effects of an instantaneous conjuration can be brought inside one.

[icefractal]

Healing spells working into an AMF seems bass-akward, given that they allow SR, but it's technically correct. Just another reason they should have stayed in Necromancy.

Also, is it just me, or are Shadow Demons the MVP of Summon Monster V by quite a lot? Hmm, Dire Bear, or Telekinesis and Magic Jar? And they fit easily in Paizo's typical cramped dungeons, unlike most powerful summons. SM7 for 4-5 of them is just brutal.

[Psyren]

I notice you ignored the rest of my post? Healing spells are not effect spells, they are targeted spells. Reach spell doesn't change that. Magic cannot be manifested inside an antimagic field, but the effects of an instantaneous conjuration can be brought inside one.

So spells without an "effect" line have no effects?

[Crake]

So spells without an "effect" line have no effects?

They affect a creature, so in that sense they have effects, but in the mechanical dnd term, they are not spells with the line "Effect: One missile of acid" for example. Note that you cannot cast an instantaneous conjuration inside an antimagic field, you must cast it outside, and then shoot it inside. Likewise, water created by a create water spell can be brought into an antimagic field, but you could not create the water inside the antimagic field, because creating the water itself involves magic, but the resultant water is not, itself, magical.

[Sheogoroth]

Just Like This (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OOF0FpKiYk).

[Segev]

Incorporeal creatures can only go so far into solid objects; they must remain adjacent to their surfaces, per the RAW in 3.5/PF. Assuming the ghost is a standard Medium humanoid-derivative, therefore, if you surround it in walls at least 10 feet thick, it cannot escape the prison. Because it's encased in an AMF, I'm not sure it can get to the Ethereal plane to escape; if it can, it certainly can't use Manifestation to get back. Also, if you drive it to the Ethereal, you can face it there, as well, and hit it normally.

[icefractal]

Incorporeal creatures can only go so far into solid objects; they must remain adjacent to their surfaces, per the RAW in 3.5/PF. Assuming the ghost is a standard Medium humanoid-derivative, therefore, if you surround it in walls at least 10 feet thick, it cannot escape the prison. Because it's encased in an AMF, I'm not sure it can get to the Ethereal plane to escape; if it can, it certainly can't use Manifestation to get back. Also, if you drive it to the Ethereal, you can face it there, as well, and hit it normally.Pathfinder Ghosts don't go to the Ethereal plane in any case; they're just normal incorporeal creatures.

I'd forgotten about that clause. Hmm; could you make a ghost plumbing system that way? They don't need any specific size of space on the other side of the surface, so they can travel along empty pipes. But a 10' stretch of blocked pipe would stop them. Put in some well placed valves and you could route them around (use angry ghosts so they won't just sit still and mope).

[Psyren]

They affect a creature, so in that sense they have effects, but in the mechanical dnd term, they are not spells with the line "Effect: One missile of acid" for example. Note that you cannot cast an instantaneous conjuration inside an antimagic field, you must cast it outside, and then shoot it inside. Likewise, water created by a create water spell can be brought into an antimagic field, but you could not create the water inside the antimagic field, because creating the water itself involves magic, but the resultant water is not, itself, magical.

There are multiple "mechanical dnd terms" for "effect." For example:


A spell is a one-time magical effect.


If you fail the check, you lose the spell just as if you had cast it to no effect.


Some spells can counter other specific spells, often those with diametrically opposed effects.


While under the effects of a polymorph spell, you lose all extraordinary and supernatural abilities that depend on your original form.

By your reading (only one mechanical definition of "effect") none of these rules apply to spells with no effect line, which is obviously nonsensical.

So you need to provide proof that the "effect" mentioned in AMF is the same one you are referencing.

[Grod_The_Giant]

They affect a creature, so in that sense they have effects, but in the mechanical dnd term, they are not spells with the line "Effect: One missile of acid" for example. Note that you cannot cast an instantaneous conjuration inside an antimagic field, you must cast it outside, and then shoot it inside. Likewise, water created by a create water spell can be brought into an antimagic field, but you could not create the water inside the antimagic field, because creating the water itself involves magic, but the resultant water is not, itself, magical.
So even a Reach Corrosive Touch wouldn't work, because there's no specific "Effect" line. Something like Snowball, with "Effect: one ball of ice and snow" would, yes?

In that case, you can scratch Corrosive Touch, Silver Darts, Gloomblind Bolts, and Caustic Eruption. The others all have a tangible thing in the "Effect" line. (Also, I only searched the Sorcerer/Wizard list; there are probably more out there)

[Crake]

There are multiple "mechanical dnd terms" for "effect." For example:

By your reading (only one mechanical definition of "effect") none of these rules apply to spells with no effect line, which is obviously nonsensical.

So you need to provide proof that the "effect" mentioned in AMF is the same one you are referencing.

the thing you're not getting is that the effect cannot be created inside the antimagic field. So even if everything you're saying is correct, a spell that affects a creature and produces an effect on that creature, still cannot happen, because the creature is inside the antimagic field, where the effect cannot be created. An effect can be brought into the antimagic field, but if a spell is instantaneous, then unless it has some kind of leftover effect, like from a creation spell, then there's nothing to actually bring into the AMF after the spell has been cast.


So even a Reach Corrosive Touch wouldn't work, because there's no specific "Effect" line. Something like Snowball, with "Effect: one ball of ice and snow" would, yes?

In that case, you can scratch Corrosive Touch, Silver Darts, Gloomblind Bolts, and Caustic Eruption. The others all have a tangible thing in the "Effect" line. (Also, I only searched the Sorcerer/Wizard list; there are probably more out there)

I'm glad you understand at least. Silver darts/caustic eruption would arguably work, because a burst spreads out from it's point of origin (Nevermind, that's the rules for a spread effect, not burst) as long as the origin is outisde of the AMF, because the created darts/acid are traveling into the AMF, rather than being conjured inside it, and gloomblind bolt does indeed have an effect line.

[Psyren]

the thing you're not getting is that the effect cannot be created inside the antimagic field.

There is no support for this. All the passage says is "The effects of instantaneous conjurations are not affected by an antimagic field because the conjuration itself is no longer in effect, only its result." It does not say "The effects of instantaneous conjurations created outside the field and fired into it are not affected." That is text you are inventing and adding.



I'm glad you understand at least.

I understand perfectly, you're just wrong. Big difference.

[Calthropstu]

Either it is magical and is shut down by the amf, or it isn't and passes through the ghost due to incorporeability.
That's the way I am reading it.

[Psyren]

Either it is magical and is shut down by the amf, or it isn't and passes through the ghost due to incorporeability.
That's the way I am reading it.

Sounds like you've decided what you're going with at your table, and we can let this thread die then.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Either it is magical and is shut down by the amf, or it isn't and passes through the ghost due to incorporeability.
That's the way I am reading it.
That is a RAW incorrect reading (there are still plenty of spells that bypass Crake's complaint), but it's not an unreasonable houserule. Holy Water still works.

[Calthropstu]

That is a RAW incorrect reading (there are still plenty of spells that bypass Crake's complaint), but it's not an unreasonable houserule. Holy Water still works.

Artifacts do too.
I am surprised no one mentioned it, as it was going to be the solution I was going to give them.
Unfortunately, that is exactly what I intend. In PF, when a ghost is killed it reforms later. And the AMF will not go with it
They will have unwittingly unleashed a 20th lvl evil spell casting ghost bent on conquest. And it just so happens he knows a group of adventurers with an artifact...

[Psyren]

Artifacts do too.
I am surprised no one mentioned it, as it was going to be the solution I was going to give them.

Artifacts are generally plot devices so they aren't assumed. We could as well have said "get a god to kill it since AMF doesn't inhibit them either" but that would have been an unreasonable assumption too.



They will have unwittingly unleashed a 20th lvl evil spell casting ghost bent on conquest.

Not a very smart one if he plans to hang around in an AMF, clearly.

[Calthropstu]

Artifacts are generally plot devices so they aren't assumed. We could as well have said "get a god to kill it since AMF doesn't inhibit them either" but that would have been an unreasonable assumption too.



Not a very smart one if he plans to hang around in an AMF, clearly.

The amf was supposed to be temporary, he himself cast it during a battle with another spellcaster to stop his own destruction.
The enemy mage had the perfect answer... use a wish spell to make it undispellable and permanent. What was supposed to be a desperate defense to gain time to get the upper hand became an ultra effective permanent neutralizer. I have the backstory laid out, but I need to be sure it can't be sideswiped by something stupid. If the pc's manage to kill him without an artifact, I will lose the great motivation for him to come after the party... who would actually be his rescuers.

[Anxe]

short of smacking it with a god, demigod or artifact, I can't really think of much that would affect it.


Artifacts do too.
I am surprised no one mentioned it, as it was going to be the solution I was going to give them.

We didn't mention artifacts because you seemed to already know about that option and were looking for alternatives. I've used that rule a couple of times in my campaign actually. I've got an intelligent magic item and the party always has mind blank on to prevent possession. The only time it really gets to play is when they're in an antimagic field.

The idea of defeating the ghost backfiring and unleashing a powerful evil mage sounds amazing! I love it.

[Segev]

Pathfinder Ghosts don't go to the Ethereal plane in any case; they're just normal incorporeal creatures.

I'd forgotten about that clause. Hmm; could you make a ghost plumbing system that way? They don't need any specific size of space on the other side of the surface, so they can travel along empty pipes. But a 10' stretch of blocked pipe would stop them. Put in some well placed valves and you could route them around (use angry ghosts so they won't just sit still and mope).

Are you making tabletop Pac Man?

[Psyren]

The amf was supposed to be temporary, he himself cast it during a battle with another spellcaster to stop his own destruction.
The enemy mage had the perfect answer... use a wish spell to make it undispellable and permanent. What was supposed to be a desperate defense to gain time to get the upper hand became an ultra effective permanent neutralizer.

Gotcha, that at least explains why he'd end up in something so disadvantageous.


I have the backstory laid out, but I need to be sure it can't be sideswiped by something stupid. If the pc's manage to kill him without an artifact, I will lose the great motivation for him to come after the party... who would actually be his rescuers.

It seems you have your answer. Even taking the houserule into account, there is still a Snowball that's been metamagicked up the wazoo, or a few gallons of holy water.

Ghost Salted arrows are another one to look out for, as those are alchemical rather than magical.