Clerics, Domains, and Deities [Archive] - Giant in the Playground Forums

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djreynolds

2017-09-12, 12:19 AM

Are the domains in the PHB for each deity set in stone?

Tyr, only has one domain? Only war?

I'm looking to multiclass into cleric

I'm an 8th battlemaster/6 swashbuckler. 20/13/16/10/13/10. I have a 13 in wisdom after selecting resilient wisdom, and I have shield master. I know 7th level rogue would give evasion and 4d6 sneak attack. But I need some oomph.

In game, our party was training an NPC in low level magic, so I thought, "hey arcana cleric could be a reasonable pick." And we did send this NPC to a temple of Mystra. However, the only real dealings I have had is with the temple of Tyr.

1. Magic initiate wizard is 2 levels away if I stay rogue, and I could wait and then acquire booming blade and protection from evil/good

2. If I grab a level of arcana cleric I get both of these spells

3. If I grab war cleric, I really get nothing other than divine favor, protection from evil, and 1/day BA attack (13 wisdom) and bonus proficiencies I already have.

4. I'm trying to stay RAW and not whine to the DM about this or try to finagle perks

So, could Tyr also have magic as "his" domain or is it only war?

Do I suck it up and just stay rogue til level 8th and then grab magic initiate?

What other domains could Tyr feasibly have? Like tempest or forge? Booming blade isn't a big deal, but it could come in handy.

Could Tyr have light as a domain? Is this far fetched?

Or is feasible that I could worship Mystra after only having really minimal exposure? I have had a lot of dealings with Tyr as I was a looking to repent and have done missions for the church, but the war domain as a fighter/rogue doesn't offer much to me.

I do have in my party a cleric of Lathandar, this is an option, but one I haven't really explored.

Any input would be awesome?

Safety Sword

2017-09-12, 12:31 AM

Snip

In 3.5E Clerics used to have 2 domains and deities had any associated with their "portfolio" specifically in FR. There were also many more domains and too many choices, really.

I guess they tried to make the choice easier in 5E by only having one and locking it in early.

RAW I think that's it. You choose a domain and that's the type of cleric you are.

Specifically to Tyr, he is not a "magic" god. He is more concerned with justice, war and good. He's basically the good war god though, light doesn't really fit his dealio.

Lathander is specifically a good fit for having the Light domain I mean, he is the Morninglord....

djreynolds

2017-09-12, 04:03 AM

In 3.5E Clerics used to have 2 domains and deities had any associated with their "portfolio" specifically in FR. There were also many more domains and too many choices, really.

I guess they tried to make the choice easier in 5E by only having one and locking it in early.

RAW I think that's it. You choose a domain and that's the type of cleric you are.

Specifically to Tyr, he is not a "magic" god. He is more concerned with justice, war and good. He's basically the good war god though, light doesn't really fit his dealio.

Lathander is specifically a good fit for having the Light domain I mean, he is the Morninglord....

I do like the light domain, it gives me more than war cleric and divine favor or protection from evil.

Unoriginal

2017-09-12, 04:09 AM

djreynolds

2017-09-12, 04:20 AM

Herobizkit

2017-09-12, 04:27 AM

The 5e PHB precise that the Domains listed are just suggestions. You'd notice how they're called "Suggested Domains".

If you want to worship Tyr as a being of light or magic, you can* do it. Being a Cleric of Tyr means that the god has chosen you as his champion and herald, so it means your interpretation is accepted as non-heretical, if not mainstream.

*Depending on how strict your DM is with trying to run FR canon. Gods have a larger 'stage presence' baked into FR than other settings; I believe the cleric Domains are not 'suggested' as presented in the Sword Coast Adventurers Guide.

Quoxis

2017-09-12, 04:38 AM

The 5e PHB precise that the Domains listed are just suggestions. You'd notice how they're called "Suggested Domains".

If you want to worship Tyr as a being of light or magic, you can do it. Being a Cleric of Tyr means that the god has chosen you as his champion and herald, so it means your interpretation is accepted as non-heretical, if not mainstream.

The question is whether the DM will allow it, or to put it in game terms: whether Tyr sees fit to give that weird guy worshipping his just and divine light, which he didn't think he had so far, access to fireballs or not. You may be lucky Tyr is god of law etc., else he might smight you for grossly bastardizing what he stands for.

djreynolds

2017-09-12, 06:41 AM

War cleric isn't terrible. Its a good addition.

But other clerical options give more. It really is 1 to 2 level dip.

Perhaps I should just hold out, take rogue 7 and then go rogue 8 and grab magic initiate (wizard)

But I will bow to the DM and his opinion.

Its just odd, Tyr only has one domain as a lawful good god

Arkhios

2017-09-12, 07:02 AM

I believe I read somewhere that Life domain is somewhat universal domain to all deities and each one should be fine with granting that as well as their predetermined suggested domain (most likely from PHB as I don't use any other sources than that (and SCAG when relevant of course) to read up on the rules when pondering on characters; but it could've been in DMG as well... in either case, from a reliable source)

Aett_Thorn

2017-09-12, 07:04 AM

Its just odd, Tyr only has one domain as a lawful good god

Alignment doesn't really have anything to do with it. It's more that it's the only Domain that really fits him and his portfolio. I might be able to see Life Domain as well, but Arcana is really just not in his wheelhouse. He's a god of Justice and Law, not of magic, and his Domain preference is chosen to fit that.

However, what race are you? Would any of the racial deities from the SCAG help you out?

JackPhoenix

2017-09-12, 07:58 AM

Arkhios

2017-09-12, 08:20 AM

It's from AL.

It is? Well, I'll be damned. AL actually has good rules! /sarcasm

Safety Sword

2017-09-12, 06:50 PM

It is? Well, I'll be damned. AL actually has good rules! /sarcasm

Heretic! Blasphemer! Deceiver!

Also, to the above discussion, your DM can allow anything. Perhaps your cleric of Tyr is on the hunt for a special artifact that has meaning to Tyr and so he chosen you to have access to the arcana domain to fulfill that destiny?

As a DM I love it when players come up with background story that I can work into the campaign. Your best approach might be to talk to your DM and say "I really want to play a cleric of Tyr and be an arcana cleric. If I can come up with a backstory that works for you, can I play it?"

Gignere

2017-09-12, 07:01 PM

Why the hard on for Booming Blade? You have extra attack already. I think getting more rogue levels is better.

Sigreid

2017-09-12, 07:25 PM

It's from AL.

It also says in the phb that most if not all deities can lay some claim to life.

Naanomi

2017-09-12, 07:39 PM

Aett_Thorn

2017-09-12, 08:00 PM

Very campaign dependent, but default FR the Powers have fairly well defined roles that are enforced by AO... so I would suspect a lot of flexibility in domains. However, I do disagree with some of the choices given in the official book (Chauntea doesn't have nature what?!?)

Yeah, there's a few that are missing fairly key domains for them. Talona doesn't have Trickery (the domain that causes poison damage isn't a domain of the poison Goddess?). And others have domains that seem weird (Dumathoin has Death as a domain, really?) I would have no problem if a character came to me with a reasonable request for a domain for a deity.

Naanomi

2017-09-12, 08:06 PM

Dumathoin is protector of the dead and guard of crypts...

JumboWheat01

2017-09-12, 08:10 PM

And let's not forget how all gods of Travel and/or Trade are now tricksters, granting the Trickery domain. Or how Kelemvor's one domain isn't even in the PHB, it's a DMG thing. So silly.

Still, I'm sure if you made a fair enough argument, you could get another domain allowed for your god of choice.

Is your heart set to Tyr? Just because your character may have had experience with only one temple doesn't mean much in the Realms, just about everyone's aware of the gods, perhaps your experience with the Tyr's temple has caused a surge of faith, and you wish to find a place among a god that truly fits your life, you go out on a little mini-quest to the nearest temple of said god, and some of them are pretty common.

Crgaston

2017-09-12, 08:16 PM

Here's one way of looking at it...

Any order is going to have members that specialize in various areas. Tyr may be a War god, but his churches will need healers (Life) and scholars (Knowledge) as well as warriors. Looking at it on a large scale, War could easily make room for those who specialize in using divine magic to study and defeat wizards (Arcana), those who supply food and wood for weapons (Nature), and those who illuminate the battlefield and rain fire upon their enemies (Light). Tempest might fit for those who fight at sea. Trickery is a little bit more of a stretch for a Lawful war god like Tyr, but stealthy soldiers are definitely a thing.

In the OP's particular example, the thought process could go like this... You've been researching and training, but don't quite get how to make it all happen yet, so you seek guidance from the temple of Tyr. When you learn how to access divine magic, the missing pieces of your previous research come together and you find yourself able to cast these spells. Your heart belongs to Tyr, but because of your past experience, your abilities manifest themselves as the Arcana domain powers.

Arkhios

2017-09-13, 01:34 AM

Heretic! Blasphemer! Deceiver!

It also says in the phb that most if not all deities can lay some claim to life.

Thank the gods! I almost thought I'd have to give AL full credit for that! :smallamused::smallcool:

djreynolds

2017-09-13, 07:43 AM

Why the hard on for Booming Blade? You have extra attack already. I think getting more rogue levels is better.

I think you're right. I have been failing, even with resilient wisdom many wisdom checks. Wizard magic initiate can cover me and give some cantrip and prof from evil. But it's 2 levels of rogue away.

But prof from evil is only certain types as well. It's no good versus dragons.

So it's 9th level fighter for indomitable.

7th level rogue for 4d6 S.A.. and evasion which will be coupled with shield master. Then 8th level for magic initiate bard and heroism, or wizard for prof from evil.

Or a level of cleric, and gaming wise Tyr is the choice because of story, and war is the only domain.

Or lathandar because of the party cleric.

I prefer concept over crunch, but I got heavy armor already and martial weapons.

Biggstick

2017-09-13, 09:24 AM

I think you're right. I have been failing, even with resilient wisdom many wisdom checks. Wizard magic initiate can cover me and give some cantrip and prof from evil. But it's 2 levels of rogue away.

But prof from evil is only certain types as well. It's no good versus dragons.

So it's 9th level fighter for indomitable.

7th level rogue for 4d6 S.A.. and evasion which will be coupled with shield master. Then 8th level for magic initiate bard and heroism, or wizard for prof from evil.

Or a level of cleric, and gaming wise Tyr is the choice because of story, and war is the only domain.

Or lathandar because of the party cleric.

I prefer concept over crunch, but I got heavy armor already and martial weapons.

Shield Master will only really be providing the Shove Bonus action once you gain Evasion. Sure, it provides a bonus to Dex saves if it's a targeted ability on yourself, but I've only ever run into one of those in a game a handful (read: less then 5) of times.

I think getting that 7th level of Rogue will be one of the best levels you can pick up. However, I think you should push for level 11 Fighter after that. That third attack will be very nice to add to your repertoire. However, if you're really looking for a feat to take, you should be looking at the Lucky feat. It will help with your saving throws, as well as be able to be used against any critical hits the DM throws your way.

As for the discussion on Tyr. He most definitely isn't an Arcana based domain, and to suggest that you are looking for concept over crunch while simultaneously trying to convince a DM that Tyr represents Arcana is a little mind boggling. The only other possibility I'd see for Tyr is Life in regards to domains, and that's because most deities can also call Life as one of their domains.

Why exactly are you looking to take Cleric levels as it is? More specifically, why Arcana Cleric? Is it simply for BB? There are better ways to gain the spell. I'm also curious why you feel you need BB when you probably don't have Warcaster, and you're already a Battlemaster with two attacks? When do you plan on actually using the cantrip in combat?

Gignere

2017-09-13, 06:35 PM

I really don't think you should get any caster levels, I don't even think you should get MI feat. You should probably just round out your dex/wis with your next ASI.

As to whether you should go fighter or more rogue depends on the gear. If you have some kind of bonus damage on hit weapon like a flame blade or frost brand I would recommend 11 fighter.

However if you don't have have fairly ordinary fear I think 11 rogue is better for the extra feat.

LordVonDerp

2017-09-16, 09:12 AM

Are the domains in the PHB for each deity set in stone?

Tyr, only has one domain? Only war?

No. Just pick any domain that seems reasonably justifiable.