[3.5] Fleshwarper build help.

[Allitra]

I am at a total loss for how to build a effective Fleshwarper. I can barely find any suggested builds forums or guides. I'd like to to make a effective caster, but I'd want the main focus to be grafts and enhancing other characters/myself. Like a mad scientist, fantasy bio-engineer.
I think going Archivist or Factotum 7/Wizard 1, but I'm not sure. I just see a lot of talk on how you 'could' get into the prestige class at level 6 but in reality you can only get into at level 8 at the earliest. Would it be worth to do so?

[Malimar]

If you haven't seen it, there is a graft handbook (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?190350-Fleshwarping-A-List-of-Grafts-Symbionts-and-Related-Goodies) that covers most of what you need to know as a Fleshwarper.

It's certainly a challenge to get into Fleshwarper early, I don't have any tricks to offer there.

[Venger]

I am at a total loss for how to build a effective Fleshwarper. I can barely find any suggested builds forums or guides. I'd like to to make a effective caster, but I'd want the main focus to be grafts and enhancing other characters/myself. Like a mad scientist, fantasy bio-engineer.
I think going Archivist or Factotum 7/Wizard 1, but I'm not sure. I just see a lot of talk on how you 'could' get into the prestige class at level 6 but in reality you can only get into at level 8 at the earliest. Would it be worth to do so?

by strict RAW, this is not possible. the idiot designers quoted you as needing 4 ranks in heal to qualify (possible at 1, or 5 cc) but in actuality, graft flesh requires 10 ranks in heal. the intent was you being able to enter by lvl 5 like normal prcs, so talk to your dm and see if he'll allow you in with 4 ranks. if not, fleshwarper is still a pretty good class.

[daremetoidareyo]

It's difficult to get into fleshwarper early because you need 10 ranks in heal.

You might be able to take the wrest possession feat, and get possessed by a quori. You need to be a human empty vessel/inspired/chosen.

Alternatively if you can work out a long-term deal with a celestial you can Channel them and many have ranks in heal. http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=20759093&postcount=38

[Nifft]

1) Put down the Factotum. Step slowly away. Don't alarm it. Don't use it in your build. Fleshwarper advances spellcasting, and that means: you want spellcaster levels.

2) You need the Graft Flesh feat, which requires 10 ranks in Heal. So you need a way to get Heal on your class list, while still advancing spellcaster levels.

3) You need to summon a Familiar, so probably Wizard.

Let's start: Wizard 5 <-- at level 5, take Spontaneous Divination

Now we need Heal as a class skill, and we can't actually get into Fleshwarper until after we take a feat, which we can't take until level 7, and we don't have a bonus feat between 7 and 9 so...

Wizard 5 / Blood Magus 4

Level 1: Toughness
Level 3: Great Fortitude
Level 6: ___
Level 9: Graft Flesh (___)

There we go. Level 9, and four of those levels have Heal as a class skill, so hitting your level 9 goal of taking Graft Flesh is quite doable.


Wizard 5 / Blood Magus 4 / Fleshwarper 10 / ___? 1 <-- This is the final build.

It's pretty thematic: first you learn to control your own blood, and then you learn to warp the bodies of others. You only lose one caster level (at Fleshwarper 1) which is unavoidable since you want Fleshwarper.

Note: since you're required to take Toughness, and you're Human, you might want to look into the Greyhawk Regional feat "Troll-Blooded".

-- -- --


If you're in a hurry and you don't mind losing another caster level (many people do mind), then there's a quicker path:

Human Paragon 1 / Wizard 1-5 / Human Paragon 2 <-- this puts you at level 7 right when you acquire a bonus feat.


The full build would be:

Human Paragon 1 / Wizard 1-5 / Human Paragon 2 / Fleshwarper 1-10 / Human Paragon 3 / ___? 1-3

You lose 2 caster levels, but you get into Fleshwarper as early as possible, and you don't have to take horrible feats like Toughness or Great Fortitude.


Is it worse to lose a caster level, or to hurl two feat slots into the midden heap? Probably the caster level, but meh.

Note on Paragon Human: you get to pick any 10 skills in the game, and one of them is always a class skill... OR you can take Able Learner (from Races of Destiny) and get all of them as permanent class skills, plus every other class you take adds all its skills to your permanent class skill list.

[Malimar]

by strict RAW, this is not possible. the idiot designers quoted you as needing 4 ranks in heal to qualify (possible at 1, or 5 cc) but in actuality, graft flesh requires 10 ranks in heal. the intent was you being able to enter by lvl 5 like normal prcs, so talk to your dm and see if he'll allow you in with 4 ranks. if not, fleshwarper is still a pretty good class.
I used to think this was the case, but then I actually built and played a fleshwarper, and now I think 10ish is the intended entry after all. Why? Because grafts are stupid expensive, and you'll never have enough gold to make use of your graft reserve if you enter much earlier than that.

[Venger]

I used to think this was the case, but then I actually built and played a fleshwarper, and now I think 10ish is the intended entry after all. Why? Because grafts are stupid expensive, and you'll never have enough gold to make use of your graft reserve if you enter much earlier than that.

as-is, you can enter at 8. You can start with some low-end stuff like a fiendish jaw.

not rolling over the craft reserve is some nonsense. ask your gm if he'll allow you to roll it over so you can save while you save your pennies if you don't like any of the cheap ones.

[Menzath]

Well, after looking at this thread
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?451088-Alternative-ways-to-get-new-Class-skills
It looks like the best way to get heal as a class skill is being a glimmer skin halfing from dragon magic.

And although you wouldn't get a familiar, you could be an artificer to get that extra craft reserve since graft does count as item creation.

[Nifft]

as-is, you can enter at 8. You can start with some low-end stuff like a fiendish jaw.

Feathery Fiendish wings are also pretty good & low-ish price.

There's also at least one Fiendish arm & leg that are decent.


Well, after looking at this thread
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?451088-Alternative-ways-to-get-new-Class-skills
It looks like the best way to get heal as a class skill is being a glimmer skin halfing from dragon magic.

And although you wouldn't get a familiar, you could be an artificer to get that extra craft reserve since graft does count as item creation.

The tough part is getting an unrestricted bonus feat exactly at level 7.

Otherwise you're not getting in before level 10.

[DrKerosene]

Glimmerskin Halfling would have been my first suggestion, on a Wizard build.

I assume you've made the connection that the NPC class Adept is perfect for entering Fleshwarper.

Since that has been said, how about a Wizard 1-3/Druid 1-3/Arcane Heirophant X/Fleshwarper X?

It's probably better if you focus on Druid, unless you have a lot of feats to throw around.

If retraining is allowed, Favoured1 and Primary Contact3, and then retrain your level 6 feat to Graft Flesh before reaching level 7.

[daremetoidareyo]

speaking of primary contact, this thread is relevant:


Graft Flesh is Item Creation, so if you can get heal as a class skill (probably by being a Glimmerskin Halfling), Wizard 3/Master Specialist 1/Wizard +2 or similar could use primary contact to pick up Graft Flesh at 6th level with your Wizard 5 bonus feat .

While we're at it, there are several notable ways to get an unspecified bonus feat that would allow us more flexibility in where we stick Primary Contact, and so expand its uses for early entry. The most useful are probably Ranger 3 on a Frostblood Half-Orc, Marshal 1 on a character that already has Skill Focus (Diplomacy), Half-Elf Paragon 1, and Human Paragon 2, but there are a few others (the Thralls of Orcus and Demogorgon have the option of an unspecified bonus feat at 1st level and can be entered at 5th, Horse Totem Barbarian 5 works the same way Ranger 3 does for a Frostblood Half-Orc).


Honestly, primary contact on a glimmerskin halfling hexblade, can get into fleshwarper by level 7, ride fleshwarper for 3 levels and apply illithid weapon grafts to themselves and their familiar without having to be a mindflayer. Then choose natural attack and weapon enhancing classes for the following 10 levels. Graft an etherblade on or any weird melee weapon and look for monk prestige classes with your array of weird natural attack melee weapons.

No...dip soulknife and graft your mindblade to yourself...then go totemist?

[Thurbane]

Some other ways to get heal as a class skill: Alternative ways to get new Class skills
(http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?491181)
Feats:


Draconic heritage (Type) – RotD - sorcerer only
Self-medicating (General) - Dragon 354 p 55 - Must have Wedded to History with survivor background (from the same article)

ACFs:


Broken one Monk substitution Levels - CoV p 36 - also Survival
Blood of Eberron Sorcerer substitution level - Dragon 351 p 79 - also Diplomacy, Handle Animal, Knowledge (nature) lose bluff

Variant Classes:


Knight (Fighter) - Dragon 310 - Replace Intimidate with Diplomacy
Fleshcrafter (Wizard) - Dragon 312 - lose Decipher Script, Profession

Races:


Glimmerskin Halflings - Dragon Magic



Human Paragon 1/Sorcerer 4/Fiend Blooded 1/Paragon +1/Flesh Warper 10/Fiend Blooded +3

H Able Learner
1 Eschew Materials
3 Blood Calls to Blood
6 Bloodline (?)
B Graft Flesh
9 Rapid Metamagic (?)
12 Quicken Spell (?)
15 ?
18 ?

...I'm a sucker for Fiend Blooded. I know most people prefer Wizards to Sorcerers, but I hate micromanaging a spell-book. Your familiar will get both the Fiendish and Pseudonatural templates. :smallbiggrin:

[LumenPlacidum]

To get the feat at level 7, just do Wizard 4 -> Focused Specialist 2 -> Wizard 5. The level 5 bonus feat for wizard can be any metamagic feat or item creation feat (or spell mastery)

It works with anything, really. Just interrupt that 5th level of actual wizard until you want the feat.

[Thurbane]

To get the feat at level 7, just do Wizard 4 -> Focused Specialist 2 -> Wizard 5. The level 5 bonus feat for wizard can be any metamagic feat or item creation feat (or spell mastery)

It works with anything, really. Just interrupt that 5th level of actual wizard until you want the feat.

You still need the 10 ranks in heal, which is probably going to shoehorn you into Glimmerskin Halfling.