Ultra long range siege weapons

[Max Caysey]

So I'm looking into building some long range artillery pieces for an upcoming warhammer-esque game, but I've hit a snag.

When looking in the Heroes of Battle, there seem to be a max range on the siege engines which is not related to the range increment like normal ranged weapons. This confuses me, since I have been unable to find any information on whether or not I can apply enchantments on these machines that would increase their range.

I right now have some archers, which have 450 ft range increment so a max of 4500 ft. Problem is, I cant seem to get my siege engines that high.

So two questions:

1) Can I apply the same range increasing enchants (or feats) to a siege engine, as I can a normal range weapon? Like (Distance (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/magicWeapons.htm#distance) or far shot (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#farShot)?

2) What is the maximum possible range to get on a heavy trebuchet?


My goal is simple, I need some siege engines which can kill my archers before they kill the engine crew.

[Bullet06320]

1) Can I apply the same range increasing enchants (or feats) to a siege engine, as I can a normal range weapon? Like (Distance (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/magicWeapons.htm#distance) or far shot (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#farShot)?


Distance This property can only be placed on a ranged weapon.
its a ranged weapon, so yes

Far Shot When you use a projectile weapon
if it fires a projectile, than also yes

[Thurbane]

How about Goliath archers with Large Great Crossbows Fitted with Gnomish Crossbow Sights? Give them the Far Shot feat. :smalltongue:

Base damage 3d8 (as good as a light ballista bolt); range increments 120ft (180ft with Far Shot); treat targets as if two range increments closer (except for first two increments). :smallbiggrin:

[Max Caysey]

Distance This property can only be placed on a ranged weapon.
its a ranged weapon, so yes

Far Shot When you use a projectile weapon
if it fires a projectile, than also yes

Ok... So considering best case scenario, I can get my heavy trebuchet to have a max range of 4500. (300x2x1.5) = 4500. What else can I do to increase the range, cause that's not enough??? Could weapon mastery add another 20 to the base for it to become 320x2x1,5 = 4800?

EDIT: So I have been looking into a bit more myself. And found two spells: Accuracy and Hawkeye, which doubles and increases range increment by 50% respectively. Now question is. How would that be calculated? Would I simply take my 4500 x2x1.5 = 13.500? Ore would I need to use some multiplier rule here, and if so what would the max distance be then???

Thanks!

[Fouredged Sword]

Multiplier rule. Add up multipliers and then multiply. In this case multiply by 2.5.

An opperator with farshot should apply the bonus for 2x. Add distance ammo and you get 3x, pretty sure.

[ExLibrisMortis]

Multiplier rule. Add up multipliers and then multiply. In this case multiply by 2.5.
No. Distance is a real-world statistic. Multipliers work normally.

[Goaty14]

How about Goliath archers with Large Great Crossbows Fitted with Gnomish Crossbow Sights? Give them the Far Shot feat. :smalltongue:

Base damage 3d8 (as good as a light ballista bolt); range increments 120ft (180ft with Far Shot); treat targets as if two range increments closer (except for first two increments). :smallbiggrin:

You forgot Cragtop Archer.

Its also worth noting that a ballista by RAW is nothing more than a large crossbow.



My goal is simple, I need some siege engines which can kill my archers before they kill the engine crew.

If you make it a magic siege engine, it can operate without an engine crew.

[Fouredged Sword]

A cheep solution is to have tower shield guards protecting your crew from incoming arrows.

[Elvenoutrider]

You could look up some real world siege tactics to see how people protected their siege weapons.in particular an attacking force would use spear walls that would gradually get closer and closer to the castle. This would stop the castle from sending out attackers at unexpected moments. A besieging force could also use their own archers as a counter.

The thing to keep in mind is that seiges were long dull affairs that could last months or even years. Defenders in a castle would have to worry about running out of food and ammunition so their archers will not be taking Hail Mary max range shots. The other thing to keep in mind is that catapults and trebuchets were not meant to actually destroy fortifications they were designed more as terror weapons to throw things over walls. If you wanted to actually destroy walls you would dig under them and set fire to the foundations or move a cannon up to point blank range and blast them apart. The main gate would also be a vulnerability an attacking force could exploit.

It was actually very rare that castles fell to direct assault.

On a more gonzo note - instead of throwing inanimate projectiles consider throwing gnomes in Wingsuits carrying bombs

[Bullet06320]

On a more gonzo note - instead of throwing inanimate projectiles consider throwing gnomes in Wingsuits carrying bombs

on maybe animated objects? throw animated stones that attack? contingent summon monster spells on the ammo?

[Max Caysey]

Thank you all for the input! It will be put to good use!

Feel free to post any cheese options which could increase the range of the siege engines , beyond what is already at the table. I ended up with a max range of 14.400 ft., which is not too bad.

Thanks again!