3.5 level adjustment

[jdizzlean]

at what point do you apply a level adjustment in a build?

do you take a class lvl at 1, then apply the LA after that, or do you take however many lvls of LA first, and then take a class lvl?

if for example the thing that is causing you to take any LA modifies your HD from the base, does it apply only during the lvls you are LA'ing, or for all lvls regardless of what the classes say for those lvls?

[ZamielVanWeber]

You apply LA when you acquire it. If you get it from a race or inherited template it is applied before you gain any levels. Acquired templates are applied after your first level, when you get them.

Ex: a Draconic human fighter 1 would be ECL 2 right away and need 3 class levels (of which they have one) for buyoff. A human cleric 6 who becomes a saint would immediately jump from ECL 6 to ECL 8 and would need 6 additional class levels (ECL 14) to begin buyoff.

[The Viscount]

If you are playing with something with LA, you must have at least 1 class level (or racial HD) to give you the stats. For example, an Aasimar Fighter starts as an ECL2 character at level 1.
It sounds like you're talking about some templates that come with LA. In this case, whether it actually changes your HD at all depends on what kind of template it is. Whether it changes things or not is indicated under the Type or Hit Dice subsection. For example, Half-Fiend mentions not to change HD or recalculate anything despite changing type to outsider. Vampire, on the other hand, explicitly tells you to change all current and future HD to d12s, which is the case for most undead templates. Vampire is courteous enough to do something most templates should, but doesn't seem that common. It brings up the augmented subtype, in which you gain traits of the type you change to, but retain the traits of the type you previously had.

PCs as always make things a bit wonky when it comes to templates because many were written with monsters in mind, even if they have a listed LA. For PCs, generally speaking nothing will change your HD (because they are class derived) except for undead templates.

Are you asking about a specific template? I might be more helpful if we could discuss specifics.

[jdizzlean]

I'm specifically asking about a LA+1 template that I have to take at creation. so i would take the first lvl for the template, and then at lvl 2 take my first class lvl correct?

[ZamielVanWeber]

I'm specifically asking about a LA+1 template that I have to take at creation. so i would take the first lvl for the template, and then at lvl 2 take my first class lvl correct?

If it is inherited that is how it works (inherited are taken at character creation only).

[Powerdork]

You can start at 1st level with or without level adjustment. You can take that first class level all the same. Level adjustment slows down your experience point gains, though, which eventually puts you slightly behind another character with a smaller level adjustment (like the +0 of standard player races).
At least, that's how it works as written. GMs might have things to say about being a human vampire cleric 1.

[jdizzlean]

I'll take the LA at 1, then class from there.

The template changes my HD to a d10. does that only take place at 1st lvl, or every level overriding class hd?

[ZamielVanWeber]

Neither. With the exception of undead granting ones templates only will adjust the racial hit dice of the creature, not class hit dice.

[jdizzlean]

so if i'm burning lvl 1 on the template, do i take a d10 for hd and then switch to what my actual class would be at lvl 2, or do i ignore the d10 at 1st, and replace that w/ what my class would be at lvl 2?

[ZamielVanWeber]

Unless you have racial hit dice you ONLY use your class level hit dice. So no matter what the template is, you use whatever your class says for all levels.

[Nifft]

You don't apply LA at any stage, because LA is bad enough that it ought to be avoided entirely.


But yeah, if you need to apply LA for some reason, then you apply it when you get it.

This means you CANNOT be an ECL 1 character if you have LA 1+.

You must start play at a higher level.

[jdizzlean]

I'm sorted now, thanks for the help

[ZamielVanWeber]

You don't apply LA at any stage, because LA is bad enough that it ought to be avoided entirely.

This is flagrantly untrue. LA needs to be analyzed carefully because the cost is immense but there are both monster and templates where the LA is worth paying (or even undercosted). LA buyoff makes this even more dramatic since a +1 inherited template ends up costing you literally nothing 13+.